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>There is a species of animal that has the females growing pseudo-dongs, in addition to being bigger and meaner than the male. They will fake-mount both males and females to establish dominance.
Nature has some very odd fetishes.

> The date stone beetle feeds on and spends at least part of its life within dates, which are the fruit of the date palm. As soon as a clutch of beetle eggs hatch, brother and sister will quickly mate with one another, but all is not lost if a young female misses out on this opportunity. She will go off in search of another date stone, boring into it and excavating a chamber within. She will then lay a clutch of unfertilised eggs, all of which will hatch into males. The female mates with her first son that reaches maturity and then she lays a larger batch of fertilised eggs that will hatch into both males and females.

>As for the beetle’s son/lover… well, she eats him just as soon as mating is complete, and then she goes on to devour his poor brothers, who ended up serving no purpose whatsoever.
That's a lot of fetishes in one species.

>>45781160
I don't know if we can top this, and I don't want to see if we can.

>>45781183
>The female Adactylidium mite, meanwhile, lives her entire life as a parasite on the eggs of a tiny insect called a thrip. From the moment she is born, she already has several females and a single male developing within her body. The baby females inside her take it in turns to copulate with their brother even before they are born. As they moult and grow, they start devouring their mother from the inside. Eventually, the mother mite is little more than a swollen bag of discarded shells and faeces, and the tiny impregnated females within her now cut holes in their mother’s body so they can emerge and find their own thrip eggs to live on. Unequipped to move or even feed on his own, the lone male will die still within his mother’s dead remains. In essence, all male Adactylidium mites die before they have even been born. But his sister’s don’t fare much better, though – within a few short days, they too will have been eaten alive from the inside by their own offspring.
I think we can.

>>45781243
Nature is pretty yeah. Until you look too closely.

I remember some kind of insect that rapes the females while they're larvae by literally drilling a hole in them. The sperm stays inside them until they become adults and get instantly pregnant.

>>45782130
I don't want to learn about nature anymore... Yes I Do.

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well then, i've had enough /tg/ for the day

Shrikes impale small animals on thorns and twigs and eat them while they slowly die. Fucking edgelord setting...

>>45789090
>you will never crucify a mouse and dine upon it while it serenades you with its dying squeaks

>>Dolphins will wrap eels around their dicks to jack it
>>Dolphins will rip off a fish's head and rapethe corpse
>>Dolphins will have violent and bloody orgies
>>A dolphin had a sexual relationship with his female trainer, and when she was arrested, he committed suicide

Dolphin facts for today /tg/

Mama Nature magical realms pretty hard.

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>>45789169
>>45789090
CAWWWING IIIIN MY SKIIIIN

This thread is making me feel... funny

>>45789421
>that feel when I have one of those things living in my yard
>I put out bird seed for it to eat because I thought it was a pretty song bird
>it never eats the seed, but seems to have gotten fatter over time
My god, I was luring in its prey.

All those poor sparrows...

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>>45789421

>Those soulless eyes

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>>45789269
Guess who just got inspiration for mermaids!

>>45778623
We're not done yet boyos! There are several species of jumping spider that catch and kill female mosquitoes for the sole purpose of using the blood they store inside of them as a sort of cologne.

If we're looking to go even deeper into the magical realm then let me tell you fine folk all about squids: The males of some squid species have a special sexual organ that they can literally fill with sperm and launch from their bodies and into a female squid, whether she wants it or not. She can't just go removing the organ either; Along with burrowing further into the flesh on its own, the organ secretes an enzyme that allows it to be broken down and causes the female to absorb the sperm. You guys get what i'm saying yet? It's drive by rape. Squids have found a way to make feminist fantasies a reality. They can rape without even touching you!

>>45780833
>yfw they have to give birth through those, and they have litters
And you wonder why female hyenas are so mean.

>>45791052
Never seen anyone be this informative while projecting this hard

>>45791168
It's a gift anon. Even when shitposting I aim to teach.

>>45780833

canus sarkeesianus, right?

>>45789421
>>45789090
>>45789169
This adaptation came from Shrikes learning that a poisonous creature (I believe it was a beetle) could be eaten by killing them and let the poison loose it's effectiveness. Now they do it to everything they hunt just to be safe.

>>45789269
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_zqiAceKzbg

AND HERE ARE SOME VISUAL REPRESENTATIONS

>>45791279
Kind of makes you wonder how the hell they figured that out in the first place, doesn't it? It almost seems like at some point one got fed up with getting food poisoning every time it ate a beetle and decided to just impale a few of them to be spiteful.

