>>82044245
easiest way could be that the people dont konw about the vampiers.

Instead of hunting, vampires could use a blood tax instead, or grant certain privileges to those who freely give blood.

But then again, the very concept of taxes is dystopian, so that's probably not a good call.

Vampires can't even run a functional non-dystopic flat.

>>82044245
Likely very well really the vampires would prioritize long term growth and sustainability of the empire. picture a Rome without the constant civil wars, that did not fracture because it was to big.

what an oxymoronic prompt. the very definition of a vampire and the establishment of a vampire ruling class means that it is certainly always dystopian. monsters that require another creatures blood to live are incompatible with a utopian society.

>>82044245

Rifts Vampire Kingdoms basically did this. The vampires provided protection to the people (and it's needed!), the people in turn provided subservience and blood donations. It's not a paradise by any stretch for regular humans, but it's not a dystopic hell hole either.

>>82044316

Given that infighting is a common theme of a lot of vampire stories, civil wars may still be a thing.

literally pick any government and economic structure you like, then add a vampiric oligarchy

>>82044342
non-dystopian != utopian

Blood taxes.
A human can donate 1 pint of blood every 8weeks/2 months. A human has about 10 pints of blood. Assuming a vampire needs to drain a human's worth of blood each night(which i doubt, so this approximation is generous), they would need 10 humans a day for 60 days. So vampire rulers would need to be able to serve on a 1:600 mortal adult basis.

A more conservative estimate would be based on human blood transfusions, which is about 3 pints. This changes the ratio of vampires to adult humans to 1:180. Maybe more manageable?

Of course these vampires need to provide a service to these humans and possibly their children who cant donate as much blood. What this service is, depends on the vampire.

>>82044245
Dracula had enthusiastic support from his Magyar serfs. Honestly, the canonical vampire isn't very different from a human aristocrat. A society ruled by them might look like the UK, which is at least debatably non-dystopian.

>>82044245
The vampires replace the nobility entirely, serving as extremely long lived and power lords and ladies, but replace traditional bloodline based feudalism with egalitarian vampiric uplifting.

Basically, power doesn't inherit based on random chance of what kid you pop you whether they are a good ruler or not, it passes based on vampiric spawn which is an intentional choice, and the vampire is expected to only add the best of the best to their ranks.

In theory, anyone of any social class can earn vampirehood, they just need to prove themselves enough. This does weight in the direction of the more prosperous and better educated families, but exceptions do exist in history which helps alleviate some of the social stresses.

The vampires feed based on willing blood donors in a tax-like system, where each year the various town nominate a member to go and donate blood for the masters. This is actually seen as an honor and an opportunity, because these donors live alongside the vampires and thus both live in luxury but also have the chance to learn from the vampires and ingratiate themselves with them to pursue their own ends. People who served as blood donors often end up in high positions when they return home at their end of their year of service.

Only very rarely is someone blood drained to death. Usually as a form of capital punishment.

With this setup, the human population is basically a farm to generate blood, resources, and new vampires for the vampiric ruling class, and the loyalist armies guard the vampires from harm during night and day. In return, the vampires guide the human population in long-term advancement, and protect them from threats.

tldr: its a lot like feudalism, but weeds out the really shit rulers by making the process selective rather than hereditary, has a precedent for social mobility for the lower classes, and can enact much longer term plans

>>82044376
>land shrouded in fog and darkness
>cut off from the world
>disease ridden peasants roam the streets aimlessly
>even the wealthier merchants live in constant fear of attacks by wild beasts
>aristocracy willing to literally bleed its citizens to death to maintain itself
how can you honestly compare a country as blighted as that to 1800s Transylvania?

>>82044349
Infighting is a theme to provide a reason the vampire don't rule anything. In a realistic setting the vampires just don't turn anybody are not already loyal supporters.

>>82044245
I don't see why this would be different from any other society run by rich aristocrats.

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>>82044245
Considering that multigenerational wealth accumulation stops dead once you're being ruled by vampires, their realms should be pretty nice and offer plenty of chances to climb the economic ladder.

>>82044342
In fact it's the opposite. "Vampire ruling class" is practically redundant. How could creatures with such outlandish appetites exist *except* as a ruling class? Perhaps as a criminal underclass, but not likely for any length of time without becoming a mafia-like organization that functions as a ruling class.

And how does any ruling class differ from a vampiric one from the perspective of its subjects? Both serve the interests of a biologically separate group concerned with survival over generations, addressing the interests of the general population only when convenient and extracting from them whatever they deem necessary.

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>>82044245
There already exists one in that game and their aesthetic is great

>>82044480
Vampires *are* intergenerational wealth accumulation.

>>82044511
Depends how often do the drink blood. I always have it so new Vampires drink aournd 1-2 gallons a week,

While elder vampires need a single glass a month. Not counting a pick me up after a fight.

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>>82044429
Then in a couple hundred years the apprentice grows in power and begins to get ambitious. Hell, even in human history where humans live for 80 years max history is full of successors overthrowing their fathers to get power sooner. With an immortal ruling class attempted coups are an inevitability, and therefore all-consuming paranoia is an endemic personality trait of the monarch. Heavy is the head that wears the crown.

>>82044428
And yet they both seem to prefer it! Your brain on subjection I guess.

>>82044376
>the canonical vampire isn't very different from a human aristocrat
The canonical vampire is an explicit allegory for the human aristocrat, lol

>>82044564
I have managed to get kingdoms where most of my subject in CK2 have the content trait it make running an empire much easier.

>>82044576
Only been a thing for less then a century. Historically vampires where obviously monsters that where kill on site.

>>82044576
Correct, but they're also very similar in practice, which is not always the case. Jesus Christ, for instance, is immediately distinguishable from a literal lion.

>>82044291
Or the total opposite; everyone knows who is and is not a vampire and the vampires are not in a constant struggle to keep hidden.

>>82044245
>non-distopic
Can't be done. Vampires are destructive by nature.

>>82044677
Humans are destructive by nature. Its not a meaningful change.

>>82044363
Its okay, vampires are antithetical to anything non dystopian.

>>82044598
>Historically vampires where obviously monsters that where kill on site.
Much like aristocrats.

