So a four way cold war? Color me interested. The tensions between China and everyone else will be immense, considering their territory claims and their border with Russia.

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Europe, that vast power stretching from Greenland to the Kuriles. Saved from a trend of disintegration by Scottish secession, leaving the United Kingdom in pieces that gradually gravitated towards European federalism. Brought back from the shame of the euro-crisis by alliance with Russia and its Eurasian satellites, energy wealth meeting the engines of technological development and industrial growth. Where Ode to Joy is played loudly and menacingly, personifications of Elysium have replaced older European symbols in prominence, and if you pay attention to the lyrics to Ode to Joy it really does kind of sound like the Instrumentality...

Their space-station/space-elevator/each-faction-gets-its-own-big-space-thing? Freiheit.

Should the federal capital be in someplace unimaginable to the modern day EU, like permanently in Strasbourg (or Strasbourg even becoming a federal district not bound to any one nation, given its historical background); or a more central location, factoring for Russia's influence, such as Krakow?

Some terminology before we begin, though. Let's not clusterfuck this thread in the middle.

Dragon: China Block
Elephant: Oceana
Eagle: US
Bear: Russeurope

>>26793896

Some name suggestions -

Eurorus (formally the European Federation and its alliance with Eurasia as per the Helsinki Pact, but Eurorus is international short hand)

The United States of America, of course

The People's Republic (?) of China...I suppose fucking over China with a coup or civil war or revolution might have knocked it out of the big league, but would it still be the PRC under the same Politburo? I suppose we need to figure out our idea of what China is like before we name it.

Oceania, PanAsia, the East Asian Community (or Congress)

>>26793891

The prevailing cultural wind through the great power decades has been the Ordodemokraten and their grand vision of the birthplace of the Enlightenment, Europe as the best hope for humanity.

But the rising tide is the prevalence of social movements and policlubs that take their inspiration from Kierkegaard and Tolstoy (depending on which side of Europe you are on) and their ilk.

The Great Dragon is surrounded on all sides by its foes. To the west, the Eagle, the American power still holding strong to its Superpower status, subverts its claims on it's rightful naval territory, and offers money in one hand while subtly inching away with another. It's Navy holds the Pacific within its talons of steel, and its wings bring the shadow of ideas that are starting to threaten the stability of the state.

To the south, far worse. The Elephant, its tusks aimed towards the Dragon's heart, the Congress of South Eastern Asia and Oceania building a navy to rival the Eagles and Dragons at the same time, while its armies stand poised to eliminate the teachings of Mao and Marx with the slightest provocation.

To the north and west though, sleeps the Bear, the Confederation of Russia and the European States. Content with its growth, it slumbers upon a pile of resources and technology that the Dragon if clever and cunning could steal... but if the Bear wakes, its claws could pierce the scales of the dragon.

And as 2029 begins, the Dragon stands, prepared to breathe fire and fight with tooth and nail to defend the Peoples Republic of China.

>>26793774
I could imagine a resurgent Europe with Eurasian support being allied to China ironically, hoping to get a closer ally then the US, while the US switching to the EAC and Pacific Rim to gain a powerful Asian ally that can face off China.

>>26793774
this would make sense if:
---Russia's economy wasn't shit.
---USA is embracing gimme-gimme niggerism in lieu of actual productivity.

Asian Powers are likely to be the masters in 100-300 years...

We're supposed to somehow weld the EU and Russia together in twenty years?

Good fucking luck with that.

>>26793891
Prague suggests itself. It has the history.

>>26794324

China's dichotomy is its going to have the old people problem of Europe, but worst, but unlike Japan have lots of young people as well; young people to buy cars and houses and otherwise drive the economy as they become a consumer/service-sector contemporary economy like the US and Europe.

And I suppose the Politburo could probably end most of its social unrest just by changing the migrant worker policies, given that all these migrants to the cities pay into the social services of the city but can't use them, and all of their social benefits are tied to their household - to the village they're from.

Given that the boom in the elderly population is going to force them to change their welfare system anyway, reforming it to no longer be tied to households would remove the element of migrants who don't see themselves as working class but as peasants selling their labor; it would take the umph out of the urban factory-worker wildcat union types as you can bribe people with a stake in the long-term benefits to make deals for pensions and so forth; whereas migrants can't benefit from that so all they fight for is higher wages and safer factory conditions.

>>26794388
And that Russia is going to have to stop shitting all over it's relations with western Europe, as it just -loves- doing.

>>26794346
I'd actually see them being rather isolationist though tending more towards the US than China due to long standing border tensions between Russia and the PRC.

CSEAO would be the wildcard, hating China and wanting the US out of the western Pacific, but honestly not liking the prospect of CRES gaining in Africa.

China is hostile to about everyone, because on all sides it sees enemies and saber rattling - and it isn't far off. Hostile to both CRES and CSEAO, with the US shifting its market focus to the more resurgent Europe and blocking its attempts to claim a slice of the pacific, Africa and South America are its best prospects for allies - but everyone has a stake in Africa at this point and South America doesn't view the Chinese any better than the US.

>>26794410

The Germans keep playing cat and mouse with the Russian relationship. When it serves them, great friends with Russia. But when Merkel needs to seem tough, fist-waving to the East ensues.

Also, all of the pipelines, including the one going from Russia to the United Kingdom, would seem to imply a pretty close relationship in fact if not in idea.

Russia's game of energy blackmailing Europe into accepting its sphere of influence in Eastern Europe could work, or it could be hoisted on its own petard as its economy and the expectations of its people on that economy become completely tied to Europe, giving Europe the power in the relationship.

>>26794432
>>26794478
Don't forget the fact that Europe/Russia will suddenly be the largest superpower, in both landmass and nuclear capability - not to mention its industrial capacity would be enormous.

Hm... the problem is that for now, everyone wants to suck up to each other, more or less. The only substantial friction is between Russia and half the world, and they aren't a world power by themselves. China and the US are making out constantly, the US and Japan are inseparable buttbuddies and NATO is still one of the closest alliances out there.

>>26794550

Wait for the energy crisis. Things will get interesting.

>>26793891
I would adore a European central command in Rome, but that's hilariously unlikely with how things are going.

>>26794550
Want to know what would make that shit go nuts?

China takes Taiwan. Instant frosting of US/China relations, military build up of Japan goes into full fucking overdrive (Though I'd guess they'd remain rather close to the US compared to the rest of the Congress and let them keep their military bases).

NATO would likely take a back seat once the Congress gets going.

>>26794580
Oh yes. Oh yes that would. Hmm... China's inability to field a navy worth mentioning in the sentence as the US's has always been a dampner on "US and PRC fight lol" scenarios, but fighting over Japan and Taiwan... that might just work.

>>26794625
Basically, you have a three way Naval arms race, NATO falls apart due to Russian influence and a series of crisis's in the Balkans and North Africa that result in a Chinese puppet state or something, US starts inching away from China, blah blah blah, boom. Fucking four way cold war.

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>panasians
I trust you know what to do.

>>26794573

I don't know, Russia's getting more theocratic, some sort of Schism-Bro's Theoauthoritarian blessed Eurorussian union isn't the most implausible idea on this thread.

>>26794671
The trickiness is making India a viable power without Japan or South Korea. Pehaps have their African expeditions bear far more fruit than China's, rendering the dark continent part of their bloc? The Middle East?

>>26794671

You don't need to go the full Taiwan invasion route. Heck, these growth projections are without China retaking Taiwan, Transhuman Space style.

It could be as simple as Japan and China actually fighting over the Diaoyu/Senkakus, or Japan and the Philippines having a skirmish with China over some of the other South China claims, ones that the US hasn't guaranteed it'd help Japan protect (the way we did with the Senkakus).

Australia's alliance with Singapore makes the prospect of ASEAN itself, much less greater PanAsia, outvoting ASEAN member Indonesia in terms of letting Australia into the club.

Between the rest of ASEAN not wanting to be Indonesia's bitch, and India and Japan being cool guys, Indonesia would not be free to just do whatever it wants.

