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>>57747266

>>57747266

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/FanFic/LeftBeyond

This might be peak neckbeard: some /qst/oids turned Left Behind into an Alpha Centauri prequel.

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>>57747266

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=366626684&searchtext=zakharov

How to un-skub Beyond Earth.

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>>57747266
>out teching the university
Feels delicious if you're playing as Sister Miriam.
>"M-muh religious Dark Age."
>"Superstitious monkeys..."
>"It's not fair!"

>>57747266
As Lal I outtech him all time.

Extra talent and more populous habs > bonus to research and extra drone

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>>57747266

https://paeantosmac.wordpress.com/first-time-here/ Gushy, but clever, commentary. Does not cover the expansion.

>>57747305

How do you do that if you aren't playing on potato difficulty?

>>57747308

There's a quality in quantity as Stalin put it. I find it easy to outtech everyone as Yang. I also find it easy to roleplay a sociopath, which worries me.

>>57747305
>>57747308

Morgan has a relatively easy time outteching Zak... Insert social commentary about academic vs. corporate R&D here, I guess.

One of the good things that came out of the expansion was Sinder Roze. Not as a faction leader (a whole faction of hackers? really?) but as a character. Aaron Shwartz for Chiron. It'd have been more interesting if the expansion faction had been characters each with their little quest, but I guess that's asking too much for 1999.

>>57747317
>How do you do that if you aren't playing on potato difficulty?

Presumably the Elite Vatican Hackers.

>>57747323
>>57747305

Okay but like, how would Zak feel about it?

>>57747328

Nobody expects the Miriam Inquisition!

https://lparchive.org/Sid-Meiers-Alpha-Centauri/ Here's an interesting take on the Gaians, on that note.

>>57747343

From the Tripocalypse stuff:

"They are many, my friend, who think that I should hate you. That I, having become a symbol of Science itself, the relentless human drive to progress through understanding, through examination of the material world, should despise you as the utmost symbol of regressivism, of the cold dark night of the mind yearning to stifle the true face of hte human spirit. For the fact that, if you did not exist, Miriam would be little more than a somewhat more annoying than average motivational speaker."

"Or perhaps to hate you because you defy analysis, because physics as we know it bends to your will. That the rules by which we thoguht we knew reality to behave are as but mists before dawn as you spread your arms and speak your desires."

"I say what is needful in public. I'm sure you understand. It's nothing personal."

"We both know the truth. I adore you. So little truly remains to challenge my intellect, but you, you, my decompressed pseudosaviour, are a puzzle, an enigma. And I am going to take you apart to see what makes you tick. To take everything that you have that lets you, and your so-called father stand above us, and make of them first wonders, then breakthroughs, then parlour tricks, then simply knowledge, avialable to anyone with the will to learn it. I may even publish a paper or two. I'll make sure to use your name in them a fair bit as i'm told that's one of hte most important things to you, isn't it? Your name written down?"

"We have that in common, you and I, my friend. I'm so glad you're going to help me save humanity. And no, Yeshua of either Nazareth or Sheol, depending on what mood one catches Miriam in, you do not have a choice in the matter."

Basically, from what I grok, Jesus showed up either on Chiron or post-apocalyptic Earth, and was promptly tazed and locked up before being able to use his God powers.

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>>57747353

> Zakharov doing a xcom-style autopsy on Jesus Christ

how horrifying.

Seriously though, does Zak fap to Dr. Vahlen, or the other way round?

>>57747343

https://lparchive.org/Sid-Meiers-Alpha-Centauri-(by-nweismuller)/ The other lparchive, showing off the softer side of Morgan. A less confusing read.

>>57747381

what

>>57747266

Fact: Any mention of SMAC in a forum thread will cause at least one person to reinstall the damn thing.

Is multiplayer still playable?

>>57747381

Does anyone have that one greentext of Aki crushing on Zakharov?

>>57747317
>There's a quality in quantity as Stalin put it.

lal has the best combination of quality (extra talents) and quantity (densely populated bases).

I think the more densely populated bases would better fit with Yang, but Lal gets them somehow.

>>57747305
>Feels delicious if you're playing as Sister Miriam.
Try Drones

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>>57748070

>>57747921
>I think the more densely populated bases would better fit with Yang, but Lal gets them somehow.
It works perfectly fine as is:
Lal has better bases that offer better facilities and actively encourage outsiders to join. Meaning more room.
Yang has intentionally overcrowded bases where there is barely anything to do for entertainment. Meaning higher population growth

>>57748070
Drones do not start with shitty research that is further made worse by running theocracy

>>57748070
-4 Research vs -2 Research. Meaning crunch-wise, Miriam is worse, even if fluff-wise, Domai is weaker

>>57747317
>How do you do that if you aren't playing on potato difficulty?
My last Transcend game as Miriam I ended up doing that quite handily because Zak isn't a particularly strong AI (doesn't build particularly wide and doesn't make enough units) and doesn't seem to thrive very well if bullied by an expansionist AI. In this case, Yang kept him locked in a peninsula and slowly absorbed a few of his town

>>57747353
>Tripocalypse
What is that?

>>57747266
what good are great scientists without an equally great bankroll?

Wha'ts the deal with Cha Dawn? I mean, does he really has a personal link to The Planet?

>>57747317
>How do you do that if you aren't playing on potato difficulty?
Not him, but there are quite a few things to consider that ultimately lead to situation where human player is going to out-do AI in every single regard:
- AI in general is pretty weak
- Zak's AI doesn't really expand, not even if given empty continent with a jungle (that actually hurts him, due to population growing too fast), so the tech bonus is only revelant early on
- AI can't into terraforming, creating utterly ridiciulous tiles
- AI can't into satellites, like, at all
- AI can't properly use energy to speed things up
- AI can't into crawlers
- Zak AI, if having neighbour, has a really hard time defending, even if it's another peaceful AI in tune of Morgan or Lal, simply because it can't properly organise expansion
In short - against AI enemies everything is possible.
Trying to out-tech human-controlled Zak is meanwhile pretty much impossible.

>>57748588
Speaking of AI - did the fan project to improve AI went anywhere, or it pethered out? It can't really be that hard to teach AI how to use resources and forest tiles

>>57748223

It's a homebrew. Started off as a RPG thing, had a /qst/ that ran last year, ended up getting a bunch of fic written for it.

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/FanFic/LeftBeyond

Basically it's a The Longest Journey style split timeline... one of which does have (post)humans fleeeing to Alpha Centauri and being poised to split up into factions once they get there.

Also Jesus gets locked up inside a SCP containment box but Shroedinger's Cats out of it, hence the split timeline.

>>57748070
It's piss easy for Drones. Just trade for Network Nodes and build them in each of your many bases.

>>57748537

Supposedly. He also doesn't need a respirator.

Reminds me of the Forest People from Nausicaa... then again so does the whole SMAC ecosystem.

Interestig that despite the whole mystical link thing, Deirdre can keep up with him on ecology.

SMAC does understated HFY, the best kind of HFY.

> tfw no smac quests

>>57748627

> did i miss a smac quest?

>>57748691

The person who ran the Left Beyond quest was supposed to do a SMAC-alike quest, but seems to have disappeared. They were waiting for their immigration papers or some such.

>>57748588
>Trying to out-tech human-controlled Zak is meanwhile pretty much impossible.
You sure that a hypothetical 1v1 game between Morgan and Zak couldn't have Morgan at least at tech parity?

>>57748703

We should try it. Does anyone play SMAC mp?

> expansion factions are like highlander/matrix sequels in that they do not exist

>>57748691
>>57748627

> not sure if samefag or people trying to write like the SMAC blurbs

We should make up SMAC blurbs for stuff that came about after 1999. Like Morgan talking about cryptocurrencies or Miriam talking about presuppositional apologetics.

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>>57747266
I kind of feel like the expansion human factions aren't really full factions but extensions/variants or combinations of main game factions
>Nautilus Pirates
What if Morgan had owned a shipbuilding company and had most of his business sense replaced with piratonomics
>Cult of the Planet
aka: that one time when university researcher combined the DNA of Deirdre and Miriam and accidentally released the specimens into miasma
>Cybernetic Consciousness
The great question finally answered: yes, the university can become more autistic than it already is.
>Data Angels
Kids like hackers. That's why Lal had a reverse sex clone of himself to build an idealy extremely cool hacker society. And do cool hacker stuff.
>Free drones
The real good boy collectivism for those days when Yang gets too depressing
>Manifold Usurpers
Lord's believers, except with ayy jesus giving them right to use planet as they see fit

>>57748588

AI can't into crawlers period. Even giving them prebuilt crawler units doesn't mean they'll use it for resource harvesting.

>>57748865

In Left Beyond the Morgan expy is named Ryan Andrews and does build an underwater city.

Then gets into a turf war with the Svensgaard expy, who is a cybernetic mermaid named Tethys.

Then they get married because they decide that literally everyone else is beneath them. Then they buy seats on the Alpha Centauri starships.

This was a sidequest on the main quest. The whole thing is kinda trippy.

http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/qstarchive.html?tags=left%20beyond They show up in the last 5 threads or so.

>>57748865

There's this ADORABLE Zak/Aki fic on suptg but I can't find it right now.


> alien factions

ew.

>>57748905
Is it the one with the dancing?

>>57748945

yes

>>57748905

Ah, yes. LBQ. Spider tank autism and Bibleman references and all sort of weirdness.

I remember the thread in which the QM was setting up for a SMAC game that would be a sequel to it (similar setup as SMAC: the human survivors of Judgement Day had to pile up in one ship, and discovered on the way that they couldn't get along, and split up into factions as soon as they could) but then disappeared.

That plus how the quest was written and the fact that it kept going even when only one or two players were around, leads me to believe that it was the QM's last hurrah. He(?) kept talking about moving and getting a new job, but then vanished. I think he had a chronic illness.

IIRC the factions were:

> Ryan Andrews: Pretty obvious. More Morgan than Andrew Ryan in that he was generally pragmatic.

> Tethys: I guess Sveensgard/Deirdre? Techno hippy with a vat grown mermaid tail. There's been a /d/ thread about that lately.

> Urist: A genetically engineered (I think) Tolkien dwarf. From Dorf Fort, obviously. Domai type.

> Cordylon: A head in a jar whose job was to pilot the AC starship. Doesn't get ganked, but stays neutral and says that its job is now to keep the remainder of the starship safe in high orbit since someone has to keep watch in case God decides to attack.

> Ziggy: Who put the TF2 pyro in charge of a faction? Very militaristic, but not insane, per se.

Notably there was no Miriam equivalent because the characters were literally running away from God as described in Left Behind.

Each leader had a copy of the Omega, which is some folding@home thing that helps them run their faction. The quest players were Omega sysadmins in-universe, with enough access to do back deals and so on.

> literally the autistic illuminati

>>57748752
We should make up SMAC blurbs for stuff that came about after 1999. Like Miriam talking about presuppositional apologetics.

The modern origins of presuppositional apologetics are in the late 1920

What are you fucking retard blathering about?