Human women suck vampire dick
Human men suck vampire tits
Vampire men suck Human tits and necks
Vampire women suck Human dick and necks
Mutual exchange equalitarian society based on sucking and getting sucked

>>82044598
But a society ruled by, like, chupacapras isn't really an interesting object of study. And when we "canonical", the vampire canon began with Dracula or maaaybe Carmilla. The actual folk traditions might be apocrypha at most.

>>82044598
The titular vampire from the novel Dracula (published 1897) is directly based on Russian monarch Vlad III, also known as Vlad the Impaler, who apparently had a taste for human blood.

The "modern" conception of the vampire as a sexually charged, charismatic, sophisticated noble can be traced back at least as far as the short story "The Vampyre", published in 1820.

So, the archetype is two centuries old at least. But the myth of the well-dressed, sexually magnetic vampire that lives in a castle, preys on peasants and seduces your daughter is 100% an allegory for nobility in central and eastern europe.

>>82044342
I mean, they are vampires. The moment they start accumulating enough continuous wealth, they can just offer a lot of money in exchange for blood.
>I will pay for your child's expensive operation if you let me feed on you once a month for the rest of your life
>I will pay for your access to the expensive academy if you let me feed on you once a month for the entire duration of your scholarship.
>I will pay for the country's expenses in this or that if you let me feed on the prisioner's blood for X amount of years.
As long as the feeding doesn't result in death, a lot of people would accept the deal.

>>82044530
Immortals don't die, so the wealth never gets passed on to the next generation.

You know, that's the joke here.

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>>82044245
The vampires protect the humans from the really fucked up things that live in the old woods. In return, there's rules and limits for the blood drinking. The blood tax, like other anons say.
Other than that, the vampire subjects actually have pretty good lives. What use do vampires have for grain? They would probably tax it a little bit to build stores and for trade, but vastly less than a normal feudal lord would take.
The vampire lords would also be interested in medicine, because a healthy populace can be drained more often than a sick one.
There'd probably be a massive administrative state body just to keep check of who's up for draining, who's ineligible, who's recovering, etc.

Of course, this pre-supposes that vampires can contain themselves, that humans would find such a deal agreeable, that blood can be drained without killing, that the vampires' blood requirements are sustainable, that vampires are even intelligent in the first place. The list goes on for a long while and doesn't fit every setting.

>>82044375
well if the setting is medieval then they could just protect the peasantry in exchange for a blood tax.

>>82044733
1820 is fairly recent history. Previously vampire was just like striga, a blood drinking monster that pretended to be an animal and hated garlic.

>>82044521
the best thing to come out of Ixalan

>>82044740
Youre making a lot of asssumptions
>As long as they dont die, its fine
Why dont they turn into a vampire and become another mouth to feed? If they dont, how do vampires propagate then?
>Vampires will compensate any voluntary victims
Why would they? They have the riches and power, and a questionable and undeniably alien moral compass.
>Vampires arrange a deal with the government to feed on prisoners
even political prisoners? What about wrongly convicted people? Do you also agree that prisoners should have their organs harvested to pay for their crimes? What is your opinions on bodily autonomy?
OP created a shit thread because he doesnt define the traits of a vampire at all

>>82044903
>Why dont they turn into a vampire and become another mouth to feed? If they dont, how do vampires propagate then?
Pretty sure is in their own self-interest to avoid making supply surpass demand. Also you are assuming they take the blood from biting, instead of other forms of exanguination.
>a questionable and undeniably alien moral compass.
Why? They used to be humans. And the vampires that manage to coexists with humans are surely more able to avoid pitchforks and torches than the ones who don't.
>What is your opinions on bodily autonomy?
That's a good question, I admit. But still, maybe "reduced sentence if you offer your blood", or "I'll pay for your bail if you give me X amount of blood"?

>>82044817
sure, but the canonical vampire (which OP is definitely talking about) is the dracula archetype.

So to circle back to OP, no, I don't think there exists any non-dystopian scenario where humans are ruled by a superior species that preys on them.

>>82044903
>>82044962
A fair and just society cannot afford vampires the chance to feed on prisoners, because it gives them an incentive to criminalise a lot of things. It's insidious and fucked up, it's great.

>>82045050
>because it gives them an incentive to criminalise a lot of things. It's insidious and fucked up, it's great.
Good point. Hadn't thought of that.

>>82044962
Other methods of exsanguination are expensive because blood is stupid hard to preserve especially in a nonmagical or nonmodern setting. Biting is simply the most convenient and also likely the most preferable to vampires since they likely did not develop in nature to sip from a cup or take a needle.
Even if they used to be humans, their biology is fundamentally different. They do not respond to the same stimuli anymore and that changes a person. A prince turned pauper will not have the same personality/moral compass if they managed to survive the change in lifestyle and vice versa
so what about people who are wrongly convicted? Do they deserve to have their blood sucked? What about political enemies? A justice system based on fulfilling the needs of a vampire aristocracy is fundamentally more interested in feeding the aristocracy than either redeeming the criminals or meteing out true justice. Why bother being a just society? Why not lock up little timmy and have his blood farmed because he got caught stealing an apple?

>>82044980
But Dracula's Transylvania is that society! It's a typically shitty 19th-century central/eastern Europe, but no more dystopian than any other.

>>82045067
Leech cookies?

>>82045062
Which is of course why they should do it, because vampires are just naturally evil.

>>82045092
Would you eat food that has been eaten by a maggot and presented to you live?

>>82045141
>food that has been eaten by a maggot and presented to you live?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casu_martzu
People would consider it high cuissine.

>>82045172
>According to some food scientists, it is possible for the larvae to survive the stomach acid and remain in the intestine, leading to a condition called pseudomyiasis. There have been documented cases of pseudomyiasis with P. casei.[13][14]

>Because of European Union food hygiene-health regulations, the cheese has been outlawed, and offenders face heavy fines
sardinians are barbarians, and i am not asking for examples of disgusting foods i am asking if you would eat it. We have no idea if vampires can even eat blood that has been processed in any way because OP created a shit thread.

>>82045197
Turns out the EU is good for something.

>>82044245
Depends a lot on how Vampires work in the setting.