>>26794774
Or, India losing a war with China and getting absorbed/turning into a puppet state.

>>26794787
>>26794774

India is already freaking out about the Chinese navy build-up, and considering the ASEAN-Japan showdown happening with China over South Sea territorial claims, Panasia is not some horribly unlikely development. India would be the largest economy in it, followed by Japan, then South Korea and ASEAN in an order I forget, and finally Australia.

>>26794432
The old people problem as you put it isn't quite the same as Japan's; China has a Surplus of people and had to enact the 1-child laws accordingly to curb its growth. Gaining ecconomic wealth and expanding its per-capita wealth will slow that some, but they have a section of the population about on par with the US which is functioning in that fancy new economy and technological situation with several hundred million still working and ecking out a living in semi-feudal styles. They'll have to reconcile this difference or else they'll be stuck with a dual economy that'll split the country in half.

Japan's problem is that they don't have enough people fucking to Get new generations, and their semi-xenophobic cultural stance is not allowing them to accept foreign nationals to immigrate in to take up some of the slack. The US relies a lot on immigration, as their native population growth is at about 2.1:2 in ratio of 2x parents having 2.1 children via averages (nb4 jokes about .1 child) and then supplement with other folks coming to live with them. If this isn't sustained, they'll actually start running into a problem similar to Japan where they have a semi-stable economy but a Stagnant one since they keep losing people and have to build infrastructure to make up the difference.

Russia's thing with the gays is heavily influenced by the same problem; lack of population. Maybe Putin figures he can stave off population decline by making the gays want to look straight and occasionally having sex enough to fake it and adding some kids to the result.

Getting wealthy and having career-focused folks actually slows down population growth which is vital to developing and growing economic production and exchange.

>>26794704
>Dats racist
>Implying the Pan Asians wouldn't make a chemical weapon that would target light skinned people with round eyes.
They totally would genocide us bro. If they didn't already turn us into a bunch of literal Anglo-asian mulattos.

>>26794774
Think about this for a second.
Last year over 90% of Indias population had a cell-phone. Not very sophisticated, but connected. They're gunning for 97% by the end of this year.

An entire nation of 1,000,000,000+ people all connected technologically. It's not sophisticated, but there's a Lot that can get done that way. China's population cannot make the same boast, much as they have a higher development index.

In the next few decades? A population that values telecommunication more than food (they will in some cases prioritize their phone bill over food resources) of that size will essentially be capable of all kinds of information tech and communication control. They might not have as much fire-power but you will be hard-pressed to get a call through on public systems with the Indian Telecommunication Tactical Strikes ddosing your country's ability to communicate.

>>26794822

I wonder if Putin's new policy of allowing former Russian empire nations' people to immigrate to the RF will hold, leading to a more Eurasian Russia in the long-term, or if they'll choose to continue to take European expatriates instead of Central Asians, over religious differences and whatnot.

>>26794928

I picture India as a core member of Panasia, along with Japan, what's left of Korea, ASEAN, and possibly Australia or maybe not.

>>26794894
>implying you can make racially specific weapons without knowledge of the other three axes of gravitoelectromagnetics

Panasians are too dogmatic and centralized. If they knew about it, they'd already have it.

>>26794923
That's probably for the same purposes, but I don't imagine that they'll want to shut that down any time soon, and if anything that Would seem to be a more solidifying point as to why the EU and Russia would be getting along. While I've little doubt that the Putin-Cyborg that will be ruling russia at that time will be trying to keep Russia Russian and be trying to push them out if they can pull themselves out of the stoop they're in, for now it looks like a favorable investment for them.

>>26794980

Well it helps that the main terrorist groups are coming out of the Caucasus, and Central Asia proper is pretty religiously moderate according to Wikipedia. Plus Kazakhstan is majority Orthodox, and Belarus in Europe is already a Eurasian Union prospect post-russian dictatorship, and Ukraine is gettable, as far as Eastern Europe goes. But yeah, seemingly Tajikistan, Uzbekistan, and Kyrgyzstan wouldn't be a problem.

So should the culture of China, or that is the national culture or the nature of the Party and its rule change in China during this time?

If we avoid the usual cliches of a civil war that would exclude it from being one of the Four Powers, and don't have a PLA coup or something, what's the road look like for them?

>>26795303
Have them continue in their current trend towards unrestrained corporate capitalism.

>>26795303
Tough. Ideologically, they're on all sides beset by enemies aside from a few friendly nations. Their main market of the US is turning its eyes elsewhere, and trading with SEA is going to be really tough. Europe isn't exactly going to be the friendliest to them, and their military and economy are really their only advantages - and Europe is starting to make that military and economy look small.

>>26795344

Well, let's look at it this way. While not by much, they'll be the world's largest single economy. And considering how much influence they have now and we're talking about it more than doubling by 2020 according to these projections, they might be in a tough geopolitical position, but it would look like they would culturally dominate Asia and be in the same position of exporting the world at large as the US has been since WWII. They'll be a big consumer economy.

>>26795431
The trick is who would they be exporting to? SEA isn't going to buy chinese products likely considering their tensions. Europe is the best possible market, but they're a producer now as well. All you're left with is South America, and Africa. While they may be an economic juggernaught, culturally they're in a tight spot with SEA going nationalist as fuck and unifying behind the idea of "Fuck China".

>>26794970
>implying they aren't under orders of using it on us during the FEMA purges under the Zionists orders.
Panasians took over that world for a reason, do you really think a rebel group would make a chemical weapon that magically kills all asians while historically Asia's already been through tons of chemical weapons and has plenty right back.
That's the problem with race war books, they always wank near the end for a "happy ending"
All is lost, the only thing you can do is wait for the invasion to arrive and speak Chinese.

>>26795575
It's not a chemical weapon. It operates on entirely different principles.

>>26795495

Selling to themselves, living the good life, trying to enjoy what America had 60+ years of before they potentially get it taken away from them. As has been previously mentioned they're moving towards a consumer economy, service-based like the U.S., meaning they'll make enough stuff to sell to themselves, with financial services and hi-tech industry jobs and the like for the wealthy consumers and burger-flipping jobs for the schmucks. Just like 'murica.

>>26795600
True. But don't forget the cultural aspirations and naval ambitions. It's a powder keg situation, and China is the one likely to light the match.

>>26795595
>well ignoring the wank of science, the closest programs to actually targeting ethnicities were US sponsored chemical warfare programs. Hence me "classifying" it as a chemical weapon.
If we let the Asians take over the world, you can bet their genes would flood the turf they've taken.
>mfw hundreds of tribes and ethnicities have been wiped out in Asia already by their need to make one ethnicity dominant.
They would destroy us, no joke. And no amount of "but muh shows and muh war movies" is good enough to over turn the frightning speed they are progressing.

>>26795622

Yep. Nothing helps unify support for the regime like rallying the people behind the flag.

It would be interesting to see/portray in a game a nation that has US levels of prosperity (just distributed over a much larger population, still putting even in projections of China as the world's largest economy/no.1 nation kind of thing the average standard of living something like a third of that in the West) but a Soviet-like commitment to winning on the world stage/escaping geopolitical containment.

>>26793774
Front Mission attempted something like this. OSEA for the southeast asian bloc, USN/UCS for a North/South America bloc, Hanzi the Chinese bloc, and the EC as a stand in for the EU, which was sometimes aligned with Zaftra (Russia).

So what about Panasia (or Pacifica, or Oceania, or the EAC, or what have you)? The vibe we've established so far is nationalist/patriotic, ready to fight China; as presumably the birth of their alliance was a South China Seas conflict. Does the broader whole get a long about as well as current ASEAN members do with each other, is their Indian domination, or tension between wealthy and distant Japan/Korea and all of their South Asian partners?