>>57748945
>>57748961
>>57748905

FOUND IT! http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/13111584/

Secretly blushing, crushing Aki is now my personal canon. He loves science, and logic, and interesting ideas, right? Experiments that other, stupider people are scared of and don't understand, he loves those, right? So, she'll become what he loves! And he'll want to write a paper about her, no, a book, and they'll write it together and present it at the colloquium and get an award and there will be a big party and he'll hold her hand when they stand behind the podium and her stage fright will be gone, because she engineered it away and because he's there, and then there will be a reception and he'll dance with her (gotta get the proprioceptive muscle control circuits perfect so she can dance perfectly and he'll be so impressed) and then afterwards they'll both be tired and giggly and they go back to his room oh god oh god...

Then there's ANOTHER story with Zak and Aki talking after the Transcendence.

Hmm. The plot thickens. The LBQ stuff is hosted on the same server as the nametag of one of the contributors of that thread.

Looks like someone's been planning a SMAC/Left Behind crossover for 7 years, and delivered last year, and disappeared.

>>57749117

I get 1950s, but yeah. I guess a lot of people only heard of it as a new thing from youtube.

>>57749160
>>57749117

Miriam isn't a bible thumper of the Jack Chick variety, though. She's obviously educated in all world religions, managed to build her own syncresis, and at least at first raises good philosophical points (She seems to kinda start losing it in the later tech blurbs though).

> mfw Miriam is saner than the actual fundies that we get

>>57749160
>>13112928

This is how End of Evangelion should have been.

"Oh, hey, a giant Rei head."
"Let's do science to it!"

>>57748865

Would this make the manifold caretakers the Mary Sue faction we don't talk about?

We must dissent.

>>57748703
Original anon here and nope, no fucking way. Morgan's only power lies in ability to get extra energy early on, BUT he has population limit that stunts his growth all the way till late game, can't use Planned (so no Dip-Plan combo), doesn't come with any research bonus whatsoever and generally can be outpaced in no fucking time by anyone.
Morgan is one of the weakest factions in both SMAC and SMAX by the way.

>>57748874
There is a reason why I pretty much always play with editor on. Because I can switch sides to AI, correct their terraforming actions and most importantly, set up crawlers. If you set up a crawler for AI, it will continue to use it, unless given tile will be within vicinity of a base.

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>>57748643
>He doesn't play Drones using only bases gained via dron riots

>>57749160

Okay, a bit of sleuthing then.

http://emlia.org/portfolio/games/smac/ was last updated in November and there's a "for tg" build of SMAC. I downloaded it and it doesn't seem to have any LBQ stuff in it, but it does have a couple of custom factions built in.

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Fanfic/LeftBeyond gives the RPG sourcebooks, such as they are (they look somewhat incomplete) as also being on emlia.org

The fics look like they were on the same wiki, but there was an effort to move them to www.fanfiction.net and now are mostly there. They are clearly not all written by the same person.

The "novelization" of the quest is also on fanfiction.net but ends abruptly and the last chapter posted is a brief rant about the Singularity that looks like it's been written by someone else entirely.


>>57749386

That's just what I mean, you'd never hear something like that out of Pat Robertson or Joel Olsteen.

>>57749420

> get money
> probe teams
> rush secret projects
> life is good

>>57749492

I can't tell if it was one guy who either has MPD or pretends to have MPD, or a case of a small group of fa/tg/uys getting shit done over the span of multiple years.

>>57749432

Doesn't Yang have a bonus against riots?

>>57749420
Okay, I'm not questioning your expertise, merely asking how to make this shit viable. As far as I know, powergaming with Morgan means heavy, heavy REX and relying on having a ton of strong center squares which with the right setup (Free Market + Demo, Recycling Centers) make the center tiles go 3/2/8+. You have to start building tight to maximize the good tiles, but then your economy snowballs and theoretically should be capable of matching Zak. You don't get a straight-up research bonus, but you get massive Energy.

Is Morgan really that weak? Most 4X games really give preference to economy-oriented civs, because economy can buy you anything you want, from tech to soldiers, but military-oriented traits like Santiago's or Miriam's don't really help you establish economy and are much less versatile in cases like an isolated start (since you have no one to war with).

>>57749420
>>57749548
Also Morgan can pop-boom through Golden Ages, Civ2 style, if I understand correctly.

>>57749537
The problem is - the net gain from +1 Economy doesn't even outweight HALF of the shit Morgan has to deal with on regular basis. You have very small bases (so can't properly use that Economy bonus), you can't pop-boom, you can't into Planned at all, your production rates are unchanged and you are literally 1 energy per base ahead of everyone else, unless you want to rape yourself and run Free Market, which will force you to not explore and not move your units anywhere at all. And that's still just meager +1 on every field, which won't be truly profitable before you have like 20 bases, each at least pop 6

And not the anon you are replying to, but nope, nobody has such bonus.

>>57749492

A bit more literary stalking. On the same page there's a XCOM let's play in which the protagonist suffers from brain damage and needs an implant for it, which also shows up as a theme in LBQ (If this was written before XCOM2, it's actually pretty prescient: the multiple endings hint that everything after the mission in which he gets conked in the head may be a fever dream or a simulation).

I would guess that this particular fa/tg/uy has had a similar accident IRL, and alternates periods of being able to function/work/write with periods of being unable to.

>>57749548

If you are playing with the SMACX map, capturing the manifold nexus is a godsend for Zak. The small chance for mindworm capture is nice, but the main advantage is that fungus squares do something, so he needs a lot less terraforming early on. This lets him keep up with Morgan.

>>57749618

Yes, largely due to having an easy time affording psych spending. This is mitigated a bit by his lower pop cap... until it goes away, which generally happens sixty percent into the game, after which Morgan can grow exponentially.

>>57749645

Ah, thought Yang had some immunity... looked it up and it turns out it's immunity to inefficiency running Planned (Which is probably why Yang is usually the scariest AI).

Thing is, running free market as Morgan gives you ALL THE MONEY. You don't need to fight wars, you can explore with probe teams and bribe everyone into submission.

Morgan easily outprobes even the Angels because quantity wins over quality. The only problem is if Morgan's main adversary is Miriam, who is effectively impervious to this.

>>57749645
>unless you want to rape yourself and run Free Market, which will force you to not explore and not move your units anywhere at all.
Probe Teams and Supply Crawlers run on absolutely free upkeep, while the tight ICS allows you to maximize Former time by sharing forested tiles.

>>57749548
... and by mid game this model is no longer sustainable against human enemies. You simply can't grow wide as Morgan, nor can exactly grow tall, so all you have is that "super" base tile... and that's it. Beyond that, you are fucked.
And energy is pretty much useless anyway until at least Fusion Power tech (which is the end of early game)
>You don't get a straight-up research bonus, but you get massive Energy.
By mid game, Lady D has more energy than Morgan can dream off, just because she has +2 Efficiency and favours Green. It's not about how much your tiles make, but how much of it you can get before Inefficiency kicks in.
Daily reminder Knowledge gives Morgan more energy than Wealth, just because one provides Efficiency bonus, while other is just raw gain in energy production (note that I ignore the fact Wealth also adds +1 Industry)

>>57749618
He can't, because he can't run Planned. You need to have a combo of Democracy, Planned and Golden Age to get pop-boom.
Anyone who can't run Demo-Plan is instantly weaker. That's also why Lal, Lady D and Zak are much, much stronger than they look (Miriam doesn't count, because she doesn't look weak to begin with).

>>57749749

+1 industry adds up to quite a bit of savings if you plan to buy your units rather than build them.

>>57749652

The xcom aliens invading Chiron would be kinda hilarious... wait, that's basically the expansion, never mind.

Why would anyone mix Left Behind and SMAC though.

>>57749749

Morgan's trade bonus lets him benefit greatly if Planet is by and large at peace, and he isn't the best militarily, so it's in his best interest to play peacekeeper (more so than Lal). His effective probe team advantages compound this.

>>57747303
Beyond Earth isn't Skub. There are no pro-BE people.

>>57749702
>Thing is, running free market as Morgan gives you ALL THE MONEY
At the cost of knocking out your capability to move. Meaning Free Market is only useful once you are done exploring (which is not early game, where it would be most profitable) or when you simply don't want to explore for whatever reason. Also, combined with Support penalty and the fact you are most likely running Democracy, your Support is at -3. You can't fucking build any units beyond first one, because you can't support them. Under Free Market, you can't even move them outside bases without causing severe issues, for which you will have to pay with Psych...
... so all your profit went on pacification of drones. Marvelous!

>>57749741
... and you are still behind everyone else in population, so? As Morgan, you literally can't benefit on one of the best Secret Projects, Planetary Transit, solely because how severe your population limit is - you build bases that barely can grow beyond the PT bonus.

tl;dr Morgan is bottom rung of factions. Definitely the weakest of original seven, with SMAX added he's 2nd or 3rd worst.

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>>57749827

> there are no probe people

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>>57749537
>people still don't understand that Domai is Yang's manchurian agent whose purpose is to instigate instability in every other faction

>>57749749
To get a Golden Age going, you need +6 growth and no Drones. Can't you just boost your Psych allotment, get Children's Creches (rushbuy them with the massive amount of cash) and just amass Talents to achieve this? Maybe with Human Genome Project?

>>57749855
That's too clever.

>>57749830

probe teams make for good scouts, in addition to being probe teams.

>>57749860


Popbooming is possible with Morgan, it's just not as easy as with, say, Deirdre.

https://strategywiki.org/wiki/Sid_Meier's_Alpha_Centauri/Morgan_Industries Here's a howto.

>>57749855
>>57749877

That's the kind of fuckery Yang would do, though.

>>57749652

So are we trying to Chris Chan some guy because he ran a quest, or what?

>>57749794
But it doesn't add up when you are trying to first earn that Energy. That +1 Industry cuts off 2 energy per row. For the effect to be noticable, you would have to speed up something that costs 60 or more minerals. Meanwhile, the +1 Efficiency from Knowledge grants (assuming maximum efficiency of base placement) you fuck-huge bonus, since it's a multiplied by EIGHT in the equation toward energy lost by inefficiency. Meaning you would have to be gaining less than 12 energy per base via +1 Efficiency from Knowledge to benefit on +1 Industry on Wealth.
I might not have a Math degree, but the calculation is so simple that it renders the +1 Industry bonus useless when picking against +1 Efficiency, because you would have less than 6 bases in the nearest vicinity of HQ to benefit on Wealth bonus toward your production

tl;dr +1 Industry and +1 Economy combined are inferior to simple +1 Efficiency.

>>57749826
Considering trade is related with base sizes and he himself is fucked over base size, it balances itself out as if he didn't have that bonus. Essentially, what he gains via that semi-secret +1 trade rating is nullified by the fact he has population way below average.

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>>57749931
Can anyone imagine this type of calculations for BE?

>>57749931

Okay, you have a point in that the math checks out. How would you play Morgan then? He's one of the factions that benefit most from a prolonged peace, which works well fluffwise.

>>57749895

I'm trying to figure out if this guy is still alive, since there's some decent writefaggotry there and some of it should at least be preserved in case the site goes down for nonpayment.

>>57749958

No. BE is basically Dan Brown to SMAC's Umberto Eco. Which is sad. Then again, keep in mind that SMAC was mostly Brian Reynolds' effort, not Sid Meier's.

All they had to do with BE was update SMAC's graphics and AI a little...

>>57749958
Anyone got that "what I expected vs what I got" image for BE? The one with looping caravans as final game experience

>>57749931
>tl;dr +1 Industry and +1 Economy combined are inferior to simple +1 Efficiency.
Yes, but consider Deirdre, a Civ which does have an efficiency bonus; if she runs Demo/Green, she effectively "wastes" some of her efficiency bonus, and there's no point in running Frontier/Green. Fundie/Green is not really useful unless you're in total war mode. She can't run Free Market either.