One I ran had a Vampire Queen and aristocracy. Humans either paid a blood tax with either actual blood, or by hiring someone else to give blood. All humans also owed their body's service to the crown in undeath for 10 years after their demise. The wealthy could buy out and got to flaunt their status by having an immediate burial. The poor got a sort of social safety net, in that they could borrow against their undead body's labor by selling extended service after their death. With that and selling blood to cover other's blood tax, poor people could live as NEETs if they were thrifty.

The undead labor that was owed to the queen was sometimes used for military purposes, but mostly it was for building projects or contracted out as cheap manual labor.

The country was reasonably happy with the situation. Especially since, at least in theory there was a chance that exceptional service could elevate them to the Vampire ruling class. The Queen being "immortal" and having a supernatural bond/control over high ranking nobles and clergy she personally turned meant the country was highly stable, and the populace often resented the aristocracy, but practically worshiped the queen. To the point that other nations believed that she had enchanted her people some how.

The whole nation avoided getting crusaded because they were an island nation, despite the rest of the world disliking them.

Humans would need some kind of bargaining chip that the vampires couldn't easily bypass in order to prey on them, both on the group and the individual level. Otherwise the vampires could just take what they want when they want it, or arbitrarily impose ultimatums that the humans would have no choice but to obey. Unless you're somehow confusing vampires for Vulcans and assume that they would be perfectly logical and rational in all but the most extreme of circumstances.

>>82044375
Depends. I remember back to Van Hellsing (decent movie that); in that movie's lore, Dracula admits to needing only 2-3 people a month to sustain himself. To put that on the larger end, that's 30 pints/month.

Let's use my native Australia as an example. We have 151 people sitting in the House of Representatives (our version of Congress). Using the Dracula numbers, that's 30*151 per month, that's 4530 pints per month they consume. Australia has a population of 25 million; If 25 million people can't come up with 4530 pints of blood per month, at the low cost of 1 pint per person, then I honestly don't know. It'd take years for a full loop of the system to happen. So yeah, a full blown vampire parliment is viable

>>82045332
the vampires don't see themselves as mindless beasts but as true nobles, therefore the follow a code of honor sworn upon when he revived the gift and duties of vampirism

also you don't need to be perfectly logical to just don't act chaotic stupid

>>82044903
>Why dont they turn into a vampire and become another mouth to feed? If they dont, how do vampires propagate then?
Depends a lot on the setting.
Traditionally, you can only become a vampire by making a pact with the devil.
The getting turned by getting sucked is pretty new to the myth.
Getting turned by drinking vampire blood is as old as Bram Stoker's Dracula. And I think it's probably the standard. They're vampires not zombies.
>Why would they?
The same reason a farmer feeds a well behaved horse an apple.
The Carrot and the Stick works better than just the stick.
>>82045050
I agree. It would get dystopian pretty quick.

>>82045332
The peasantry would have the same bargaining chip they've always had. If things get to bad, they use violence.
How effective that violence is as an option depends on how strong Vampires are and what sort of weaknesses they have.

>>82044342
This anon is stupid lol. A society run by vampires is exactly the way the modern western world operates today. You're oblivious to the blood sacrifices that feed your overlords and don't pay attention to their carefully orchestrated plans to keep you all as cattle.
It's a pretty cool premise for a game, but no one wants to really pin it directly on the nose because they don't want to be Epstein'd.

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>>82044342
>pretentious pseud virgin noises

>>82045465
The parallels arent lost on me. The difference between a vampire and an ultrarich CEO is in the matter of fiction, but that is not what is being discussed right now.
>>82045482
I accept your concession.

>>82045755
That's EXACTLY what's being discussed right now you retard.

>>82045210
Product safety standards are like all the EU does

>>82045462
I think that Vampires would want to avoid large scale revolts because it makes eating them actively more difficult. Unlike a person which just needs to sleep a Vampire has a lot of very specific weaknesses it needs to mitigate and in some cases will actively require human servants to get shit done. Even going by Dracula's standards where the sunlight doesn't kill him it just makes him effectively mortal that's a time of day the vampire is extremely vulnerable to some asshole with a pointy stick. If you go by "modern" vampire standards there's half of the rotation of the sun they straight up can't do anything whereas humans can kick down their castle doors and stake him and they can do this shit day or night. Vampires are powerful, but they quickly run into an issue where either they're overpowered by sheer numbers and built-in vulnerabilities or they create too many additional vampires in the interest of stopping the peasants and then starve.

>>82044581
Well if it can work in a video game, reality shouldn't be that much more difficult.

>>82044564
Exactly.

Although Rifts takes it a different route. Their vampires all share a common progenitor in the form of a blobby horrible god-monster. It basically gives them free reign to do what they want, but if it dies they die and it can take control of them whenever it wants wherever they are. So "infighting" among the same family of vampires is pretty limited. But there's multiple vampire intelligences out there, and they (and their families) don't all get along.

>>82044429
"In a realistic setting" the kids get sick of their parent's shit after a few decades and kill them. Meanwhile, the parents are terrified their kids will kill them, so the parents kill the kids first.

Things do vary depending on -which- vampires we're talking about though, and what options/powers they have. Vampire the Masquerade has things like Blood Bonds, Viniculums, Dominate, Presence, inhuman levels of skill and ability, and so forth. It also has Diablerie, Frenzy, ancients that have to consume the blood of younger vamps, and all sorts of still active motivations dating back to the before the Bronze Age, among other things.

You can't talk about "realism" regarding magical creatures without establish which version you're talking about first.

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>>82047597
I think everyone should read RIFT's Vampire Kingdoms book. It basically answers this thread with multiple takes.

>>82045141
Once you start ripping out virgins' throats for a fix, your standards are already pretty low.

>>82044245
Vampires act like a nobility, acting to defend humanity from even greater threats in exchange for blood and wealth. You don't want to piss one off but they'll happily deal with humans as almost-equals and might offer to turn you if you impress them.

>>82047720
Pick Innistrad for example. With Gheists, zombies, ghoulcaller, cursed ents and werewolves fucking you around, paying a pint a blood to a vampire in order to stop the others

>>82047679
"We've come to save you from the vampires!"
"Cool, cool. But after you defeat them, who'll protect us from the Splugorth slave raiders?"
"Not our problem. We have to stop the vamps!"
"I gotcha', I gotcha'. And then you'll protect us from Coalition expansion efforts?"
"Uh, no."
"And there's a bunch of rifts the vampires are keeping clamped down, some Brodkil cybergangs out there, a few different ocean factions on the west coast side of things, and the occasional band of roving Mechanoids."
"What the hell are Mechanoids?!?!"
"Something that gets covered in one book, and then forgotten for the next quarter-century."
"And the vampires protect you from all that?!?!
For free?!?!"
"Well, they do ask for monthly blood donations, but yes."
"How do I get become a citizen?"