>>26796681
I'd say its like Europe, except much more tense. Everyone knows this is an alliance of convenience, but it's a damn useful one that they all want to milk for all it's worth. Vietnam/Laos and Korea (Lets assume China simply invaded and took over NK) are incredibly militarized and even more bunker'd up now, the Philippines and Japan are both in the sea race, and Indonesia and India are the manpower and manufacturing base keeping everyone together. Australia is a de jure member, and helping with wargames and the like, while claiming neutrality and non-allegience. Every member is looking for advantages against the other ones to dominate the Congress.

>>26796823
To expand more on this - really, the main issue that is keeping the congress together is China. Other than that, they have no real reason to work together. China militarily and economically can wipe the floor with them individually, but all together they stand a chance. It's after the victory or defeat that the members are manuvering for, just in case the congress stays intact.

>>26796466
Exactly. Hell, a book series about this would fucking make bank. Every side has a legit reason to be sympathetic - China while aggressive is still simply trying to provide for the absurd number of people within its borders. The US is trying to prevent a three way pacific war and a repeat of the Island Hopping campaign - with modern weaponry. Eurorussia is trying to simply well... exist unmolested. The Congress is trying to remain independent.

>>26796878

I imagine the economic imperative is there as well, there's more here than military alliance. The pacific rim is a natural trading area, and there might be some joint pride to not being the trade-partner-vassals of the US or China.

>>26796994
That's another thing, and why they're worried about Eurorussia - they don't want to start getting muscled out of their markets in Africa. They're as much a military as an economic alliance.

They don't want the US to meddle in the Pacific either, because they ARE the Pacific for the most part.

>>26796965

Also by 2030, India is going to have the world's largest population, and likely all of those South Asian countries are going to be heavily affected by climate change. So that's an element to it.

>>26797037

Oh, this reminds me. Europe is getting its carbon from Russia and North Africa, and has a sensible long-term plan to get off the stuff. China and the Congress get to compete for influence in the Middle-East like real superpowers, and the US has presumably suffered some setbacks making it more of the largest regional power; policing the Americas and getting its fossil fuels from itself, Canada, and Latin American sources; than the global power it used to be.

The existence of the Congress would seem to indicate that the Pacific Fleet is no longer based out of Japan. Maybe Bangladesh isn't in the Indian sphere of influence and within the Congress, and is hosting the US fleet.

>>26797105
Actually, I'd have Japan occupy a weird position in the Congress. Technically, they're still a US protectorate and let them keep their military bases. In reality, the Japanese control their own defense and military and are perfectly capable of defending the home islands or launching a small scale campaign in Asia. As such, the US is still a major force in the pacific . The Japanese bases are secondary ones, the US navy is based out of Hawaii or Guam.

>No african development
/tg/,I am disappoint


you forgot south america too

>>26797291
Hey, I suggested African development being spurred by India!

>>26797291

We're talking about the great powers, the four world powers, and we did mention the projections show Mexico and Brazil rising up in the ranks, relative to the list of nations by GDP.

Also, a economic conference from the beginning of the year that I'm using as a source on things such as India having more people than China by 2030, predicted that by 2030 we'd be talking about Africa the way we talk about China today. Because Africa will have more young people than anywhere else the world.

>>26797156

>US still in Okinawa in 2030/2040
They (the Japanese) mad.

>>26797332
>The Africans are stealing our jobs!

But wouldn't Mexico have to get over the Cartels? Not just the drug cartels, but the ones that control every industry. Those things constrict the economy down there

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>>26793774
Australia would join America over Asia m8.

>>26797371
All we would need is for us and Canada to rejoin Britain for a glorious Anglosphere. RULE GRAND ANGLIA, GRAND ANGLIA RULE THE WAVES

>>26797394
Grab New Zealand and South Africa while we're at it. You're next India!

>>26797326
It is - the Congress, China, the US AND Eurorussia are all competing to influence the direction the nations of Africa will turn to. South America is basically US's turf, but rather independent.

The U.S will take Mexico, Canada, Australia, and the U.K., and subdue South America to basically a territory. Maybe after a while, Siberia will join the US too, making the US the greatest superpower basically forever.

>>26797440
>India makes a push to make the Commonwealth a force again
>Basically takes over the alliance
>India starts speaking English, bossing New Zeland and Canada around

>>26797528
>India starts speaking English

Hey now, if we're going full fantasy you may as well have Belgium conquer the Western Hemisphere.

>>26797588

Isn't their national anthem in phonetic sanskrit so it will be mostly legible across the largest variety of Indian languages? Doesn't sound like a place that will become anglophone anytime soon.

And I don't see the Commonwealth as mattering whatsoever. Canada and the South African Customs Union have more to gain from and fear the loss of their European Partnership Agreements than from the symbolic Commonwealth.

>>26793774
>not calling the Russians the Bears

>>26797689
We rectified OP's blatant faggotry on that front.

>>26797736

I was thinking of the Russian Eagle and the Prussian Eagle for Eurorus, c'mon.

But yeah, bear works better.

>>26794580
I think if China ever did invade Taiwan, Japan would just say "fuck your treaties" and start building nuclear weapons. That is if they don't already have them and are merely keeping quiet about it.

Asianfag here. Philippines, Davao

You guys seem to be overstating China's growth.

They've been sued for stealing foreign company secrets and many organizations have been sprouted by foreign governments to block out Chinese and US spying.

Since China had relied heavily on stolen secrets for their benefit, the sanctions are going to hurt them badly.

Next, China is suffering from their capitalistic growth. Their businessmen and professionals are quickly leaving their country for better futures while all thats left are laborers.

Which brings us to their laborers. After China's distasteful method of diplomacy regarding its territorial spats, a lot of countries want little to do with China. Or want to fuck them over even further.
The US are offsourcing less to China and more to India, Japan and Korea.
India has made it a vendetta to harass illegal Chinese miners trying to slip past India and into Pakistan and Afghanistan.
Japan has been selling warships to many of its Asian neighbors under a technicality that, if Japan can't have warships, they can have their allies roam the seas for them instead.

All in all, China's growing but not expanding as it should. It'll implode on itself eventually.

>>26802188
I also forget that in Europe, China has been implicitly banned from participating in certain business deals. Notably, being banned from selling Solar Panels believed to be technology stolen from brussels.

>>26802188
>>26802227
Which is actually an even bigger powderkeg for a four way cold war. The Dragon needs to expand, and it's willing to do anything it needs to do to make tht happen.

>>26793774
>Because Russia is going to become the largest European economy by those same predictions, and if you add Russia's projected GDP to that of the European Union, you end up with it being close to China and the United States.
The EU's combined GDP is already bigger than the USA's.

Oh, if only greece wasn't fucked right now. I would love to see a setting where the little mediterrean country rises up into New Byzantium.

>>26802837
Cyprus

>>26802837

Fuck off Greek.

Welcome to the setting of 00 Gundam

>>26802831

Actually bro, even in the modest realistic IMF predictions for 2018 that are not the spate of "China will grow larger" we're using as a base...

United States
21,101 billion $US in nominal GDP

European Union
19,754 billion $US in nominal GDP

And using the figures we've actually been using...

Top 10 economies in 2020, by nominal GDP in trillions of US$ -
1. PRC ($24.6, up from 5.7 in 2010)
2. USA ($23.3, up from 14.6 in 2010)
3. EU ($19.7)
4. India ($9.6, up from $2 in 2010)
5. Japan (between $5 and $6)
6. Russia (between $4 and $5)
7. ASEAN ($4.7)
9. Brazil ($3.8)
10. Mexico ($2.8)

Sources:
www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapoza/2011/05/26/by-2020-china-no-1-us-no-2/

http://www.rediff.com/business/slide-show/slide-show-1-worlds-top-economic-superpowers/20130121.htm#21

http://blog.euromonitor.com/2013/05/forecast-worlds-largest-economies-in-2020.html

http://blog.euromonitor.com/2010/07/special-report-top-10-largest-economies-in-2020.html

http://www.scmp.com/business/economy/article/1228657/asean-economies-set-double-gdp-2020-says-ihs

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>>26803054

I do love me some Human Reform League, but the other two nation-blocs weren't nearly as interesting conceptually. I remember their space elevator was named The International, did they ever say the names of the Union and AEU's?