Max Effic is easy to get with just running Demo/Green on any faction. I'm fairly certain Morgan's research is strongest when he runs Demo/Green/Wealth.

>>57750031

Fundie/Green is not war mode, it's tentacle rape mode. Fundie/Green/Power even more so.

Not that there's anything wrong with that. You can stay there the whole game and win.

>>57750007

The hybrid affinities fix that a little, but only a little.

>>57750007
>How would you play Morgan then
By not playing him. He's the least interesting, least fleshed out and least useful mechanically of all factions.
If I do end up playing as Morgan (which usually means random pick during multi) I'm doing my best to get Command Nexus. If I won't get that thing, I'm essentially fucked, no matter what. If I'm not the first one to hit the techs removing restrains on food production, I'm also fucked.
Essentially, early game hell to secure position, otherwise you can pretty much quit.

>>57750031
>if she runs Demo/Green, she effectively "wastes" some of her efficiency bonus,
Explain to us how the hell having surplus to use from is "wasting"? She can easily afford running Planned without going into red. Only Yang can do that, and he has eseentially a cheat mode to pull that, but he's also perpetually stuck at 0 Efficiency, meaning growing wide kills him anyway

>>57750072
What community of SMAC players do you come from? I'm endlessly interested in how the high-level meta looks like.

>>57750007

Hi, LBQ QM here. I am alive, I do in fact have a small amount of lingering brain damage from head trauma but it's an old accident and I'm not in any danger of dying or losing my marbles, I've just been really busy with work and I'd rather run another quest when things are less hectic so that I can do it properly. Thanks for the concern. If anyone has questions about Left Beyond or Tripocalypse or any of the crap I wrote, please ask, but I'd rather not derail the thread.

>>57750072
Also, Morgan is probably the only faction where I don't rush toward Ascetic Virtues. It's simply not worth it, because you are going to get "normal" bases out of it and if playing multiplayer, the other side will most likely just nuke your base with Virtues.

>>57749854
stop that

>>57750007
>All they had to do with BE was update SMAC's graphics and AI a little...
Wasn't there some fuckery with the copyright? I seem to remember that they were legally unable to port over the storyline directly, and had to write it again, which is both why it isn't SMAC2 and why it's suckier.

although I actually did like BE as it's own game. It's okay.

>>57750122

I'd love to know how that works in fluff.

"See those people living over there? They were so high and mighty and they got nuked! I'll stick to watching the Simpsons."

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>>57750135

I think that was Civilization 3....

>>57750111
I've been playing with my friends since early 00s and then there are guys from CivFanatics and Apolyton.
The "high-level meta" simply assumes you are familiar with all the formulas that govern the game and play accordingly. Plus a lot of careful micro. As in - A LOT. To make it less game-breaking, certain things are usually negotiated before the game (like for example limits on crawling or "no nukes" rule)

>>57750117

Glad you're okay (if you actually are the same person). What happened with the LBQ novelization on ff.net?

>>57750135
>>57750151
It's both.
But yeah, SMAC is one of those games that is in eternal limbo due to copyright. To unfuck the situation, you would need AT LEAST 4 different law suits and cases draging for years, costing so much money nobody cares nor see the point.

>>57750200

The person who played Quinn was supposed to be in charge of it. I guess she got bored.

>>57750208

Yep. At least they worked it out enough that you can buy it on gog.

>>57750185

Is the former AI any good?

>>57750265
SMAC getting on GoG is absolutely nothing when compared with the fucked-up situation regarding Sierra's city builders. Due to Impression Games being dead and Sierra essentially being a reanimated corpse that first went through Vivendi (while still making games) and then Activision (when it was euthanised), the rights to their library ended up so spreaded, each and every single city builder they've made had to be negotiated separately with different companies and private entities. That's why there was such massive lag before Emperor, the final game by Impressions, took so long to get on GoG

>>57747266
What traditional game is this artwork from?

>>57750356

It's obviously an allegory for the politician archetype.

>>57750342
Well, Sierra "had it coming" once Williams quit. In '96 they've entered corporate business and Williams stepped out of being CEO.
In '97, both Ken and Roberta left the new company entirely.
By '99, 35% of Sierra's employees have been laid-off, numerous divisions shut down and the company at that point went in 4 years from THE powerhouse of vidya to barely functional wreck. Ironically, when Impressions got green-light on their projects, it was done to capitalise on Caesar 1 & 2 being such hits, so the whole "Sierra city builder" genre happend more or less by accident.

>>57750570

Why does this keep happening?

>>57750601
Want to hear the joke part of it?
Sierra didn't enter corporate business out of greed, lack of funds, internal issues or anything like that. Both Williams were simply trying to build Disney Company of vidya and were doing great in this regard. Then they've decided that they've laid foundations for it, so they could both step down and watch their child project mature.
Half year later the new board was in the middle of destroying the whole company and another half a year later Ken decided to simply quit than fight with windmills. Then things went from "bad" to "horrible" within weeks. The new guys had absolutely zero clue about the business they were running and were too busy constantly rebranding the existing sub-divisions to notice the company as such is falling apart.
Once they've laid off most of devs (with games in progress), it was sealed. Then they've turned into publishing house, only didn't have a clue about that either and by 2002 the company was essentially existing due to accumulated in the past assets. By 2004 it was dead in all, but official bankrupcy papers.

>>57750705

And that's why you keep the suits on a leash...

>>57750769
No, that's why you don't allow suit joining at all. Sierra was one of those companies started by people from the business that spend all the 80s and first half of the 90s learning not just how to make games, but how to run a game-making company, essentially keeping everything in the house and knowing what to do. Which is part of the reason why it was doing so fucking well and for so many years.
Daily reminder that Half-Life was published by Sierra, publishing for some unknown nobodies called Valve.

>>57750769
>>57750817
Also, there is very, very related exact opposite site of the equation, regarding both /tg/ stuff, SMAC and other things:
GURPS
Part of the reason why SJG is such small company despite the fuck-huge potential in the late 80s is the complete and utter disagree to allow suits in, while also never learning how to be a suit yourself. This effectively cancelled any chances their game had, despite there being a boom for simulationist games back then. SJG currently exists solely due to Munchkin.

>>57751055

Again, that's why you keep the suits on a leash, rather than putting them in charge or not having them around.

>>57750601
Because we can't have nice things, anon.
And because 90s were this magic era where a fuckload of awful corporate shit happend, but most of it was kept internal, so people consider it "golden period" for both /tg/ and /v/ stuff.

>>57749160
Oh Jesus bashful Aki is cute.

And imagine the cold mechanical fury that must have happened to make her declare independence.

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>>57747266
> Like... what do they do all day?
I like to imagine they're doing a lot of dumb bullshit and/or crazy scientific research that is technically scientific but beneficial to no one.
Things like discovering new artificial flavors for poptarts, or splicing mind worm DNA into cats to see what happens.

Things that in no way relate to any of the tech trees, but it's still research.
Can you even imagine what their archives must be like? Just gigs and gigs of this weird, meandering, off-the-wall research, with exhaustive notes and scientific ponderings, and only then maybe once every hundred projects or so will they come across anything even remotely related to civ building.

It's like Alice In Wonderland in there, just going down the rabbit hole. But with science.

>>57754314
Wasn't this part of the canon to begin with? So that +2 Research bonus really represents the fact that once upon 50 or 100 research project, they still research something beneficial or some weird obscure shit from utterly useless and/or failed experiment still gave useful data in the end for something completely unrelated.
This and of course utter lack of any sort of ethics.

>>57748865

Data angels always felt like the inverse lal. An optimistic society upholding freedom but decentralized. Like it or not but Lal strikes as the cynical freedom keeper who's idea of fun is sitting in a library reading depressing literature and books on politics while everyone else is pigging out, spending dosh, fighting and fucking.

>>57755760

He also cloned his girlfriend. Often.

>>57754212

And rip out her own right hemisphere.

What did you do, Dr. Zakharov? WHAT DID YOU DO?

>>57748865
Canonically, Nautilus is splinter from Spartans and Drones are the effect of revolt against Yang. Oh, and Cybernetic is subdivision of University, while Data Angels are literally Morgan probe team. So two of them aren't factions on their own and the other two are splinters. And the source of Cult is uknown, since it's never made explicit from which other faction they came. But it's more than unlikely they are Gaians "born".
Part of mentality behind human factions in SMAX during development was to create factions faring from unlike hosts, like unruly soldiers or rogue agents, rather than making them, say, runaway capitalists or muh freedom hackers.

>>57756226
She, in her awkward and slightly autistic way, asked him to dance at the new years party. She told him that a maybe a new world could mean new beginnings. Her heart was all aflutter when his lips tugged into a slight smile.

>Oh you dear, brilliant, silly child.

Ajd then he turned away from her. As she left the ballroom trying to maintain her composure and desperately trying not to cry she heard whispers and sniggering. That dug deeper than any surgical tools could.

But it's okay. She doesn't hurt anymore. She is beyond hurt and now sees he was right. She was a child then, and so was he. But she grew up and he never will.

She has set aside childish things like love and hate and when she next sees him it will be to simply remove him as any other out dated component.

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>>57757292
Ironically the Drones don't have many issues with Yang, at least not in the games I've played. They actually usually end up being friends, which I think is something that isn't often modeled in games; sometimes, the people who are very alike hate each other more than they hate the guy on the opposite side of the spectrum.

Also which dumb-ass gave the okay to have subdivisions of canon factions be the expansion factions. If they didn't break off, why add them?

>>57756226
He gave her the dick.

Turns out being 800 years old isn't great for the old boner. Zak hasn't been hard since he left Russia.

>>57757758
>If they didn't break off, why add them?
Because canonically, SMAC factions are much more nuanced than the game suggest by simply giving you 7 factions on a map. For example, Morgan Industries is less of a Corpo-Nation and more of a massive company that in the same time is a nation by itself (still fully structurised like a corp.), while in the same time having subdivisions in other factions, doing business with them. Kind of how you've got, say, SquareEnix and then there is daughter company SquareEnix Europe, doing business on specified market and interacting with specified people. And while being pretty much independend, it is still just a sub-division.
So with this mentality in mind, sub-divisions aren't that weird. Plus, the original plan for SMAX also assumed possibility to get the map of the Planet reworked to the maximum size the engine allows and have all 14 factions on it, rather than being restricted to just 7. Didn't work out due to then-present technological limitations and budget of the expansion itself (it was doable, but would cost too much to make).
Essentially, we were few steps away from making SMAX into perfection.

>>57757852
And adding to the nuance part - Believers run their church in similar fashion, while Lal sends observers and maintains UN structure in factions that wish to cooperate

>>57757852
>>57757867
I wonder what are the actual nations in SMAC.
Maybe there's only the UN, and in some places they lose local power to other factions, which are also present everywhere else.

>>57758009
Given her personality, I'd be rather surprised if Santiago let the weaklings into her glorious master-race nation.

And anybody who's seen a Zak/Miriam alliance happen, or forced one, knows no sane leader would allow that abomination to kill everybody. Which means they at least aren't working with each other.