>>45778623
Just google traumatic insemination

>>45791243
I see the joke, but Hyena's aren't actually of the genus Canis. They're technically feliforms, and more closely related to cats then to dogs.

>>45791085
Aren't they actually highly sociable and tameable?

>>45791551
Hyaena Sarkeesians, right?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_HrvhM4cOpo [Embed]
Scorpions are the most deviant of creatures, engaging in hand-holding along with dancing, and cannibalism if the female happens to be hungry.

>>45791395
Sometimes it takes a while to kill thing. When you eat thing that's been dead for a while, no poisoning. So you start trying to kill things and come back to them, but if you just leave it on the ground, it's not there when you come back. So you put it up high, in a place where you can remember. Done.

>>45781160
Youknow, I really like that "got no males? No probs, just make some." thing in insects. Unlike humies, if we lose all the Y chromosome carriers, they're gone.

>>45791897
>Naw baby, don't go, come here
>Come on, let's dance, here, gimme those pincers
>...now, what do you say to some mating?
>And... m-maybe you eat me after~?

>>45789269
How the fuck does a dolphin commit suicide?

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>>45789421
>>45789169
>>45789090
>>45789556
>>45791279
Also appearing in children's television!

>>45794662
Drowned itself I guess

>>45794662
With a few paces of rope, a bottle of pills and a gun, duh.

>>45794830
My main memory of that show was when they had to cross a road, and the hedgehogs didn't make it.

>>45794662
Are you implying it was murder?

That someone else killed the dolphin and made it look like a suicide... on porpoise?

>>45794890
>>/out/

>>45794879
I don't remember a whole lot either. I was barely 10 years old when it was on tv. I did watch the first few episodes again a year back or so.

there's that one duck that engaged in homosexual necrophilia
but that may have been an isolated deviant

>>45794928
All ducks are necrophiliac rapists with 9 inch corkscrew penii

>>45794853
Still don't know what the dolphin would do with both the rope and the gun. Sure, one or the other makes sense, but both are just kinda overkill.

>>45795035
see a dolphin, lacking hands, can neither aim a gun at himself nor properly tie a noose around its own neck
it needs to instead tie the rope to the gun trigger, then pull it when the gun is secured and aimed at its own head

dolphin suicide is hard

>>45795045
>One in every ten dolphins is driven to suicide by the dificulty of dolphin suicide
>#Graylivesmatter

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>>45791395

Probably started as a mating ritual and then developed into a feeding strategy from there.

>>45791085
I read that as
>>yfw they have to give birth through the nose
Holy shit, I'm glad I was wrong.

>>45792100
Haplodiploidy best day of their lives.

>>45795085
Lost my sides

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>>45791897

If you think that's bad some boy spiders kiss each other while feeling each others thoraxes

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Fellow anons, behold: Da Booty
Also known as the living Dickbutt.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pigbutt_worm

>>45791643
The males are. Females, not so much.

>>45785680
>You will never read Blip again
My fucking heart.

K, my love.

>>45795160
Male fruit flies will occasionally fuck smaller (but still adult) males. This can be a bit of a hassle since fruit fly semen is very long and sticky and can get smaller one stuck in place.

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>>45789269
>>Dolphins will rip off a fish's head and rape the corpse
not sure I can post this on a SFW board, but I'll give it a go - for science

probably shouldn't watch this if you ever eat fish pies with creamy fillings - because after this, you won't

>>45789269
>>>A dolphin had a sexual relationship with his female trainer, and when she was arrested, he committed suicide
Can I have a citation on this?
For science, obviously

>>45795201
>wanting to eat anything that spends its entire life in the same medium it defecated, urinates, and mates in
Stay pleb.

>>Gaia, stop inserting your terrible fetishes in the game.
>>I am going to pollute you.

>>45795230
http://nypost.com/2014/06/10/the-dolphin-that-fell-in-love-with-a-human/

You could have googled that yourself anon

>>45795247
Dude, I get what you mean, but as you were typing that there are millions of dust mites shitting all over you and your entire home and eating your dead skin, not to mention those mites that live in hair follicles, especially the eyelash ones.

>>45795195
That semen is fucking hilarious. I imagine it like moving tape from one cassete to another.

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>So God, you're telling me that this setting has asien men in things dicing under water to fetch and eat clams that are shaped like dicks?
>Yes
>STOP INJECTING YOYR FETISHES!

>>45795294
Yep. And just like casette tape it's longer than its container. Which is why it has to curl up tightly in fruit fly testicles to even fit.