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Countries, much less supranational entities, have flags and seals and military seals and identifiers on uniforms and lots of symbols basically; but in order to discuss these four blocs more easily having a "main" symbol, would help us to represent them visually. Some thoughts:

The People's Republic of China (The Dragon) - the Red Star?

The United States of America (The Eagle) - maybe some of the less used symbols like the Phrygian Cap completed with liberty pole and Roman fascisti accompanying.

The Helsinki Pact (The Bear) -
The European Federation - representation of Europe as the goddess Elysium
The Eurasian Federation - the real life Eurasian Union symbol (pictured)

The East Asia Congress (The Elephant) - something using ASEAN's stylized golden bundle of rice?

>>26803247
I highly doubt the US is going to change its seal within the next two decades. Same with China. The Congress and Helsinki Pact however, yes, they do need symbols.

Thoughts: East Asia Congress block voting in the Asian Development Bank and other regional organizations leads China, already in 2013 the third-largest shareholder in the World Banker and by our 2050 setting let's say the largest share-holder, to push more of its weight in the international organs.

So while some predictions would have China as regional hegemon rather than really try to change the nature of the international community, the regional alliance aimed against it would kind of force it to play the "no.1 world economy" and probably no.1 military by this time card as well.

Regional superpowers aiming daggers at its heart, the move it has to play is the world stage. China sets the tone for the World Bank and IMF, China has redefined what is an is not internationally acceptable, favoring sovereignty over human rights and resource-concessions over copyright-protection and financial reforms, gaining the loyalty of many developing nations.

Of course the UNSC is dominated by the Eurorussians unless its added new members. UK, France, and Russia running the show on the Security Council would be amusing; but maybe they have added more members...let the long-proposed candidates for permanent seats join and kicked out the UK after its been broken up by Scottish secession and subsequent developments (Irish unification/Ulster independence?).

UN Security Council -
US
France, Russia (Eurorus, 2 votes)
China
India, Japan (Congress, 2 votes)
Brazil (fought over by China and the US)

Of course membership reform could really just strengthen the Eurorussians if you have UK, US, France, Russia, and Germany.

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Work in progress map showing the blocs and a Canada divided by separatism and competing foreign influence (Chinese oil concessions in the West, US domination over the souls of the government in Ottawa, Quebec secession forcing Maritime independence and them all joining the EU).

Need to show Mercosur, with Chinese influence, and Mexico and other Latin American countries with US influence, and maybe do something with the Middle East, as well as show African alliances.

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>>26805103
International Relations grad here, interested in the setting and here to help out with some ideas.

Well you can't forget about the oncoming East African Federation (Burundi, Kenya, Rwanda, Tanzania and Uganda and maybe expanding further than that into South Sudan or elsewhere).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/East_African_Federation

Plus, the UN has sent in it's own army into the Democratic Republic of Congo which could lead to some interesting power changes there.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/may/05/un-force-democratic-republic-congo

Egypt and Ethiopia are about to go toe-to-toe over the construction of a dam.
http://www.newvision.co.ug/news/645490-egypt-warns-ethiopia-over-plans-to-build-dam-on-river-nile.html

The death of Mandela could lead to a resurging race war in South Africa. Here is footage of their president chanting "Kill the Boer" to crowds of thousands. There are strong black and white power movements already in South Africa.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6fzRSE_p1Ys

Maybe make Puerto Rico become the 51st US State.

There are plans in motion to build a bridge between South Korea and Japan. It may sound like sci fi now but in the time when this is set it could be very different.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan-South_Korea_Undersea_Tunnel

>>26808232
Mr. IR grad, what do you think is the best book on the History of International Relations? I'm studying Law so I don't need something too in-depth since it will just be one semester, but I'd like the opinion of someone that actually knows his shit.

>>26808232

In South Africa, I think the possibility of the emerging Democratic Alliance to challenge ANC domination is more interesting than race wars.

>>26808372
International History of the 20th Century and Beyond by Best, Hanhimaki, Maiolo and Schulze

Introduction to International Relations by Jackson & Sorenson

They're the core textbooks.

>Russia = Fire Nation

>>26797371
If that happened, Aus would become a military staging post, and so would Indonesia / Philippines...

>>26797394
Anglosphere? do you have any idea how black Aus-America is ???

NIGGERS EVERYWHERE!!!!!!

and they took over the TV too....whites are being bred out by constantly pulsing nigger dicks...

>>26793891
>Scottish secession, leaving the United Kingdom in pieces that gradually gravitated towards European federalism.

NEVEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEER.

/thread

>>26797371
You say that, but the growing increase in South Asian and Oceanic immigrants into Australia may soon slowly turn it away from being a white/anglo-nation.

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If the European and Eurasian unions that represent one bloc via an alliance get their separate animals, I actually came up with a good "national" animal for Europe, the way the bear is for Russia.

The auroch!

>>26808526
I take issue with this. Cataolinia is more likely to secede than Scotland at this point, especially with Spain's economy and social unrest the way it is.

>>26808553

I would say, India and Japan are bros and their guarantee of keeping Indonesia in line would be a good thing for Straylia.

Straylians already vacation in Vietnam and Thailand, so the glorious East Asian alliance is a natural fit.

>>26808560
Europe is already represented by a white bull anyway IRL.

>>26808576

European Union develops a strong unified military after Argentina retakes Falklands from UK and Second Spanish Civil War forces European intervention.

Leads to unified European military command.

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I'm more worried about demographics.

There will be one billion Nigerians alone by 2100. One in three humans by 2100 will be from Sub Saharan Africa, assuming their birth trends don't change, and it is unlikely they will.

>>26808635

Yes, the African population of young people, best ration in the world in terms of adults in their prime, due for 2030 will give great potential to that continent for economic development.

>>26793774
>the other Eagle
Russians are bears, dude.

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>>26802837
Like that could ever happen. Greece is headed for third world status.

>>26808600
How could Argentina feasibly ever take the Falklands? Not that I'm disagreeing with the idea it's just that there needs to be some kind of reason.

Does a second credit crunch cripple the UK so much that it can't afford to send a strong enough counter-offensive?

Is Argentina armed with top-of-the-range Chinese military technology (leased to them or sold cheaply to secure Chinese interests in Latin America)?

I'm going to assume yes to both.

>>26808635
>assuming their birth trends don't change, and it is unlikely they will.

Slippery sloap fallacy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Slippery_slope

The problem doesnt even exist NOW.

In terms of birth rate Nigeria is single handedly responsible for overpopulation.

But most of those children will be dead before 25. So in actual fact their only barely striking even.

>>26808719
What's to say Nigeria won't sell its vast oil wealth to fund infrastructural developments Chavez style?

>>26808600

>Retake the Falklands

Because that worked SO well the first time around.

>>26808424
Perhaps the ANC, under extreme duress due to losses to the Democratic Alliance, starts rigging elections, or installs a one-party state.

>>26808662
Assuming they have any opportunity to hustle.

Africa is in a double barrelled trap of debt and shitty governance.

Hustlin' youngin's won't beat debt. A revolution won't lead to a good, stable government (probably).

>>26808719
Nigeria's population has already quadrupled.

>Modern usage avoids the fallacy by acknowledging the possibility of this middle ground.

I'm aware it's possible Africa may pull a China, but they won't. The various countries HATE each other, and within their borders, the various ethnicities HATE each other.

The poor Igbos of Nigeria, or the poor whites who can't afford to leave South Africa, or the Asian immigrants to South Africa, or the other black immigrants to South Africa...

Man, South Africa sucks.

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>>26808758
Shut up Argentine, Tech has advanced, if GB wanted the fagland islands they could have them within a month without losing more then 10 or twenty soldiers in the process.

>>26808830
Oh anyway, arguing this to show Africa won't be a world power for the next century at least.