>>57758009
It's more in tune of "most factions keep their sub-divisions in other factions" than "everyone splinters out of everyone". For example, Yang is absolutely absent and isolated. Imagine North Korea isolation, only cranked over 9000. Nobody knows shit about what the hell is going inside, aside those rare times when Yang allows outsiders to visit. But other than that, Hive pretty much exists in a vaccum.

>>57747381
>xcom-style autopsy on Jesus Christ
NEW RESEARCH OPTIONS AVAILABLE:
SHROUD
MESSIAH ARMOR
MEDINAILS

>>57749827
I don't hate Beyond Earth, I just wish it was better.

>>57758159

That sort of did show up in the quest, autopsying an Angel unlocked a few options to help deal with them. The hard part was making sure the body wouldn't self-destruct, IIRC.

>>57757758

Nah. Zak has the Russian-est boner science can beget.

>>57757744

... that is terrifying. And believable.

>>57762941

Why do we not have board-tan faction profiles?

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>>57762970
Would require you to drum up all the board avatars and get faction bonuses that everyone can agree on.

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>>57763030

>>57762970
/x/-chan is a two-faced whore that broke our hearts and we still want nothing to do with her.

>>57756193

That too. The big downer is all of times his tech quotes that focuses on human psyche comes up he speaks of it in the most dreary tone. Roze? She is utterly detirmined to use the tech to keep humanity free and the information with it.

>>57768271
Lal is still in the top three "faction I wouldn't mind being a drone of"

>>57769192

Imagine living in the most politically correct, dreary joyless society that makes Yang's place look happy in comparison. Imagine everything from entertainment to food so politicized that you cant do a single thing without being called things like problematic. Your voice is drowned out because even in an ideal democracy, spending treasure on parties with no value is wasting treasure on the utterly irrelevant

That is what life as a drone in Lal's democratic society feels like

>>57769532
That's why it's number 3 to me.

>>57769532
Lal's Peacekeepers were created before SJW were a thing, so I doubt it was either meant to be like that at all.

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>>57769192>>57769532
Zak>Aki>Dee for me. I reckon I can get along well with Spartans, though, I've fought for a few years in the brutal shithole, and roam the wilds when time affords.
Bible-humper and Rose would get squashed by whoever they'd piss off with their probing, convey no benefits to living under them and are ugly bitches besides.
Domai and Sven are kind of alright, but meh. I'd rather try my luck outside than live in corrupt bureaucracies of Yang, Lal and Morgan.
Alien Dawn and webmouths ought to be exterminated.

>>57769532
>Lal
Dreary beuraucracy with no soul, but you're not going to be sent to the punishment sphere for saying something wrong or being poor. Still, your life is determined by the red tape you own, and everything needs to be completed in triplicate, and nobody is really happy.

>Zak
Unless you have an IQ over 140, you are a test subject and don't really have rights. Your life is determined by the type of research papers you publish, and the inter-faculty warfare can be more deadly than most vendettas
>Yang
It's the Hive
>Deidre
Free Love, Free Speech, Free Worms in your salad. And yes, you will be eating salad. Animals have just as many rights as humans, and you must obtain consent from the cow before eating it.
>Morgan
Rights are bought. So is everything else. Literally; Air is a product that's controlled by an Air Company. Free Speech is paid for. Slavery is a thing, but you can buy yourself out; how though isn't really established.
>Santiago
Are you an infant? Welcome to the Marine Corps! Immigrant? Welcome to the Marine Corps! Pacifist? Welcome to the Marine Corps! Here's your rifle, shoot or be shot!
>Miriam
All Jesus, all the time! Jesus hates atrocities, like nerve stapling (the faithful), putting people (the faithful) in punishment spheres, and gays. Just be a good christian and everything is fine. Don't, and you're LITERALLY SATAN.

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>>57771192
>Unless you have an IQ over 140, you are a test subject and don't really have rights. Your life is determined by the type of research papers you publish, and the inter-faculty warfare can be more deadly than most vendettas
At least all credit for your work won't be taken by some Shlomo Mendelson, Research Director, whose skills reside in the fraudulent dominion and who can't tell a zygote from an atom. Zak won't tolerate freeloading scumbags. I'm by no means a genius, but I can do fairly well for myself as a lab technician or even measly assistant.
>Free Love, Free Speech, Free Worms in your salad. And yes, you will be eating salad.
Free love and free speech are some of the things life worth living for. I don't eat meat mostly anyway, though I indulge in milk and egg-derived products, and even occasional chicken breast. Both because of my health and because fruits and veggies are infinitely easier to prep. I have no particular dislike of worms, as food they're rich in protein and perfectly palatable, and those symbiotic boils Deirdre's so fond of are perfectly docile.
>Welcome to the Marine Corps!
You say that as if it is a thing to be detested. Good food, good regiment, good if a bit dim company. No disgustingly unfit and unhygienic slobs, incels, SJW and other degenerates around you as far as the eye can see. Members of the opposite gender are the eye-candy. You'd get to try all the best and newest toys on living targets. Killing the enemies of your fatherland is pretty fulfilling activity by itself.
>Everything else.
Fair point.

>>57772787

I will vouch for the Hive.

Yes, the Hive can be rough. But on the bright side you can do drugs, get laid and despite it all the feeding bays offer actual food during those offdays and you have a tight social community. Not as bad as Lal's reading halls. The big question is if you are willing to ascend beyond base needs and be like Yang

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>>57773742
Hello, Yang.

>>57773742
Hiver detected.

>Muh Yang
>Muh Enlightenment
>Muh Pain Into Pleasure

Stay salty Hombre. Deidre should've finished what she started and wiped all you heathens from your holes.

>>57772787
Aki is way to sexy to be basically just factory furniture.

>>57774765
You know she has horrific personal hygiene, yes?

>>57772787

aki-waifu 5

seriously she's a top tier waifu

>>57772787

> Members of the opposite gender are the eye candy

And the same gender, too. It's the Spartans. They were famous for being all about brotherly love even by Ancient Greek standards.

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>>57774877
Precisely opposite, being a cyborg.
Where did you get your idea, morganite propaganda? If anyone ever was accused of lacking such, it was Zak, and that's because he couldn't be bothered to cut his hair to any fashion rather than actual lack of hygiene.
Although there was a period where she was too out of it to care, being stricken with fever shortly after ill-fated experiment that nearly became a case of self-lobotomy.

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>>57775329
Sure, although I'd rather go for the opposite.
Also many forget that Spartans also have the best childcare on the planet.

What if you took competent sci-fi writer showrunners and made a SMAC TV show about the different factions?

Sorta like Star Trek but with many different perspectives.

I wonder what progenitor blowjobs feel like

>>57775453
Miriam would be missionary.

>>57775537
Decent people shouldn't think too much about that.

-- Prokhor Zakharov,
"For I Have Splooged in Mouth"

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>>57775478
How do you keep them from murdering each other? Only Deirdre and Zak can coexist peacefully in a room for some amount of time, and that if they avoid sticking the worms where they don't belong and ruining ecosystem.
>>57775538
Did you even play? Although yes, the position would likely be missionary.

>>57775689
>How do you keep them from murdering each other?
Through a convoluted set of ceasefires, demilitarized zones,pacts and possible Progenitor influence to make sure there's often a larger than life enemy.

>>57754314
nice

alternatively, you could fluff it that they become authoritarian in their admittance of new theories and their science suffers as a result - it's actually happening to some extent right now, with peer-reviewed journals having a strangulative effect on certain science industries

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>>57775725
Implying that Santiago wouldn't come bearing every weapon she could get her hands on, Morgan wouldn't break the wind and make the room entirely unbearable to anyone but himself, Lal wouldn't rig the election to get double the votes, Yang wouldn't ignore any agreements altogether and Miriam wouldn't outright attack whoever had misfortune to be a sceptic.

>>57775954
So basically the showrunner in your prototype is Seth MacFarlane.

>>57775982
Can't do worse, I guess. Stephen Fry can do it as well, if not better. Given the liberty, I'd have picked Tom Lehrer.

>>57775478
Current television would turn the spartans into the amazons, miriam into literally trump, the gaians into a lesbian feminist utopia, morgan into the king of wakanda and zak into a dawkins-at-best tbbt/r-atheism steroetype at worst, obviously evil russian. Lal could go either way, and Shang would still be mostly Shang but probably closet gay.

Also I'd prefer an animated film series. The first one about the spartan-gaians wars.

>>57776933
The Spartans and Gaians always seemed like some of the least likely factions to beef with each other. Santiago is paranoid about Zak's research and contemptuous of Morgan's pursuit of luxury, but I can't see why she would hate the Gaians unless they're just in an unfortunate geographic position relative to her expanding borders.

Likewise the Spartans have the weakest industry on Chiron, which in theory should put them towards the bottom of Deirdre's hit list.

>>57748865
Free Drones were the only xpac society that made sense, as they were an extension of a real life philosophy: Communism.

They could have done other things the game was missing, like Feudalism or Anarcho-Capitalism

>>57756193
>He also cloned his girlfriend. Often.
*once

>>57778864
The original factions were great because they were spoofs of political ideologies that were in vogue during the 90s. The game had synergy with the prevailing zeitgeist of the time when it was made. The expansion factions were just a grab bag of concepts that had no real connection to anything. Hence why they felt a little fan fiction-y

>>57774765

It is still unpleasant, but it aint no Cult of the Planet where only the elite gets to live well. It is the kind of community that commands hard work so everyone is safe.

>Most Cultists lead an austere existence.
Living quarters are cramped
and bare of comforts. Clothing tends
to be ragged, patched, and filthy.
Locally manufactured equipment is
serviceable but crude. Only the priesthood
enjoys clean, ostentatious garb
and luxurious quarters

As for more Lal vs Roze, this is life with the Data Angels

>The Angels enjoy creature comforts
and entertainment. This is especially
true of faction members who
are not ace hackers. The farmers,
engineers, scientists, and laborers
who make up the community's support
network are particularly fond of
luxuries. Even the hacker elite
indulges in good food, intoxicants,
and elaborate roleplaying games
when not pursuing a ragged burn

Miriam: Austere and bare bones like the most autocratic societies, but not as demanding as the Hive and much more hopeful and full of spirit (both in the soul and mind) against an uncaring planet that tries to kill it's people everyday.

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>>57775453
>Santiago doesn't need a strap-on to rape you

>>57769532
Not sure if bait, or just regular /pol/tard

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>>57771192
>>Yang
>It's the Hive
The simplicity of this one kills me from inside

>>57779048
>Miriam: Austere and bare bones like the most autocratic societies, but not as demanding as the Hive and much more hopeful and full of spirit (both in the soul and mind) against an uncaring planet that tries to kill it's people everyday.
See, I like this, because austere and... well, Spartan is my aesthetic.

Ironically, I'm staunchly agnostic and probably would end up in Lal's territory by dint of having both morals and a brain, and thus having nowhere better to go; but I don't mind the Believers being the Believers, and I think Miriam by the end game has some pretty good points while everyone else is going off the deep end.

Like, seriously, if you're disintegrated and reformed somewhere else, is it really you, walking out of the portal, or someone just like you? Miriam's the only one who really asks that question besides Lal, Zak and everyone else is busy tossing shit through the portals and having a blast playing Chelle, and Yang is probably doing his best impression of GLADoS given autocratic control of a society.

