>>62359947
A valid point about the population being lower than it's maximum, but then we could just avoid the issue of the station's maximum capacity and just say that they were down to about 500,000 people when the Ssylth showed up.

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What concerns the Royal Couple in the closing years of the 41th millennium?

>>62360630
Malys lining up another Black Crusade
That the 'Nids have landed
The Necrons are mostly all awake and the Silent King is being a shit head
Orks are getting more organised
The dark eldar are closer than ever go the Chaos eldar
The inquisition is having a civil war
The Beil-Tan avatar won't go back to sleep

On a personal level Isha wants children and can't have any. At least not yet.

>>62360929
>On a personal level Isha wants children and can't have any. At least not yet.
Wait, won't Ynnead spawn in the turn of millennium?

>>62361046

Maibe later... Who is going to be born is Lofn.

>>62361046
Probably. But prophesies are a poor guide to the future, especially that one with all the variations.

>>62360014
That's just the station. There were also outposts.

>>62361896
Which got ,ironically, I raided by the dark Eldar once. The Sneks actually manged to fight then off.

Surpringly.

>>62362118
Not that surprising. Depending on which Kabal it was, their method of attack and who was present commanding the defence it could have gone very badly indeed for the DEldar. The Sneks worked for these "people" for a very long time. Knowing how they think and predicting their behaviour was a survival trait. Add to that that it might be a Kabal that once employed them or that they have been in conflict with before at some point.

DEldar come in expecting to encounter a lower end PDF. They leave the system with substantial losses and nothing to show for those losses, they return to their homes humiliated.

The real kicker? They never even knew that the Ssylth were there. The outpost they went after had one Ssylth who never left any survivors to report back what they had seen.

This wasn't the first time that the DEldar had gone on easy raids to Cherys in the 500 years of isolation. The place was practically a free range human farm crossed with a pick-and-mix. They haven't been back since as their reckoning of profit to loss no longer stack up favourably and there are softer targets elsewhere.

>>62362389

I was hoping the Ssylth would be welcomed as heroes for this much to their surprise.

>>62362577
They would still praised for it. If it wasn't for their take over security would have consisted of poorly trained gangs running protection rackets. Since moving in the Ssylth broke the gangs up, gave some of them them some degree of training who then trained others, formed them up into mixed squads, shored up defences and generally got them to take their jobs seriously. When the Imperium came calling they provided them with new las-rifles to replace or augment the supplies of 500 year old hand me downs and improvised home made shit and gave them some flack jackets and other really basic gear.

None of this would have happened if the Ssylth hadn't arrived, beaten everyone into shape and eaten the worst objectors.

Also Sekropss was especially well praised or leading the defences and turning the raid inside out. Sekropss is an extremely clever bastard. That wasn't even his real job, he was just keeping the seat warm for someone who was moulting, his actual job is trying to create a judiciary and the rules for a constabulary system from whole cloth.

>>62362953

Neat. I wonder how life on this port would be for an average human and if rogue traders would stop here.

>>62363024
Life on the port is... interesting. The Murphy-effect doesn't just affect the sneks, though they certainly seem to have gotten hit by it harder than most.
At this point, it's somewhat normal for the residents, who don't really see anything too weird about it, and an outsider looking in wouldn't notice anything too glaring at first. Then they get to one of the station's worksites and find people with five different wrong types of connector that the workers go through until one of them inexplicably fits, backup tools are stashed in every crevice, and a normally-minor discrepancy with the power intake leading to everybody leaving the floor, seconds before the power-surge the discrepancy heralded wreaks havoc on the floor.

In other words, they've grown very good at anticipating unexpected dangers and working with the wrong materials. When they're off the station and out in the rest of the Imperium, this can come off as paranoia and obsessive-compulsive behavior, but on-station it's all completely justified.

As for Rogue Traders, of course they stop by, and several of them leave with hulls full of riches or powerful new crew-members or the like. This is because to them, the station is basically like a casino; Try your luck and see if you make it big! There's potential for profit here, a land of opportunity, but only if you're lucky enough!
Some of them find that fortune in ways that basically screw them out of being Rogue Traders, others just get screwed, but they keep coming because they hear about the ones who came out better for it, and ignore the bit about how customer satisfaction is universally shit.

>>62363024
There's a glass ceiling you can't get past. Ssylth didn't escape one master to becomes servants to someone else. They rule Cherys Station, you can choose which one of them rules in the (rigged) elections but that's about as far as it goes.

The station and it's outposts are a better place to live now than they were, you probably won't get shanked for no reason any more and the Ssylth cleaned the worst of the scum out of the airlocks and the critical systems have more or less regular maintenance now so the inhabited sections of the station are reliably habitable and functional now.

It's still shit, but it's getting better slowly.

Once the Imperial Reclamation and Colonization effort really gets underway they will be swimming in customers and goods. The good times are coming.

>>62361046
Yes. Probably. Maybe. Possibly. Certainly, for a given value of certain.

>>62363024
No worse than the underhives. Possibly slightly better.

What could be some good ideas for trader dynasties?

>>62366005
Indeed, and that also raises the point of different tolerances for things. The underhives, even in this Nobledark setting, are a moralistic nightmare by our current standards, but the Imperium is fine with it because it's not exactly something that can be fixed and is actually useful in it's own way.
In a similar way, these Ssylth are still absolutely reprehensible by modern moral standards, but to the Imperium they're practically upstanding citizens, especially considering their past and current circumstances. There's still gang wars over territory, gun-trafficking, and all sorts of bad stuff going on in the station, it's just that it's basically "normal" crimes for the Imperium, rather than the balls-to-the-wall edgy shit of Commorragh.

This brings up another point, that these Ssylth don't engage in the slave trade and tend to crack down on it harshly and bloodily. It's not a matter of approval, they started out in the Dark City after all, it's their possessiveness kicking in. Any slave-trade on the station is dealing with Station-dwellers, and the station-dwellers belong to THEM, so taking them as slaves is basically stealing the Ssylth's shit. And no commorraghite is going to tolerate anybody stealing their shit. Of course, this gets misinterpreted as them having a moralistic line they won't cross, so once again the whole situation is screwing them over.

>>62367753
We've established that old Rogue Trader dynasties have basically become giant mega-corporations, so perhaps something that builds from that?

For something a bit more specific, maybe have a trader dynasty with some foibles from their early days when they had to negotiate with several different independent parties, like social rituals they had to go through for one race that eventually became standard policy, so now you've got dozens of systems where any official meeting has to be prefaced with a tea ceremony or something of the like. The old purpose is no longer relevant, but now it's done because it's tradition and because nobody's seen fit to change it.

>>62367753
>>62369623
Maybe take some inspiration from Shadowrun as well, as cyberpunk megacorp aesthetics might fit in better with the generally more modern art deco style of the Nobledark Imperium than regular 40K's Gothic aesthetic. So instead of cyborgs in powdered wigs and ruffled coats, think cyborgs in tailored suits, ties and smart hats, perfectly legitimate businessmen who also dabble in being 'perfectly legitimate businessmen' on the side.

>>62369823
Yeah, that look goes particularly well with the fact that anyone that has the money will pay for a "Lunar" style ship with sleek lines and as much chrome and gold as they can afford. The major Rogue Traders themselves would probably mix enlightenment era dandy looks and slick, tailored futuristic minimalism, while also trying to stretch youth centuries beyond its end with cybernetics and rejuvenants. At some level even the middle management of Imperium scale corporations would come off as altered carbon style meths, but for all their preening, strutting, and colorful talk, the interstellar aristocracy have many strong cultural reminders of their own mortality.

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I'm back, though I think I caught something when I was AFK. I am going to go back through the last thread or two and make sure everything from them is on the wiki.

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>>62373466
Welcome back! I hope you enjoy reading through the last thread's escapades; we certainly had fun, and even managed to reach the bump limit like we're supposed to!

Sorry to hear you're not feeling well though; here's hoping you get better soon!

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A suggestion for some Star Empire Necrons.

The leadership of the Necron Star Empire is a pale shadow of its former self. While Szarekh, first and mightiest of their number, still reigns, the other two members of the Triarch, his left and right hands, were lost in the millions of years during the Great Sleep. Szarekh's right hand was Ahmontekh of the Suhbekhar Dynasty, a skilled warrior with an eye for long-term strategy, valued not only for his ability in battle but for his wise council. Ahmontekh's skill in battle was such that he was one of the warriors that fought alongside the C'tan and even struck the killing blow that slew the Great Weaver of the K’nib. When the War in Heaven ended, Ahmontekh entered the Great Sleep without issue like so many other Necrons.

Then, approximately twenty-three million years ago, the Old Eldar Empire made the mistake of waking Ahmontekh up early. Although separated from his dynasty, having been put into stasis alongside some of the finest soldiers and war machines of the Necron Star Empire due to his status as Triarch, Ahmontekh had enough resources entombed with him in his royal crypt to pose a serious problem. Ahmontekh’s response to being awoken by the children of the Old Ones was swift, immediate, and fiery. Worlds that had known peace for millions of years burned under, their state of the art defensive systems no match for ancient Necrontyr technology. In particular, the eldar swore eternal vengeance on Ahmontekh for destroying the Crone World of Maldek, killing trillions in a single stroke, and declared they would hunt him to the ends of the galaxy. Worse yet was that Ahmontekh’s destruction wasn’t simply mindless. He was looking for the other tomb worlds and his buried lord. If the eldar didn’t stop him soon, the Old Empire would have a full-scale revival of the Necron Star Empire on their hands.

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>>62376083
Then the Old Empire were approached by a strange figure, a robotic avatar of an unknown species with a single cycloptic eye. Exactly who this being was remains unknown, but told the eldar it knew of a way to destroy Ahmontekh. Long ago before the Necrons had traded flesh and blood for metal, Ahmontekh had warred with the Charnovokh Dynasty, which at the time had been ruled by his cousin. Although outright warfare between the Suhbekhar and Charnovokh Dynasties had been stopped by the control protocols, the memory of the rivalry still existed in Ahmontekh’s mind. The stranger could take that seed of resentment, distort it and expand it, until nothing else occupied the Phaeron’s mind. While Ahmontekh was a skilled fighter and cunning strategist, his weakness was his lack of scientific knowledge. Like most Phaerons, Ahmontekh knew nothing of how technology actually worked, and therefore no way to stop anyone from subverting the functions of his mind. Ahmontekh would be made predictable and easy to destroy by his madness. The eldar considered any plan to destroy Ahmontekh to be a good idea, but they didn’t notice the stranger spoke such words with a heavy heart. Although they knew the stranger wanted Ahmontekh gone as much as they did, what they didn’t know is that Gahet of the Cabal had approached the Eldar Empire as a last resort, having previously tried to sway Ahmontekh to his cause with words instead of violence.

The foul deed was done and Ahmontekh’s mental state began to deteriorate. Rather than seek out and awaken his liege Szarekh, he became increasingly focused on finding the resting place of his hated rivals the Charnovokh Dynasty and destroy them once and for all. Knowing his hated rivals were located somewhere on the Eastern fringe, Ahmontekh’s army marched increasingly eastward, making their movements extremely telegraphed and easy to intercept.

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>>62376123
The eldar assumed he was killed in a bombardment, especially given his forces fell apart soon after his assumed death, but such was not the case. In one last display of sentimentality out of regret for his own actions, Gahet crippled Ahmontekh’s cybernetic body and spirited him away before his death. He placed the mad Phaeron in a stasis capsule and laid him to rest in the old tomb complexes of the Suhbekhar Dynasty, hoping that Ahmontekh could one day be awakened and healed of his madness at a time when the galaxy no longer had to conceive of war.

With the incapacitation of the triarch, rule of the Suhbekhar Dynasty fell to Ahmontekh’s son, Ahhotekh. In many ways, Ahhotekh is everything that his father was not. Instead of being a proud regent and warrior, he is a schemer, who prefers to dispose of his foes through intrigue and manipulation rather than brute force. Ahhotekh has even gone so far as to disdain those who gain power through brute force; while he has killed in his share of duels, he considers those who make a habit of it to be insufficiently imaginative to actively hold power and capable of little more than savagery. Ahhotekh spent much of the War of Heaven disposing of his rivals in convenient accidents and other such methods, including stoking the rivalry between the Suhbekhar and Charnovokh Dynasties. Indeed, before the biotransference, Ahhotekh was actively plotting to dispose of Ahmontekh, the only member of the Suhbekhar Dynasty who would dare consider raising their hand against the Phaeron, something that the control protocols put a stop to.

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>>62376135
Fortunately, despite Ahmontekh’s incapacitation the control protocols were still in place, his insanity was not enough to cause the Suhbekhar Dynasty to break the will of the Silent King. However, this is cold comfort for Ahhotekh, who isn’t sure if the control protocols also protect him since his father is incapacitated, not dead. As a result, Ahhotekh is intensely paranoid and relentlessly persecutes his underlings for any perceived sign of betrayal. After all, he would do the same to them if their positions were reversed. It is unclear, but ironically possible, that the control protocols forbidding harm to their liege are the only thing preventing the Necrons of the Suhbekhar Dynasty from rising up and uniting as one to overthrow Ahhotekh.

However, no matter how much he wants to, there is something preventing Ahhotekh from disposing of his dear father. Ahmontekh saw something when he was awakened, something that few others alive in the galaxy today still remember. The Silent King wants that information out of Ahmontekh’s head, as any intelligence on the state of the galaxy since the Great Sleep could prove highly useful in realizing the Star Empire’s plans. At the same time, Ahhotekh wants the control protocols to secure control of the Suhbekhar Dynasty, and as long as the Silent King’s orders leave room for creative interpretation of his orders he is willing to pursue it. Nevertheless, examining Ahmontekh’s mind is a slow process, one that must be carried out piecemeal by thousands of Crypteks. Seeing too much of Ahmontekh’s mind at once tends to drive any Necron who sees it insane.

>>62376170
Wasn't sure how good this was and how closely it fits the themes of the characters in canon because it was kind of a hashed out rough draft. Ahmontekh is implied to be one of the toughest Necrons in canon and was also implied to have killed an eldar god, but I couldn't find one from Fantasy that might work well (Mathlann? Who cares about Mathlann?) So I figured throwing out a mention to a K'nib god as one of those tantalizing bread crumbs.

Ahmontekh in canon was said to be one of the better long-term planners and was said to have a bunch of contingency plans. So that might be something to consider addressing.

Like canon, I'd assume Ozkan the codifier is loyal to Ahmontekh over Ahhotekh, and is slowly trying to piece Ahmontekh's mind back together. Some of the description of what Ahmontekh saw could be interpreted as him having seen a certain dyson sphere, though I think we mentioned Szarekh knows where it is.