>>26808742
>vast oil wealth to fund infrastructural developments Chavez style?

Because the average IQ of black people in Africa is 75.
And the average IQ of white people in America is 103.
Thats 32 points different. And that number will also exist in the highest IQ averages. So American middle class will have an IQ of 135 and that means that African middle class will have an IQ of 103... thats right. Average intelligence.

So your a socialist liberal... That explains why you didnt learn the proper statistics and just assumed that africa would be like everyone else, and also how you think that the solution to africas problems would EVER be socialism, as if its now viable because their poor. Or as if they can be seized upon as a weak target.

>>26808836
Are you retarded. YOU won the Falkands war.
Dis dumb nigga don't even know what wars his country's won.
God damn 10/10.

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>>26808742

>Nigeria nationalizes oil
>a lot of angry investors
>business men billionaires losing their gold mine
>aggressive businessmen see something dangerous brewing there
>add 50 similar events here

Newspapers after these events:
>"Nigeria houses terrorism!"
>"Bombing in NY metro, Nigerian perpetrators caught!"
>"America curbstomps Nigerian oppressive government accused of housing terrorists and giving them nuclear weapons, installs democracy."

>>26808836
>I'm so British I shit the Duke of Wellington

>>26808840

In this thread's scenario, Africa and Argentina experience growth but due to relative size remain the territory to be feuded over by the Great Powers (US, China, Eurorussia, Eastasia).

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>>26808830
>>Modern usage avoids the fallacy by acknowledging the possibility of this middle ground.

There IS NO MIDDLE GROUND. Its a fallacy.

A fucking metier could kill us all. You CANNOT project trends.

If you pick middle ground you are HALF AS WRONG, but you are STILL WRONG.

This is what i get for using wikipedia as a source for fallacies. The edit wars continue...

http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/26793774/

Take a long look at the massive wall of shit on sup/tg/'s current archive page. At least something novel and interesting can be added onto there.

>>26808854
Irelands IQ was in the 70's when they were third world too.

Now it's the same as France's.

And their immigrants to here always had that IQ.

Now, do you know how well African immigrants do in the US? The average immigrant from Mozambique earns more than the average American.

Not every black is a nigger.

Although I agree they shouldn't be flooding into Europe. Their inescapable mark of the "other" means they will never integrate, which means they will always ghettoize, radicalize, and become the criminal elements they are in the West.

>>26808854
I was debating in the context of the game's setting we're developing, considering we're discussing the prospect of a 21st Century Scramble for Africa, it could be quite interesting to see Nigeria turn into a socialist nation that would be inclined towards friendship with the Chinese much like the Pink Tide's relationship with the Peoples Republic.

No need to turn this into an ideological argument.

>>26808896
>metier
mé·tier
meˈtyāˈmeˌtyā
noun
1.
a trade, profession, or occupation.

>>26808896
>You CANNOT project trends.

You are wrong. I didn't say "this will certainly happen", I said "this looks likely".

You seem to be arguing you shouldn't fore-plan at all or something, which is just, man. Misplaced.

>>26808875
>"America curbstomps Nigerian oppressive government accused of housing terrorists and giving them nuclear weapons, installs democracy."
Fuck that, go full cyberpunk and make Exxon install democracy themselves with an army of PMCs. God save the private sector!

>>26808953
Honestly all they have to do is give guns and drugs to Nigerian rebels. They'll do it.

Oh shit, maybe they'll import a Liberian cannibal army.

ITT: /tg/ tries into international geopolitics by simplifying the world into 4 distinct blocks.

>no account for rapidity of information
>no account for civil or social unrest
>zero account for economic innovation

Air sure is stale in this bubble. Go look at the previous IMF assessment of global economic outlooks from 1980, 1985, 1990, 1995, and etc.

You'll see a startling trend.

Eurorus (The Euro-Eurasian Confederation)
The Bear
the goddess Elysium

United States of America
The Eagle
American iconography

Zhongguo (The People's Republic of China)
The Dragon
Communist iconography

The Congress (East Asia Congress)
The Elephant
Asian symbols like the bushel of rice, Buddhist iconography, and figures/creatures from Asian myth (like the Kirin/Quilong)

>>26808969
This keeps getting better and better.

>>26808875
Something like this could be very interesting. It could be cool to see the focus of the war on terror shifting towards Sub-Saharan Africa, given that there are lots of Muslims live there and the current dilemma in Mali.

>>26808854
>>26808907
Also not forgetting that within ten years Chavez's social schemes caused the literacy rates in the country to increase to over 95%. Why could such a similar thing not be possible in Nigeria if everything went smoothly, which IRL it probably wouldn't.
http://venezuelanalysis.com/news/5107

>>26808953

That reminds me of something I read, that Exxon's ownership is almost universally dedicated to Objectivism.

>>26808884
I meant Latin America, not just Argentina.

Maybe Argentina IS South America... (Argentina can into stronk?)

>>26809034

From what I remember of the article, it was about oil diplomacy. How China can offer tanks and the use of its position on the Security Council to African nations, whereas Exxon is the private company most able to compete with nation-level players like China.

>>26808984
>Go look at the previous IMF assessment of global economic outlooks from 1980, 1985, 1990, 1995, and etc.

That sounds like two much work, plus, OP phrased his view much better.

Ergo, fourway battle of the bands at the end of the century.

>>26808984
Are you kidding? The Congress is basically at each others throat all the fucking time. There's more infighting than shit getting done. Eurorus and China are facing a serious amount of political and social unrest respectively, and the US is starting to slip back into a Monroe Only mindset.

>>26809064
>too much work

>>26809064

No he's right, these predictions are shit. In the 80's they extrapolate from the then current growth rates to predict Japan becoming the world's largest economy. But it is fun shit.

>>26793774
Might be worthwhile to have a watch or a listen to this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EiTrl0W1QrM

>>26809088
But we could tell by Japans abysmal birth rate it wouldn't last forever, as there's a relation between birth and growth rates.

Also wealth strongly correlates with fertility rate.

In this case, Africa is actively getting poorer. Although their birth rates ARE falling, this fall seems to be tied to their growing health levels, which are also levelling off.

So we still get an African quadrupling of population short of something drastic.

>>26809034
Having Africa and South America basically being the economic battlegrounds of the superpowers works well.

South America is still American turf primarily, but China has made serious headway in the market and so has the Congress. It's getting insanely competative and everyone is choosing sides. It wouldn't be unlikely for there to be a large scale conflict to break out in proxy between the Elephant, Dragon, and Eagle over the future of South America.

>>26808662
Economic development that will belong to China, as they are colonising the fuck out of Africa and buying up all the land, resources, and people there.

>>26809001
>Asian symbols like the bushel of rice, Buddhist iconography, and figures/creatures from Asian myth (like the Kirin/Quilong)

and the swastika!

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>>26809261
To be fair the swastika is more of a symbol of the Proto-Indo-Europeans, aka Aryans and their descendants in Europe, India, and parts of the Middle East. Pic related, anglo-saxon in origin (descended from aryans).

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As we all know, Russia only has one political party. Plus, it's kinda fitting, so I propose this.

>>26809377
>using the commieflag's colours

>>26809377

One way I was thinking as mentioned up-thread a little is that the European Federation and Eurasia have their own separate systems and symbols, but are united by the Helsinki Pact of military and economic cooperation.

So Greece is Eurasian, Turkey is European, for example.

>>26809193
As a southamerican I doubt it.

Unlike Europe, Asia and Africa; Latam really only has had one big war since the colony time.

We don't have millennial hatreds (japan-china-korea-india, almost everyone in fucking Asia). Nor have we ethnic tensions (Africa).
The biggest conflict we have are some communistic tendencies in some countries while others tend towards capitalism. But even then it's not that bad, and any kind of war would be extremely unpopular.

So no, it would be unlikely proxy wars started here.

>>26809444

Still need some kind of flag, EU is not a nation per-se, too.