>>82044294
If citizens go by lottery or a weekly or monthly rotation to give small amounts of blood then no one has to die and they benefit from immortal rules with centuries of experience with super powers. Imagine a vampire diplomat who doesn't have to hide the fact he has mind control powers.

People get socialized perks like free healthcare, free college, all sorts of shit like that in exchange for a bi-weekly blood donation.

>>82044245
Well I have a naiton ruled by vampires in my setting but I don't know if it isn't distopic
>continent is cursed with no sunlight
>landscape is mostly a tundra with harsh living conditions
>monsters roam the landscape
>most cities are walled very little is outside
>life for people is a struggle and a meritocracy where one has to pull their weight to survive
>the vampire rulers are no different they consistently assist the people
>the people are not aware the nobility are vampires
>because the nobility are genuinely helpful and the landscape so horrible most people don't question a person disappearing here and there, people die all the times in the dark woods

>>82047758
Shame the only sane line of vampires was wiped out leaving you with the freaky fish worshipers and the decadent blood-gorgers.

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>>82044245
Good vampires are just kinda gay unfortunately

As others have said
>Blood Tax
>Maybe Vampires use necromancy to have undead do hard labor instead of the peasantry. The peasants might still farm and such but the undead deal with keeping roads good, general clean work like trimming hedges on the Vampires estates (if they have them) or cleaning sewers.

>>82050391
state undeads are only send to do a private's citizen work when he is recovering from the blood tithe, and only while they are recovering

>>82044376
>an actual failing police state
>non-dystopian

>>82044245
>is a functional, non-distopian nation
>is also ruled by vampires
Here, done.

NEXT!

>>82050514
Last time Bongistan was resembling a police state, your parents were in high school.

>>82044903
>even political prisoners? What about wrongly convicted people? Do you also agree that prisoners should have their organs harvested to pay for their crimes? What is your opinions on bodily autonomy?
Volunteers would do just fine, prisoners would be offered lighter sentences, everyone else would get money equivalent and extra vacation, the same way you do for kids.
>OP created a shit thread because he doesnt define the traits of a vampire at all
OP sucks pinus nigra

>>82044740
Anon comes very close to class consciousness

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>>82044733
>Dracula (published 1897) is directly based on Russian monarch

>>82045465
Are you implying that the modern Western world is functional and non-distopic?

>>82044245
First off, the vampires aren't predatory or parasitic, they're more like sustainable farmers who seek to do as little harm as possible to their donors and spread the burden as much as possible among as many people as possible to minimize the burden upon any one individual. They satisfy their base blood thirst with a system of blood donations from regular humans, not very different from modern blood drives, blood banks, etc. Every now and then, a normie sits down, gets a syringe in the arm, donates some fluid ounces or so in a high school gymnasium or something for a few bucks, then goes about their day, likely without ever even meeting a vamp. The blood bags are distributed among the vamps, probably getting dropped off by Amazon as part of some subscription service. No fangs touching flesh (except on consent, but this is private and is considered akin to sex; feeding scandals are a common way for a vamp politician to lose face) Thus, the vamps have a regular, steady supply of consensual, cruelty-free blood.

Secondly, the vampires aren't tyrannical, but rather level-headed politicians investing in the wellbeing of their society in a form of enlightened self-interest. With their bloodthirst slaked, they use their prolonged lives and accumulated experience to shape long-term policies and cultural shifts. With a long-game view in mind, they'd invest in climate conservation, nuclear disarmament, world peace, and alleviating world hunger/poverty/disease/discrimination. The happier and healthier the humans, the higher the quality of blood and in greater abundance, with fewer threats to the overall supply and to themselves. Nuclear war, climate disaster and industrialized warfare means no food and possible direct harm to the vamps. Poverty, hunger, disease, means low quality blood and in lower amounts. Being accurately seen as a benefit to society means fewer humans trying to stake the vamps or turn their nation states into anti-vamp genocide engines.

>>82044245
All the vampires are hot sexy women that prey exclusively on NEET virgins as their feeding/seeding slaves.

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vampires suck

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>>82053163
based bonus if hags

>>82045391
>forced out of Parliament because you were going to blow the lid off the fact they're all vampires
>grow epic beard
>team up with old rival
>Rudd & Turnbull, vampire hunters
>Murdoch is Dracula

>>82053236
thanks for the input 9gag, now go back

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>>82053236
vampires don't suck
they bite, then lick

>>82044733
>Russian monarch Vlad III
>Doesn't know what Romania is
>Has never heard of Wallachia
>Is a complete retard, yet insists on talking to humans as though it has any capacity for thought
lmao

>>82044511
>How could creatures with such outlandish appetites exist *except* as a ruling class?
Friendly neighborhood slumlord who takes rent payments in blood while keeping the streets safe at night.

>>82050743
>>82053570
>oh no, he mis-nationed a 600 year old monarch
You faggots really are desperate to pounce on anything to feel good about yourselves, huh?

>>82053894
>t. Amerifat and clueless
How is it that whenever Yanks are wrong and/or stupid, instead of admitting so, they double down on being retarded?
Literally the most famous bit about Dracula is that he's a guy from Transylvania. This isn't some arcane knowledge, this is fucking pop-culture 101

>>82050560
12 NHS credits have been added to your balance. God save da Queen!

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>>82045465
>but no one wants to really pin it directly on the nose

>>82044245
Vampires are benevolent leaders, take care of their people, don't feed enough to kill and have a rotating stock to not weaken their people.

Pretty easy actually.

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>>82044245
Aztec style blood sacrifices in the name of stability and prosperity. Think about it. Vampires NEED humans to survive, they live forever, and lets assume healthy humans taste way better than sick ones. A smart vampire would take the long approach and try and create a situation where he could have an endless supply of humans that taste good and don't want to kill him. The best way to do this is to provide stability and protection from outside threats. This is dead on what the Aztec gods did and what did they get in return?