Yang would be fine if it weren't for the fact that he acts like a shitty person. It's one thing to have an austere outlook on life, it's another to be a nhilist forcing people into tiny concrete boxes and telling them that if they think hard enough, pain turns into pleasure. One's asceticism, the other is just chattel slavery.

>>57779571
Yang does a pretty good job of explaining his philosophy himself. One good thing that can be said about the Hive is that there's no pretense; either you love Nerve Staples or you don't.

>>57778722
>Likewise the Spartans have the weakest industry on Chiron
You fucking idiot... their -1 Industry rating means they overmilitarise their economy and thus have hard time making other things than guns. Kind of how your average commie nation was always focusing on heavy industry, even if it was fucking Cuba, just to make more guns and ignoring other branches of the industry and economy in the process.
tl;dr Spartan industry is inefficient and dedicated to weapon manufacturing, not small

>>57778864
>or Anarcho-Capitalism
You mean Morgan once he can run Free Market?

>>57778722
>always seemed like some of the least likely factions to beef with each other.
Yeah that's right and yet their war is one of the few mentioned within the game. And it seems like Deidre completely destroyed Santiago.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2L5JgTkxAkg

Other quotes about this include the neural amplifier and the "dig that crazy gaian witch!" ones, as well as a book directly called "The Fall of Sparta".
It's pretty funny how all this seems to suggest that a) the spartans, the survivalist faction was the first to fall, b) the best possible army humanity could produce died like a bitch to the planet's common fauna, and c) it was the work of the seemingly most innocent and powerless leader and faction. Must have been a huge wake up call for the other leaders.

>>57781209

Apparently canon has it that Miriam falls later, and she herself steps into a psi gate without programming exit coordinates.

>>57748627

Ok, I gotta ask, what the hell?

>>57781393

The Left Behind / SMAC crossover? From the look of it it's someone's labor of love. Weird choices for a crossover, and the RPG stuff looks unfinished, but the quest is a decent read.

Create civs for a new age of alpha centauri!
Hard mode: game bonuses too

>Ancap faction: Freemen's Society
+1 morale
+1 economy
-1 police
May not use Planned Economics

>SJW faction: Progressive Utopia
+1 police (thought crime)
+1 probe (doxxing)
-1 economy (little real freedom)
-1 research (problematic thought)

>Socialist Democracy society: People's Republic
-1 efficiency
-1 economy
+1 growth
+1 morale
Extra talent for every 4 citizens
May not use free market

>>57781209

The ironic thing is that gameplay wise, the Spartan morale bonus means that they'd fare the best of any non-Gaian faction against Planet's fauna. Guess that didn't hold up in the fluff.

>>57781505

SMAC deals in classical archetypes, not internet flavor-of-the-month nonsense.

>>57781525
>I hate fun and have no imagination

Ok

>>57781525

Interestingly if you pick fundie values, Miriam will welcome you. Instead of declaring jihad/crusade.

> mfw miriam is more enlightened than all the nutcases today

It also hints at the other factions being more or less atheistic, or at least highly secular (think northern europe).

One victory option that is missing is "complete the terraforming and kill the planetmind" - you win by getting rid of (almost) all the fungus squares.

Zak would probably rather do that than achieve transcendence.

>>57781559
All the other factions are pretty secularist yes. Spartans worship the individual, University science, Peacekeepers are liberal universalists, Gaians are hippies, Morgan worships dosh and Yang is Yang

>>57781593

The Hive is still the most alien society, overall. I'd say even counting the (human) expansion factions, including Aki.

Aki: "I'm going to create utopia by messing with everyone's heads!"
Yang: "I'm going to beat you to it by messing with everyone's MINDS, no surgery needed."

>>57781450

Given how central to the plot is the metabolic extension controller stuff, I'm surprised that Aki didn't show up in that game.

>>57781625
Hivr is about complete denial of the individual, in a way that isn't really matched by any faction or even any ending. Even in Transcend ending, individual minds continue to exist in the gestalt of the planet. Yang is a move towards complete eusociality, society as a mechanism or organ rather than a collection of individuals.

>>57781582
Indeed.

Double points if it interfered with other factions going for the "Become one with teh fungus dood," victory.

>>57747406
>>57748905
>>57749160
>>57754212
>>57774998
>>57774765

I am genuinely surprised that there's no Best Waifu / Synder Roze slash.

>>57781655

IDK, I think that transcendence victory fits Yang pretty well. Eusocial ecosystem, but he gets to stay in charge.

Reminds me of Gaia/Galaxia from Asimov's work, really.

>>57781625

The metabolic extension controller is used to keep the brain, heart and lungs ticking, it doesn't replace brain functions per se. I guess Aki would've showed up in the sequel quest. Clever idea though.

> God decrees every unbeliever dies right after puberty
> ok.jpg
> Pacemaker on steroids resurrects you six seconds later

The stuff about Hell was confusing, though.

>>57781593

Yang is what Kim Jong Whatever would like to be.

>>57781505

You know what we lack, speaking of archetypes?

A faction that ultimately only cares about Planet as a launching point, and believes that humanity's future is in the stars.

It's the only trope that isn't covered by anyone (even Zak).

>>57781790
Zak was supposed to be transhumanism but wasn't handled well, much like Spartans weren't handled well.

As for post earthers, planet already is "the stars". You could argue that the manifest destiny crowd is the Spartans, which maybe is what they should have been instead of hurr /k/

>>57781819
The game makers had a hard on for some factions and an obvious lack of interest in others. There were several directions they could have taken the Spartans in to make them a unique and interesting faction, but instead they just gave them a basic U.S. military paint job and called it a day. On the other hand, they lavished attention on the Gaians and obviously expect us to sympathize with Deirdre, despite the fact that she's rivals Yang for title of most inhuman monster on Planet.

>>57781819

As a result, there's no faction that covers it well, so there should be one maybe.

I would give them a small air unit morale bonus, maybe start with some faction frequencies known (all the space nuts I know are also either radio hams, or like to hang around radio hams), and a -1 to planet (who cares, there's plenty more out there) which is partially offset by a bonus to terraforming times (we will have to get very good at terraforming, we got lucky with Chiron).

>>57781885

I always saw the Spartans as more of a homage to Robert Heinlein...

>>57781710

The Hell stuff looks like it's particular to the theology of Left Behind. Should any of this stuff be on 1d4chan?

>>57781931
>Spoiling 1d4chan with someone's crossover fanfiction cancer

Ugh

>>57782165

It's reasonably well written though, and really no worse than the 40K fanfiction that's all over the place. And it does set up a series of worlds using one unified RPG system, although the system itself is incomplete (the magic sections look like placeholders).

>>57782165
>>57782210

It's already in it's own wiki. And the guy who wrote it answered in >>57750117 that he is alive and well so his site is not going anywhere.

Looks like he's hosted other stuff, like quests not by him, and board games. The only thing that should go on 1d4chan is a link as a resouce, maybe.

>>57775478
It'd be more interesting to have something made about what happens on the ship, and how in the end they all end each taking one of the Unity's pods and leading the people inside, whether they want it or not.
We got some webnovels written by SMAC writers, IIRC? They could be expanded upon.

>>57783197

Yeah, one of them was about it. The GURPS splatbook at the beginning of the thread does expand on it some.

An animated SMAC prequel would've been really cool.

>>57781819
>much like Spartans weren't handled well
Now that you said it I could imagine Spartans as space nomadic survivalists

>>57783425

Spartans weren't nomadic one bit, they were all about their citystate... (Interestingly it's implied in the fluff that Sparta is a federation of affiliated bases/citystates on the preclassical greek model).

>>57782271
>>57782165

This is a very strange side conversation.

>>57783478
>Spartans weren't nomadic one bit
And they weren't a well developed faction either. Any new details would be an improvement for them.

>>57784148

I meant Greek Spartans, not Hot Chilean Colonel Spartans.

Is there a canon winner?
Or at least is there canon looser?

>>57784311

Canonically, the Spartans and Believers are eliminated.

By the look of it the assumption is that Gaians win by transcendence, if you look into the game files (they and the transcendence victory are the default for translation samples, etc).

>>57782165

So do we let this die?

>>57784350
O-oh, a little disappointed my boy Zakharov doesn't win but thanks for the answer anyway.

>>57757744
>But it's okay. She doesn't hurt anymore. She is beyond hurt and now sees he was right. She was a child then, and so was he. But she grew up and he never will.
This reminded me of my ex.

>>57784272
Aye, and I meant Hot Chilean Colonel Spartans as this sentence
>Zak was supposed to be transhumanism but wasn't handled well, much like Spartans weren't handled well.
refers to Spartans as a faction, not Greek Spartans

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>>57747266
nerve staples stop people having thoughts unrelated to victory.

>>57784872
>nerve staples
>no atrocities run
Pick one and only one.

>>57785008
no, that was from the no-atrocity run.
It could have been even more if it was stapled.
This, literally, isn't even his final form.

>>57785407

Has anyone ever tried to completely terraform Planet? Kill the fungus like the anon above said?

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>>57785008
>implying it's even a choice

>>57781507
Assuming fanon "quotes indicate who build it", it's even more interesting:
Spartans have their morale bonus, Command Nexus, Cloning Vats and Neural Amplifier. Meaning there should be literal legion of them. Lady D has all the "Planet" secret projects, including Dream Twister and Xenoempathy Dome. And Spartans got their shit kicked, mostly because they are into regular, standard, symmetrical warfare, not contingency against what they percieve as wild animals.
Essentially, your typical high-tech high-training army getting shit-wrecked by non-stop partisant and insurgent actions, while not even recognising them as such and thus not making proper moves. Because what kills Spartans is their utter ignorance toward the Planet. Not in sense of unreasonable exploitation, but simple ignorance of study of it, expecting regular armies to be their enemies.

>>57781559
>It also hints at the other factions being more or less atheistic, or at least highly secular
Welcome to fucking modern times. Completely secular rule is a thing since at least Napoleon.
But I guess when you have a region called "Bible Belt" in your country, this might seem hard to even imagine and thus instantly branding every bog-standard secular country as fedora-tipping atheism.

>>57784872
Sweet baby Jesus. Dat map. Dat holy ever loving fuck map.

He's murder/raped a planet.

>>57781582
"Canon" has is that Zak is one of two people hell-bend on achieving said transcendence. As far as quotes go, Uni and Gaians have pact and work together toward transcendence, with Gaians as "senior" part of the deal.
Also, at that point Spartans no longer exists, Believers are waaay behind with Miriam dead thanks to being too stupid to handle teleportation gate, Yang being either wiped out or so isolated nobody knows what the hell happend to him (which is a thing going most of the time in fluff) and Morgan being replaced as CEO (and thus leader) by his younger relative, T. M. Morgan-Reilly.

>>57781819
>You could argue that the manifest destiny crowd
That's literally part of baseline Believers. Their -1 Planet comes from literal manifest destiny mentality.

>>57784399
Your boy Zak also wins. Going by the quotes and all the existing data, he and Lady D had pact and worked together toward the transcendence - she providing all the knowledge and data on the Planet, he providing the high tech and high concept stuff to make the whole "Planet awakening" possible without killing out everything and everyone.

>>57784872
>On multiplayer, it's fun to play this way too
It's strictly forbidden in multiplayer by pretty much everyone aside people completely green to multi. If you perform base-crawl like this, it usually provides everyone else with a clause to nuke the shit out of you just because you base-crawl.