>>26809473
A nation is an ethnicity. A state is a government framework.

The EU is only a version of the latter.

Although given how bloated and inefficient the EU ALREADY is, any more powerful version would be just awful in so many ways.

>>26809572
Fun fact: most EU higher-ups are "former" communists aka enemies of Europe

>>26809572
>A nation is an ethnicity.
[Citation required]

Russia is not part of the european union.

>>26809454

Proxy-wars betwen LatAm countries? No. Mercosur would be chilling and hanging out with CAN/non-Mercosur countries just fine. Maybe a Peru-Ecuador war or something, but no big conflicts.

But Latin America would be rife for influence grabbing. Selling themselves to the highest bidder. It would be a debtors market, with the blocs falling over themselves to get Brazil and Mercosur to take their loans.

>>26809718

In the future it could be, and the EU would not be equal in economic size to the US without it.

Even if we take the figures we're using (the 2020 figures) as hyperbolic, in all probability in real life by 2050 China will be the world's largest economy, followed by the US, and then the European Union under its current membership.

>>26808836

Actually I was making fun of the idea that Argentine would conceivably think that getting their asses kicked by the British again would be a good idea.

>>26809928

But EU is already better economically than the US without Russia.

>>26810007

The EU is not projected, even in more plausible long-term projections, to continue to do so. In all likelihood the EU in total will be a smaller economy than the US and China within decades. And Russia will surpass any of the European Big 3 economically based on current projections, but that's based on fossil fuel revenues and less likely to come true, but that's the set of projections we are working with.

This has been mentioned multiple times, so read the thread before you post.

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The People's Republic of China (The Dragon)
Pros: Largest economy, largest military expenditure, leading role in most international institutions.
Cons: Surrounded by rivals, supply-lines and force projection in jeopardy (if its route through the Indian Ocean were blocked by the Congress, it would have to risk lack of refueling stations and the US pacific fleet out of Hawaii to make it on the open Pacific to maintain presence in Latin America)

What about the others?
The European Confederation (The Bear)
The United States of America (The Eagle)
The East Asia Congress (The Elephant)

>>26812953
Africa: The Eldest (in reference to it being our home continent)
South America: The Colonists
Some Middle Eastern powerbloc: The Crescent

>>26813066
Actually our home continent is asia. OOA's been debunked for years now.

>>26813175
Links plox.

>>26812953
>hurf durf everything that barely touches Russia is made of bears
Oh for fuck's sake. Let's please go back to the other eagle.
a) unlike the Chinese with their dragons, Russkies DON'T up and identify themselves as The Bear, to them it's what the others call them. At most they go on about the bears ironically. Imagine Germany renaming itself The HunZ or Yodeling Pretzel.
b) Eurasian confederacy would be FAR from lead by Russia alone. Two-headed eagle fits best to symbolize the duality
c) Almost everyone involved has eagles all over their history books. A Two-headed, two-colored eagle would be a close enough mash-up.

>>26813513
How does The Old World sound?

>>26812953
Jesus christ I didn't realize how big Kazahkstan was.

>>26813175
No. Nope. Nooo. Just no. They migrated to Asia pretty early, but the first anatomically correct humans, the first lineage branching off from mitochondrial Eve, etcetera, are all African. The main debates are whether we're naturally East African, North African or South African.

>>26813513

Well here is a question then.

Can we just have one big united European Confederacy, with the whole 18th century enlightenment fetishism the unified cultural establishment norm, meaning the goddess Elysium adorns a lot of shit; or does there need to be a distinct Europe-Russian dual identity in the culture and in the symbols, such as the double-headed eagle you mention; or should it be two separate entities united in a trade bloc and military alliance?

>>26809648
Nation: a large aggregate of people united by common descent, history, culture, or language, inhabiting a particular country or territory.
Ethnicity: the fact or state of belonging to a social group that has a common national or cultural tradition.
They are essentially the same. They both describe the culture and tradition of a group of people. lrn2sociology.

>>26813957
It depends how far in the future you set it. I'd say you'd need at least 50-80 years to create a unified culture like that. Even then, the cultures would still have some subtle difference, and won't be a homogenous mixture of European and Russian culture.

>>26814280

Any thoughts to a Kierkegaardian Europe and Tolstoyan Russia as Christian existentialist bros?

But how would Russia get past its Oligarichal Kleptocracy?

>>26814608
I doubt they'd be Christian bros. Christianity in Europe is taking a beating from the Internet "converting" many atheists/agnostics, as well as the huge influx of Islam. It's going down the tubes bad lately.

That being said, I bet the Pope and Ecumenical Patriarch, representing the Western and Eastern sects of Christianity, and therefore the two halves of the union, would probably bro it up a bunch and make it more official.

>>26814230
No. Just... No. Points for getting the nation definition correct though.

>>26803063
That prediction for the EU has a 3.4 billion growth from the GDP in 2010. That's the growth of the UK, France and Germany alone. I'd be surprised if Spain, Italy and Eastern Europe don't grow at all in the next 7 years.

Bumping for greater justice.

>>26801156
Any nation that has a nuclear reactor anywhere within their borders has nuclear weapons.

It simply isn't feasible to believe otherwise.

>>26793774

>Russia
>Largest european economy by 2020

The EU had a GDP 8 time bigger than Russia as of end of 2012.
France, UK and Germany each have a bigger GDP than Russia.
Italy is only marginaly smaller.
Even with a yearly 10% growth, it would still take 22 years for Russia to reach the current GDP of the EU.
Even assuming a continual decrease of 1% per year from the EU, it would still take 20 years.
So more like 2032-2033.

Add to this that EU and Russia hate each other's guts as they are competing for influence in the Balkans, Eastern Europe and Middle East.
The only way for the EU to get closer to Russia by 2020 would be for Russia to invade, seeing as Vlad and his cronies are going to stay in power at least that much longer and they won't even discuss a possible cooperation.

>>26819692
> won't even discuss a possible cooperation.
But that's just wrong. Russ and Germany have been on again, off again for a decade at least. They even discuss defense cooperation.

Also, you left out the variant of Russia's collapse. The so called "diminutive" nationalists over there all about reducing themselves to a cozy European republic and eurointegration.

>>26819692

Calm your butt devastation.

Russia is projected currently to overtake Germany as the largest economy in Europe (geographic Europe, not the EU obviously).

No one is saying Russia would reach the economic size of the EU.

What is being said is that the European Union will be a smaller collective economy than the national economies of China or the US, thus precipitating for this scenario its pairing up with Russia in order to be part of four roughly equal great powers/blocs.

China-The Dragon
USA-The Eagle
Europe/Russia-The Old World
Africa-The Eldest
Pacific powerbloc-The Elephant
South America-The Colonists
Some Middle east powerbloc-The Crescent

>>26821877
Makes sense.

The future happened more quickly than anticipated. By 2020 the People's Republic of China had outpaced the United States as the no.1 nation economically, and both had advanced beyond the European Union's collective economic strength.

The 2016 Diaoyu Conflict set in motion the formation of the East Asian Congress in the early form of a military alliance of nations with South China Sea disputes with the PRC, gave the PRC a tangible win over the United States and dealt a blow the nascent Pacific Turn of US foreign policy, and breathed new life into militarism in Japan and opposition to the US fleet stationed at Okinawa.

The Syrian Intervention continued the process of European military adventurism seen in Libya and Mali, pushed to the breaking point the American people's appetite for overseas conflict, and unwound the entire region when the victorious rebels turned on each other. The chaos spread into the Levant and Mesopotamia, and along with the continued transition of Egypt into a failed state marked the beginning of the Arab Wars, which largely took the entire Middle Eastern region "out of play" in world politics for decades.