>>45795279
Mites gotta live too and i'm a recycling type so their just helping me erase my Footprint on mother natures ass. I also don't eat them out of respect for fellow coworkers.

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>>45795382
>>45795294
This is to scale.

What about certain breeds of anglerfish? The males are born much smaller than the giantess females and are unable to survive by themselves. So they seek out a female, mate with her and then meld bodily with her, losing all brain functions to become a living dildo for the female to use whenever she wants. Females can have multiple of these sex-slaves melded into their body at once.
If there was a setting with a race like this in it I'd call it magical realm in a heartbeat.

>>45791085
>here are severe reproductive costs to this androgenfueled hyper masculinization of female spotted hyena. Nearly all female spotted hyena’s first-born cubs are stillborn, as the placenta is not long enough for the extended penile birth canal. In addition, the first birthing process is time consuming, as it requires the meatus of the pseudo-penis to tear, allowing the fetus to pass through; as a result, the first-born often die of anoxia.

>>45795477

The extra length is so that it can contain a load of special chemicals to aid fertilisation and to kill off other sperm and to neutralise other sperm's chemicals designed to kill it off.

The chemical cocktail tends to leave female fruit flies a bit cum drunk after sex.

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>>45795490
Step up, senpai.
>The planktonic, free-swimming Bonellia larvae are initially sexually undifferentiated. Larvae which land on unoccupied sea-floor mature, over the period of years, into adult females. Most larvae, however, come in contact with the bonellin in the skin of an adult female—its body or its roving, bonellin-rich proboscis—and are masculinised by this exposure. The chemical causes these larvae to develop into the tiny males, which cling to the female's body or are sucked inside it by the feeding tube, to spend the remainder of their lives inside her genital sac, producing sperm to fertilize her eggs, reliant on her for all other needs

>>45781243
And there are honestly people who think God made all life

What God would make something like this, honestly, what would be the point

Female bed bugs don't have vaginas, so the males mates by stabbing the female with it's knife dick and injecting it's semen into her.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cw9XP01QnIw

>>45796588
But, anon, god works in mysterious ways. Far be it from us lowly humans to try and even GUESS at his incredible plans and machinations. How can our feeble intellect justify questioning something with enough power and wisdom to create the universe in 7 days when i takes us months just to build a skyscraper?

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>>45795490
Really the deep sea in general is pretty damn Magical. It's like God stuck all of his vore fetish stuff down there hoping nobody would notice it, like hiding porn under your bed. Deep sea fish are also almost universally either hermaphroditic or have tiny short-lived males that exist purely to mate with a female and then die.

>>45796506
I always find it amusing that Charles Darwin never really saw his theory of evolution to be in conflict with himself being a Christian, but when he learned about parasitoid wasps he lost his faith because no way would a loving god allow for somethign like that to exist.

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>>45796588
Apparently they do and use it only to lay eggs. Males just don't give a fuck.

>>45796612
>Hey Dad!
>Jesus Christ, don't surprise me like that, I was staring at seraphim, they look really lewd trying to hide from my gaze with their wings
>Thats real great dad, but can you tell me something
>Always listening kid
>Yeah alright, um...what the hell is up with all the weird shit you made. Like, sure most of them are bugs n microscopic stuff, but you got living things down there raping each other to make babies, reproducing in their mother's carcass, stabbing each other to have sex, and look at that one, it's literally shooting it's babies into another animal, and don't get me started on the way some of these penises look, seriously what the fuck dad.
>It's a message, son
>What the fuck kind of message
>That if they don't straighten their act up, they won't get to hang out with lewd seraphim, and instead will have to live with all that shit down there.

>>45794890
I'm proud of you, Anon.

>>45796637
Why do you think it's so damn dark down there

If you go deep enough you'll find old photos of angels posing lewdly

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>>45796687
>>That if they don't straighten their act up, they won't get to hang out with lewd seraphim, and instead will have to live with all that shit down there.
God makes a compelling argument.

>>45795490
Compared to some of the stuff in thread, that just seems normal.

>>45778623
Whatever your argument.

Dont bring weird shit intpo tabletops.

>>45782130

There's also a beetle that mates by stabbing the female through the abdomen with their penis to get straight to the ovaries. No sex needed.

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>>45794890

Don't forget fish that can switch between sexes. Look up sequential hermaphroditism.

Can someone archive this?

>>45796813
I think the process is known as traumatic insemination. Pretty sure bedbugs do it too.

>>45797145
Wait, NVM, they already got it covered.

>>45781299
>nature is pretty yeah

I don't know that nature is very yeah at all.