>>82054659
>This is dead on what the Aztec gods did and what did they get in return?
Pox from the Europeans?

>>82044245
You convince the goy- err living to donate blood "for the greater good". Also you make them pay taxes "to build roads".

No brainer.

>>82054659
The vampires had convinced them that if they ever stopped offering up sacrifice the sun would go out.

The old school post-Roman vampire aristos of Europe saw this and decided it was a bit beyond the pale even by the worst of their standards. The Spanish were a puppet force sent in to distract people whist the Euro-vamps went in and cleaned house.

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>>82044376
>Honestly, the canonical vampire isn't very different from a human aristocrat. A society ruled by them might look like the UK, which is at least debatably non-dystopian.
I would make an argument that the vampires may actually be preferable to the Angl*s.

>>82044699
I don't see why this wouldn't work.

>>82053894
>>82054519
lol, saying Dracula was Russian is like saying Napoleon was Italian
or Cleopatra was Ugandan
or George Washington was a Mexican
or Chairman Mao was Japanese

It's like in the shortlist of the character bio lol
but hey we all start ignorant about a lot of things. I've been embarrassed about not knowing plenty of shit myself, best is to learn to laugh about it.

>>82055638
100%, vampires actually have a reason to keep their people healthy and their nation stable.
>>82055410
Sounds based

>>82054519
Poster is from Belgium lol

>>82055707
Which makes him twice as retarded

>>82044245
Not completely related, but I think vampires that don't kill their victims while/after feeding is fucking gay and is why we're stuck in this shitty "vampires can be good" hellscape.

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>>82044245
I just thought, wouldn`t vampires be ecoterrorists or at least be very eco-motivated?
Think about it, humans who live in shit conditions have low quality blood. Of course you can feed on wealthy people, but that means the price for that blood and consequences of feeding on them illegally will make it tremendously expensive.
So you want cheap and constant blood donations of at least acceptable quality.
>Some fucker dumps fertilizers in local water and guess what, blood now tastes awful.
>Another retard decides to skip on safety measures and his factory waste contanimates environment? Well, good luck finding new food source now.
>High levels of cancerogens and radiation? A few businessmen and eco-inspectoin officers will get disappeared soon.
Same goes for food manufacturers and med industry, because people being more healthy in general means getting good quality blood is affordable in any situation. Sorry US, but its time you stopped adding corn syrup in everything, vamps will lobby against subsidising corn farms anyway.
So yes, non-distopic vamp-ruled nation can work if vamps are really invested in food quality. Vampire solarpunk anyone?

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>>82055738
Thats how evolution works. Vamps who cant control themselves and become no better than wild beasts upon feeding will get caught and exterminated. Vamps who can exert power over or at least hide themselves from angry people will keep on living, getting more powerful through accumulated knowledge, wealth and social ties.

>>82055756
I just thought, wouldn`t humans be ecoterrorists or at least be very eco-motivated?
Think about it, crops grown in shit conditions are of low quality. Of course you can feed on imported crops, but that means the price for that food and consequences of importing them illegally will make it tremendously expensive.

>>82055756
There's also the more direct matter of lifespan. You and your generation invent the plastic shopping bag and it's going to be a problem for your grandkids 70 - 80 years later but you don't care because you'll probably be dead 20 or more years by then.

Aristo-Vamp doesn't want his garden fucking with, sees the writing on the wall and starts to put plans in place to minimize the use of disposable plastic.

The really old fuckers are still salty that they didn't save the wolly mammoth.

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>>82055780
Vamps are marginally stronger than humans in every regard. Also dont forget riches and longer life, vamps are presumed to be the ruling class too.

>>82044245
Voluntary bloodletting with social perks given to non-vampires who give of themselves. Non-vampires who give of their blood freely gain protective status, becoming a sort of soft nobility. It would be a capital offense for vampires to kill such people, these givers would also pay less taxes and get priority choice in well payed jobs and positions. These boons would promote human vampire integration I guess but I could also see the vampires who actually run the state not wanting the types willing to part with their blood to do certain dangerous tasks like military service and the like as well as track them constantly, plus you'd need people ok with being essentially birds in a gilded cage.

>>82053581
>slumLORD
a local ruler is still a ruler.

>>82044294
Win with wine and honey. A vampire nation what takes in any mortal willing to integrate would need proper incentives for such folk. Perhaps regular blood festivals, lavish holidays and impressive perks. Setting up a religion is also a must, probably, and blood draining could be seen as societal rite of passage for the young or compulsory for those who desire an easy and protected life with basically little want or worry. If you tell a rival nation's poor that they will gain instant elevated status out of their respective gutter if they immigrate, you'd have plenty of takers despite the potential bad inherent in getting the suck.

Humans are dumb and constantly looking to belong to something greater than their simple singular lives so a smart vampire nation would promote fervent nationalism in their human population.

>>82044245
>How could a functional, non-distopic, nation ruled by vampires work ?
By making the vampires in question actually want to have a functioning and prosperous society that isn't some trick just to drink he blood of rubes. The way to prove this are the laws of this nation. Maybe humans who live there eventually gain vampire status after a perquisite time, but you gotta put that sort of shit in the nation's charter.

>>82044245
Only taxes are blood taxes.

>>82055980
>>82055900
Lower taxes because they don't have to supply a military. They are the military. They also tend not to throw big feasts for themselves and their friends, most of their long term friends are all on a liquid diet. Any feasts thrown are typically a public festival.

Also the very best and brightest get the oportunity to become vampires, partly as a reward for excellence that causes others to want to excell and partly so that their usefulness can be extended for many centuries to come.

The nation is expansionist and agressive as there can only be so many vampires in a given population and the flock remain healthy. Everyone has a friend they want to see elevated to the ranks of the risen and the only way this can happen is for a vampire to die (rare in peace time) or for the flock to be increased. To increase the flock the empire must spread. Or the ranks will be thinned by attrition and some social mobility will happen.

The increased health and happiness of the flock compared to the sorry state of the other nations causes the peons to not fight all that hard against them occupying a former nations territory, even less so when the new citizens start to raise through the ranks and local vampires start to emerge.