>>57785447
Not counting deep territory of certain factions, I've once dedicated my game solely to this task, playing on Huge Planet Map.
Most of fungus is on water squares, which makes eradication extremely lenghty, as you can't just roll over it with army of rover formers.

>>57785822
What if you get nuked first?

>>57785878
You don't get it, do you?
Base-crawl is forbidden, period. You do so, others are allowed to use nukes against you. You use nukes first unprovoked? Congrats, enjoy looking for new players for multi and good luck with that in current year.

>>57784872
>>57785822
Is this a subtle implication that Yang actually won since he's unstopable gameplaywise.

>>57785878
Since apparently you never played multiplayer, here is a tip: certain actions and strategies are talked before the game starts and player declare what's allowed and what's not. Due to being just obscenely powerful and the only way to counter it is to base-crawl yourself or simply nuke your enemy (quite easy to pull with such high density of bases), meaning the game turns into min-maxing meta bullshit run and extreme violence going all the time.
And most people hate that.

>>57785919
>>57785969
O-okay.
I don't play multi, shit's too stressful

>>57785964
>since he's unstopable gameplaywise.
Single planet burster (so very small impact on Planet secret rating) can wipe out 12 of his bases. Meaning 4 bursters (the "safe" limit that doesn't allow any meta to counter) can wipe out most of his territory and literally reduce it to sea level.

>>57785985
>shit's too stressful
Part of the reason why base-crawl is verboten comes directly from how stress-inducting it is. Even if nobody is currently doing it, if it's not forbidden, eveyone is scared shitless that others are base-crawling, so they start eventually to crawl themselves (or at least create their initial spread-out of bases to allow future crawl) and thus it turns into self-fulfiling prophecy.
That's why it's simply forbidden most of the tim and when it's not, then it's probably some small map setting, where you either base-crawl or there is no space to move at all.

>>57785985
Multi comes in two flavours: either everyone is comfy building their bases, with kick-started early game due to exchange of starting techs from turn 1 and the game boils down to someone cornering the market or transcending OR everyone is at everyone's throat and if you are Aki, expect to be hunted down with passion, before you can steal-conquest technology.

>>57786017
Does it mean that I can literally never put a city 2 squares away from another city? How many cities do I have to put close to one another to make it count as base crawl? As Morganites, for instance, I basically have to do some early ICS just to alleviate their pop issues.

>>57749232
>She seems to kinda start losing it in the later tech blurbs though
No, she's just the only one still with morals by that point and probably with the most sanity. Giving machines control over your entire civilization, destroying and restructuring your entire body over great distances, cloning entire slave armies, nanomachine hordes, unmaking our very reality strand by strand, this is really fucked up shit that all the other factions just go along with whole hog.

>>57786153
Depends on what people agree upon. "No base-crawl" usually means you can't get a 3x3 base grid. 2x2 is fine, because it's often situational, but 3x3 is what gets people twitch around the red button for nukes and anything above 3x3 is considered blatant violation of agreement to not do this.

>>57786158
>No, she's just the only one still with morals by that point and probably with the most sanity
>This shit again
When, oh when, people will finally grasp that "I have religiously-backed morality" means absolutely shit, because each and every faction has their own highly distinctive set of their OWN morality, centered around the theme of their faction.
In case of Miriam it means what this anon >>57771192 described:
>All Jesus, all the time! Jesus hates atrocities, like nerve stapling (the faithful), putting people (the faithful) in punishment spheres, and gays. Just be a good christian and everything is fine. Don't, and you're LITERALLY SATAN.
She's not better, more sane or level-headed. She's green-eyed religious fanatic that is sprouting more and more aggressive bullshit solely because how far behind her faction eventually gets. There is nothing noble, good or far-seeing in her mentality. It's just an aggressive fundie that is pissed being fundie left her behind, so sells this to own people as "moral superiority" and "moral victor". The kind of bullshit you invent to cover the fact your fucked up and/or lost something, so you need a justification for common people.

>>57786158
Annoying bitch as she is, militant crusader/jihadi that she may be, theocratic dictator that she absolutely is she at least ads a "should we" stage between the "we can do it = lets do it".

Fuck morality and philosophy and personal code of ethics. Giving clouds of floating grey-goo/dust sapience and free will might be a less than great idea long term.

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>>57781663
That would definitely be very interesting. Especially if it also got linked to Global Warming, so either you had some seriously MASSIVE waves of formers to plant forests on the newly de-fungus'd tiles, and pissed off just the players going for Transcendence, or you had half as many formers (and more troops) and pissed off /everybody/ by making Planet barren.

Zak goes with the first option, Yang with the second.

>>57781790
Is it run by Kaito Mamota, Luminary of the Stars? Pic Related.

>>57785447
Doesn't the fungus bloom randomly? Even if you did wipe out all fungus on planet, the blooms would eventually reconquer everything unless you kept around a small army of formers even after such a victory.

Also Planet herself would be fucking /livid/ so the blooms would only grow worse.

>>57785659
>expecting regular armies to be their enemies.
Funny because that's how the actual sparta lost to thebes.

>>57786722
ThatsTheJoke.jpg

>>57786241
Please don't quote me to spread this idiocy, you obviously didn't into Miriam's arc at all.

The first anon is mostly right. She starts off a bonkers fundamentalist by human standards, but she doesn't move, which means by the end game, when everyone else is /actually/ LITERALLY SATAN she's both right and probably the most moral person on Planet.

>>57786758
>It's another episode of whitewashing Miriam
I miss times when "Miriam did nothing wrong" was just a meme. Then somewhere around late 00s it suddenly started to be treated serious.

>>57786888

Well, she's got her good sides and bad sides like all the factions.

>>57781312
Maybe that's the case
But consider the following. In the Psi-Gate quote she calls others to into it as well!

>>57786911
>like all the factions.
Only if we are concerned with original seven and take very lenient on incredibly vanilla and underdeveloped Morgan Industries.
If SMAX is added to the equation, then most of its factions are dog-shit awful, starting with pirates

>>57786940
Compare:
>Go through, my children! The time of miracles is upon us. Let us cast off sin and walk together to the Garden of the Lord. With God's mercy we shall meet again on the other side.
From Psi Gate facility, implying the whole thing is HIGHLY untested and risky Psi Gate itself requires Matter Transmission tech, which gives us Zak's dry humour in form of "The first living thing to go through the device was a small white rat. I still have him, in fact. As you can see, the damage was not so great as they say."
>And what of the immortal soul in such transactions? Can this machine transmit and reattach it as well? Or is it lost forever, leaving a soulless body to wander the world in despair?
From The Bulk Matter Transmitter secret project, and the video is considered the moment she dies

Miriam literally disappears from quotes after that point and before it, most of her quotes were "We must dissent" fearmonging about how technology is bad and evil. So the ultimate irony is - she is the only one to fuck up research in the end and perish because of it. Perfectly fitting, given how SMAC fluff works.

>>57787385
>ultimat irony is
This quote:
Beware, you who seek first and final principles, for you are trampling the garden of an angry God and he awaits you just beyond the last theorem.
But yeah, she fucks up big time. Nobody cried, thou

>>57787230
>incredibly vanilla and underdeveloped Morgan Industries.
Why such a hateboner for Morgan Industries? They've got a pretty distinct flavor and even some explicitly committed atrocities.

>>57778919
>The original factions were great because they were spoofs of political ideologies that were in vogue during the 90s.

What ideologies are even in vogue now? Where I live it is basicaly 90’s social liberals desperately clinging to power in cities, while rural regions are domain of alt right and postethical neofeudal technocrats. Besides some loud ancap pundits, there is nothing else.

>>57787385

I guess that her faction lose, she sticks around as a minor cult leader, and that's her version of the koolaid.

>>57787558
Because they are vanilla, that's why.
This might be my own biase, working as corporate drone for almost a decade, but thing is - unlike all other factions, the only overblown fact about Morgan is that his company is the state. Other than that, it's your bog-standard corporation, with late 80s/early 90s steak of short-sighted high-profit deals at the cost of long-term profit.
So while other factions represent interesting venues for human development or at least toy around some high concepts, Morgan is just a multi-branch corporation. Gee, sooooo futuristic! So mind-blowing!

tl;dr we already had guys like that before the game even came out, nothing interesting.

>>57787750
Not him, but I guess it depends from country to country right now, with a relatively stable situation all over the planet (no, really). Compare it with the mid-90s, where people were still dealing with the aftermath of desolution of Soviet Union and the fall of Eastern Block (this was and still is a BIG deal), Latin America was in the middle of massive shitstorm caused by sudden powershift, Africa was either in the middle of civil war or reconstruction after one (not to mention end of Apartheid still being something new and fresh, having massive impact on media) and then there is North Korea, which almost ceased to exist back then due to combination of factors, while shocking people just how inhuman the regime is (it was the first time when it hit general public since Korean War)... and in the same time China was suddenly on a rise (this was also a BIG deal back then, as it pretty much worked against all possible prognosis made, especially considering Far East economical crisis that DIDN'T affect China, but rather helped it)

>>57788008
>So while other factions represent interesting venues for human development or at least toy around some high concepts, Morgan is just a multi-branch corporation. Gee, sooooo futuristic! So mind-blowing!
Then why aren't you also treating Lal with disdain when he's literally just 21st Century Earth Redux?

>>57788008
Oh, and let's not forget all the issue caused by sponsoring fundies all over the planet due to Cold War and suddenly realising the shitstorm it causes (even in States) as Cold War ended. On one hand there were fundies in Iran (surviving against all odds Iraq-Iran War), on the other there was massive spike of tele-evangelism in States back then as high-profile stuff and of course different fringe Protestant sects gaining notoriety for their "pastoral" style of living. And a lot of weird, "futuristic" cults rising up out of the blue, most prominently Aum Shinrikyo

>>57787750
There's a resurgence of fascist branch ideologies, in the U.S. at least. Mostly neo-nazis and the like finally having a generation that doesn't have a close family member who saw what Hitler did, combined with some slow rot in the right wing weakening the traditionally liberal policies there.

Not sure where the Dems would fall. There isn't a ideology for "Rolls over and plays dead when threatened". French, maybe?

>>57788008
>tl;dr we already had guys like that before the game even came out, nothing interesting.
There are really people who think Morgan is totally right in turning the state into a corporation though. I'm friends with one who swears by the guy.

Morgan may lack the deep impact of Yang or Miriam's stark ideology, but he's not really lacking in depth. In a way he's one of the most insidious faction leaders in a game where every faction leader is at least a little insidious.

>>57788031
>UN that works out and is successful
Maybe because of that? The lofty goals Lal represents are as much fantasy today as they were when the game was developed and released. Meanwhile, Morgan was already stale even before they've started making the game.

>>57788054
He's a greedy CEO that wants constant profit. That's literally all he has. His quotes are about this, his faction is about this, his AI is about this. It's as vanilla as it can get. Like I've already said, the only unique thing about him is being corpo-nation, but how many times you saw that in sci-fi, especially if you are old enough to remember the cyberpunk when it was at its peak.

>>57788061
>UN that works out and is successful
Is it, really? How successful is Lal really in upholding the U.N. Charter for everyone else? Who really cares about what he and his little faction want? Nobody listens to the U.N. on Chiron. And it's just as bogged down in bureaucracy and liable to make the same mistakes.

>>57788089
Doesn't stop Yang's 1984 from being interesting to you though.