>>45795045
Prehensile dick

There is a Bee virus that makes a bee larvae cocoon itself in glue. The cocoon is kind of like sweat that dries into a substance like clingfilm plastic. Inside this see through sleeping bag prison the developing larva seems to writhe in agony as it slowly dissolves. The "sweat bag" is strong enough that you can pick up the bees liquefied remains by the bag and it looks like a half filled water balloon with all the liquid remained at the bottom.

>>45797841
>it looks like a half filled water balloon with all the liquid remained at the bottom.
you mean it looks like a used condom?

>>45797968
>you mean it looks like a used condom?
No need to bring Op's mom into this

>>45798012
I didn't know you were siblings

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>>45798120
>>45798012

>>45796687
Actually a really good point.

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>>45797841
So the queen is suddenly dead. The hive is now missing its only fertile female. The bees become listless, they don't know what to do with themselves, they have no reason to exist.

A thought suddenly washes over the hive mind and 30,000 individuals suddenly start working with new purpose. The window of opportunity is closing fast, time is short, and an egg is selected out of the few that have yet to hatch.

The cell that the egg was laid into is renovated. Workers tirelessly expand the cell outwards for the developing larva. The craftsmanship is shoddy, the cell looks rickety and cobbled together, but the colony is dying, time is short and the process requires more room. Once work is complete the workers begin force feeding the larva a powerful mutagen, called royal jelly. The developing larva distends and mutates rapidly... After only 16 days, from the start of the process, the worker emerges as a slightly stunted emergency queen.

The new queen isn't very good, she's squat and slightly deformed, but after she's mated and starts laying the second part of the hive minds plan can begin.

While the emergency queen works away, keeping the hive supplied with eggs, the workers are painstakingly crafting a perfect queen cell. The emergency queen lays an egg into this specially designed cup and the workers keep it filled with food. 16 days later a supersedure queen emerges. The workers spent a lot of time and energy developing her and she is perfect in every way. After the emergency queen is destroyed, and the supersedure queen has returned from her nuptial flight, the colony will return to normality and quickly grows in strength.

>>45798438
This is, also, relatively tame compared to some of the stuff in this thread. It's pretty neat, though.

>>45789421
top keke

>>45791643
Well, they're highly sociable at least. This may be expressed through rape however

>>45794851
>underrated post

>>45800887
>>45794851
He actually did. Just one day decided to stop surfacing for air after being moved from an insanely free range habitat with a women he was courting and falling in love with to a dingy disused bank converted over for temporary (hopefully) dolphin storage.

>>45801598
That's actually kinda sad.

>>45798438
>you will never be born incomplete after a childhood of forcefeeding and mutation
>you will never be forced to give birth to your replacement, forced to raise a child that will quickly take over your position and is predestined to be better than you in every way.

it's a good feeling

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Could this setting be any edgier if they tried?

>>45802717
...Did that crocodile just rip off the leg of that other crocodile? And moreover, did the croc that just got its leg ripped off completely ignore it?
Man, crocodiles are hardcore.

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>>45778623
>this man has never wanted to have cool wushu fights with his waifu that end in passionate love
Just when I think the tastes around here can't get any more shit.

>>45803065
boy that gator farmer/zoo keeper must sure feel stupid now.

>>45789421
"you left me no choice. To do harm to the headmaster means death! MAGICAL LANCE GUNGNIR!!"

>>45802717
I like how they all just paused, then the one with the lost limb just looks at the culprit
>...
>Frank...did you just tear my off?
>Did you guys just see that shit?
>Did Frank really just tear off and swallow my motherfucking arm?
>I swear to god Frank this is the last time I've having lunch with you.

>>45803375
>Thanks Frank, not like I needed that.
>asshole

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>>45795535
What sadist god designed this beast?

STOP

>>45805449
It's too late to stop.

>>45791551
Pretty sure they are more closely related to weasels than cats.

This is the thread for me. I'm a biologist and I live off weird animal mating facts.

Let's start small and cute. The mating habits of garter snakes are a rather simple by snake standards; a female comes out of hibernation and releases a pheromone signaling her willingness to breed. She's instantly surrounded by a veritable crowd of males that make a literal ball around her.

Some males, after they're done mating with a female, release the exact same pheromone around them that females do, to get males to crowd around them. Not to mate, of course, but to steal their warmth and to use as a living protection from predators.

Garter snakes have a trap, gay4pay system.

>>45805826
Bonobos' entire societal structure seems to revolve around sex.