Their rivalry with the Charnovokh in canon is pretty funny because the Charnovokh seems to have forgotten they've even existed due to 'nid problems.

>>62376259
Also, as an semi-related question. The Necrons kind of have a British Empire-conquistador vibe going on here in their relationships to everyone else in this timeline, seeing them as primitives.

Does that mean they might have some kind of robo-smallpox? Like some kind of Mummy-style nano-smallpox themed after the ten plagues of Egypt or something? Necrons see most other people as dishonorable and would have no problem unleashing biological (well, sort of) weapons on them.

The only tactic that would probably be off limits is dispatching Deathmarks to off the Emperor and Empress. Szarekh probably sees them as technically worthy adversaries, if barbarians. He would want to humble them fair and square to demonstrate his superiority through either outmaneuvering them or walking his armies up to Cadia or Old Earth. He doesn't want to just flip the table on them, he wants to checkmate them and then flip the table, to show off how much better he is than them as a matter of pride.

>>62371257
The old money mega-corps derive their authority, or at least some of it, from inherited Writ. Many were given out in the Great Crusade. The old money dynasties, the Goldbergs and their like, are cultures unto themselves. The family trees so broad and rambling as to be tribal groups and their traditions more than 5 Romes in age.

>>62376580
New Money Rogue Traders are thus like the Rockefeller's. They have some traditions but they're more susceptible to their sectors policies. Their Warrant of trades also tend to be a little more restrictive and their wealth less so.

Still this makes them only as strong as a planetary governor with a lineage that races back to centuries.

>>62376376
They undoubtedly would be up for using biologically weapons. It's not really war. War implies too much equality between them. It's pest control. It's like using myxomatosis to cull rabbits and nothing more.

Also sending Necron assassins to the royal couple is also something that has almost certainly been tired. It was presumably as effective as every other type of assassin they have survived.

>>62376259
It's good. there's lots f time to play with in eldar history and they are bound to have encountered nthem at some point

Bump

>>62378070
This ultimately. The silent king can't be reasoned with even if he pretends to be civil.

Does Malys have any children. She's thousands of years old and has had a very active sex life. I would imagine she has had children. I can also imagine that at least a few have been offered up in sacrifice and many other she just murdered because they annoyed her in some way. How many of them would have been Vect's?

>>62369623
Is there actually anyone left not in tue Imperium already that can be traded with? Has the Writ become less valuable?

>>62382408
There are still some independent bodies out there, and some of them are willing to do business, but by and large, at this stage in galactic history, the vast majority of sane races have either allied themselves with the Imperium, joined Chaos, or are xenophobic isolationists with no intentions of playing nice with the Imperium.
As a result, the Writ of Trade has certainly become much less powerful than it used to be, in it's old function at least. Of course, the Rogue Traders have not remained stagnant and have changed with the times, so while originally the Writ was used to trade with non-Imperial governments, now it gets used somewhat similar to a license to do business. They work as corporations, rather than explorers most of the time, though their is still profit to be made in finding lost worlds or discovering new things in previously-overlooked places.

>>62381872
Well, I'd assume "her children" only counts the ones she's acknowledged, and even with her acknowledgement it confers no special right in and of itself. Some will certainly have grown up quite forgotten about, attended to by the staff of her disused mansion/embassy on the central layer of Shaa-Dome, but certainly many more would have been discarded, sacrificed, or played with to a fatal end.

>>62382986

Cue, to the stoy of a orphan Eldar child, living happyly in some exodite world, that someday discover, who is mom/dad , and that he/she/it form part of a nefarius/joke/whatever/irrelevant Malys/Vect's plan.

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>>62382986
>>62384622
One would have to wonder if Malys has even had a stable enough relationship in order to conceive a child, given how eldar get pregnant through repeated bouts of intercourse. I mean yes, she does spend most of her time on Shaa-Dome, where orgies and casual sex are as common as binge-drinking and bar-hopping for an urban alcoholic, but is that enough to produce a child? Is having casual liasons with random strangers enough to do it, or would it have to be a semi-monogamous relationship (hey, she loves him but she's not a saint, and he's much the same) with her Veccy-poo?

If she was human she might actually avoid getting pregnant because it would impede her carrying out the will of the gods, canon implies and we've outright said that eldar aren't as crippled by pregnancy as humans, given that Dark Eldar are capable of somehow capable of surviving long enough to have children in Commorragh, among other things. Although one can only imagine what would happen if Malys had pregnancy cravings and started ranting for things even weirder than usual.

That said, I can easily see Malys disregarding most of her children, using them for sacrifice or murdering them for being annoying. Any she does acknowledge she treats no different from any other Crone that has received her seal of approval. Kind of reminds you of the Greek gods randomly deciding to acknowledge their bastards when they need something, and points out just how deific Malys is perceived by your average Crone pleb. Malys is the ultimate absentee mother, caring more about Deus Vulting than any child, and the only reason any might survive to adulthood is she has servants to take care of them. Some might even pretend to be Malys children in an attempt to gain prestige, though eldar society typically frowns on that and imposters may be violently disabused of such a notion.

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>>62385739
You could even imagine a Malus Darkblade-style Crone who is trying to live up to the reputation of Vect and Malys, and whom both give zero shits about, a la Darkseid and Kalibak (minus Darkseid begrudgingly resurrecting Kalibak because he is the only reminder left of his late wife).

>>62385739
> Malys had pregnancy cravings

I hadn't even considered that. Holy shit so much nope.

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So I've been doing some thinking on the Ulmeathics (I know they're a minor faction to the point of being almost irrelevant, but I enjoy them) and I've struck upon some ideas that I'd like to share for consideration regarding their fighting style/tactics/how their units would function.

See, originally I wanted to avoid having them have slower reflexes, because I don't want them to fall into that tired old category of "Big dude who's strong but never actually accomplishes anything because he's dumb and everyone important's faster than him." However, I've struck upon a way in which they can have the downside of slower reflexes, while also subverting that expectation by being aware of it and working around it, if combined with another trait.
Rather than a pure negative, their reduced reflexes are compensated for by cold, implacable lizard brains that are highly resistant to shock. And by shock, I mean both the "By Oscar how horrifying" shock, and the concussive blast of a grenade going off five feet away. Not to the level of being immune, and they still have to deal with shrapnel, but this would actually give some character to how the Ulmeathic fight. Their guns are primarily kinetic with a propensity for explosive rounds, sort of like bolters but designed for creating explosive shockwaves rather than penetration, and on the larger scale, calling artillery bombardments on or right in front of their own position is a common and reasonably intelligent tactic, both when defending against enemy waves and when on the offensive. Nothing's quite as morale-shattering as coming under heavy artillery barrage, and then before the shells have even stopped falling there's giant lizards with massive swords crashing through your front lines and butchering your dudes.

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>>62387388
Speaking of swords, their martial art styles would likely seek to compensate for their reduced reaction time by both drilling in muscle memory and emphasizing planning ahead, choosing to start swinging if you think there might be a need rather than waiting for confirmation that the enemy is upon you. This is part of why they may be seen as overly-aggressive or excessively violent; while to most it would seem they just start swinging without any reason, to them waiting until you're absolutely certain there's reason means leaving yourself open and vulnerable. From their viewpoint, taking a swing at thin air is little different from how a human might clench their fist, or tighten their grip on their weapon when under duress. So yeah, if an Ulmeathian is heading towards a fight, or is expecting one, it's common sense to give them some space, and announcing yourself by yelling a greeting or announcement before approaching is considered socially polite.

This also leads to some interesting customs regarding doorways; in a combat situation, an Ulmeathic is going to be coming through the door already swinging. As a result, there's a social taboo against standing within a certain distance of an entryway, and hanging around by a door is considered either foolish or suspicious behavior- since anyone looking to pull an assassination or hit is going to try and use that window of opportunity to get in and hit them while they're vulnerable. This also means that the polite way to greet a guest into your home is generally by sitting in the middle of the room, facing the doorway, and loudly yelling to whoever it is entering your home. Whether you stand and go to greet them or remain sitting to let them come to you depends on both your relationship and the nature of the meeting; figures of authority typically stay in place, while choosing to approach is a sign of trust, or of subservience- again, with Ulmeathians the line between the two concepts is blurry.

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>>62387388
>>62387654
They also have a variation of "knock on wood" based on old combat pragmatism where if you thought there were allies in the next room, you'd give the door two loud, hard knocks before coming through, so that they knew to get out of the way. In a similar vein, they bellow when approaching a turn in a corridor, sometimes an order or declaration, but wordless roaring is just as acceptable.

All this gives them the appearance to outsiders as a strange people who alternate between being incredibly quiet and short-spoken when relaxed, and excessively loud and violent when riled up. It's easy to take the excessive roaring at face-value and think them over-compensating muscleheads, when the truth is that they're a very intelligent bunch who have adapted to compensate for one of their most glaring weaknesses.

It also plays up their shtick as the big tough guys, because what makes you look tougher than shelling your own position to disorient the enemy so you can chop them up with your sword?

>>62385739
>>62386988
She probably gets off on the unique twisted sensations of sacrificing your unborn child to the Chaos gods and aborting the fetus. Not necessarily in that order. The cramping and sickness that usually follows premature births would probably be orgasmic for her, and most Crone Eldar for that matter.

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>>62389471
Aaand that's enough Internet for today. Congratulations, I think you've won this thread's Golden Drach'nyen. <spoiler>Keep it up.</spoiler>

To be fair that sounds exactly like what Malys would do. Especially if you consider eldar natal stillbirths or sacrificed infants would go to Slaanesh. And we know how much Slaanesh loves corrupting the innocent.

>>62386988
>Malys is throwing things and screaming demands for the menstrual blood of a virgin, the pituitary gland of a Fenrisian wolf, and pureed Catachan devil.
>Arrotyr says he can't quite get a read on her, but he thinks there is a slight chance she might be angry.

You know, I was thinking about it, and given that the Word Bearers have no special connection to Colchis in this timeline, it seems that their most likely base of operations in this timeline might be Monarchia of all places. Monarchia could have been constructed by Lorgar as a planned settlement, a Katholian “city on a hill”. It was intended to be a peaceful place where people of all faiths could meet and discuss their beliefs, because Lorgar loved debate and interfaith dialogue, even if he was a syncretic who believed that all reasonable religions came from a common source and tried to cram everything through his Katholian lens.

Since neither the Steward nor Guilliman would have much of a reason to destroy Monarchia in this timeline, it could be that Monarchia was eventually targeted and razed by the Taskmaster of Shaa-Dome, who was offended by the Katholians being “idolaters” raising shrines to what he considered to be “false gods” (i.e., any god that is not Slaanesh). Or possibly Arrotyr did it for the same reasons. In a meta-sense it would give the Chosen of the Gods some much needed street cred in fucking with the Imperium rather than their own petty struggles.

>>62387920
It does a good job of reinforcing the idea of them being "slow to anger, terrible when roused" that they've been portrayed as.

I've always wondered how one improves fighting skill if they are large beyond the stereotypes of brute force or taking more punishment than your foe. People always talk about how to improve your skills and compensate for weakness when you are small but the reverse never comes up.

>>62392124 (cont.)
If we really wanted to we could do a parallel to the Babylonian captivity in space. After Monarchia is left a husk of itself the Word Bearers become a fleet-based chapter for fifty years, bringing the good word of civilization across the Imperium (secular proseletizers in SPACE). This stops when the planet (let’s say something like Neo-Babylon or Babylon II if we want to mix ancient history and sci-fi) calls for aid and the Word Bearers are one of the groups that respond. All 2,500 of them at once. The Word Bearers are commended for their aid but when they are questioned why they were there in force the rest of the Imperium’s jaw drops. The destruction of Monarchia had slipped through the cracks of the Imperium’s massive bureaucracy and the Word Bearers had been too stoic to make enough of a fuss. The news filters its way up to the Master of the Administratum and the Steward, who either tell them to go back and rebuild Monarchia (providing funding to rebuild ostensibly as a reward for saving Neo-Babylon), or gives them Neo-Babylon as a new homeworld. Having a first founding chapter be effectively homeless is an embarrassment and unacceptable to the Imperium.

>>62392124
>>62392140
I'm down for one of the chosen of the Ruinous Powers to destroy it, then another destroy it again after its reconstruction. The Taskmaster has every reason to make Slaanesh a hated foe of Imperial religion, their candlelight gods are useless but it lends towards the Prince of Pleasure's intention to become the subconscious archenemy of the Imperial couple. Provoking (raping and razing) the church(es) is an excellent way to be denounced extra hard as a god of sin.

Arrotyr would hear and wouldn't want anyone to get the idea that there's a Chaos God more important than THE BLOOD KING OF THE GALAXY. Though attacks on various other emblems of Imperial religions would be locally devastating at worst and hard fought defenses at very best, he'd eventually break off, maybe having hounded the Word Bearers, maybe having mockingly avoided them in their exile from Monarchia. Then after its rebuilt and restored, bam, Arrotyr shows up to argue the merits of worshiping King Khorne with the rite of system wide bloodshed, fire, and war, because he's a colossal dick.

The Taskmaster would have actually moved on to other things. Always more ships to order built in Shaa-Dome, entreaties for the favor of princedom to screen, soulstones to grind up for master to snort, etc. so the Taskmaster had nearly forgotten but nobody, except possibly Be'lakor, hold on to a grudge or a perceived slight like Arrotyr.

>>62392749
Only question is do Word Bearers stay on Monarchia after Arrotyr shows up?

>>62390474
Arrotyr, ever the social skills champion.

>>62393978
Monarchia could have a permanent guard of Word Bearers kept as a bolster to the PDF. Also there would be a few of them around if it's their main recruitment base.

Monarchia is a hive city. A very large hive city now. The first Monarchia was designed with all effort put into making it a nice place to live and defence as an after thought. It was in it's way an architectural marvel and in some distant possible future when war is just a memory it design choices would have been copied across the galaxy. But it was easily defended.

New Monarchia was far more formidable and had elements taken from Perty's designs and innovations discovered since. Arrotyr had to work for it. New Monarchia was not as devastated as the first city was and there were enough survivors left to rebuild and legitimately claim continuity. 3rd Monarchia was rebuilt stronger again.

Only a fool would go to Monarchia now with hope of an easy victory. Logar was pleased with the results even if reaching them was a price he believed nobody should have to pay.

>>62385739

Think God of War"Chaos pantheon's saga".

>>62392140
2.5 k of soldiers would be just the core chapter. Legion would have broken up by then.

>>62394884
What should the rest of the planet be like?

>>62395849
Definitively. We've said there are Word Bearer descendants near Biel-Tan, the Eye, and a few other places. This would be more where the core chapter went.