Meanwhile, the Egyptian-style protests in Brazil spread throughout Mercosur. The painful process of de-Bolivarization in Venezuela led to massive populist reprisals against the new neoliberal government, and the softer left in Brazil and Argentina had no easier a time of it as the people's demands stopped being outwardly focused (an end to American and IMF neoliberal hegemony in Latin America) in favor of inward focus (clean government, increased democracy, dissolution of the political class). The Americas were in flux and would stay that way for decades, not just in the South but in the United States' Northern neighbor as well. The rise of the first New Democrat government in Canada set of the chain of events that would ultimately lead to the nation splitting up (first in the West and then Quebec).

>>26822318

And in Europe, Scottish secession doomed any move by Britain to leave or reform its relationship within the European Union; setting it along the long path towards being part of a Federal Europe.

The end of the Korean armistice and completion of the war in the 2020's catalyzed the potential for the East Asian Congress created by the Diaoyu Conflict into a reality, as did the PRC naval buildup as it ascended to premiere military power status (or at least largest military spender, with decades to go in overtaking the US). Skirmishes and disputes with China over Indian Ocean trade routes guranteed India's membership in the military alliance; and the joint effort to fund the reconstruction of the unified post-war Korea led to the economic and political community. Korea was also the last call for American supremacy in the Pacific, having won the war but lost the peace as the negotiations among the allies against the depraved DPRK were dominated by China and the proto-Congress.

In Europe, Russia had ascended to the status of the largest individual economy in the early 2020's, gradually leading to even closer Euro-Russian relations as Russian energy supplies fueled European "reconstruction" after the dark days of the 2010's and the economic depression. Putin's death and the repeal of the anti-homosexuality laws, as well as Russian support for the European intervention in the case of anti-semitic riots in Hungary, allowed the relationship to move forward at a greater pace than anyone would have previously anticipated.

>>26822323
The 30's and 40's saw the growth of the megacities, as metropolitan sprawls grew together into economic and political entities more important to their residents than previously existing provincial and national borders; undermining the states in the US and the nation-state in Europe. The final conflict between rural and urban America took place in this period, ultimately leading to the popular vote in presidential elections by the early 2050's.

This was also the period of Chinese reunification, as economic and government reforms (but no significant political reforms) made the distinction between the PRC and RoC fundamentally meaningless, continuing the trend of Taiwan as a special administration zone of the mainland in all but name that had been happening since the 90's. However, this period also saw the Congress permanently settle the matter of the South China Sea in their favor, having grown out of the shame of Chinese victory over the issue of the Diaoyu/Senkakus decades prior.

[More stuff from 2050 to 2100 - what is depends on what we make the four powers like. Just keep in mind that the world outside of the four powers remains in flux, static zones of influence or minor regional alliances resisting the influence of the greater powers doesn't lead to a dynamic and interesting setting, so the century should have high and low points and continual change in Latin America and Africa]

The majority of the 21st century was marked by four roughly equal powers (China, Eurorussia, the US, and the East Asia Conress), a situation which by the end of the century had become untenable. The dawn of the 22nd would be one of military, economic, and political conflict. That and nothing else was certain.

Then they build space elevators and the plot to Gundam 00 starts.

>>26821877
The more realistic Middle East would be dualist, Teheran bloc and Riyadh-Ankara alliance.

>>26822435
Turkey's deep in the USA's pocket and have been vying for EU Accession since the Cold War. I can't see that changing any time soon unless something radical happened. The thing about this setting would be that both powers would have a stake in Turkey and would be attempting to compete for it.

What I could see however would be a war starting in Turkey between the Turks and the PKK (Kurdish independence movement). This could have been ignited by the Arab Wars or something. The interesting question could be who backed who? Could it be a proxy war of USA vs Euro-Rus?

>>26822350

Or EndWar tyle orbital military platforms.

Or just commercial/national peaceful space development.

Either way, that is a cool aspect of 00 Gundam (the Human Reform League's space elevator, The International, for example). So what kind of names are we looking at for the four orbital stations here?

PRC:

>The paramount leader of the People's Republic of China from 1978 to 1992 Deng Xiaoping changed the cultural fabric of the Chinese society and decided names used in the space program, previously all chosen from the revolutionary history of the PRC, would be replaced with mystical-religious ones. Thus, new Long March carrier rockets were renamed Divine arrow (神箭),[12][13] spacecapsule Divine vessel (神舟),[14] space shuttle Divine dragon (神龙),[15] land-based high-power laser Divine light (神光)[16] and supercomputer Divine might (神威).[17]

>These poetic[18] names continue as the first, second, third, fourth and fifth Chinese Lunar probes are called Chang'e after the moon goddess. The name "Tiangong" means "heavenly palace". Across the PRC the launch of Tiangong 1 inspired a variety of feelings, including love poetry. Within the PRC, the rendezvous of space vehicles is compared to the dreaming of the cowherd and the weavergirl, Niulang Chinese: 牛郎 and Zhinü Chinese: 織女, lovers separated by the milky way which was scratched there by an angry goddess. Only on the night of sevens, over a bridge made from all of the sympathetic magpies in the world, the lovers may meet. The remainder of the year, Zhinü sits on the banks of the 'milky way' river with two of her children and weaves the clouds, with Niulang on the other side.

>>26824896
Dude, Turkey has a huge internal rift going between west-coastal "we Europe nao" and backwoods "we Islam again", and the latter have been elbowing their way to power like mad, that's what the protests were largely about.
EU integration has been all but abandoned by Erdoğan.
On top of that, they've been pretty consistent pals with Riyadh's bros. Top that with Saudis themselves being kind-of-sort-of in line with US interests of late.

New and brighter Kurdish fire would be very interesting, I agree, as this time they have a base (it's probably gonna happen IRL anyway).
Kurds have lately been hopping sides and switching friends to whichever suit them better, and while EU has been weird and inconsistent in ME, Russia is getting more and more solidly on Teheran-Shia side.
Although that Saudi prince hinted that he reached some new understanding with Russia, probably with relation to Syria.
This region could turn so many different ways, you'd lose count of the back stabs.

>>26824896
Chinese and Congressional involvement would upset the old proxy war method like crazy, probably to the benefit of the pawns, they'd have competition between their "buyers."
Sides would switch constantly.
Maybe it'll be altogether more peaceful, though.

Bumping a very awesome thread?

>>26825579

Will the AKP ever forgive the Sauds, Kuwaitis, and Jordanians for supporting the Egyptian military coup? Also the way things are going there could be a Kemalist coup in Turkey that might pave the way to a hypocritical change in Europe's heart integration wise.

>>26793774
The European power could be the Lion (assuming they are London-based) or the Bear (Moscow).

>>26826230
>London.
>A place that is relevant on the world stage.

Pick one.

>>26796965
>Hell, a book series about this would fucking make bank.

Would /tg/ be mad if I used some of these ideas in a story that I'm working on?

It's post-apocalyptic, but it would be good to detail, at least in part, the events leading up towards the End.

>>26821877
>Europe
>The Old World
>Laughing Chinese Dragon

Part of living in a world balanced by more then western powers, will be the need to shift paradigms away from solely western points of view.

Also, why is Africa a power bloc at all? It'll be neo-Imperialism at its finest with the four blocks squabbling over their resources.

>>26825579
>>26826159
That depends on the political power the AKP will yield in the next few elections. Certainly the Gezi Park Protests this year will have encouraged a lot of (young) people to vote against the AKP/Islamism, some of them will be coming of voting age too.

But understandably there is a big Islamic/Islamist section of the society. I'd assume a lot of them are the older generations, who will die out soon IRL.

So assume Turkey joins this EU in this game. Then the Islamist faction in the East become more radical and desperate given the Arab Wars and a "situation" occurs there. The Kurds seize the opportunity and declare themselves a free state amongst the chaos?

>>26826958
It's been stated several times that Africa isn't a power bloc so much as it's a battleground for the four powers.

>>26826362
You gonna thank us in the forward?

>>26827003
Yeah, some people were saying Power Bloc: Eldest when I stepped away. Didn't catch up with the thread when I got back.

I'm sorry.

>>26827057
Certainly.

How would you like to be credited?

>>26827112
Sages of the Four Khans.