Bonobos use sex as greetings, a mean of solving disputes, making up for fights, and as a favors in exchange for food. They tongue kiss, engage in oral sex, mutual masturbations, have face-to-face genital sex and even have a strange "penis fencing" ritual. It's not restricted to straight (or monogamous) couples either. Gay sex still happens and it's treated just as casually. So are orgies and threesomes.

>>45796687
Got me, I'll convert.

>>45796931
Seconded

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>>45796687
My sides have ascended the mortal plane, to the company of the heavenly host and his lewd seraphim.

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>>45797145
Traumatic insemination is one hell of a drug.

>>45805874
I am glad bonobos aren't sapient. Can you imagine them talking?
>"Grandma for fucks stop making a mess everywhere"
>"Oh calm down you little shit while nana gives you a handy to make it all better"

>>45805965
Thirded

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>>45796506
>what God would make something like this

There's only one answer

>>45791643
Taming wild animals is never a good idea shocking I know because no matter how hard you try to get the wild out of them, they still have a chance to attack and kill you.
Check out deadly attraction on animal planet. They did a hyena episode.>>45791897

>this thread
I feel like half this shit is what Khorne and Slaanesh would have pillow talk about.

>>45801598
That's actually really sad. He just wanted to love...

>>45807689
Modern Romeo and Juliet story

>>45780833
>They will fake-mount both males and females to establish dominance

Stop repeating this. I know it panders to your futa fetish, but it's wrong.

However, female hyenas are still females and behave as such - female-female mounting is rare, and the females are incapable of actually mating. If a hyena pup indulges in sex play, involving mounting other pups, that hyena is almost invariably a male.

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>>45791085
they destroy their clit tube in their first birth (which almost always results in the death of their cub) and then after that first time they give birth normally

>>45808846
its like a super hymen

>>45806064
But Bonobos are sapient

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>>45795535
>>45808846

HOLY FUCK

I didn't know this fact before, but the webcomic Digger has a race of hyena people who have invented an entire mythology as to why their first kids die.

And yes, they're a matriarchal society too. The whole thing with the hyenas is astoundingly well done and doesn't nosedive into furry shit.

My mind's pretty blown right now.

>>45809430
Gladly no, Bonobos are sentient animals. Almost all life is sentient but so far only humans are sapient.

>>45795188
Did Blip ever finish? It kind of stopped around the part Alan Moore appeared and it fell off my radar.

>>45795188
My heart broke when the updates stopped.

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>>45807092
Does this look like an unhealthy and possibly fatal relathionship?

>>45810360
Define sapient.

>>45794890
Thought this was gonna be an Ace Ventura reference

>>45811892
Yes

>>45810360
Bonobos have display tool use and culture. They are very likely sapient, along with dolphins, crows and elephants.

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>>45812146
Maybe you jus ain man enuf whitboi.

>>45811892
>youre now aware that hyena are related to the mongoose

>>45812167
and fish breath in water. it doesnt necessarily mean anything if animals use tools a little bit. its could just mean that in their way of life they had need for it and adapted. its more likely a case of scientist setting a standard (tool use) that doesnt really mean as much as we thought it did at first

you can train a pigeon to solve problems at like a 5 year olds level or something. does that mean a pigeon is as smart as a 5 year old or does that mean tool use doesnt necessarily mean much?

their culture is more like "culture" just like how their sign language skills are more like "sign language skills". researches and the media have a way of blowing things out of proportion

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>>45812183
I can't help but think this will only end in tears.

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>>45812183
>niggers try hard and probably die trying to do something for status that loser white neets do for fun

nice muzzle fuckboi

>>45812222
Please, mighty trips. Tell me someone actually tried and fired that.
>>45812223
Its a Face Hat you uncivilized unfashionable plebeian. It compliments and accentuates the Rug Skirt.

>>45812200
The tool use in indicative of reasoning and learning, which are the literal definitions of sapient. The fact they learn and teach different practices unique to various populations is indicative of something more than instinct. You're probably right that the standard probably doesn't mean as much as we thought it did, but it's still what sapience means.
Also, pigeons are pretty high on the animal intelligence scale.