Morgan's somewhat unique in his cyberpunk megacorp vibe by being somewhat reasonable and not just lolgreed. He /is/ lolgreed, but he's put some thought into it and can actually argue the point eloquently.

Likewise, not all his quotes are about lolgreed. He also has quotes for the research hospital, which implies that he at least cares for his citizens enough to make sure they can turn some long-term profit for him, even if it causes some short-term hiccups in his bottom line. He's more rational than most modern CEOs

>>57788133
>Who really cares about what he and his little faction want?
The same logic applies to every single other faction
>Nobody listens to the U.N. on Chiron
Everyone does. I dare you commit major attrocity in the game.
> And it's just as bogged down in bureaucracy
Here we go again...
>and liable to make the same mistakes.
liable to =/= does, you moron. Last time I've checked, his faction had the highest living standards of them all. Which, shock and horror, is what UN is busy trying to achieve since at least '92 as its main goal.
I'm really tired of reading bullshit how "eviL' and/or "weak" Lal is. Kind of expected, given >>57788054, but that's just disorting the faction solely to fit your own political believes

In other words - go and stay gone. You know where.

>>57788140
>Morgan's somewhat unique in his cyberpunk megacorp vibe by being somewhat reasonable and not just lolgreed. He /is/ lolgreed, but he's put some thought into it and can actually argue the point eloquently.
Like I've said, I've been working for multinational corporation for 9 years. He's your average CEO. There is nothing special about him. Nothing.
Which is why he's so boring. I'm eager to say he's more generic and unfit to the setting than The Generic Guy, Lal.

>>57788133
There is such lovely term in colloquial English, called "flanderization". It's when you pick characters and then continously overblow all the characteristic element of them, until all you are left with are gross and out-of-proportions caricatures.
Guess what you are doing right now

>>57788221
Nowhere have I said Lal is weak or evil, nor have I started calling you a moron; think of me as you wish or call me a fag, but I'm not going to insult you.

The Charter is out of hands of the U.N. Peacekeepers themselves; you can wipe out Lal and nothing in the Charter would prevent you from doing so. Its resolutions might hold, but the Peacekeepers aren't somehow protected by it.

And yes, the bureaucracy is an issue for the UN. It's spelt within the game itself by the -1 Efficiency malus that points to the red tape as a reason.

Of course Lal's faction is one of the more likable or pleasant ones to live in - but any interpretation that centers around their clinging on to the U.N. virtues causing their ultimate downfall is a viable one. That's because not a single faction in this game is the "good" or "bad' guys, and none of them is perfect. I thought we established that earlier when we noted the good sides of Miriam's character.

>>57788386
>Nowhere have I said Lal is weak
Everything else in the post is fair and true enough, but you 100% implied Lal was weak and ineffectual in the post he quoted.

>>57788133
>Who really cares about what he and his little faction want? Nobody listens to the U.N. on Chiron.

Factions definitely listen to the U.N. Just because it lacks the power to unite them all and become a hedgmonic state doesn't mean it's weak and ineffectual. Commiting the atrocities outlined in the charter is still asking for a dogpile and there are plenty of disincentives that make pulling Yangshit generally a poor idea, at least when playing with factions somewhere in your power group.

It doesn't work this way in-game because in-game the AI is mid-90's "okay" and so a human with a brain can squash them like ants. Doesn't mean that in the fluff the U.N. is a function-less shell... Until shit gets real, at least, but there are excuses for that.

>>57788604
>It doesn't work this way in-game because in-game the AI is mid-90's "okay"
It does work pretty well in multi, because there is even stronger incentive to not pull any atrocities at all. Other humans will ruthlessly gang on you if you give them such great reason, and the lack of commerce really hurts.

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>>57781669
Won't work. Aki had a pretty solid, if tragic, crush on Zak. There's a lot of steamy Deirdre on Santiago tentacle rape and even some fanart to it, though.
>>57788695
Framing Yang always works, though, as nobody trusts Yang so it's relatively easy to imply he's up to something. Or implying that Lal tries to outmanoeuvre everyone. Those votes make him priority target when everything more or less calm.

>>57788604
>but you 100% implied Lal was weak and ineffectual in the post he quoted.

That was not my intention, I apologise; I just thought that you were being too harsh on the Morganites.

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Lal's weakness is ACRP meme. In fluff and crunch both he turns to be pretty good - and surprisingly devious. He does well in pretty much everything, even brutal total war.

Who's your favourite pact bro? Somewhat surprisingly mine is Santiago, for she makes a decent expansion and packs wallop early game - I love it when she protects me from Yang and Miriam long enough to wreck them on schedule, instead of breaking my economy in frantic attempts to arm up, and generally is pretty loyal, even if you beat her, unlike even Lal, who'd try to backstab at the slightest opportunity. Fluff wise I like Zak, but his AI is both weakest, dumbest and unpredictably aggressive to its allies, which makes any alliance with him unbearable.

>>57789296
I usually play Zak, and since I almost always adopt a green economy the Gaians are always willing to make pacts.

As a result, I'll trade all my tech with Deirdre early on to ensure my future ally is as strong as possible. I've got her back, she's got mine, Miriam can eat shit.

>>57750356
From the tabletop supplement IN THE 2ND POST.

Also there is a popular vidya, which is eerily accurate to the tabletop despite being a strat game...

And speaking of the tabletop, if I can ever force myself to run GURPS, what sort of SMAC campaign would be good? I was thinking of having the players be Talents chosen to troubleshoot problems for their Pact (whatever factions the PCs choose would start as allies).

>>57788985
Everybody has their good points and bad points, which is why the game is so good.

Well, actually, Domai doesn't have any glaring flaws, except socialism. But SMAC actually makes socialism viable, so that doesn't count for me.

>>57789614
Nah bro. Ally Miriam and Santiago/Yang, and show the world what happens when the Believers are one of the most teched up players in the game.

Rape, by the way. Rape is what happens. Jesus + Lasers = Rape.

>>57789821
Probe team operatives. Gives plenty of reason for them to be a ragtag group of total weirdos, make them go wherever you need them to go, and still have enough free reign that they don't feel railroaded.

Hell, if you play with Murderhobos, just have them bust into a Hive city with the sole goal of causing as much of a commotion as possible. They'll /love/ that.

Anybody here got the books in rtf or pdf? I need Ely's trilogy and Power of the Mindworms.
>>57789614
As Santiago I always bully Deirdre, but she still wants to be my friend. It makes for a good, but also guilty feeling.
>>57789821
MadMax game, Probe team, exploration/archaeology, diplomacy, hunt for and abuse of the alien tech, dystopian cyberpunk in the hive underbelly. Pretty much everything goes.
>>57789833
Domai fucks up the environment worse than Morgan, without any goodies to show for in. Also is usually still at cavemen techs when everyone approaches singularity.
>>57789843
Miriam being Miriam that rape always turns your way if you're playing Zak. Has merit if you're Yang or Aki, though.

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>>57788875
Daily reminder Miriam inspired Christ-chan and then it went full-circle when Christ-chan was used for Miriam.
And back to topic: the best tactics on multi require going against expectations. People expect from Miriam to go for war - build instead. People expect from Morgan to hoard money and cash on treaties - build military might and aim for few crucial MILITARY projects. People expect from Zak to go full science - run Power and get Cloning Vats. And so on and forth. The only faction that stays in the mold are Gaians. Simply mind worm the shit out of it, because it works always and each time.

>>57789296
>Who's your favourite pact bro?
Either Zak or Santiago and depending on map, Lal. Zak is conflict-free and I tend to run Knowledge. Just trade some techs early on and the build-up trust will carry you for the rest of the game. Meanwhile having Santiago on your side means both Yang and Miriam are going to have to deal with Spartans, while our policies aren't conflicting (I never run Wealth and often end up running Power, so go figure). Lal only works out if he has relatively easy early game. His AI is one of the more competent ones when it comes to building, but only if there isn't much fungus around him and/or he has an abundance of rainy/rolling tiles
I absolutely hate being pact bro with Morgan, since he is utterly useless as a support, lags behind technologically and regularly begs for hand-outs, while also starting wars with Zak and Santiago. Miriam and Yang demand running social choices that just flat-out don't work for any other faction.
And from SMAX, either Domai or Aki. Rest literally could cease to exist. Both are solid allies, both have competent AI (Aki is literally Zak AI revisited, so double-gain) and have non-conflicting social choices (I mostly run Cybernetic, thou)

>>57789843
>and show the world what happens when the Believers are one of the most teched up players in the game
... the same as always, three-sided war with Santiago, Yang and Zak. And Believers AI can't win those, because it can't properly seize bases, instead being written around focusing units. That's part of reason why wars involving Believers go forever.

>>57790052
>Domai fucks up the environment worse than Morgan, without any goodies to show for in
Domai mid and late game choices are anything, but fucking up Planet, aside being unable to pick Green, since for him people are the priority, even if it means strip-mining entire continent
>Also is usually still at cavemen techs when everyone approaches singularity.
You mean fluff or actual gameplay? Because in BOTH you are wrong. Fluff-wise, he has rough start, but then starts rolling with some heavy hitting stuff. Gameplay-wise, even AI can properly use the -20% production cost bonus, especially since it goes from there and thus allows to spam all sort of science facilities, all while shitting out fuckload of bases.

So aside your own disdain toward Domai, he is the most solid faction from SMAX and could easily work out as honorary 8th faction of SMAC if that even was possible

>>57789821
Set it in an alternate timeline where the mission went about as well as could be expected.

Unity did a bunch of orbits of Planet, deployed a bunch of satellites and set down on the shores of Landing Bay and was disassembled to make Unity City.

It's been 20 years. Garland has been dead for 7 of those due to cancer although his removal from office was so gradual that barely any of the plebs noticed until some time after the fact. Lal is Chairman now as he is at one and the same time the only one capable of doing the cat herding and not actually hated excessively by any of the other Chairmen.

The members of the Board are:

Nwabudike Morgan
Prokhor Zakharov
Corazón Santiago
Deirdre Skye
Miriam Godwinson
Domai

They each vie for position and power and offer cash for anything that can be used to either aid themselves or hinder their rivals.

In the 20 years a bunch of people gathered the resources to set up their own nations. Typically consist of one or two settlements, with the possible exception of Sheng-ji Yang and his rapidly growing Hive.

Break away national leaders are:
Sheng-ji Yang
Aki "Zeta-5" Luttinen
Cha'Dawn
Ulrik Svensgaard

Sinder Roze is an information broker and annoying dipshit wanted by all people in authority but occasionally tolerated because she is sometimes useful.

The party is a probe team.

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>liking the spartans who are the same boring, overused 'warrior race' trope as every other fucking sci-fi """""spartan""""" faction

>>57790223
Why would you play against your strengths? I don't wage war as Deirdre in multi, usually allying with Zak and Aki for mutually assured protection and teching together for transcendence while the rest - idiots - tries to wipe each other from the map. Between three of us we have a hard counter to pretty much everything.
>>57790316
Zak's player has problems staying loyal and consistent, although he's always eager to exchange tech as long as you'd never think of probing him and offer military assistance when required.
>>57790426
Domai is broken, in the powerful way. He can outcrawl Yang, outfight Santiago and outrich Morgan, but usually he still lags at tech and shits up the environment in the process. Ally with Zak to make all Domai problems go and stay away.