>>26827184
And Teej, the Wisest Amongst Them.

>>26827112
>>26827184
Done.

>>26827227
Don't forget the Teej part or we'll fucking sue you

>>26827227
I did not mean to quote myself; I meant to quote both >>26827184 and >>26827193.

Credit where credit is due.

>>26827360
Bother.

This time I meant to quote >>26827327.

Sorry.

>>26793774
i stopped reading after the largest economy by 2020...you are a fuckign moron and do not read anything coming out about how the progress of china is overinflated because it is pegged partyl onto the measure of pollutants it produces...fuck off pleb

>>26827485
Here comes Debby Downer.

>>26827485
>Opening statement: These estimates are always wrong
>Follow up statement: Let's pretend, for fun!
>Final statement: Be Excellent
>Post Script Statement: Don't be haughty if you can't use basic grammar.

>>26827003

Why, Islamist radicals are obviously Arab refugee militants. The Kemalist national government is requesting Confederation-level troops to help quell these outside agitators, for the peace of Europe and the world.

Ok, that's a bit heavy-handed, but one bit I've been mulling over, and have in the timeline bit I posted, is that Eurocorps type troops, primarily German, march into Hungary and are actually celebrated by the international community and peace activists; because they were intervening against anti-semitic riots abetted by the ultra-hardline elements loosely attached to the ruling party.

>>26829391

The point being this is a future where people no longer are as skeptical as we would imagine when German tanks roll in to "restore order". A few legitimate humanitarian interventions get the Eurofederal train rolling and that lays future expectations.

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>>26824896
>PKK
>Kurdish independence movement

>>26827003
>That depends on the political power the AKP will yield in the next few elections. Certainly the Gezi Park Protests this year will have encouraged a lot of (young) people to vote against the AKP/Islamism, some of them will be coming of voting age too.

>But understandably there is a big Islamic/Islamist section of the society. I'd assume a lot of them are the older generations, who will die out soon IRL.

Check out Turkey's new education system.
You will find your mistake there.

>>26829391
>The Kemalist national government

If only

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>>26795495

atrange thing about China is they will bw thw worlds largest economy but will still have a tremendous amount of development ahead of them. The largest economy in the world will be a second world country with a first world fringe along the Pacific Ocean and a third world interior.

>>26829718
What's wrong with that?

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>>26796965
>Exactly. Hell, a book series about this would fucking make bank. Every side has a legit reason to be sympathetic - China while aggressive is still simply trying to provide for the absurd number of people within its borders. The US is trying to prevent a three way pacific war and a repeat of the Island Hopping campaign - with modern weaponry. Eurorussia is trying to simply well... exist unmolested. The Congress is trying to remain independent.

That DOES sound like an interesting book series

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>>26797037
>They don't want the US to meddle in the Pacific either, because they ARE the Pacific for the most part.

somehow I missed that.

>>26797371

America may not be worth joining eventually.

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>>26797528
>>26797588

Ummmmm English IS the language of business and government in India. You know that right?

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>>26801156

I know sore feelings remain between Japan and the rest of the Pacific over the attrocities Japan committed during WW2. (or at least dominant governments, particularly the PRC like to bring attention to that)


I wonder how that would effect things with a commonwealth.

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>>26802188

Wow. thats the first I've hear of anything effective happening in reguards to China steeling technical secrets.

Tell me more.

>>26831160
>>26831226
>>26831295
I don't get it. Are you avatarfagging or flooding?

>>26808668

watching greece slide into the sea, and Spain and Italy possibly be torn apart by a civil wars now.

Its scary shit.

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>>26808897
>http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/26793774/
>Take a long look at the massive wall of shit on sup/tg/'s current archive page. At least something novel and interesting can be added onto there.


Remember to upvote the thread so it STAYS in the archive.

Unless you don't want to.

you can vote here http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive.html

>>26813513
>Yodeling Pretzel

I asociate pretzels with America.

Then again I associate lots of German things with America.

>>26813736

It is also where apple trees came from. Though the natural apple forests are disappearing.

>>26814632
>Oligarichal Kleptocracy


Isn't that what the US was in the late 1800's and has become again (it's just better hidden and has more of its components in other countries)

>>26818799
>That prediction for the EU has a 3.4 billion growth from the GDP in 2010. That's the growth of the UK, France and Germany alone. I'd be surprised if Spain, Italy and Eastern Europe don't grow at all in the next 7 years.


Doesen't Slovakia have one of the fastest growing economies in Europe?

>>26831965
Yeah, Eastern Europe is doing fantastic. It's just France, Italy, Spain, and Greece dragging everyone down.

>>26822318
>>26822323
>>26822328

How come you didn't cover whats going on in Murrica itself?

>>26827112

The anons of 4chan?

>>26832107
Dude, half the things you're saying have been said before.
What's your rush? Why the barrage? This isn't twitter.

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>>26808758
>>26808836

>>26793891
>Saved from a trend of disintegration by Scottish secession, leaving the United Kingdom in pieces that gradually gravitated towards European federalism

Suspension of disbelief broken, an independent Scotland will never happen.

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>>26813513
>Two headed eagle
>Imperial Aquila
>Eurasia is the beginning of the Imperium of Man

I like this. The two-headed aquila it is!

>>26832236

Well, Nate Platinum - Modern Day Oracle, agrees with you.

But there a few better ways of ensuring the British Isles continue on in the EU and drift closer to the Eurozone core than starting to split the UK up into bits.

Because if 5 million Scots get independence, the 8 million Londoners will want autonomy, and Wales while independence is a fringe issue has a majority in favor of devo-max.

Bumping.

So, if the US is the Eagle and the Russian Bear is not a thing, the Bull for Europe?

Some thoughts on their individual strengths -

People's Republic of China: Carries the most diplomatic and economic weight on the world stage.

European Confederation: The leading light of scientific research (such as international high-energy physics labs), intellectual freedom, and of course industrial espionage of non-European corporations.

United States: Abundant natural resources and the unique geographic advantage among the four powers of being separated from all of its rivals by an ocean.

East Asia Congress: The most manpower, sitting on the most contested supply-route (the Straits of Malacca and the Indian Ocean exit/entry to the Gulf/Suez Canal) in the world, and some truly hellacious terrain for would-be invaders.

I love this.

>>26840187

The Congress, covering ASEAN (Southeast Asia and Indomalaya/Austronesia) plus Japan and India and either and Korea and Australia, would represent such a population (with India set to be the world's most populous nation by 2030) and such a large geographic area, covering such important waters strategically speaking, that no matter how poor it averaged out to be over the majority of its members and populace, would be nothing to sneeze at. Especially when you combine Indian+Indonesia manpower with Indian+Japanese (and possibly Korean) tech.

One idea, stolen from the book Star Fraction by Scot socialist scifi author Ken MacCleod, would be having Communist parties be widely known to everyone to represent democracy, nationalism, and free markets; and socialism to be a dirty word representing hardline crazy radicals trying to upend the entire global system - with labor and democratic socialist parties feared and Communist parties as the moderate parties that have some sympathizers and support covertly for said socialists.

When you look at China, Vietnam, and Laos; Communist Parties that exist in most parts of the world leading later generations to equate communists with generic nationalist type parties isn't so far-fetched.

Europe might tie everything into an enlightenment bow, an uninterrupted march of progress towards the goals of the 18th century liberals - from the American Revolution to the French Revolution to Napoleon nearly unifying Europe to the Chartists and the Grain Laws to the expansion of the franchise to the Springtime of Nations to the additional French revolutions all the way to the October Revolution, incorporating Russia's political upheavals in its narrative of Europe as the forefront of human progress towards some sort of Enlightenment ideals oriented world state.

To reiterate from much earlier in the thread, my idea would be the political scene in Europe has been throughout most of the unification period dominated by the Ordodemokraten, who instituted a lot of the Enlightenment-focus in national culture, but the growing counterculture is Christian existentialist in nature, basically Kierkegard and Tolstoy oriented.