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>>62392124
>I've always wondered how one improves fighting skill if they are large beyond the stereotypes
The reason people don't talk about it much boils down to the fact that the world isn't fair or balanced. Big people benefit just as much from being skilled and fast as smaller people, but smaller people cannot get the benefits of longer reach and wider arcs that being bigger gives you. This is why fiction always has the big guy portrayed as strong but slow and stupidly straightforward; the hero needs to be able to overcome the obviously-stronger opponent, and the easiest way to do that is to make the big guy a retard.
One of the best subversions of this is Letho from the Witcher series- the dude's both tall and bulked out to hell and back, but still moves fucking fast and is incredibly agile. He also makes full use of the expectations caused by the way he looks, when the truth is that he's exceptionally clever and skilled at manipulating people.

To put it in game-terms, being the big guy is a straight stat-boost, while skill is a stat-multiplier. People emphasize skill for smaller characters because they need to be skilled enough to overcome that straight stat-boost, and the only way to really do that is by keeping the big guy completely unskilled. In a fight between two equally skilled people, the bigger guy always has the advantage, even if it's only an inches worth of difference.

>>62394884
Yeah, I can imagine the first sacking was some time after the Great Hunt or early black crusades, Lorgar was still alive and the Imperium was somewhat reconquered after the Beast. The Taskmaster would have taken the system and desecrated it during some gathering of the Conclave or something similar, making a point to enjoy the ravaging of the beautiful central hive himself. The Taskmaster's restraint, vanishingly rare in all other Slaaneshies, ensured there was a small population of Monarchians that survived relatively unmolested as it was his intention that they carry forth word of the deeds they witnessed. Some effort might have been made to permanently taint the world and system, but when the Word Bearer descendants were ready to respond in force the Taskmaster promptly returned to the palace in the Eye, and let the stragglers leaving the afterparty face the vengeful Imperial guns.

Then Arrotyr gets involved to make everything worse.

>>62397211
Not as fucked as Armageddon or Cadia, not actually a deathworld, but scared. It was visited millennia ago by the prime agents of two hostile gods, Slaanesh's majordomo and Khorne's foremost commander. Even without the massive occult power that implies either one could arguably be the most heavily armed (former) mortal in the galaxy, boasting personal command of forces only rivaled by the fleets and armies united in singular purpose under Oscar in acts as Warmaster. Both are known for massive gestures in their gods' names and the physical signs of these acts would be hard to cover, even long after any curses or horrible blessings are dispelled, the only thing being to let erosion and reforestation, flooding and tremors, slowly make it fade away.

What's the quality of life like in the imperium, now?
Has The Guard been changed any?

>>62401432
>Quality of life
It's not all sunshine and rainbows, and there's still plenty of people living in abysmal conditions (underhives are still a thing, and so is Salvar and other deathworlds), but overall quality of life is higher because the Imperium doesn't just throw away living humans frivolously like in canon, and quality of life for the middle-class and upper echelons is fantastic.
Put another way, the average joe is still stuck slaving away at the manufactorum for the duration of their lives, but they're not at risk of getting servitorized for a dip in production or suffering a workplace injury, or blammed by some passing commissar looking to make a point.
>Has the Guard been changed any
The basic groundwork of the guard remains much the same (ie massed lasfire and artillery), with fewer suicidal charges out of defensible positions and more tactical retreats. The biggest difference is that they're commonly supplemented by non-human elements- Regiments from Cadia have Eldar support elements practically as standard-issue these days. The Imperial Guard acts as the front line and anvil, while the Eldar take the flanks and act as the hammer.
Also, while the majority of their equipment is still Mechanicum-produced and approved, access to more exotic options exists, and you won't get Blammed for having something like a Tau pulse-rifle. The cogboys still screech about it, but most of them can be bribed into performing maintenance or at least looking the other way.

>>62401432

Example

Cogboy:REEEEEEEEE
Guard:Fuck you, I don't go to erase the runes from my chimera.
Cb:REEEEEEE
The cogboy run away from the heresy before him/her/it?
G-2:You know what that mean?
G-1:Yes! They are a tribute to his virility and potency after we transported the Banshes to the front, the last asault. And he love it!
Chimera:(Happy)Rumble Rumble

>>62398220
Unless we have someone else mentioned I'm going to suggest that the head of the Word Bearers at 999M41 be Oriax the Persuader.

http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Oriax_(Word_Bearers)

In this AU he beat the shit out of Slaaneshii Greater Deamon single handedly, made unlikely friends with a bunch of soldiers and Space Wolves from one of Fenrisian Colony Worlds, was a native of Monarchia and is about 1,100 years old. The other senior brothers consulted with the Head Apothecary and had him removed from the men-at-arms list against his wishes at the time. Still retained the rank of Chapter Master.

>>62401790
The guard also work much closer with the Astartes, and as well as Xenos auxiliaries there are the various local forces of Survivor Civs, who can pull various more exotic forces and weapons out for a conflict in their spheres of influence.

>>62403045
The astartes usually a thing in their own right, they are a branch of the Imperial Guard and when a Warmaster (almost always a baseline human) gives them orders they follow.

>>62402902
Sounds good except for being 1,100 years old. Both in canon and in this AU the only SM that old is Dante by a long ways, as a key part of his character is being a legendary hero that even other Chapter Masters heard stories of when they were children (which is contrasted with his inner turmoil and weariness).

In regards to the discussion last thread about Lucius, I don’t think the Fulgrim-fag characterization about looking for immortality is mutually exclusive with him being space Abhorash. He needs something to do with all that immortality once he has it, and Lucius is a vampire swordsman in need more interesting characterization anyway. On that note, have we said what the Blade of the Laer is in this AU? Instead of a chaos sword, maybe it’s a Ctan phase blade with a shard in it?

>>62401790
I'd actually think the common worker has it much better here, between the general Nobledarkness of the whole thing and the fact that things are more art deco now. So maybe Johnny Hiver doesn't spent 16 hours a day 7 days a week in a manufactorum (that's what servitors and machines are for after all), but he does spend 12/6 down in the filing cabinet mines,

>>62406595
Forgot to add: What I mean is that the typical Nobledark Imperial civilian shouldn't be some dirty peasant with metal bits sticking out blubbering incoherently from spending his whole day breathing fumes, but some poor bastard in slacks, long-sleeved shirt, suspenders and a fedora coming home from work with a pipe in his mouth and a battered fedora on his balding head. Which has metal bits in, because this is still 40K after all.

>>62406630
Also the typical Hive Ganger wouldn't be some punk with a pink mohawk, but a greaser with a pompadour.

>>62405138
>Dante

I think we suggested moving Dante's age back to keep with his theme of being the oldest space marine that isn't either a Mark III S or in a dread, since with rejuvenants you have humans living 800 years or more and several others have been around a while (Asterion Moloc has been Chapter Master of the Minotaurs for 800 years).

>Lucius
Completely agree with the two characterizations not being mutually exclusive. Lucius spent all his time looking for immortality, now that he actually has it he has to sit down and ask himself "what do I do with the rest of eternity now?"

The Blade of the Laer is still a Chaos blade. Laer are Chaos corrupted as shit. Fulgrim dodges a bullet with the blade (been suggested either Eldrad gets to him before Laeran as part of the World's Finest thing he and Oscar did to each other, he recognizes it for what it is due to his relationship with Ferrus, or since he already has Forgebreaker he gives it to Lucius. Lucius wants the sword in addition to his C'tan corruption because he wants to be OP as shit, breaking it out of Ganymede is one of his long-term plans IIRC.

>>62406746
The only person who might be able to compete with Dante for the title is Lysander, who doesn't count because he got flung into the future. Indeed, I could see the IF asking the BAs to have Dante talk Lysander down as a favor, because he's the only person short of some eldar and the Royal Court who he might recognize, and potentially the only one who he might recognize personally enough to calm down. Lysander would be asking things like "Wait, why are the Tau allied with us now? What's this Star Empire thing? The fuck's a Brain Boy?" The culture shock is one thing they really missed out on with Lysander in canon, given that the Imperium has been mostly stagnant in culture since the Age of Apostasy.

Lysander probably has super-PTSD which leads to his canon Nam Dog behavior whenever Chaos comes up. Space Marines don't normally get PTSD but he was stuck in the Warp, if anything is going to cause PTSD it's that. He's repressed most of what he saw while trapped in the Warp, one of the few things he remembers is a figure in grey throwing him through a portal back to realspace.

>>62406658
There have probably been worlds where gang wars have been fought over whether pompadours or mohawks are better.

>>62406746
I think one idea Fulgrimfag suggested was that Fulgrim and Lucius could have commanded separate contingents in the attack on Laeran, one on the ocean moon, the other seizing the planet's torch drives before it can make another warp transit. Another was idea I remember was something like Fulgrim having enough general forewarning, as well as vanity, to declare its shape unstylish and let Lucius retain it as a trophy. Soon after someone more perceptive than Terra's Children, a meeting with Ferrus or with whatever nearby Eldar Fulgrim wanted to ingratiate himself with, would notice it, and thus it would be consigned to Ganymede.

what if

robots

>>62407448
Fuck I messed up that second sentence.

>>62408772
Still in use by the Hubworlders.

>>62405138
Then we lower the age to 950. Exact number is less important than him just being extremely old.

>>62405138
In Vanilla the head of the Black Templars is also over a thousand years old. It's not unique, just extremely rare and some people deal with it better than others.

>>62408772
You want Skynet? Because that's how you get Skynet.

>>62399439
Would there be other hives on the planet or us it just one hive and the rest of the planet as a bread basket?

>>62416512
A truly massive hive city designed for good living and preserving the verdance of the planet would be a noteworthy design, lets say it was at least the only structure of such a scale on the planet. The system might have had other settlements and infrastructure, particularly after the far corners had to be purged of remnant Slaaneshi depravity, and even more after the second sacking.

>>62416512
>>62416895
It could have been one of the ancient hives that stood through Old Night at the stump of a fallen space elevator. And salvageable neutronium in the system to rebuild the elevator would make the hive a very excellent gathering place for many multitudes of the faithfull's ships early in Imperial history.

>>62417001
>>62416895
Monarchia is the only real 'city' on the planet. There are other settlements but they are mere resource distribution and administrative centres with the hub stations for the global transit systems.

The hive is also an emergency shelter. The transit system allows every citizen to be less than a day from the city in an emergency.

The rest of the planet is extremely engineered. Every river is a staircase of lakes and dams that feed vast fields and generate immense power.

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>>62408772
Imagine what happened to the people responsible for this abomination once Oscar found out. I get the feeling this is something he would be very adamant about dealing with personally, if only to make a very clear statement about how utterly fucked you are if you decide to try something like it again.

>>62419659
It would technically be a strictly internal matter of the AdMech. The subjects are all volunteers with informed consent. On the other hand this is the sort of shit Ursh would have done if they weren't so technologically inept. The Great Crusade was all about creating a realm where humanity could prosper safely with all due dignity.

That would have had it's inventor returning to his hab, switching on the lights to see someone sitting at the table wearing a modest but well tailored administratum suit. The door then closes to reveal a similar individual who was standing behind it. The magos might observe that the sort of people that wear those sorts of suits aren't usually built so athletically. A very perceptive Magus might also notice the hard lines underneath the fabric that would indicate concealed weaponry.

"Mr Steward is very upset with what you have been doing" says the one sitting down.
" Very upset indeed" clarifies the one standing by the door

It will be discovered the next morning that the Magos committed suicide. His note indicates extreme regret about what he had done.

>>62419659
Iron Hands are kind of this only done over a longer period of time, with greater care and not as ugly.

>>62420526
>technically be a strictly internal matter of the Admech
This instance, I think, would be one of those times where the entire point is for Oscar to get involved as a message to the rest of the Admech. It's not enough to just subtly say "we don't want you doing this anymore;" this kind of willing torment that puts the subject through a living hell for however long they survive before inevitably dying is not just sick and twisted, it's moronic considering the nature of Chaos makes these people corruption-magnets, not to mention they heavily mirror some of the atrocities of the old Eldar Empire- a fact that Isha would be sure to belabor, as she doesn't want her new family going the way of the old.

In short, Admech gets incentivized to crack down and not allow even attempts at this kind of shit anymore, specifically because it's something that will risk their self-regulatory privileges by being something the top of the Imperium are willing to get personally involved to shut down. They've got too many dirty secrets to make the benefits worth the risks.
>>62422079
The important difference between this and the Iron Hands is that as a result of the gradual nature of the process, they are replacing parts of the brain with metal analogue systems, rather than an all-at-once overhaul, means that the Iron Hands still receive and feel sensory data, just through circuits rather than neurons. In other words, their emotions are more "robotic" in nature- organized and categorized, with the ability to disregard or suppress inconvenient ones.
This abomination, on the other hand, puts the subject in a state of eternal torment, either by constant agonizing pain or sensory deprivation via lobotomy- either of which are unimaginably cruel fates.

>>62413775
What? Don't make shit up, according to the Lex and Wiki Helbrecht had a rapid rise and was still a Neophyte in M41.833 during the Vinculus Crusade putting him at no more than probably 250 years old at present, which is quite young for a Chapter Master.

>>62406746
I don't know that we can really push back Dante that much further, the man has already been around for twice as long as the Roman Empire and over 1/10 of the Imperium's history. He's already bordering on absurdity as it is.

Also, don't humans with rejuvenats top out at around 500 years? Asterion Moloc is a pretty old dude, but there are also rumors the name and equipment are passed down to new Chapter Masters, with maybe their memories/personality being overwritten as well.

>>62412796
The point is not about quibbling over the exact number, it's the fact Dante being holy-shit-it's-that-super-old-famous-guy is thematically integral to his character, whereas being old adds nothing to Oriax given that he's a mostly blank slate based on an incredibly minor villain from a shitty unknown shovelware video game.

>>62420526
>>62422079
>>62424665
The AdMech would probably argue if the volunteers went insane it means they had insufficient willpower and faith in the Omnissiah. But turning random people into a Thallax in constant agony is probably short-sightedness on the level of that scene in Aqua Teen Hunger Force where they tried to put Carl's brain in a bleeding edge military robot.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kmPbmz7SzOs

>>62425916
Kyril Sindermann lived for 2000 years in canon. In this timeline Ahriman also lived a hell of a long time before he rubric-ed himself, at least four thousand years, but then again psykers potentially live longer than anyone else anyway.