>>45812283
>The tool use in indicative of reasoning and learning

again this doesnt really mean as much as you think it means. basically every animals learns. it doesnt mean anything to say an animal learns. a bear can ride a bicycle. you can teach fucking goldfish synchronized swimming

it used to be that we thought tool use was indicative of HIGH levels of reasoning and learning but for one, that assumption was based off of nothing but common sense and secondly it seems to not really be the case

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WiYLOkXuHAc

their "culture" is incredibly basic and never builds on itself. they learn to use a stick in some very simple way and then forget and then relearn. we seem to be doing the same thing with early idea of tool use. "culture" may not be very special and lots of animals may have some degree of very basic "culture". for instance tons of animals behave differently if they were raised in captivity suggesting that when they are raised by parents they are taught a set of skills and often time those skills depend on the area (what is safe to eat, what to avoid, song bird calls, etc)

>>45803212
Hatoful dangan ronpa when

>>45812331
if this sounds like moving the goal post it is. but only because we dont know what human intelligence is and the more we learn about animals the more we learn how different we are from them and have to reevaluate our ideas and definitions of intelligence and what makes a human a human

>>45812331
Dude, that shit does mean a whole lot considering a lot of animals can't even recognize their own existence. The distinction of tool use and culture, no matter how basic, signifies a significant difference in the level of awareness said animal has of itself and its environment compared to other animals, our own species included.

>>45812558
>Dude, that shit does mean a whole lot
says who and why? more importantly does any science back it up? (i already know the answer its no)

>>45812558
>The distinction of tool use and culture, no matter how basic, signifies a significant difference in the level of awareness
then it may be easy to list the animals that DONT have an incredibly basic ability for tool use and culture. especially depending on how you define tool use. is an archer fishing using water to knock down prey tool use? (i say yes and it just highlights how unimportant tool use has because as a measure of animal intelligence)


i dont know why im responding to you. youve obviously read my posts and completely missed the point. youre a good example of whats wrong with the study of animal intelligence though. plug your ears and repeat the same mantra over and over until people leave you alone

>>45812633
You're responding because you're clearly fucking retarded. Not that anon, but fuck your pseudo-intellectualism, you're not as knowledgeable about this subject as you clearly think you are.

>>45812633
I feel sorry for you. Kill yourself.

>>45812697
>>45812678
well i do study it but whatever. youre free to think whatever you want. its my bed time anyway.

>>45791395
>How they figured it out
Natural selection.
Those that had a genetic tendency to leave things dead for a while before eating them got poisoned less often, and thus died less often, and thus bread more.

The impaling bit was probably a separate behavioral evolution: those that tended to impale their meals had them stolen by opportunists less often, and thus starved less often, and thus bred more.

>>45808279

>Female-female mounting is rare

It occurs far more frequently than you are implying. Males mount everything more, to be sure, but females grind that snatch into everything too just not as frequently.

>>45812633
As I understand it tool use, at least the kind that indicates intelligence, is defined by a creature's ability to learn to use unfamiliar implements to achieve a purpose in a way the animal is not specifically adapted to. So basically, an animal with an instinctual drive to use a particular thing as a tool is not indicative of sapience, but a creature that encounters a problem then figures out a way to use something in it's surroundings to solve it, all in the same generation, is a sign of sapience. Many things use tools instinctually, but few things learn to use new tools to solve new problems.

Sapience is really just a way to move the goalposts and make humanity uniquely special once it turned out that a bunch of animals were way smarter then we thought they were.

>>45813053
If I recall the actual defining difference between humans and other animals is hypotheticals. As in, we can conceptualize a problem without ever encountering it and come up with a solution. Every other observed animal has to first interact with the problem before solving it.

But that is literally it.

>>45813177
That's a pretty shit definition. We have virtually no way of observing another animal "conceptualizing" a problem

>>45813424
You're seeing the issue. The real problem is the borders are like the borders between countries and states. They don't actually exist but we gotta make them exist to keep shit organized so we put arbitrary shit up to do so.
Both sides of this shit flinging contest are right and wrong because of this.

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>>45812331
Did you know that a bee has between 100x and 10000x the horsepower of a mosquito?

Do you understand how much more powerful a bee is than a gnat?

Of course not. To you they are both "small". It is the logarithmic sense of scale inherent to subjective biological perception. To you they are both weak, without great power, because compared to your power a difference of magnitude of 100 or 1000 or 10000 is negligible.

But it is not so. It only looks negligible because of where on the scale you sit.

You sit in a privlidged place in terms of intelligence. And therefore to you the difference between a sparrow knowing what a birdfeeder looks like, and a bluejay teaching another bluejay how to find and identify a birdfeeder seems like a small difference in intelligence.

But it is not so.

>>45814155
This makes me wonder about how animals perceive us.

>>45816489
Ugly giants with silly clothes.

>>45816734
I'm not sure they'd understand this clothes business

>>45817046
Crows have been observed to remember people who behaved aggressively towards them and teach other crows to recognize them, even if the human changed clothes.