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>>57772787
>No disgustingly unfit and unhygienic slobs, incels, SJW and other degenerates around you
>lead by a hue
>no degenerates

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>>57790656

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Reminder that Beyond Earth killed Alpha Centauri and we'll NEVER get a remastered

>>57790700
Why would you need a remaster? All it needs is a touch-up on the AI of the factions and the planet itself, something those currently in charge of the Civ series would be too retarded to implement properly.

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>>57790795
i'm a whore for graphics and the outdated ones in smac have kept me away no matter how much i want to play it

>>57790437

I love that!

Is that the continuity in which Zakharov changes his title to Space Wizard?

>>57788875

Would too work. Roze would just redirect Aki's crush with a few keystrokes.

>>57788054

Bryan Reynolds wrote a better Randian hero than Ayn Rand did.

>>57790836
Why the fuck not. Who would argue with him?

>It's a "Pravin Lal is a corrupt bureaucrat who represents corrupt bureaucracy" episode
The UN in this future is an immensely successful agency that managed to put together this entire mission to save mankind. Every single individual on the Unity is involved with the UN in some way. Pravin Lal wasn't even a bureaucrat back on Earth; he was a doctor, and the ship's medical officer. He only ended up as the head of the remnants of the UN after everyone else of importance on the ship fucked off to create their own factions. Lal represents a fairly ordinary, though particularly intelligent and canny man, with unshakeable faith in the character of man. There's not really any "bad guys" in AC (although Yang comes close), but Lal is indisputably the good guy.

>>57790795
SMAC is kinda ugly by modern standards. A shiny new case would be a very appreciated addition.

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>>57790882

>>57790820
Primitive CGI aside, it aged pretty great. DPI aside I would argue that the graphical part of SMAC still is much better than that of the modern Civs. And gameplay's even better. You should definitely try it if you're a fan of the genre. Get it from the GoG.
>>57790857
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BmRpLLs7SNE
Fuck you and your probes, bzzt.
>>57791021
One could dream.

>>57790940
Yeah, I'd say Yang is the only really villainous cast member, and Lal is the only one with any hope of being Good.

Everyone else could go either way, depending on your view of politics. Deidre could be a wormfucker like her detractors say, or she could run a hippie paradise. Morgan could go full Randian dystopia, or he could exemplify the benefits of the free market. It really depends on who's the player for that faction.

I always play Miriam and play fairly peacefully, so in any of my games the Believers are a kind and forgiving people. Her AI ain't like that though, and I don't think she is in the fluff either after the Unity goes down.

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>>57791117
>I'd say Yang is the only really villainous cast member
what about the one who's willing to kill you for not having enough guns for her liking

>>57791117
>wanting humanity to be as efficient as possible is being evil

>>57790539
I wonder if anyone modeled an actually historically accurate Sparta instead of relying on the meme version.

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>>57790820
I dislike you with great intensity, yet respect you for your honesty.

>>57792524
It's never been done in sci-fi, at least

>>57792524
>>57796125

"The meme version" is roughly how Spartans WANTED to be seen. So theres that

>>57792524
>>57796355
Spartans were REALLY mishandled as a faction. It's like they wanted to make Nationalists, but then realized oh, they don't have a nation. Uhhh.... have them worship guns

They should've been a Heinlein-esque military republic with a boner for rugged individuality, get all the /k/ and innawoods and manifest destiny humanity fuck yeah fags

>>57796488
as bare as the lore is in BE compared to SMAC, I like Rejinaldo as a military leader more than Santiago. He's a reasonable general who cares for his men rather than just being a hooah jarhead

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>>57796574
Bolivar was one of the few leaders with any personality, yes. Him and Russian. The Strayan had a personality but not any clear politics. The Chinese lady was... Chinese

>>57796488

> They should've been a Heinlein-esque military republic with a boner for rugged individuality

I though that's what they ended up being.

>>57796488
Spartans are what /k/ dreams of being.
Nationalists make shittiest characters. At best you'd have hysterical brownpants with delusions of grandeur, incredibly annoying voice, bereft of senses common and otherwise, or that fat spoiled retard that inherited and somehow keeps Korea, despite having no clue abut running a country and general wits of a rotten toddler. At worst you'd get a /pol/e Piłsudski wannabe.

>>57797280
Globalists are just nationalists on a grander scale. EU supporters, for example. Hyper nationalist; they just see themselves as a different nation.

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>>57749827
Base game is pretty meh, but after Rising Tide it's solid. Civilization fans blindly shit on everything that isn't [insert your favorite Civilization game here] for poorly conceived reasons all the time.

>>57796673
>The Strayan had a personality but not any clear politics.

That actually makes sense given his character, though, since he's not a political figure. He's a businessman who didn't even want to lead a colony ship, but ended up being pushed into it anyway.

>>57797675
>but after Rising Tide it's solid

It isn't. God, I loved Beyond Earth and I wanted Rising Tide to fix things so much, but the AI is utterly braindead and almost completely passive. Even more so than in most Civ games. It rarely seems to bother upgrading its tiles and seems to stop performing research after a while, either that or just putters about getting random techs instead of useful ones to catch up with the player. I can't remember the last time an AI faction in BE actually attacked me, as opposed to declaring war then sitting inside its borders doing nothing. Being able to settle on water also means you rarely compete for space or resources, because you can drop cities down anywhere you like rather than being restricted by landmass.

Sadly, I think with one more good expansion pack to improve the AI, add some more layers of flavour and address a few other balance issues, it could have been a fantastic game. But with Civ6 now hogging the spotlight, there's no chance of it happening.

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>>57797780
Oh yeah, and my playtime just for posterity.

so is the gog version good and working properly?

>>57798116
From what I played yes.

>>57798116
Yes. So long as you won't use shit systems like Win10. Millennium, or applecrap.

>>57798133
>>57798234
ok, thanks

What kinds of games would you even run in the GURPs game?

>>57798537
Here are some plots I thought of for fun
>Morganites and the University of Planet are racing one another's industry to raising a new wonderful Secret Project; players are spies that sell info and sabotage the efforts for money. Bonus points for a Yojimbo/A Fistful of Dollars situation.
>players encounter an Obelisk which gives them st
>players are Deirdre Skye's right-hand assistants and due to their strong PSI-force were chosen to pilot the Gaians' first Mind Worm unit
>UoP research colony is laid on a foundation of fungi and all its nutrients are delivered via Supply Crawlers, which are conspicuously going missing
>the conquered New Jerusalem becomes home to The Self-Aware Colony and the players must dissent
>players play a Probe Team
>Santiago's Cloning Vats produce the PCs as the Spartans are commissioned by the U.N. Charter as the first line of defense against the Progenitor Usurpers who won the Progenitor struggle
>the Gaians have transcended, but their cities lay empty and mysterious
>Morganite colony on a remote island doesn't have standing militia to withstand bombardment and upcoming invasion of spore launchers and mindworms; saving the colony is the first step for the players to making it big with the bigwigs
>Human Hive refugees embrace the Yangian principles of ascetism and collectivism, but refuse to be nerve stapled
>ships begin disappearing in the sea and their last communications are incoherent screaming
>Miriam Godwinson receives strange premonitions and sents a group of her acolytes to investigate a location where a manifold nexus lies dormant
>players are members of The Empath Guild and the Planet is calling out to something sinister
>like Paranoia, except Friend Computer is Sheng-ji Yang

>>57798835
The battle for Planet is over. The Gaians have won, sweeping over everyone with ever-growing hordes of mindworms. In a last ditch effort to save himself, Zak commissions a secret portal be made - to where, he never knew. Turns out, it went /everywhere/.

Players are heroes from other universes, each dragged in by a different faction survivor, and this is the first steps to reconquering Chiron. For now, everyone, even the University and the Believers, are united against the Gaian threat, but how long will that last? And why does Skye seem so... accommodating to the players actions against her? Everyone's plotting... but who's plotting evil?

>>57799679

That's indeed very GURPS. :D

>>57798835

* Probe Team shenanigans. All of them.

* There's an organization called the Underground Monorail, that exists to help people discontented with their faction leave it, in exchange for a year of service. Hippies moving from Morgan Inc to the Stepdaughters, stuff like that. Obviously, Hive extractions are really difficult...

* Riffing on the weird Left Behind stuff up thread: Eight years ago, Miriam walked into a psi gate. Now she's back looking all silvery and calling herself the Herald of Yahweh.

>>57796673

this guy has seen some shit.

>>57790582
>Why would you play against your strengths
Because Miriam makes fantastic builder, Morgan can afford fuck-huge army despite -1 Support (-3 in fact, since you are going to run Democracy) and put up to speed all those secret projects with stacks of money, Zak already has a massive tech advantage and can afford picking Power instead of Knowledge for massive boost to military... I didn't pick those factions and tactics at random. They are all tested and throw people off-balance when preparing to deal with you. Especially those all to eager conquest type of people, since you suddenly have more than ace in your sleeve.

Regarding Zak's AI "loyality" - there is in-build trust counter (or whatever the game actually calls it in the script). If you time things right and provide Zak with extra techs, free of charge, while already running Knowledge in early game upon first meeting, you essentially kick the counter of trust (this is not the same as relationship status), it carries you for the rest of the game. Meaning Zak AI will stick to you through thick and thin.

And not the anon you are replying to, but Domai works as a partner with pretty much everyone, considering his political choices and the fact anyone can prop him up with technologies.

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>>57801086

> supercapitalist faction
> run democracy, but stay in charge as corporate overlord
> spike your psych spending to entertain the masses when you go to war with the huge army you bought earlier

>>57801086

Zak announcing to the University board of trustees that the faction is going to pick Power instead of Knowledge for a few years, in order to win a war, deserves some writefaggotry.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PqxCL8n2LD8

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>>57790795
Not the anon you asked about remaster, but:
I would kill to have the clips for secret projects re-made into HD. I saw Baraka two years ago in clearead out version in cinema. Playing SMAC was never the same after it.
And despite being a veteran, I say the UI is clunky as fuck. Ironically, I tend to randomly switch to simplified menus out of the sheer clunkieness, because the option self-selects itself.
And not my complain, since I'm still using 15'' monitor out of pure habit and I'm scared to death the day the old clunker dies, but friend of mine can't run SMAC properly on a panoramic display of his and is forced to play on laptop to get it running at all. Kind of problematic on the long run.

>>57801135

Left Behind fag (geistklempner?) has solved the problem.

Download the "for tg" or build at http://emlia.org/portfolio/games/smac/ and then copy your audio and video files there.

This comes with a bit of a rules change, enough to desync multiplayer, but it also makes the game work properly on widescreen, and it can be windowed with alt+enter.

>>57796488
I don't think you were around in first half of the 90s and the initial few years of the internet. At least not as fully reflective person. And I don't mean this as an insult. Here is the deal with Spartans from SMAC:
They are your average right-wing paramilitary survivalist group from Oregon, only in space. They have nothing to do with nationalism or any of the currently "trendy" right-wing stuff. They represent the aftermath of the end of the Cold War and the effect it had on all sort of those overly gung-ho types that were preparing all their CIVILIAN lives for a war that never happend, but still advocated the "well-armed militia to defend the country" bullshit.
It all was lost in the context somewhere around War On Terror started, like... well, half of the things that were THE issues of the 90s.

Also, how the fuck you imagine nationalists in a game that is all about dropping national issues and instead focusing on political and social agendas?