Given the weird canon stuff with age, we ruled a long time ago that in the best case scenario rejuvenants can get your average human to 800-1000. This is your high end stuff that is not available to your average person. Edmond Aldsworth got some of the cheapest stuff out there and he's merely spry and healthy for someone his age. Some get lucky and are super compatible, Guilliman was one at 2000, others are not. We never really said how Astartes fit in but it's likely they could reach a similar age more reliably than rejuvenants (due to all the stuff that gets messed with in their systems already) but most die in battle long, long before then. Lifespan of the Mark III S is about 6000 years, but they do die of old age. Admech can live pretty long as well, there have only been about six to eight Fabricator Generals.

>>62426202 (cont.)
I think everyone does agree that no matter what we do with age the bar should slide so that Dante is still considered the oldest serving space marine by a large margin.

In universe any discrepancies with rejuvenants could be due to the fact that the Steward is paying a lot more attention to quality of life and rejuvenants are both a Terrawatt thing and a good way to keep your best baseline people around.

Dante's reason for living so long in-universe could be due to the fact that he's from Baal and hence could probably trace his lineage back to Sanguinius, who was genetically engineered to be super compatible with Mark III geneseed and was likely biologically immortal with it. But in Dante's case it just means he's lived a hell of a long time compared to other Astartes (more due to him refusing to die until he feels his fate is fulfilled and his body is healthy enough to keep up rather than crapping out like most humans), and everyone considers it just a fluke because he doesn't have wings or is whipping out flaming swords like Celestine.

>>62419659

Probably the same fate as the one who designed the Repentent Engine.

>>62427062
Likely servitorization. Reminds me of the old historical legend of what happened to the inventor of the brass bull. The Greek tyrant who commissioned wanted a new way to kill people, but was so horrified of the idea he purportedly had the person who came up with it tortured inside it. Then they threw the bull off of a cliff.

Though aren't penitant engines, arcoflagellants, and the like DaoT inventions or productions? Either that or penitent engines are bastardized, stripped down versions of a dreadnaught or something. I know the Butcher's Nails are said to be, as the canon Emperor recognized them when he saw them in Angron.

>>62427915
They might have been DAoT inventions but they could have been less than official deviations from standard designs back in the day the possession of which would have got their owners into a lot of trouble.

Also the Iron Minds went nuts at the end.

>>62426368
There is also warp travel. Space Marines travel a lot. Warp distorts the passage of time. A trip that should take a month could take a week from the perspective of the passengers or it could take a year. Dante is old either way and has spent lifetimes in the warp whichever way you slice it. He could have had his time extended by short subjecting travels or he could be even older than they think he is subjectively.

>>62426202
I'd like to think that the 6-8 part is due to the Year of Three Fabricator Generals when the succession was called into question. It was a confusing and unpleasant time that almost saw the Olympus Mons Brotherhood loose control of Mars and by extension their position of the AdMech. It's the only time this has ever happened and it was the closest the AdMech have ever gotten to a civil war since The Beast.

The rest of the Imperium never realised anything was happening.

>>62420526
Which type of assassin temple operates like that or would it be a job for the Dark Clerks?

>>62392140
I'd have it be 40 years of traveling in the wilderness.

>>62426202
If the astartes implants are watered down Man of Gold parts then a lot of the longevity could be dependent on degrees of compatibility.>>62426202

>>62425916
So what/who should the leader of the Word Bearers be?

>>62433552
Someone relatively young maybe. A charismatic preacher and orator taking over from a much older veteran commander. His style of leadership isn't universally liked by his fellow Word Bearers but he is somewhat of a celebrity on Monarchia also an ordained priest, not a necessity but it helps.

Is there a Word Bearer in Vanilla we can steal for this?

bump

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>>62429246
Reminds me of some discussion of explorers of Cthonia finding really crazy stuff, some technologically advanced, other seemingly natural or castoff, often half-useful or novel or strange, and sometimes quite horrible.

If you found something like pic related while exploring Cthonia would you dare test it?

>>62433552
>>62435415
I have nothing against the suggestion of Oriax, I even rather like what was suggested. I just wanted to correct that particular aspect of him so we're not thematically treading on the toes of one of the Big Three CMs.

>>62439129
What is it?

>>62442167
Well presumably its a weapon, at least in shape, figure yield anything from repairing broken technology to melting cities. Probably best not to test it in an enclosed space, or an atmosphere.

>>62442167
Only one way to find out. Do you dare to do it? Take the plunge into the unknown and pull the trigger? Are you prepared for the catastrophe that may follow in it's wake? Are you prepared to give up the advancements you may find if you test it?
It's like the mystery box, only with unrivaled destruction and unfathomable wonders as potential things in the box. Maybe it blows up continents. Maybe it's a welding gun for Neutronium. Maybe it's a prank novelty that squirts a self-refilling load of Demiurg jizz. Maybe it's a medical needle for injecting longevity treatments.
The only way to find out is to pull the trigger and hope it doesn't kill you as a side-effect. Never know when they're psionic-powered, or psionic-locked, or psionic-fueled.

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>>62405138
>>62406746
>>62407448
That made me think of an idea for Lucius. Originally thought about it as “what if Lucius tried to go after Luther” and seeing what would happen if one of the most dangerous beings in the galaxy went after the most skilled Fallen who is still relatively normal. But then I realized it would be a good idea to showcase Lucius’ nature and that would be done better if he’s chowing down on a less plot-critical character.

Since your average marine really can’t expect to win a fight one-on-one with Lucius the only option would be to fight smart and use the environment to your advantage. Specifically luring him into a place with a lot of high-intensity radiation. I would say have the two fight until sunrise but I don’t think anyone would be able to last that long and they would run out of steam long before Lucius did, and Lucius might be smart enough to avoid fighting close to daybreak if the sun is going to be bad enough to hurt him. Maybe something like a discharge from a solar plant. Lucius realizes he’s been tricked as the marine stares him down and says something along the lines of…

“The nightmare is over. It’s time to wake up and see the sunrise”.

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>>62445382
The light pulse dies down, the marine lets out a long sight of relief, and for a minute you think Lucius is actually dead. Then Lucius bursts from the ground, covered in soil, right behind the marine. He buried himself beneath the debris in order to keep the light from reaching him. He looked ragged and ratty with inhuman eyes and pulsing necrodermis veins beneath his skin, but more importantly he’s still alive. Lucius chides the Space Marine for thinking that in the ten thousand years he’s been alive no one has thought to pull that trick on him before. But if it’s any consolation, that really, really hurt. And then he restores himself by eating the marine and we get a close-up look at how a C’tan vampire eats someone.

From a meta-perspective it shows how dangerous Lucius is and how he works in this timeline. Lucius survived the encounter through his own wits and the skills he gained through 10,000 years of fighting rather than dying and letting Slaanesh’s blessing do all the work for him like in canon.

The only thing would be to potentially use a named character from canon instead of some faceless mook so the reader doesn’t immediately go “oh, Lucius is going to win because he’s not cannon fodder” right off the bat. Or maybe not because anyone can see what Lucius is about from a mile away.

Eh, more just throwing the idea out there, as I'm not sure what the best way to write Lucius would be.

>>62439129
>>62442655
Oh, and you're holding it backwards, the barrel points the other way.

more waifus

>>62445423
Or you could go the cheesy Dracula method and have them fight until dawn. Maybe it's a planet unknown to Lucius. Other dude (Gabriel Angelos maybe) assumes him dead when he appears to crumple to dust and leaves.

At sunset Lucius comes out of the ground extremely pissed off. Destroys Cyrene to express this.

>>62424665
Did we ever decide on what exactly the Iron Hands were?

>>62420526
What other projects would have gotten their creators this treatment?

Bump

>>62447377
What was the Vanilla reason for the purge of Cyrene?

How intelligent are Legio Cybernetica ?

>>62451531
Basically they realized that canon 40k Imperium's way of doing things was dumb, and that couldn't be tolerated.
>In truth, Cyrene was not afflicted by the usual forms of heresy seen across the Imperium but by an unexpected cultural change.
>Cyrene was ready to throw off the shackles of the Imperial Creed and embrace forbidden ideas such as planetary democracy, free trade with xenos species, and allowing psykers to practice their powers unrestricted while living among the population without stigma or being handed over to the Black Ships.
>Horrified at this turn of events, Angelos quickly sent a coded message to the Inquisition, who performed an Exterminatus action on the world. This was an extraordinarily difficult decision for Angelos, who had called Cyrene his own home before he was recruited by the Blood Ravens.

In other words, what got Cyrene purged in canon is practically the MO for Nobledark Imperium.

>>62452526
Intelligence of a cuttlefish, personality of a dog. Except the Scyllax, which show...more concerning levels of intelligence. It's why the Legio Cybernetica balked at the Fabricator General telling them the robots had to go, he was telling them to euthanize their beloved and loyal pets and their life's work.

>>62447647
Basically Thallaxi/Skitarii on steroids. Chosen from the best of the best and most devoted to the Machine Cult, allowed free will because they are trusted to not abuse it because of their extreme respect for tradition, and given augments most Skitarii would drool over.

One advantage they have over Astartes is they are ironically non-standardized, which means they have more tactical flexibility than the walls of meat that are Astartes.

They are a militarized religious institution, but the AdMech claim they're allowed exemption from the rules because fuck you we make all the things. The AdMech have always considered themselves first among equals among member states and believe they are allowed exemptions. Whether they actually are depends on how much Oscar wants to push them. The Skitarii were probably allowed due to a clause in the Treaty of Mars and the Steward's trust in Ferrus Manus.

>>62452537
In this AU it could very well have been Angelos who was pushing for those changes.

>>62452742
Do they have souls?

>>62452742
Are they a militarized religious institution or just a military institution closely associated with political body that coincidentally happens to be religious in nature?

This or something like it is the excuse they would use when they are feeling diplomatic. Most of the rest of the time they just tell you to fuck off.

>>62452742
You're right in that the IH are super-Skitarii, but you have the tactical considerations reversed. There may be some variation in the metal bits, but the IH are methodical, thorough, and efficient, which is how they are in canon and how Mechanicus armies fight in general. Not sure where your idea of "walls of meat" is coming from, but your average Ultramarine-style Space Marine is literally the most tactically flexible soldier available to the Imperium: as fast and deadly as an Aspect Warrior with the staying power of an armored regiment and educated in every aspect of war. Hold the line? Can do. Rapid assaults? Can do. Siege warfare? Can do. Guerilla warfare? Can do.

Sure, many chapters have specialties and preferences, but as an Imperial commander you can point them at any reasonable objective and expect it to be accomplished. In contrast, the Guard is immobile, Tau are squishy, Eldar are niche and specialized, and so forth. Their only drawback is that they're so damn expensive and rare thus they're only deployed where they will be of maximum value.

>>62455147 cont.

>>62445382
>>62445423
>>62447377
I love me some Gabe, but he would get splatted by Lucius in this universe. As a high level C'tan vamp Lucius has physicals stats that are at least comparable to a high level Mk III S Marine or probably even higher (I know people have raised the Senator Armstrong comparison but I've made the argument before why that's ridiculous). If we're going with his space Abhorash characterization then he's had millenia to train his skills, so that plus his physicals means he's literally one of the deadliest people in the galaxy in the tier of true combat monsters and outliers like Drazhar, Logan Grimnar, etc. Actually, given his combination of skills and stats, Lucius might actually sit in his own tier below Oscar and Malys and above everyone else.

If we don't want to make him quite that strong, it could be that tapping too much into the power of the C'tan shard increases the power it has over his mind (since we said the C'tan want to reunite the shards to become whole, and can influence the minds of the vampires), which means he would fear losing control to it and eventually losing his immortality. It also sets us up for cheesy anime-moments when Lucius says, "I can't believe you made me use my true power!" when he faces a worthy opponents.

Luther might actually be a good fight for Lucius, given that he fought pretty evenly with Lion who was Mk III S and probably the most skilled swordsman of the Primarchs. Drazhar would also be a good fight so it's not always Bad Guys vs. Imperium.

>>62456840
>after five decades traveling aboard Imperial vessels, Vhane has learned to determine actual danger levels with extreme precision
>This is just standard operating procedure, nothing to fuss over

>>62454532
Yes, full of righteous fury in the name of the Omnissiah.

>>62455327
>If we don't want to make him quite that strong, it could be that tapping too much into the power of the C'tan shard increases the power it has over his mind (since we said the C'tan want to reunite the shards to become whole, and can influence the minds of the vampires), which means he would fear losing control to it and eventually losing his immortality. It also sets us up for cheesy anime-moments when Lucius says, "I can't believe you made me use my true power!" when he faces a worthy opponents.
I think that's a pretty reasonable way to cap him, though he would still be an absurd sort of threat to face. He's definitely head and shoulders above nearly any mortal combatant.

The Deceiver himself was atomized by the Necrons, an alternative they also had in mind for the Nightbringer, his fractal fallout took eons to become the slivers that brought about vampirism. As such, its the shards within particularly powerful Strigoi sires that are the most significant focuses of the Deceiver's will, with few exceptions. Others are the Golden Pyramid, and the exiled courts of the Lacrymole, both having amassed significant amounts of the Deceiver's necrodermic material. Drawing too heavily on the shard's more esoteric powers wouldn't just open Lucius to the influence of the Deceiver (which would have already considerably warped his mind) but to Orikan and the Elders of the Lacrymole, who would gladly have his power at their command.

I'd never actually get to it if I went chronologically like I've been doing, so I wanna say that my idea for Lucius ended with him in charge of the remains of the Terra's Children after Fulgrim retired from military command following the Wyrd War. Fulgrim wants nothing but to work on projects in Sol and on his proof of concept for resettling Cthonia, where he was turning one of the massive, world sized domes common on the outer edge of the ring into an engineered pleasure garden. Its under Lucius's actual leadership the legion is broken, chapters are organized, supplied, and stationed on various worlds they discovered in the great crusade, and at this time Lucius also lead the Terra's Children chapter in the Great Hunt. During this time he renamed the chapter the Emperor's Children, and when questioned about this claimed he would explain "at some later date." He would remain in touch with Fulgrim and would go to him for further improvements to himself and his soldiers over the following centuries, but eventually, likely around the time of Horus's death he or Fulgrim would conclude his experiments in immortality were fruitless. Lucius, a technologist long associated with Fulgrim's projects named Fabius Doe, and a few highly modified veteran companies of Emperor's Children traveled to Terra, lingered in Jovian orbit for some days meeting with Alpha Legion contacts, then made an unexplained hard burn for the minimally settled moon Ganymede, only to break off and flee the system under rapidly closing pursuit. They made for Segmentum Ultima, into which Lucius had pursued the Beast's armies, and disappeared beyond the fragmentary Ork empires. When Lucius reappears in the history books he is the monster of his current legend. Fabius also reappears, one wonders what became of Lucius' soldiers, likewise enthralled by immortality.