Also the vampires want their people to prosper. It's very rare for someone to be raised up untill they've had children and even then their siblings probably have children. They still love thier families even after their undeath, even after a thousand years and their family is the size of a small nation in it's own right. The nation to the vampires isn't just food, it's their family. vampires are very territorial by nature. They want to see their family do well, they'll fucking murder anyone and anything that tries to harm their family.

>>82045050
Depends pretty heavily on the amount of blood needed per vampire and on the vampire:human ratio. A medieval city of 15-20,000 people could expect around 10 executions per year (per the diary of Frantz Schmidt). Someone previously said ITT that Vampires require about 2-3 peoples worth of blood per month. Just with the executions, therefore, a vampire could be sustained by 3 or so cities. Add in voluntary, non-lethal feedings with a system like Roman clientage, where people will offer blood in return for favors from a vampire patron, or blood taken non-fatally from prisoners as punishment, and a vampire, possibly even a small vampire family, could be supported by a single medieval city.

>Carnarius
Human religious holiday otherwise known as the Charnel Solstice wherein the nation's people come together to celebrate family. For three days the dead within the grand crypts are beckoned forth to visit with their living relatives as benevolent wraiths. Takes place at the start of the harvest season, beginning on the eve of said day to celebrate the end of winter, festivities begin the holiday in cathedral hymn while it ends by gathering to offer fresh grave-goods to one's dead kin as a symbolic renewal of filial piety.

>Soleil
Vampire festival that begins upon the first full solar eclipse of the year, wherein the nation's vampire populace venerate the sun. On the day of said solar eclipse the single oldest among all vampire houses takes upon a golden mask, a state relic, to symbolize the an un-living embodiment of the sun in deification persona. In this manner the chosen great elder enters into a spiritual-pact and for two weeks hence of that solar eclipse until the lunar eclipse that follows, they act as a ritualized judge who gifts the worthy their due and punishes the wicked.

>Winerreste
Jointly promoted holiday that takes place on the winter solstice every ten years. On this day vampires gather to account the finest humans in their care with the gift of un-life. Those few chosen represent the most selfless and charitable among humans as public servants to nation's well being. The known deeds of the person or persons in question are recounted while they genuflect naked before the elder who has seen fit to review entrance into their house. These few humans chosen are allowed to maintain ties with their human relatives every subsequent Winerreste and Carnarius but must otherwise cut ties as they enter vampire citizenship. Said humans who are accepted are then taken to be thoroughly prepared via cleansing ritual and subsequently drained to willing near death to symbolize their rebirth and fealty to their lord.

So it seems like the only way for a vampire society to work is to give them a bigger, more monstrous thing they have to keep their food supply safe from - preferably something that the bloodbags can't actually hurt but the vampires can.

>>82056520
Heretic witches, dragons, rival undead like mummies and lichs, demons and devils who want to do everyone in, including vampires, and Soul Drinkers (double vampires).

>>82056583
Why would mummies or liches be considered rival undead?
Mummies just stick to their tombs and liches are giant nerds in their wizard towers.

>>82044245
>taxes are in blood and labor
>peasants get to keep their harvests
Sounds pretty prosperous to me. Probably has an insanely large population and army compared to its neighbors too thanks to the food surplus.

provided that non-dystopian doesn't mean utopian, i would say that a society in which vampires took over would be more focused on oppressing other vampires than the rayas.
look at the seljuk empire or the ottoman sultanate, for example. both were extractive systems owing to their founders' nomadic origins, they came into administration later and depended heavily on the people they ruled for bureaucrats and what we would call staffers.
the big threats for them didn't come from sedentary peoples, they came from rebellious turkmens and powerful raider clans respectively. the more entrenched that central authority becomes is the more marginal these others get, the more likely they are to try and rebel, since they approach the leadership from a presumption of equality.
the tension in a vampiric society would be between supremacists, who believe all vampires are de facto superior to humans and entitled to blood and power by virtue of their condition, and aristocrats, who consider personal relation to power more important and probably cultivate a ring of sycophantic court humans/persians who do most of the paperwork, and in so doing wield more practical authority than marginal vampires.
you could set it decades after a sort of vampire war, in which the first attempt to conquer the known world and reduce humans to cattle was frustrated, leading to the emergence of the tensions i mention above owing to the limits on herd size and political dignities

>>82056672
Both make fun of vampires for being the most alive among undead and vampires are touchy.

>>82056520
What about elder things? Draculas versus Cthulhus. Draculas wouldn't want some fish fuckers trying to dick with humans when they do the dicking. Two rival dogs pissing on the same spot and they will get into a scuff at some point.

>>82044245
Reading through this, I think you need to consider a few things.

First, how much blood does a vampire need? Does he drain a human a day or is it a pint. That will drive a lot about how the population looks upon their masters.

Second, how many vampires are there? If there is a small population (say the ruler and a parliament) that has a much different impact than if we instead say that it is more medieval feudal system with knights being vamps who rule over say a hundred peasants.

Third, what is the purpose of the vampires? If they are the protectors then you probably need large numbers, if they are instead just a noble ruling class then smaller numbers. But that purpose will drive a lot of justifications as seen below.

Fourth, tax doesn't go away. Instead the 'blood tax' will be an addition to, not an instead of the normal grain (or whatever) tax. Still got to build and maintain that castle, those roads, those ships, etc. Likely still that military/police force, even if the vamps are the heavy hitters in your military. So nothing really changes for tax needs, other than adding a blood tax.

Fifth, non-dystopian does not imply utopia. Just because your kingdom isn't going to be a drudgery hellscape, that does not mean it has to be a perfect benevolent paradise. Don't go so far the other direction that you lock yourself out of adventure options.

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>>82044245

Imagine a whole nation of Mavis's interested in building relations with human nations

>>82056601
>St. Dracula
How is this not a setting??

>>82056987
Keep in mind costs for labour will be next to nothing with skeleton workers.

>>82044245
How would religion even work in such nation ?

>>82057019
I took OP to be vamps controlled, not that necromancy was the rule. But I could see that.

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>>82056601
This is basically Ixalan's vampire church, except the monarchy and some of the nobles go full vampire and miss the point of the vampire saint's sacrifice.

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>>82056996
Would dhampir kids be common or taboo? Tfw no vampire gf

>>82057045
Worship of various vampire flavored gods and concepts. Worshiping the First Martyr, the most venerated human of the nation who was the first to willingly and selflessly give their life to vampiric hunger ushering in a complete philosophical change in the vampire they satiated who then became the fountainhead of said nation.