>>45817517
Its the faces. They still might not understand clothes as a concept beyond something that changes about us. They probably don't understand the underlying mechanic of it keeping us warm or dry.

>>45791643
different species, the whole pseudo-penis thing is only done by one species, the ones that occasionally get tamed are generally from other species, heck if we didn't have dogs we probably would have fully domesticated the hyena and the cheetah(as cheetahs are also very easy to tame)

>>45818597
Cheetahs are lazy asses. Give them food and they do whatever you want. Understandable though since their hunting method is so strenous they could overheat and die.

>>45816489
They perceive us as we perceive weather and natural disasters

>>45796506
I generally believe God created all life, but generally lets evolution happen on it's own, with one of his only direct intercessions being the development of humans

>>45796687
okay I'll admit that's pretty hilarious(if probably technically blasphemous)

>>45807092
that's not quite true, just means you have to always be careful around them and treat them with respect on top of the affection you usually give a pet

>>45818743
true that is part of it, historically the main reason we stopped trying to domesticate them is that it's hard to get cheetahs to breed in captivity(or at least back then it was, as far as I'm aware we've got it figured out for the most part these days)

>>45818901
Artificial insemination is the usual now since cheetahs get "performance anxiety" in captivity.

>>45798438
I know enough about bees to think this is stupid, but not enough to say it doesn't work like that for some species

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>>45818901
I don't think a god would be so chalice as to leave life to chance. Not unless it was but entertainment for such a god. This is 4chan though... do you think God is but a divine troll?

As far as evolution, I take a pretty radical stance that I don't think we evolved from the same species as animal. Most likely we do descend from different primates, but it could go a step further than that even. Our physical and mental characteristics are vastly different yet all seem to share genome tropes the likes of dog breeds over one universal ancestor.

Slugs are hermaphrodites, whose penises are often as long is their bodies (or longer). Some species will mate with both sets of genitals simultaneously, some will have a penis fight to decide who gets to be the male

and some species will trap their partners penis in their vagina, and either chew it off itself or wait for the partner to chew its own penis off in order to get free. The penis doesn't grow back, and from then on the partner will only be able to mate with its female set of genitals. No one is quite sure of the reason for this forced-feminisation.

>>45821182
>No one is quite sure of the reason for this forced-feminisation
They've spent too much time in Sadpanda threads, obviously

>>45819090

That and a female cheetah can't get pregnant unless it's inseminated above 33 mph - which is obviously a lot easier to achieve in a volvo on the interstate than in a cramped zoo compound.

>>45821182
>No one is quite sure of the reason for this forced-feminisation.
It takes more energy to be the female than the male, make a group around you the females and you can breed with them while they can only breed with you and have to put in their energy to grow your young. Basically its a more energy and time efficient way to spread your genes, so they try to do that.

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>>45821023
A good chess player can see two to five moves ahead. A great one can see five to ten, an entire game under some circumstances. God is the ultimate chess player. He can simultaneously consider all possible states of the chessboard and every possible way for those states to be achieved, chess is trivial to God. Go is trivial to God. P=nP is trivial to God.

Evolution is a mechanism that boils entropy up into a complexity building device for harnessing energy, at least evolution as we understand it. The idea is that to a mind such as God's that using such a mechanism as a tool would be at least as simple as a screwdriver or a hammer is to us.

Honestly things like parasitic wasps, and monogamous blood flukes, fig trees and five species lichen, termite guts and emergent ant minds are proof of a creator God. They just seem so apocalyptically unlikely that I have a very hard time imagining them as a result of natural selection or of random chance.

>>45820926
It's actually a point of contention in my local association. Commercials don't tend to go for it and would rather just mail order a new queen for their colony. Hobbyists, like myself, tend to let the emergency queen cells develop. There isn't a great deal of information on how good emergency queens are, but the colony doesn't tend to keep them around for long.

The only downside to a supercedure is that the old queen may have been passive and docile, but you can't vouch for the new queen. I've known really peaceful queens get replaced by complete bitchdemons.

>>45821829
>proof of a creator God. They just seem so apocalyptically unlikely that I have a very hard time imagining them as a result of natural selection or of random chance.
Your lack of imagination aside we have proof of evolution, speciation and unique odd and complicated mechanisms all arising through natural selection of random variation. Given large enough time scales and populations even tiny differences in reproductive capacity have the power to reshape the gene pool of a species.

>>45821829
hey can I have the sauce please?

>>45822094
here's where I found it

http://g.e-hentai.org/g/400192/a90af1723c/

>>45822217
you are a gentleman and a scholar.