>>62459635
Also, for some in-universe-conspiracy-theory fun, many that believe Horus yet lives say that Fulgrim's Pleasure Dome is where he abides. Some say Fulgrim found a form of immortality that only lasted within the storied paradise he created on the shattered ring, others that he attained Dominion era method of true eternal life shared in secret among his confidants but denied to Lucius, and still others say after the experiments failed it was Lucius they sent out to fetch them vampire gold. There are claims that the Pleasure Dome is the same one Vect strove to loot, those that conjecture Fabius Bile found what his future master had gone seeking, or that it is the secret heart of the Imperium, the nest of the Hydra and the deciding place of its excesses and sacrifices.

The location still exists, according to official Imperial record, but it is not of any particular importance beyond the history and the technological project it represented. It proved that resettling Chtonia even in a very limited fashion would be prohibitively expensive, but that the various industrial structures of the outer edge could be made habitable. It is best described as an oversized estate of Fulgrim's own design, it was the place of his little publicized eventual death, it is apparently still populated, and the Imperial government has no intention to share its coordinates on the ring with the general public.

Ave Hydra.

>>62459221
He could even be a Nosferatu. We've said one of the hallmarks of sufficiently powerful or old Nosferatu are that they've wrapped all the way around back into sanity, and unlike less powerful ones which are just bloodthirsty monsters on the fringes of civilization are capable of playing dress-up as a civilized being until the time is right.

Lucius might have had the strength of ego and will to already give him a headstart, and the Nighbringer may not have had to do much to affect his personality in the first place.

>>62455327
One thing that isn't really pointed out in Revengeance is that Armstrong's nanomachines consume a lot of power. To fight Raiden he has to basically eat Excelsus and to fight Jetstream Sam he almost puts Denver in a blackout. Which is why he spends most of the game using other weapons and ironically sounds kind of like a C'tan vampire in that respect. But I agree that he's not "tossing Warhounds around with his bare hands" levels of power, which is a Malys-level feat.

Lucius definitely is in a tier above Luther but below Malys and Oscar. Probably in the same general region as Be'lakor, Magnus, Vulkan, and Sanguinius. Be'lakor might be a little bit more powerful, Magnus it would depend on if he could get to knife-fighting distance, Vulkan it would be hard to say given they would have had similar amounts of experience and Vulkan will refuse to stay down, and Sangy it depends on if psyker powers wreck C'tan vampires as well as C'tan.

>It also sets us up for cheesy anime-moments when Lucius says, "I can't believe you made me use my true power!" when he faces a worthy opponents.

I love this idea.

>not always Bad Guys vs. Imperium.

I agree with not making every fight Imperium versus X. I was actually going to suggest using some other Fallen Warlord but wasn't sure if we were having Chaos job too much to Necron-aligned groups or vice versa (only other example seems to be Ka'bandha spanking the expedition to Baal).

>>62455327
Yep, Gabe would be literally eaten for lunch. Luther has kept his job as top dog of the Fallen despite 10k years of challengers through martial skill, extensive paranoia, and ability to lead troops effectively. He can get people to follow him and command troops on the actual battlefield better than any of the other warlords, as opposed to Malys who is best either planning safely from a distance or as an insane, drug-addled meatgrinder in the heat of battle. There is no middle ground (as one might expect for an eldar). If he can’t beat an enemy in face-to-face combat, he out-strategizes them.

That raises an interesting idea for Luther and Malys’ first meeting. Malys hears about this mon-keigh commander who is supposedly so good the gods have decided to grant them safe passage into the Eye of Terror. So she goes to check it out for herself. Luther has no tolerance for the eldar and wants her out of there. Eventually things escalate, intentionally or otherwise, to a duel between the two of them. Although this is the same Malys who recently almost killed the Steward, Luther gets some good hits in, in part because Luther knows how to fight against people stronger than he is and in part because Malys is holding back and toying with him. Luther manages to get one particularly good hit in and for a second it looks like Malys is about to get serious.

>>62460779
And then Malys just drops her sword and says she’s done, she concedes. She got what she came for (“was it good for you too, Luther?”), and she’s feels if she’s goes any further she’s going to break Luther. Luther’s holding his sword and looks at her like she’s crazy. Luther’s still holding a weapon and she isn’t. What’s to stop him from simply running her through right now? Malys raises an eyebrow and says even if he were fast enough to impale her with his rod (oh myyy), which is very much up for debate, that wouldn’t stop all the eager, loyal (well, semi-loyal…loyal for crones, I should say) Crones from viscerally taking their revenge on him. Which is how Malys rolls. She’s not afraid of dying, Chaos Gods or no Chaos Gods. Death is just another experience. Luther, who very much does not want to die, is forced to let her go. The insane has cornered the reasonable mind through logic.

Malys whole point of going there was to see how competent Luther was to gage his potential as an asset. And she likes what she sees, his flavor of batshit insanity doesn’t overshadow his competence as much as Arrotyr, the Crow, or Nimina, and because he wants nothing to do with eldar politics he isn’t as backstabby as the Taskmaster or the other hardcore Chaos Undivided eldar.

>>62459943
It's all such good shit and adds an El Dorado myth to the Imperium.

>>62459943
This is all great and adds some depth to the Imperium's history.

>>62380761
There's a distinct possibility that in the possible branches of the post999M41 future Obyron is going to challenge the Silent King to a duel and declare him a coward if he sends another "piss-poor effort like The Stormlord" in his place as a champion. Silent King will be unable to refuse the call as loosing face is unthinkable because he must crush all dissent immediately and without question.

It will be a sad display of Obyron kicking him from one end of the throne room to the other, ripping off his arm to use as a club whilst yelling "stop hitting yourself".

It's doubtful that the title will survive such an event.

Has Drazhar abandoned the Dark City or is he too far into the sunk cost fallacy to escape at this point?

>>62455327
So what has Gabriel Angelos been doing in this AU? And is Cyrene still inhabited?

>>62467039
I remember that it was decided that the events of Dawn of War still happened, but with the Imperial and Eldar forces working together and actually sharing information from the start rather than the canon antagonism. The Blood Angels were aware of the ritual and the severity of the situation thanks to familiarity with the concept of Eldar soul-stones, though the ritual did manage to succeed in summoning the demon before the combined Eldar-marine forces succeeded in resealing it.
The details are a bit hazy, and I've not found it on the wiki yet. I'll let you know if I find it and can give a more concrete answer.

>>62465666
I think it's been explicitly said that he did, Vect keeps Drazhar close because it pissed his bride off and this pleases him.

I don't think Drazhar cares for much else than the incubus shrines. So long as Vect doesn't completely slip into Chaos, he's staying in Commorragh. And Vect, no matter how much he might be making the beast with two backs with Malys, has no interest in letting Commorragh become just another toy for Chaos. Commorragh is his, and the alliance with Malys is for their mutual benefit, not just hers. And Vect's too smart for any brute-force attempts at corruption like what happened to Fulgrim in canon. If she tried that he might just release all his wraithblades over the city at once then make the Ilmaea go nova just to salt the earth and spite Malys and Chaos.

>>62467317
There was some mention that the artefact was a leftover War in Heaven weapon. It was the equivalent of a mass produced land mine.

>>62454532
Yes, to the tangled growths of regular mortal souls they look like simple clockwork things. But they do have them.

>>62439129
This is why the Ganymede Vaults have Expendable - Grade inmates.

>>62462992
>>62463971
I invite adventurers to search for it

bump

>>62454941
>This or something like it is the excuse they would use when they are feeling diplomatic. Most of the rest of the time they just tell you to fuck off.

This is the answer to your question. If they are feeling diplomatic they say the latter to be polite, but unlike many planets like Ophelia VII or San Leor where the military just happens to be associated with a theocratic world and advancement in church status is explicitly not tied to military rank (e.g., in order for Miriam Cain to become an Abbess-General she had to become an abbess then a general separately [or vice versa] and the two ranks technically should have a comma instead of a hyphen between them).

The AdMech, though, when they don't want to play nice (which can be surprisingly often) freely admit the Skitarii serve the Fabricator-General who is a religious authority. Those who don't like it can get bent. Treaty of Olympus Mons predates formation of Imperium as an interstellar entity (please quietly ignore how dealings between Earth and the Migrant Fleet and Mechanicum were in part how the Imperium codified how they would treat Survivor Civilizations), and lists the Machine Cult as a special exception to the normal rules. Don't like it, let my mechadendrites play you a sad tune on the galaxy's smallest nano-violin.

Mars may have been a tricky issue in the days before the Unification of Sol. Mars was playing isolationist until Kelbor-Hal decided to turn problems into opportunity. Orioc wanted everyone to get along so it could reunite with Mars. Mars was salty about the Void Born refusing to overtly take sides.

>>62471951
A lot of Earth nations remembered the days when Mars was the big power in Sol and Martian expeditions came to Earth to loot cities and ancient tombs and ruins for archaeotech. Someone pointed out how well the recent Battle Angel Alita trailer fits Oscar's discovery. Basically like that. Mars hears someone found some interesting tech on Earth and sends an expedition to retrieve it for Mars and roflstomps the less advanced techno-barbarians who try to stop them. Eventually they set up a foothold on Earth which becomes Orioc, the crusader kingdom in the Levant to Mars and Olympus Mons' Europe and the Vatican.

Terrawatt would really not like them, despite having similar ancestry they would see the Mechanicum as being dangerously idiotic morons who have devolved into superstition. Or looked at them and went "there but for the grace of the ancestors go I". But note how Terrawatt is about the size of Poland (or Scandinavia if we include Uralia at best), and Mars nominally has both Antarctica and a whole planet under their command.

>>62455147
I think it's more despite being mentally and tactically flexible Astartes (especially in the same chapter) are all physically cut from similar cloth. There are no Astartes equivalents to ruststalkers, for example, which are more like Eversors.

Ironically, skitarii and Iron Hands are probably less tactically flexible than Astartes, despite being more physically variable.

>>62470286
What legends are told of it that could launch foolhardy expeditions?

>>62473376
Other than it is a paradise that contains the secret for immortality?

>It contains the treasury of the old GaBHD capital, which even accounting for that money having little face value anymore has enough raw materials to make one richer than the Imperium's Rogue Tradet dynasties. Combined.
>It contains all of the DaoTech Fulgrim hoarded, including possible Men of Gold/Iron Mind related stuff
>A map of every location colonized by humanity during the DaoT, and therefore potentially most of the places an STC could be found.

Is there something like the Primaris in this AU?

pls no bully

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>>62475254
Nah, you're fine, 8th edition may be shit because of it's implementation, but that doesn't mean everything from it gets the boot. Though, in this case it's not nu-Marines who are spess mahreens but stronger, but basically an initiative to increase defense spending.
See, Chapter Master Titus has been shaking things up in Ultramar, and one of the ways he's done that is with the Primaris Initiative- basically an increase in spending to bolster Ultramar's military, including the expansion of Space Marine forces in Ultramar.
Many are opposed to his plan, especially within Ultramar, as what he's proposing is going to look like a power-grab to outsiders- it's essentially a space-marine chapter mobilization to rival that of the Great Crusade - and Ultramar would be practically bankrupting itself to pay for it. At best, they'd have an army of young super-soldiers whose loyalty they may or may not be able to guarantee, and may not be able to pay- in money or in provisioning.

Titus is fully aware of this. He gives Exhibit A: the wave of "Oh Fuck" predicted to start rolling through the galaxy, with Ultramar as the first stop. He's essentially of the mind that they need to sacrifice Ultramar's prosperity to save what's left of it, since the alternative is seeing it all get destroyed because they maintained the status quo.

>>62475473
Also Oscar is inadvertently making things worse by not stepping in: he likes the idea and has been helping out indirectly, doing things like kicking Belisarius Cawl in Titus' direction, but has been unwilling to speak up about it because he wants humanity to make it's own decisions. He doesn't want to be the eternal babysitter, and if somebody else is willing to step up and lead the charge, he's not going to steal the credit and make himself some sort of god who's approval is needed for every good idea. While the sentiment is nice, there would be a lot less freaking out if he'd said "let's do that, but spread it out over the entire Imperium," rather than leaving it as the issue of a Survivor Civ potentially bankrupting itself and being accused of premeditated Insurrection.

>>62474125
Also the conspiratorial value to draw Illuminate Order secret handshake enthusiasts, ones that might pull strings to motivate adventurers to find it. Who knows, one might get there and find Fulgrim, Ferrus, and Horus in recreated GaBHD style Man of Stone bodies, working on back-up projects for the Imperium, or an embarrassing playboy mansion filled with the descendants of an entire population of courtesans Oscar wants kept out of history. And certainly it will be filled with Unification and Great Crusade era treasures, stuff like Fulgrim's Merikan human-compatible cybernetics, the organ that lets you eat brains and absorb memories, Kelbor-Hal's flying spear, innumerable treasures he took on the great crusade, his weapons and armor, whatever projects and research remain, the works, treasures, and weapons of his mechanists and bio druids, etc.

It may be that the Pleasure Dome continues Fulgrim's work to constantly improve upon the Astartes modifications for the Imperium, and that is the reason for the secrecy. There are records the primarch was decorously asking the new Empress of the union of Eldar and Sol's children to bless his work on Cthonia, mentions of very old original reports on Oscar's evaluation of the project, but it's been nearly ten thousand years. The golden Ouroboros on a black field that is the banner symbol of the Cthonian restoration project is usually attributed to Fulgrim, but that organization has never demonstrated a direct connection to the Primarch's project, or knowledge of the Pleasure Dome's location.

Another thing, in the War of The Beast, I was thinking Fulgrim might have taken a measure of "dishonor" along with Horus and Ferrus, not actually fighting on Old Earth, or at least being very late. He might have prioritized Mars with Ferrus, or a secure Luna where much of earth's advanced tech had been employed for ship building, something that, following Sanguineous and then The Beast's deaths either a world or further away, looks pretty bad. I'd enjoy some input on what in particular. His response would be something between actual grief at the death of someone he (people say jokingly) cursed as his rival in beauty and art, and a neurotic celebrity's need to be affirmed in reputation, and it would drive him into the string of successes in the Great Hunt that ended with the Wyrd War.

>>62475734
I think that's the implication others in the threads have had as well, he prioritized Mars with his bro Ferrus (and might have pitched in at Luna) but didn't do much to help Old Earth itself.

Ferrus' stated reason for helping Mars was you had somewhere between five to seven primarchs helping Old Earth but no one was thinking about poor old Mars, at least until they needed to ask for help fixing things, but it's clear he had a more sentimental reason of valuing Mars more highly than Earth. Still, that doesn't mean he was wrong, and that could be enough of a reason for Ferrus to help with fighting Orks on Mars and trying to stop the AdMech from forming a circular firing squad due to the return of the Dark Mechanicus. Regardless of whether he thought it was a good idea, trying to get back in the good graces of Imperial celebrity rather than going 'yeah, I did was I thought was right for the good of the Imperium, come at me bro' like Ferrus sounds like a very Fulgrim thing to do.