>Be ruler of a poor human city-state struggling to stay afloat
>Undead diplomat shows up offering massive grain surplus for cost of the unwanted and unwashed

What's more evil, letting one's people starve or giving living humans to vampire neighbors who do God knows what?

>>82057102
This is a question best answered with faction flavoring. Some among the noble vampire houses in the city don't mind while other more conservative ones see them as refuse.

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>>82057102
I'd have it as rare. Vampire women have no cycle and vampire men fire blanks. The only time they come about is is a vampire man concieves a child with a human woman after being turned but with the last viable load he had been carrying since before he was turned.

They can live off of normal food and only get bad sunburn in direct sunlight. Tehy don't have access to any supernatural abilities beyond the clinical immortality. They are in every way a dead end as they can't have children the normal way and they can't pass on the vampirism.

The vampire nation uses them as ambassadors.

>>82047948
I guess it depends which kingdoms you find yourself living in. It's not all great.

>>82057248
Another vampire nation plus for mortals, no werewolves.

>>82057049
She was easily the worst thing about Ixalan.
If we ever return odds are the vampire church and nation will be destroyed. They already did it to vampire France.

>>82044245
By never truly being tried.

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>>82057045
Sun worship, the great destroyer and ultimate end of all things

>>82044521
The farther we draw away from that expansion the more I appreciate them.

>>82044245
Depends. Do vampires have free will & choose between right & wrong, or are they all compelled to do evil & evil, only, like in Buffy?

>>82057045
Some say that they are the Redemption of Cain, they carry his mark but build a nation to keep safe the flock of God's faithful.

Some claim that the Jesus was the first vampire and that his blood was shared with the twelve at the last supper, and it is carried by them passed on through the generations since.

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Though I will admit that the Ixalan vampires easily have the best outfits of all the MtG vampires.
Innistrad and Dominaria vampires are just your typical over dressed noble, and the vampires on Alara and Zendikar wear rags.

>>82055699
Retarded. They would want everyone to be soi-golems unable to resist domination. They would keep a handful of well kept ghouls as playthings.
>>82056601
This is pretty cool bu would pretty obviously end with Pope just telling them to crusade east until they die. Ixalan unironically did the “vampire theological world dominating empire in the twilight of days” much better.

>>82057296
Just head cannon that she’s still in her tomb somewhere silently screaming for sin S U C C and that we will never return.

>>82057416
Dominaria vampires are easily the least interesting, probably because it’s the one good mtg plane.
It’s the opposite of how Magic typically does things, where the vampires of each respective expansion are generally the best part of it by a wide margin (shiniest kernel in the pile so to speak).

>>82055688
>lol, saying Dracula was Russian is like saying Napoleon was Italian
anon, I.............

>>82044245
Everyone is a vampire

>>82044245
take sparta remove history

>>82057483
Dominaria vampires aren't interesting because Dominaria is so vast that you don't get to focus on them. There are parts of it that haven't showed up in the card game, and likely never will.

The Sengir bloodline are (so far) the only vampires to be found on multiple planes. Why can't we get a Sengir planeswalker? Off to see the family in the multiverse.

>>82044740
I would say that besides that, the king never dying would be a real plus with a lot of the nobility since it would guarantee stability in power

>>82057679
Didn't Sorin leave a few of his brood on
Tarkir and possibly elsewhere?

>>82056520
they burn

>>82044294
>I dont want to give blood

Without blood, who would build the blood roads? Who would defend us against foreign vampires? Who would educate the children in vampire math? Thats stupid anon you cant have a society without the blood tax.

>>82056987
>Fourth, tax doesn't go away. Instead the 'blood tax' will be an addition to, not an instead of the normal grain (or whatever) tax. Still got to build and maintain that castle, those roads, those ships, etc.
vampires don't need to eat. much of feudal taxation was to provide a high protein diet for a military elite and their dependent retainers.
vampires' consumption (besides blood) is mainly luxury items and military goods, and the former is purely a gesture of status. i doubt there would be no taxes, but lower taxes for sure.
as for a blood tax, i expect you would find communities getting out of it the same way that byzantine soldier families escaped their military duties by substituting goods or money for manpower - the vampire state would be importing large numbers of slaves and prisoners of war to compensate for the tax avoiders, which might bind the mortal population to their leaders through being despised by everyone outside of the state, granted that there would be an incentive to fuel endless wars and sponsor the worst and most exploitative governments to maintain instability and keep prospective enemies weak and divided.
the other aspect of substituting slave for peasant blood is that they can also be used to build castles, maintain roads, ships, etc., though whether the vampires would consider roads and ships to be something for which they are responsible is questionable.
i would imagine it as more of a confederation of settlements under vampiric hegemony, run by human compradors and mainly tending to their own business, with the undead residing in casbah-like citadel towns

>>82044245
Blood tax obviously. Each peasant of adult age must "donate" a certain amount of blood to the ruling class, in exchange their immortal rulers...
What the fuck are the peasants getting out of this?

>>82044245
>non-distopic
not possible

>>82057759
Sorin "I created an angel to curb the gluttony of my race" Markov just leaving vampires on every plane he's ever been?
Something about that just seems wrong. I know all he cares about is his precious Innistrad, the rest of the multiverse could be on fire but so long as his home is safe he wouldn't care. But it just seems wrong.

>>82057981
>Each peasant of adult age
or every community nominates one person who will be exsanguinated. usually the one who is most unstable or suffering from a congenital deformity.
in this way the vampires keep the scum in line with complicity and guilt, depriving them of the moral grievance that would animate rebellion

Drinking from the commoners will always result in revolution. Keep the commoners happy by having a lower cast in society that the middle class feels morally superior to be the food for the vampires. No need for prisoners when criminals pay their debt in blood.

Or reverse that, turn the orphanages and churches into a cult that feeds the vampires with the home of being turned and let the branches of nobility and church supress the commoners just like real history

Requesting art of vampires in a color that isn't white-gold-black-red.

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>>82058198
But thats literally the best combination. Ehh fine, this has some blue on it.