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>>45822048
Except that there isn't an infinite universe,
there aren't infinite second generation stars of appropriate composition and stability,
while planets around the relevant stars are more common than we speculated in the past, there certainly aren't infinitely many of them, and while planets with oxygen and water seem to be more likely than was speculated likewise, they remain quite finite

So let's say that in the 3 billion years that the earth has been hospitable to animal life you have 1:1,000,000 odds of developing a cockroach, and that in a similar timeframe you have 1:1,000,000 odds of developing a wasp

What are the odds of developing a wasp that can build a hidden nest, identify particular cockroaches while in flight, land on the particular part of the roaches back to avoid the roaches senses and defenses, drill a hole through the armour of the cockroach to a non-vital spot adjacent to the cockroach's central ganglia, and inject a symbiotic virus that it has a specialized sac to cultivate, a specialized virus that specifically disables only certain parts of the cockroach's brain.

What are the odds that the wasp then knows, by instinct how to mutilate the zombie cockroach's antennae and how to manipulate them in such a way that happens to control the cockroach's motor functions now that the cultivated virus has modified it's neurons. And so the wasp steers the cockroach into a premade lair which it can remember how to find from roachback, even though it normally flies to and from that location.

What are the odds then that the cockroach larva know exactly what sequence to eat the organs of the then entombed cockroach to preserve it's life as long as possible.

And you can't near miss on any of these genetically encoded features and instincts, you have to get 00 on the roulette wheel EVERY TIME or else the species dies out.

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>>45822478
Knowing that there needs to be certain concentrations of specific star forged minerals and metals to even attempt this result and that the stars need to be of a certain type and strength you don't have an infinite number of attempts in the 14 billion year span of the universe.

But there may be an infinite number of universes. But in that case, given whatever odds you ascribe to the biological process that could create such intricate biological symbiosis and parasitism, how many universes would you need to have a planet with such life and a creature capable of ascribing meaning to such arrangements and to believe in the existence of a God.

And on what level is it more reasonable to assume that number of entire universes than it is to presume some organizational entity encouraging the creation of complex life?

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>>45822674
>tfw youre a construct made out of stars and powered by a ghost

>>45822674
Well, what I assume is that we are woefully underequipped to understand the things we observe and often come to wrong solutions. ascribing a human intelligence as a solution to something human intelligence has failed to understand seems like another wrong solution in our long list of them.

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>>45823086
Well if our observations aren't meaningful then why believe in science at all? Why not believe in Bo'Erath the living flame and thunder?

>>45823843
Why believe at all? Lol i dunno is as good an answer as any. Why try to explain something implausible with something else implausible?

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>>45817517
Oh boy, I got to post this now.

>>45822478
>you can't near miss on any of these genetically encoded features and instincts
AH, there is your fuck up. Most of they very complicated 'machines' and behavioural traits do have origins in simpler traits that accumulate complexity as time progresses. There are plenty of examples of animals taking advantage of a situation that they don't HAVE to, in that way they could get by with a simpler set of traits but variation exists.
In your wasp example it will have hunted other things, then one is born slightly more specialised and in doing so happens to gains more advantage and the population shifts. Eventually the other less productive hunting strategies are lost from the gene pool and all of a sudden someone with no imagination and no willpower to actually look at the history of the wasp comes along and sees a wasp that can only do one thing but does it extremely well, they don't see all of the abilities the wasp species used to get by, before they specialised, they only see a bug that could not change a single part of its complicated life cycle without dying. Then they say an intelligent being made it this way.
Every mystery that we have put human intellect to understanding has turned out to be not magic.

Another example. Consider any virus, when it kills it's host it limits it's ability to be passed on, to get around this some viruses have changed from the normally deadly variant to a less deadly one that can be transmitted to more hosts. This adaption may seem intelligent but it is simply a numbers problem, those viruses that have mutations that prevent their host from dying too quickly will infect more people and over time dominate the population of that virus. No intelligence necessary for this very 'clever' adaption to premature host death.
Every step in an adaption must confer advantage (or at least no overall disadvantage) in order to be retained, add enough together and the picture seems unlikely but each step isn't so unlikely as to require God

>>45825177
I'd like to add, "Personality", hence "Sapience", is merely enough behavorial patterns of enough complexity mixing together, nothing else.
There isn't a magic spark, just a high enough ammount of what even bacteria has.

>>45794920
what was the show called?>>45794830

>>45814155
Not him, but when the point of a word is to define animals that are like us (homo sapiens), it's important that they're in the same intelligence ballpark as us. We're not trying to describe animal intelligence in relation to each other, we want it in relation to US.