>>62475473
Funny thing to note, given the way the main hive fleet is going it looks like the Imperium is going to be dealing with a fighting retreat to the northwest. As in, where the Eye of Terror is. It's like being caught between a rock and a hard place, only you're getting brained in the head with another rock as you try to decide courtesy of Szarekh and the Necron Star Empire based out of Mandragora (and da Orks are getting another rock ready from behind all brutally cunnin'-like). Only upside is Chaos, the Necrons, and the tyranids hate each other (well, to the degree tyranids can hate) as much as they do the Imperium.

>>62475734
What was the name of the ork in the Wyrd War?

>>62478171
He's yet to be named
>>62476543
Nice to have a ringworld right next door to earth with nothing to attract Tyranids to it and plenty of space.

>>62476543
I think that the 'Nids can hate in their way. The Hive has learned how. Terranius Held.

>>62467357
Is Drazhar still the Fallen Phoenix?

>>62475473
>>62475546
It's not just making a shit load more Space Marines that is the cost. The Imperium in this AU is quite a bit better at flesh crafting than Vanilla. Space Marines are expensive but not bankruptingly so for an economic powerhouse like Ultramar. Sol managed to build the first Legions with much less for example.

It's everything else that makes up a Legion that is going to cost Ultramar dear and it's Legions Titus wants to build, not just mere Chapters. It's the 500+% increase in baseline soldiers and their equipment, it's the ships to carry them in, the food that they will eat, their wages and pensions and these are going to be a lot of conscripts rather then volunteers and that brings other problems with it.

>>62479083
It's probably more "extreme frustration/anxiety" than actual hate.

>>62469760
Isn't that a bit too grimderp?

>>62480403
Also the Navy beefing up of.

But he has seen the reports others haven't.

>>62479083
https://www.fantasynamegenerators.com/warhammer-40k-ork-names.php

Beakiewakkah da Kunnin Git is what he would be known as afterwards.

>>62484613
I like the sound of it

>>62475473
I thought that the Tau Empire was on the far side of Ultramar.

>>62486601
The vast bulk of the Imperium actually being in the untamed west, far removed from the obvious power-center of Ultramar, was another sticking point for belief in Por'O M'arc when he returned.

>>62475473
Think we should make an effort to update this map. Some ideas would be to fill it out with more minor Ork Empires and Imperial internal spheres of heavy influence for Survivor civs, sector commands, adding loose borders for the major power blocks, and going down the list of notable worlds and putting them in.

It might be good to do this on a bigger image of the galaxy.

>>62488583
Hubworld League is also more of crescent shape I think around the hub with the thick bit pointing south or south west.

>>62488583
Yeah, the map could stand to get updated. Unfortunately, I'm abysmal when it comes to cartography, so I'm of little to no use for that.
If we do update it, we could add in stuff like the original approximate area of the Ulmeathic League and the path of Hive Fleet Hydra that wrecked their shit- though at a respectable price to the hive fleet itself.

>>62387388
Who were the others under their protection?

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>>62491819
So far we have the Passeri song-birb people and the F'feng sand-people who were client races for them. There were probably at least a couple of others, but the Passeri were probably the most prominent, considering they'd started out on equal or superior footing to the Ulmeathians before the Nameless Foe showed up and wrecked their shit. Considering that the Ulmeathic League is now just a memory and Tyranid bio-mass, with the survivors being a mostly-minor part of the Imperium within the same area of the galaxy as the Tau and Tarellians, any further client races of theirs would be mostly for fun. Heck, the F'feng are basically a race of idiots who exist because the OP image for that thread had a tusken-raider in it.

>>62488583
It seems the average size of Survivor Civilizations and minor xenos species is about 60-100 worlds or so. No clue how big that would be on the map. Cthonia is 80 light years from earth which is mere pixels away on a galaxy scale map.

If anyone knows a better source for a galaxy map that would be great.

Mandragora as the current seat of the Star Empire should probably be on there too.

>>62490181
That would be about right. They wouldn't be right in the middle of the galaxy because of the galactic bar.

>>62491700
They're just north of Tarellian space near Halalthel I think.

Who would run the most prestigious and classiest five michelin star restaurant in the galaxy?

>>62447377
I swear, if Lucius even hurts a hair on the Red Lady's head the Blood Angels would be on him in a way that makes the Cachadrodons look like tamed goldfishes in comparison.

>>62491961
But the others did survive. The ones closest to extinction were the Big Lizards as befits the realms defenders.

>>62491961
Did we have names on what the other were called or is it still up in the air?

>>62497906
I don't think we've got anything on the League's client races other than the Passeri and F'feng, so if you want to do a writeup, here's your chance to go hog wild son!

>>62495426
Depends- I'd say an Imperial Tau restaurant would be your usual go-to for fine dining, simply because they want every race to enjoy the fruits of what the Greater Good can accomplish, but for the finest in fine dining nothing beats something owned by Slaaneshi Croneworlders. Just don't as what the food's made of, or come back too often...

>>62498831
Tau are borderline vegetarians, Ratlings are officially the best cooks.

>>62495426
I was going to say Eldar because "Path of the Chef," but then I started imagining an Eldar Gordon Ramsey and now I can't stop laughing because it fits so goddamn well.

>>62500723
The best BBQ chef in the Imperium is Isha. This has nothing to do with her divine nature or any innate gift Macha had. It's just that Kurnous really liked BBQ, any BBQ, and she was married to him for tens of millions of years.

>>62500723
Oh God, I can just imagine some fearsome, red-in-the-angry-face Biel-Tan Exarch in a chef's hat yelling obscenities at his ratling cooks.

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>>62501311
>"Are you trying to poison someone!? This Grox-meat is FUCKING RAW!!!"
>"Lar'gant steak in lemon sauce?!? Why not serve goddamn battery acid instead, you'd have the same fucking result!!!"
>"Where's the fucking La'uumb sauce, people!? WHERE'S THE FUCKING LA'UUMB SAUCE!?!"
>tfw the fucking mini-mon'keigh was making "lamb sauce" instead of "La'uumb sauce"

>>62501205
It is a fact universally accepted that Isha knows exactly what to do with meat.

>>62502267
After the Scouring of Ornsworld the ratlings stopped taking shit from people, all went on the warpath and all carry a length of spider silk with them. Yelling at one in his own kitchen is a good way to get garrotted.

>>62504969
Nah, these are chefs we're talking about. Communicating entirely through screaming insults at each other is just part of the process when creating a delicious meal.

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Is this too sleek for Lunar Styling?

>>62459635
>Emperor's Children traveled to Terra, lingered in Jovian orbit for some days meeting with Alpha Legion contacts, then made an unexplained hard burn for the minimally settled moon Ganymede, only to break off and flee the system under rapidly closing pursuit.
What material do we have for early, crusade era Ganymede. Presumably its collection was much smaller but growing much faster, with much more coming and going through realspace, but have we come up with much of its history. Definitely it was a project between the Imperial Court/Hydra, Alpha Legion, and the precursors to the Inquisition and Grey Knights, and all the Primarchs found things that needed containment there, so it would have been well funded and not an Ad Hoc solution.

>>62506282
It would have probably been considered an “out of the way” location during the early Great Crusade. Considered close enough that you could easily keep an eye on all the dangerous forbidden stuff that keeps getting found during the Crusade from Old Earth but far enough away that it was considered not an immediate threat to the Imperial heartland. However, nobody accounted for the thousands of years of urban sprawl that happened afterwards. It’s the equivalent of if a city expanded enough to the point that a formerly secret military base is now stuck in the middle of a bunch of suburbs. It seemed like a good idea at the time but now it’s becoming a problem and the necessary infrastructure is too entrenched to move.

Titan would have been the same way. No one in their right mind would keep the base for their super daemon fighting warriors within the busiest solar system in the Milky Way. Since the Grey Knights didn’t fully become a thing until the immediate aftermath of the War of the Beast, despite the eldar setting the groundwork before then, this suggests Sol wasn’t hyper-urbanized by that point (which fits with what we’ve said before about the old nations still being culturally recognizable before the WotB, and the Khan seeing the writing on the wall), though Earth, Mars, and some other areas were probably highly developed.

bump

>>62506955
The Grey Knights aren't as secretive in the Nobledarkness. They might not be bothered about people knowing where they live, but will still shoot anything that gets too close.

>>62510519
Still a huge step up from their canon policy of shooting everyone in the vicinity, regardless of allegiance or whether they were just helping them, "just in case."

>>62506282
>>62506955
IIRC Ganymede is officially the site of some 'great accident during the Great Crusade' and is to the 41st millennium still sparsely settled, if you can call it that.

At least that's what the wiki tells me:
https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Nobledark_Imperium_Notable_Planets#Ganymede

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>>62506177
I can certainly see that as the ship of some rich bigwig, or maybe something one of the Imperium's xeno races might consider pretty cool, but on the whole I think the Imperium still focuses on art deco stylings, with higher craftsmanship translating into more gilding or statues and the like. Pic related might be a common shuttle, for example (source here: https://www.deviantart.com/transbot9/art/Diesel-Punk-Deco-Starship-WIP-264762389)

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>>62511802 here.

I couldn't find it, but I'm sure someone had a picture a drawfag made of a nobledark spaceship with an art deco hull. In any case though, nobledark Imperial ships usually have gentler (for lack of a better word) prows, and I suppose ramming ships would have prows similar to this train's engine.

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>>62511802
>>62511911
I gotchu, buddy, this is the drawfag's spaceship right here.

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bumping with architecture

>>62499738
>>62500723
Eldar cooks would be good but due to their nature as perfectionists would probably demand to work with only the finest ingredients, highest-quality materials, and whatnot. Otherwise the food just isn't "right", which bugs the hell out of them.

Ratlings, on the other hand, have recipes passed down from their great grandmum that with a little tweaking and creativity can turn a dried boot and an eel head into something that tastes damn good. It's like soul food, Italian street food, or "once pleb food but now a delicacy" like jellied eels in Britain. It's not gourmet, not that healthy, but it's really, really good. Now imagine what they can so with access to the really good ingredients.

And of course you get the really weird shit in Commorragh and Shaa-dome. You could even imagine a Crone or Haemonculus obsessed with creating the perfect meal and hunting down gourmet ingredients from across the galaxy (ranging from a chunk of Legienstrasse to a Munitorum-grade jar of legume spread).

>>62511717
I had assumed that accident was either an early breach or the original coverup to keep people away from the appropriated moon

>>62515029
It's a cover. Nobody was dumb enough to run that experiment.

>>62515029
>>62515763
Yeah, the article pretty much spells out that the whole 'accident' business is just something they trot out if questions start being asked.

>>62502796
Lewd

>>62479752
Yes.

Of all the eldar who went on The Raid it was Drazhar who dealt with the shit he had seen the worst.

Most left the Path of the Warrior and took up other paths far from war. Bjorn Fellhanded's friend became a Hunter Disciple and later left that to become a Harlequin or possibly the other way around.

The ones that dealt with their damage and stayed on the Path of the Warrior became Phoenix Lords in their own right.

Drazhar's damage ate at him slowly. What drove him to the Dark City to start a new life is known only to him.

>>62515012
What is this from and is there moar of it.

Also If that was anywhere it would be the plaza before the Eternity Gate.

>>62516844
Especially considering he faked his death and is living under an assumed name, and barely says anything on a good day. Just showed up one day as a guy in Incubus armor, killed the leader of a particular shrine in a few seconds, and has seemingly been content to live in semi-obscurity as "just" another Incubus rather than let his past be widely known. At least if we are using canon as a guide.

>>62519950
I think the only one left who remember who he is is Karandras. He doesn't talk about it.

>>62516844
The gods can't see into the webway properly. The Dark City is the only place he could feel safe, stupid as that seems.

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>>62518211
Apparently concept art for the Phantom Menace, and Old Earth is so built up this could be really any mid-sized crossroads away from the parks.

>>62520439
Presumably Eldrad and Isha at least know something is up. They were there at the time.

>>62521839
Also remember that Commorragh is idealistic Ancapistan by Old Empire standards.

>>62524102
The other Phoenix Lords would probably recognize him if they saw him as well. They did spend years training alongside him and he was the one who burned down the Shrine of Asur.

>>62526195
Vect suspects. He hasn't told his dear wife his suspicious, nothing good or advantageous to him could come of doing so.

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>>62511802
>>62511911
>>62512445
It also depends on who made it and why, and also on the ship-class. Pic-related would obviously be something a particularly-wealthy sector governor splurged on because it's intended to fly alongside the Traveling Court whenever they're in the area. This would be probably an Escort-class ship going by tonnage, and as a matter of fact Escort-class is where you find the most variation, as they're the smallest and thus cheapest to build and thus something within feasible price-range of a large number of wealthy individuals and organizations. Cruiser-class vessels are primarily more militaristic and gritty art-deco, but there are outliers from the few obscenely wealthy and/or Rogue Trader dynasties that have the sheer spending power to aquire one and either customize it or commission one wholesale.
Anything larger is Imperial-navy only, at least production-wise, and thus there's not really any stylistic deviations.

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>>62376259
Another good option for a Silent King Necron might be the Undying One. In canon the Undying One has been portrayed as one of the most powerful Necrons, and in canon he had access to what by this timeline’s standards just scream “prototype of the Cadian pylons”. Which would explain a lot, because the Necrons/Mag’ladroth would have to have had a prototype lying around somewhere before they started building worlds like Cadia. In canon the Undying One activated them and the Word Bearers who messed with him had a fun time (in the Dwarf Fortress sense of the word) as their souls were ripped out and smothered.

I kind of picture the Undying One as the Silent King’s Mortarion or Vulkan, someone who is willing to slog through impossible odds out of sheer determination to get the job done, even if it killed him. After the biotransference, this description became very literal as death no longer held any meaning for him. However, this being Necrons, doing so meant he lost piece after piece of himself through the reanimation protocols until little more than an automaton is left, leaving him merely a vessel of the Silent King’s will or alternatively a puppet of a C’tan shard. Other Necrons, Star Empire and rebels alike, look at the Undying One with a bit of fear and revulsion, seeing it as what they could easily become if they aren’t careful.

The Undying One is said to have replaced his lower body with a giant spider-like construct, which is also very typical of Necrons that have lost a lot of their individuality or sanity.

>>62530044
Can they regrow their personness if they avoid dying for long enough?

>>62532879
They probably wouldn't regrow into the *same* personality, I would imagine, but they would gradually gain in independence and individuality the longer they spend active and not dying. How fast it happens would depend on what exactly they're doing (standing guard duty for an uneventful hundred- year shift would not encourage the formation of a personality) and a lot of individual variation.

That would be my take on it, at least.

>>62532933
Have the necrons "uplifted" any worthy servants? Maybe some favoured slaves they would like to keep in the event of Silent King slapping the big red Cadia button.

Question: What would be the general reaction to a Rogue Trader and an Elder Autrach having a sexual relationship be? Even if said relationship wasn't very "public". I mean that neither party hides it really but they don't advertise it either.

>>62534940
Depends on where you are. Dorhi are eldar supremacists, Krieg are human supremacists and most people would consider it odd but not massively so.

Taldeer is fucking a human assassin and it's only considered unprofessional due to their jobs. RTs aren't military so even that won't be a problem.

>>62535529

Let's go with Alaitoc for now.

Do Writ of Marque exist here and so what major differences are there?

>>62535563
Free trade was a major reason to join the Imperium in the early days. To protect this it was enforced inside the borders but trade with outsiders was forbidden to tempt people to join and share the riches. Those who were given Writs were because the Imperium occasionally needed outside goods.

As the number of civilizations outside the borders fell most of the Trader Houses used the wealth they had amassed with their exclusive trade to set up mega-corps and monopolizing internal trade rights.

>>62532879
I would probably say not. The issue is that while their bodies regenerate into being whole the data of their mind is being lost, and there is no way to recover that short of finding some backup of their mind. The C'tan bar Mag'ladroth weren't overly concerned about their metal toys losing their minds. Even though we've mentioned basic Necron warriors have more of a brain behind them in this timeline but rarely talk or interact with others because they are hyperfocused on their job, see other species as weeds completely beneath them, and won't and can't question orders from a superior (their minds having been subtly altered and lobotomized to make them ideal soldiers), having them have personality and individuality beyond "capable of enough thought to follow orders" was probably not intended.

Though the loss is probably pretty gradual at first. It's not like Sigmarines where dying twice turns you into an automaton.

I dunno. Necrons gradually losing their minds due to dying is a big part of their darkness. But if we could replace that with something even darker that would work just as well.

>>62535529
Do human rogue traders have sex with eldar a lot

>>62535549
Depends- an Alaitoc ranger wouldn't raise many eyebrows (hell, the Ranger probably browbeat the guy into it), but anyone else? Whoa man, it'd be one hell of a scandal- on Alaitoc. Most humans would eb all "You go dude/ette!", and worlds with close human/Eldar ties would just shrug their shoulders.

That said, there'd be very few who'd approve if the relationship became emotional outside Ulthwe/Cadia, and even then only if one or both partners are constantly engaged in combat and they both understand the risks. The Eldar grief spiral should be common knowledge, or at least one of widespread folk knowledge, and most human/Eldar relationships should be aware of this fact.

>>62536633
Depends on what you mean by "a lot." Is it common for Rogue Traders to have, at some point, banged an Eldar? Pretty much, yeah. Rogue Traders tend to be able to pay for Rejuvenant treatments, so they're long-lived (for humans), while 'young' Eldar do go through an "experimenting in college" phase like humans. Of course, this means that these are mostly flings and mutual fun without any expectation for there to be more, though it's not uncommon to stay in touch as friends.

Of course, no one Rogue Trader is swimming in Eldar pussy. Most of the time it's something that happened once and lasted for anywhere from a week to a year or two, but compared to their typical lifespan which is measured in decades it's still a "that one time on [planet]" experiences.

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this guy is epic

>>62538773
It's so damn sweet and lovely. Everything about it is perfect, right down to the wedding rings.

>>62538773
aw, that's sweet. It's always nice to see new art for the setting.

>>62538773
Fun

>>62539049
>>62540709
Cool thing is that they mentioned us in the comments.

>>62535840
Which makes me wonder: how many Necrons would have a backup of their personality of some kind, or some other means of preventing the degradation? I imagine some of the more independent and tech- savvy Necrons, like Trayzn and magic pyramid scheme man (can’t remember his actual name), and the highest- ranking Necrons like the Silent King and his most valued lieutenants (if he does in fact value anyone that much) but who else beyond that? Would there be anyone beyond those limited circles?

>>62536633
>>62537120
>>62537707
I think it has been mentioned the main barrier to human-eldar relationships is the psychological.

Gene-therapy could grant millennia long lifespan, but to get on the Eldar level, one would have to develop a super-consciousness (to human standards) or something like that.

>>62542617
There is also the fact that the eldar will at some point want to start a family. For that they need another eldar or the sort of divine intervention that gets mentioned in prophesies about Judgment Day.

Also a minor factor is that you have to be at least a low level psychic to speak the High Tongue properly.

>>62542617
>>62543043
For long-term romantic relationships, sure, but friendships, friends with benefits, and other such "casual" relationships are still well within the realm of possibility. After all, the eldar are rather relaxed about casual sex compared to humanity with the Katholian influence on their society. Also since Eldar don't really get pregnant unless they're trying to with the whole five-cycles thing (bringing it up because of the effect it would have on attitudes towards sex, not any concern that a different species could successfully impregnate them).

Also depends on the Eldar; some craftworlds have more contact with humans than others, so an eldar from Ulthwe would have grown up with consistent contact with humans, while another craftworld might have never had any humans around.

>>62537707
>>62544919
Rogue Traders also often have eldar corsairs on as part of their crew, who tend to have a Jack Sparrow "live in the now" sort of mentality. So they would be more liable to have short flings, but long-term relationships are less likely.

>>62535529
>>62535549
Most such relationships are considered odd but not hugely so. However, an autarch and from Alaitoc. Autarchs are, depending on which Craftworld you are talking about, either highly respected military officers or form a council that is the actual ruling body of the Craftworld. They're much more public figures than your average eldar. And Alaitoc is your stereotypical "we think we're so much better and more cultured than you" elves/eldar, to the point that a lot of other Craftworlds are sick of their cultural posturing (they think they're the only ones keeping up the memory of the pre-Fall empire, but they're not). They would flip their lid at the idea of a human-eldar relationship. If someone disagreed with that policy they would more likely immigrate than stay (even in canon, eldar will leave their home Craftworld if their views fit more with another one, though IIRC each Craftworld has its own "accent" of High Tongue).

>>62541855
Ironically they think we're the ones to come up with the Macha thing, when it was an extrapolation of an already existing in-joke.

>>62544919
>not any concern that a different species could successfully impregnate them
I imagine LIVII reading this out loud.

>>62546979
I have to wonder what LIVII and Taldeer's reaction on first learning they were going to have children was.

>>62544919
A lot of people are in for a bit of a shock soon. Once Macha gets pregnant then the division between the species starts to break down.

>>62549302
Headcanon: the probability for this to happen will steadily increase after the clock shifts to M42.

>>62491961
I'm going to do something on this this evening if thread survives.

>>62550148
Looking forward to it.

>>62549287
"We... We weren't banging THAT much were we?"

>>62550976
Possibly

Now how are lower hives different here and hive cities in general?

>>62553816
Lower hives are still pretty shitty. Perturabo designed hives to be self-sustaining fortresses, so hives in general have more green space to generate oxygen and make food and are somewhat better to live in. The problem is not even Perturabo could account for 10,000 years of war economy. Also no one is quite sure how to repair hives because Perturabo wasn't conventionally sane and people have a hard time figuring his designs out. It's like trying to repair a bridge when the bridge is also a load-bearing structure for a skyscraper.

The Imperium would love to repair the lower hives. It just doesn't have the time or money to do so. So lower hives are still pretty run down and have problems with hrud, gangers, genestealers, and now the occasional C'tan vampire (mostly Nosferatu) and Maerorus.

>>62555080
It's not that they don't know how his stuff works, Perty was using AdMech approved overseers and foremen because there was no other option on that scale and they wouldn't do unsanctioned components. It's just that on the mega-scale the designs aren't intuitive to most designers. His were fortresses, they were cities and they were niceish to live in. They were also meat grinders and every part of them was either or could quickly become something to kill with. His notes are extensive, they're just not easy for people without Perty's "unique outlook" to follow.

It's the patchwork stop gaps installed by lesser architects over the years that have become permanent, cumulative and integral to continued functioning that have become the issue.

>>62549549
The "now" of the setting is the moments just before midnight on the last day of 999M41.

Taldeer is in the final days of her pregnancy. Lofn is the trial run.

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Did we ever give stories to these two archetypal vampires?

>>62557188
Not those two in particular. Or any of them beyond what fulgrimfag is doing with Lucius the Eternal unless I've missed something.

>>62559143
We’re kind of short on vampire stuff in general, really.

>>62555307
Also, even in the nobledark, there is still corruption. It's less the brazen "sell poor people to get ground up into delicacies for daemons" kind of corruption, but more the "So, we could save ten million thrones on the budget if we don't buy the certified plasteel pillars, and get these off brand scavenged supports? Guess our consulting fees just got ten million thrones more expensive," type of corruption.

The type of corners cut that would only be noticeable thirty, forty years down the line when suddenly the underhive has a collapse and ten million people are without power. And it's been decades and thousands of such compromises in the making and so no one knows where to point fingers to in a structure designed to house billions and fixing it might put tens of millions without power and...

On occasion, the administratum quietly wish for the old days when they could line up an entire municipal ruling class up against the wall and shoot them instead of having to deal with due process. But separation of powers and the war economy make that infeasible. Instead, they've got a small army of structural inspectors training up from the Progenium to try to deploy across the Imperium's infrastructure so that these patchworks can be identified and fixed before they cause problems.

Not that that's much comfort to the underhives. But enough outreach organizations are present that more hivers and gangers and juves and mutants can hope for a better life than in 40k.

>>62560195
I can only imagine what a building inspector is at risk of accidentally stumbling over. Genestealers, cults, mutants, gangs... they probably go everywhere armed, and in groups.

>>62561432
Bemused space marine initiates get told they have to accompany building inspectors from time to time as a training exercise.

They are less amused after the fact.

>>62561432
>>62561815
Remember when we were talking about a Teen Titans-esque cartoon based off events around a real inquisitor a few threads back? Now I'm imagining something similar, only it's a Scooby-doo-esque show based on the adventures of a team of building inspectors.
Though that raises the question of whether the "Scooby" of the group would be a beastman or Fenris Wolf.

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>>62550148
Well I intended to do some writefagging on the Ulmeathic League but ended up doing Lynn Mywin instead.

https://pastebin.com/mkkfwWLz

How does it look?

>>62561920
Quadruped therefore either a Fenrisian Wolf, Kroothound or possibly a cybermastif.

>>62562386
Maybe it's because I've been on a bit of a binge rewatching since "Hellbent" came out a few days ago, but stories somewhat like the Mystery Skulls story would fit right in with this sort of thing in this setting.
>"dog" that's more than meets the eye and dangerous
>nerdy chick with psyker powers
>angry warp-spirit of a deceased member constantly pursuing/tormenting the group
>and the nerve-wracked Building Inspector with the mechanical arm who's job it is to deal with all this shit

>>62559467
Well, any ideas for them? I imagine it would be rare enough for the two main types of vampire to interact, but I assume it would usually be violent when their paths crossed. That these two aren't killing each other is a sure sign of something afoot, as is the sliver they have in some kind of suspension. The Nosferatu has definitely taken the guise of his patron, intentionally or not, but his sword looks Imperial. It's hard to judge if he's grown beyond bestial bloodlust, his ragged appearance could hide a killer as clear minded and calculating as any Phaeron. The Strigoi also carries Imperial medals and regalia, clearly of some rank and renown, but he could just as easily be a mastermind or recently blooded puppet as his burly counterpart. His weapon may just be some aristocratic embellishment of a laspistol, but there's a chance its a horrific token of favor from the Golden Pyramid, which has been known to produce gifts for successful agents of Orikan's (or its own) will.

>>62563539
There’s something about their bearing that suggests they’re more than recently turned dupes to me. Perhaps they knew each other, were friends even, before they became vampires, and continue to make common cause with each other?

The thought comes to mind that Idranel must really hate the stereotype her craftworld gets.

>>62557188
>>62559467
>>62563539
To be fair, the lore for C'tan vampires is thin because they were OC introduced in a very early thread when we were still figuring out how we wanted to expand on this universe. When the consensus emerged that we would rather reinterpret/modify existing fluff rather than create OC, they sort of fell by the wayside and no writefag has taken it upon themselves to write anything detailed for them yet.

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>>62562068
I like it.

>>62560195
>>62561432
It's hilarious to think that even in Nobledark things are still insane enough that a building inspector is a dangerous enough job that carrying around military grade ordinance is considered sane and normal. Inspecting buildings must play out like an ordinary human level version of Space Hulk half the time. Heck, I could even see that as a first mission sort of thing for a Dark Heresy campaign similar to the whole "rats in D&D kind of thing".

>>62561815
You know how the Imperial Fists in canon recruit from underhives? I can see in this timeline one of the the tests for aspirants wanting to join the Fists is for Scouts to tag along with building inspectors. It doesn't have the huge casualty rates of forcing child conscripts to fight to the death, but it is dangerous and forces one to learn to fight or die (and the importance of good architecture). The scouts don't like it? Tough shit. It builds character.

>>62562386
Fenrisian Wolf probably. That's where you would get the brains necessary for a Scooby-esque character. And the hilarity of a wolf the size of a pickup afraid of its own shadow.

>>62563539
>>62565556
>There’s something about their bearing that suggests they’re more than recently turned dupes to me. Perhaps they knew each other, were friends even, before they became vampires, and continue to make common cause with each other?

That would be kind of interesting. Two people who knew each other through sheer odds both became C'tan vampires. They weren't the only people they knew nor particularly close at first, but their relationship would have been emphasized by the sheer amount of time that's passed due to no one else they knew being immortal. Their initial reaction to the other being "you're still alive?"

It's likely vampires aren't big fans of other types due to competition. Too many vampires with too many different M.O.s and it's easier for someone to put the dots together and then people bring out the sun guns and there is screaming and whatnot. But in this case the two may have formed a mutually beneficial relationship. The Nosferatu kills those the Strigoi can't be seen disposing of while the Strigoi sets things up for the Nosferatu to sate his bloodlust and so forth. Though their free will may have been tampered with, their patrons may allow interaction if they feel they will benefit from it.

>>62567311
Thank you.

This evening if the tread survives I will try again to do something on the Ulmeathic League.

>>62567311
I was thinking a bit on the interactions between building inspection teams and underhive denizens and came up with this:

First, the average gang doesn't want to kill any building inspectors because they're agents of the Administratum and thus of the Throne and shooting one invites brutal reprisal raids from the Arbites. Also they carry lots of guns and will shoot back. On the other hand, a gang is still perfectly capable of keeping inspection teams out of their territory just by bodily throwing them out. The gangs can't attack the inspectors outright, but the inspectors need at least a little bit of cooperation from the gangs to do their jobs.

Also the gangs both want the building inspectors around and don't want them around. Since their knowledge of their home turf is a vital advantage, outsiders coming in and wandering around making maps is a threat. On the other hand, gangers need working ventilation and plumbing and roofs that won't cave in on them as much as anyone else.

So what would happen is this delicate diplomatic dance, where the inspection crews pay tribute to the gangs to enter their territories (probably in the form of barter goods like lho sticks, battery packs, medical supplies, etc. that are hard to come by in the underhive but cheap in the upper levels) and have to put up with an escort 'for their safety' but are otherwise mostly unmolested. Probably a lot of macho posturing involved as well.

I could also see the building inspectors becoming diplomatic go- betweens between gangs as a result of this, since they have relationships with all the gangs but are uninvolved with all the feuds. So part of how the inspectors maintain the gangs' cooperation is acting as neutral mediators whenever different gangs want to talk to each other and need a third party. They could also fill a similar role between the underhive as a whole and the upper layers, since their job allows them to pass easily between both.

>>62568890
This diplomatic role could easily become almost as important to the stability and functioning of the hive as their formal job of making sure it doesn't literally collapse. Especially since, when a major threat like a genestealer cult pops up, the building inspectors are likely to be the first to find out, and with their knowledge of the underhive would be vital in coordinating a defense.

Of course, all this applies only to the saner sort of gang, the ones capable of doing cost/ benefit analysis. It's still a job that requires quick feet and large guns.

>>62568916
Taking this further what is the living standard or quality of life for low level administrator adepts? In canon they have their own separate housing, security and quality of life better than all but the upper classes of the imperium.

>>62568952
Honestly, between the Noble aspect of the setting, the Dark aspect of the setting, and their generally more active role I'd think inspector HQ would be more like a PDF base or Arbites precinct. Infrastructure's hardcore in the nobledark, man.

>>62545692
I can now see it here. Rogue Trader Dynasty head and Alaitoc Autrach who have a mutually shared past together for the past four hundred years. Initially what started as a curious phase for the two morphed into a relationship that lasted a few decades. Afterwards they parted on good terms although they are still friends with benefits whenever they meet.

>>62566528
>Idranel
Is she in this universe?

>>62567408
I like this. Figure they could be Nercomundian, one that went off with the Guard, another that went and became some sort of official or statesman, and eventually upon returning home centuries later they both find each other, and end up setting up shop.

>>62561920
The building inspectors would be on Old Earth. It has the range of environments whilst still being a Byzantine mess of varied peoples stacked up and down like pages of a tome.

>>62571969
I don't see why not. We have Taldeer, Caerys and Macha after all. We could use an angry embittered eldar racist.

I ended up rewatching the “pure imagination” scene from Willy Wonka, I know we’ve already given the Taskmaster some degree of characterization, but that song and Gene Wilder’s mannerisms for Wonka seem really fitting for the Taskmaster. The lyrics would take a much darker meaning, but the way Wonka’s seemingly polite and polished nature veils a weird kind of menace and control.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RZ-uV72pQKI

>>62575210
Pretty sure that Wonka would be some sort of cultist, possibly Slaaneshi. He lures children into his fortress with temptations and then tortures, kills and/or mutilates them according to their vices all the while singing merrily. Also slave labour force of impoverished mutants/abhumans.

Also that boat had the exact number of seats for the number of passengers that traveled on it meaning that Wonka knew ahead of time they would be loosing a few members beforehand. This shit was planned.

>>62575417
>next book is about he and his apprentice going to space to get in a dispute with “the chief of the army”, using immortality serums on people that de-age them into negative time with a large enough dose, and then going to the realm of non-existence to retrieve someone he accidentally did this to. He’s absolutely a Slaaneshi sorcerer.

>>62575575
And fight tyranids.

>>62574898
Having more eldar characters with a negative opinion of humanity that are not frothing-at-the-mouth-Dorhai levels of racist are always good.

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>>62577573
Could work well. I'd have her as one of the Grey Seers who are eldar who have had their "fates cut away" and associated with the Black Library in Vanilla.

Beyond that damn near nothing is known about them even to the other eldar because they're secretive little bastards and almost certainly up to something. Which of course they invariably are on an individual level but not coherently as as a collective. Truth of the matter is that when the Harlequins capture some old artifact they aren't the ones who file it away or devise methods of containment for the more "interactive" items. That's too much like having a real job with responsibilities and shit.

People forget that although all the Harlequins are disciples and followers of Good Ol' Ceggers not every follower of Ceggers is a Harlequin. It's the Grey Seers who prowl the depths of the Black Library, tending the archives and collections of old curiosities. Typically they don't leave the Black Library unless it's to go meet a Harlequin trope for the handing over of an artifact or the imparting of information.

Sometimes, rarely, they leave to find something stolen, escaped, lost or just because they don't feel that the Harlequins are ideal for a particular task. Idranel is almost certainly on such a mission. She does not value human judgment highly, she sees Isha as the Empress of the Eldar Imperium and Oscar as her "husband of necessity and convenience", humans are ignorant savages barely out of their birthworld's gravity well, the Inquisition are out of their depth (because it's almost entirely human run), the Guard are a joke or at least would be were it not for their numbers and her job would be a shit load easier if the humans would know their place and stop bothering her with shit like "border checks" and inconvenient questions like "why did you stab those people?"

She can't see into the future, but she can see into the present with some level of skill at remote viewing.

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>>62578773
Huh, never knew about the Grey Seers. We'd need to give her a very important mission then. She's fighting against chaos, but considers herself above or otherwise not beholden to the Imperium's laws. Not that non-chaos aligned criminals are necessarily rare, but ones that claim divine blessing are.

Cegorach's lot have never been the most law abiding of sorts at the best of times. Usually, their activities are less traumatic. Theft, trespassing, public indecency, brawling, these are all easy to ignore. Sure the arbites will still try to lock them up, but the whole thing is considered a forgivable affair. But when one has a mission (and is uncharacteristically (in the eyes of the uneducated) serious about it) and the power to back it up, that can present a quandary.

Farseer Idranel for her part doesn't share any of the good humor of her fellow worshipers of Cegorach. But she has faith in her god's mission, and faith that her goal is worth any sacrifice. Whatever it might be.

Despite her confident disposition and decisive nature, she is actually left entirely in the dark about what her objective actually is. Which irritates her. Not that she'd let it interfere with fulfilling the cryptic orders she does get from the Black Library. She just channels that frustration into her zealous work.

As of late though, as she's growing more confident, she has been more proactive with her mission. At certain points bending the rules somewhat to better protect the Black Library. Those mon'keigh academics attempting to gather information on a means to enter the Black Library might not have been cultists after all, but their work could have been suborned by cultists. And she could hardly let them live after taking their life's work, they'd just try to find that knowledge again. And the serene grin she had watching them burn to death was merely satisfaction at a job well done.

In the grand scheme of things, she's nothing major. Just another curiosity in the nobledark.

>>62579939
/included picture because i found it via google and thought it was funny

>>62567311
>>62573918
When you've seen the shit that Fenrisian wolf has seen in Terra's underhives, you'd be jumpy too.
It'd be one thing if it was just the standard threats to your life to deal with, but there's some weird shit going on down there. Like the time he got trapped and forced to dress up in frilly clothes and attend tea parties for a week. It'd have been one thing if they'd been after information or were threatening his life, but no, they have the means to catch and corral a fucking Fenrisian wolf... and they make it wear frilly dresses and attend tea parties.
This shit is par for the course in Terra's underhives. Some of it's the eccentricities of rich nobles basically getting telephone-gamed down the centuries to their less fortunate descendants, some of it's current eccentrics with more money than they know what to do with, and then there's the cultists who have had to bend and twist their methods so far in order to evade detection that somewhere along the line it stopped working as means of worshipping Chaos and became something just straight-up bizarre.

>>62579948
Idranel is /tg/-approved DFC, anon. No need to justify anything.

>>62578773
>>62579939
But what about her past?

She's from Ulthwe, a craftworld deeply bonded with humans. Her racism must've originated during some intense moment of youth.

>>62583077
Eh, Craftworlds aren't uniform. Sreta looks down on humans and she's from Ulthwe.

>>62581214
If you think the big city there is bad, just keep repeating to yourself: "at least it's not Shaa-Dome".

>>62583122
Sreta looks down on non-Ulthrans, and unambitious Ulthrans, and lesser Ulthrans

>>62583077
She was about as eldar supremacist as you can be on Ulthwe and get away with it socially. She did her obligatory military service and served alongside humans well enough but that was a long time ago. She's been a Grey Seer for about a thousand years all that remains of her ulthweness is an accent.

Mostly she isn't outright hostile. She just doesn't want to deal with others.

>>62579939
What if ceggers as a prank gives Idranel a job to protect Taldeer or otherwise assist her? That would drive her bonkers.

Though that probably would be unwise on a meta level as we want people doing their own thing in the setting, but the thought gives me a grin.

>>62583077
It needn't be any kind of trauma or good reason for Idranel to be a bigot. Maybe she was raised by a traditional family with legends of the old days. Maybe her military duty allowed her to bear witness to human failings. Maybe one too many humans who had the wrong idea of Ulthwe's rep from ribald human xeno romance novels propositioned her. Or Idranel hung out on the eldar equivalent of /pol/ growing up. Sometimes people (and eldar, tarellians, ogryn, and every other creature) are just jerks.

Bringing up the gift baskets idea from before: What kind of stuff would you find in a gift basket within this setting. Assume that there is not malicious intent behind said basket and that it is not one of a kind.i

Am interested in seeing what people give as gifts to each other here and what not.

What's a moderate or moderate radical inquisitor in this timeline?

>>62585642
Depends on where you are. On hiveworlds, Necromunda in particular, fresh off-world imported or "real" grown food is a lovely gift. Even tinned real food.

On Fenris on special occasions tribal kings and queens hand out gifts of warm clothing, spices or even jewellery of precious metals.

>>62586439
A moderate radical would be like Mr Bester from Babylon 5.

>>62584233
Ceggers is the sort to do that but not at the expense of effort in the Long Game.

++Thought for the Day: The big picture is made out of many smaller ones. Pursue excellence in all you do, no matter how minor.++

>>62586534
Real, fresh food would be considered a thoughtful gift a lot of places, really. Ships and space stations, mining worlds.

>>62591245
Did you take that from some self-help book, inquisitor?

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I propose next thread's theme should be Eye of Terror locations, I gotta think THE BLOODQUEST is dedicated to THE BLOOD KING OF THE GALAXY, and there's also cool places like
>goreswirl
>hateflood
>the great drowning
some delightfully Slaaneshi sounding places like
>fool's paradise
>the citadels of flesh
>the forbidden vault (galaxy's biggest porn collection)
and specific Crone worlds L'oquis and Belial IV, the later of which seems to be right at the edge of the eye and very close to Ulthwe.

>>62593268
I can agree with this. Though it does remind me- we still need a name for that mobile port that's been parked in the Warp and is now producing Murder-class cruisers. Maybe Laputa, after the floating city in Gulliver's Travels?
There's not any obvious mythological parallels to it that I can think of, which makes coming up with a name a bit tricky for me.

>>62592743
What about Xenos?

>>62593777
If not for the Tyranids it could be the Leviathan, being a huge vessel that lurks in the deepest depths of the warp full time. Luther might have renamed it from whatever it was labeled by the Hereteks that built it, looking up french sea monsters the original Tarasque comes up as an amphibious dragon tamed by a french saint, which could work.

>>62593777
hellcunt

>>62593777
My first thought was Lucy, because it's in the sky (the warp) with diamonds (neutronium).

>>62594768
>>62593777
>>62595194
"Lucy" could work. Maybe Port Antropoff, after the guy who first came up with the idea of Neutronium?
Tarasque is nice, though I think we might have already had a creature with that name? Maybe the port is named after the creature.

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>>62594707
Kinebrach would be fascinated by anything metal or interesting metal alloys. They've been known to look at a fortified wall and be more fascinated with the quality of the metal than anything on it.

Tarellians who knows. They like being self-sufficient but gifts are not charity (especially if you are giving someone a gift because you know them, in which case it is something earned and therefore okay). Most of the ancient cultures the Tarellians are inspired by (Iroquois, ancient Greeks, Cahokian Moundbuilders, Mesoamericans) put a lot of emphasis on tribute to leaders and on sacred hospitality.

Tau are a lot like humans in most respects. Eldar are rather picky, they'd like gifts that mean something to them. With humans that is the unspoken assumption, but humans don't have a language that involves psychic contact nor as self-centered.

>>62594768
The Nautilus? We 20k Leagues Under the Sea Now. Giant construct manned by militarized refugees "submerged" in the immaterial sea? It works.

>>62593268
I would love to see some fleshing out of the Eye. There's got to be all sorts of fun stuff going on now that it's split between the Crones, Fallen, daemons, and whoever else can get a foothold. The Screaming Vortex from Black Crusade has some neat stuff including a planet whose entire ecosystem revolves around one huge Chaos Spawn.

>>62596886
Ooh, I like Nautilus. We could even run with that and get names for the cogboys running the project from it.

>>62555080
<spoiler>And in the worst case scenario sapient rats that do not exist from an alternate timeline stranded thousands of years in their past illithid style due to their naivete and poor safety regulations trying to get back to their time without breaking the space-time continuum and deleting themselves from existence (how to you accidentally break space-time? Skaven that's how). I can see the conversation now...

“Look-see. We do not exist. If we were real-real, people-things would be curious and go look-search into where we came from. Which would alter-wreck timestream and cause us to not exist. Thus bad-bad. And if we not exist, then we never travel-run back in time-time, and then you never find us, and then you never tell-blab to other people-things, which cause paradox, which break-ruin space-time continuum. Do you see-see what I am saying.”

The Imperial inspector continues to stare at the talking rat-people dumbfoundedly. The lead rat puts its forepaws over its face in frustration.

“By the Ancients, let me put this in terms you understand…”

The lead rat, followed by four rather beefy looking rats with rodent-tooth cutlasses, snarls at the inspector, causing him to run screaming from the dilapidated hive structure ranting about giant rats.</spoiler>

>>62597893
>>62597893
New Thread

>>62597933
"God dammit Bob, you can't just run screaming into the night every time... bah. Why do I always get stuck training the noobs?"