>>82057199
>shadman

>>82044245
As any lords would; for protection. There is a blood tax upon the healthy, not much mind you, but a monthly tax all the same. And the number of vassaled Vampires beneath the measured master are a static number and only by lengthy petition can one be turned if it is within the blood budget.

Perhaps vampires not affiliated with that lord exist, and some enterprising livemen are in the blood letting business for profit outside of taxes, and themselves for their finesse and skill are sought for the preparation of taxes.

>>82044297
Half drunk people all over, dishes not done in a decade.

>>82047277
So, why Brexit?
Also, Vampire Brexit?

>>82053535
Scrape and lick!

>>82058653
>we are taking our ghouls and LEAVING the Camarilla!

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>>82044245
>vamps get killed off easily in sunlight
>find a cursed place with night staying on forever
>its filled with monsters but is a perfect stronghold for vamps
>maintaining stable human population for food is a must, so they bring in slaves, but skeletons are better as a labour force anyway so enslaved people live as personal servants and blood donors
>time passes, vamps hunt mosnters and build inpenetrable hyperprotected cities which keep everyone safe inside, eventually they start taming new realm
>human population is big enough, with advances in tech and general life improvement slavery becomes ineffective and is now abolished
>adventurers, scientists and enterpreneurs start flocking to the new place trying to win the favour of its vampiric rulers, the most prominent ones becoming vampires themselves
>the place is hellish, horrors lurking outside are endless, every advancement is won with blood and sweat
>but under vampire lord`s wing it becomes alright

>>82058653
Because considerable part of traditional British cuisine is in direct violation of those safety standards.

>>82058948
French can't handle mustard. It's fucking sad really.

>>82058607
Fuck you man, I hate doing dishes.
>>82058159
>Keep the commoners happy by having a lower cast in society
Fine and dandy till it rebels too.

>>82059089
And why can`t vampires eat garlic then? Why does it have to be garlic of all things?

What about a world like the Witcher where 1) there are varying types of vampires, and 2) they don't reproduce using humans? It's been a long while, but I think there was a similar vampire civilization established in the history of the setting.

A good compromise could be a kingdom ruled by both humans and vampires in a dualistic fashion; maybe the two rulers are bound together in a mystical ritual so one cannot betray the other, or maybe there's even a marriage ceremony involved.

Twin Thrones, blessed by Sol and Mani, to represent the two peoples joined together in brotherhood against a harsh world.

>>82044245
>Vampire ruling class is small because spreading the gift ruins the gift, inherently better than redundant bureaucracies that make everything worse for everyone
>Vampire ruling class doesn't compete with the population for basic needs, their luxurious castle and exquisite clothes will last them eons because of their manias for native soil and abnormal sense of time. No constant white elephants getting built on the people's taxes. They also don't need to eat normal food, much less waste it in decadent banquets to impress foppish rich cunts.
>By the very nature of worth, they'd eventually become absurdly rich giving them the ability to splurge on improving the living standards of their population to bolster popularity and allegiance. Castro and Chavez are still supported staunchly on broken promises alone, someone who actually delivers would be a god in the eyes of their populace.
>Vampire nobility might be super powered enough to not need a standing army and be able to dissuade aggression from other countries on their presence alone similar to a nuclear option.

Nothing in a vampire's nature force them to be considerably worse to any other aristocrat, and in fact allows them to be much better rulers. It's nurture or word of god forcing them to kill to feed (not necessity in either folklore or most media were they're able to feed on the same victim for prolonged periods of time) that could intervene.

>>82060252
Garlic has antiseptic and antibacterial properties that were use in herbalism to treat some illness, that lead to the believe that garlic could ward off the evil spirits that cause illnesses and the original vampires were thought as evil spirits of the dead that fed from the living vitality, causing illnesses like tuberculosis

>>82044521
And they are still to this day absolutely butthurt that the LoD wrecked both the tranny globohomo pirates and the dino-Aztecs in all popularity polls at all regions including Latin America.

>>82056205
>The nation is expansionist and agressive
its supposed to not be dystopic. And the easiest way to do this is remove problem is vampire have term limits of 10 years and a immortality tax which is every 100 years you lose half your assets to be circulated between mortals. Vampires in the military lose all ranks after 30 years and are not allowed to enlist again but a severance that last forever in the form of personal blood donations and cash. Also a cap on the number of vampires would be good. Also keeping it from being a dystopia is hard because the best way to keep vampires from going crazy and just attacking every country is to put a limit on how long you get to exist as a vampire but any cap on how long you get to live is fucked but a fun work around could be a search for immortality outside of vampirism or a cure to vampirisms. Because digitizing a vampires mind doesn't seem evil because your just swapping a curse with science. and curing a vampire after a long period of life seems like it would also be fine.

>>82057311
hell yes the burning hate

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>>82044245
Criminals pay a blood tithe in addition to other penalties. Indentured servitude includes a blood tithe as well.

The main issue is that it'd eventually go sour because vampires are immortal monsters and would eventually degenerate into complete hedonists more likely than not.

>>82060546
It wouldn't be any fun if they were stable.

>>82060510
It's not unpleasant inside the aegis of the Lex Sanguis. It's a perfect nation, or as close as any have managed and the nobility, noble in character and not just in title, always have a mind to close the gap to perfection of thier rule for the well being of their flock.

To allow other nations to exist, to allow others to suffer under the rule of lesser beings, is cruelty without cause or need. They do not need to fight to enjoy the fruits of true civilization, true civilization offers those gifts without price. All they have to do is submit and if they won't submit their suffering should be at least mitigated by a swift conquest and an the introduction of just law.

>>82060546
That's why you have the vampire military to coup the vampire nobles.

>>82058159
>Be an asshole to the poorest of the poor of a race that consistently breeds bleeding hearts
Retard.
You build a luxurious playground for a hundred or so artists and athletes where they get to live the easy life so long as they entertain both you and the working class, while also sustaining your blood tithe.

>>82060546
>Criminals pay a blood tithe in addition to other penalties
Already discussed, gaining anything off criminals means crime will become a point of gaining wealth. So enjoy your vampire-ran private prisons.
>The main issue is that it'd eventually go sour because vampires are immortal monsters and would eventually degenerate into complete hedonists more likely than not.
Or maybe they gain wisdom and sophistication, or even become aloof.

>>82058653
Because France was taking all the fucking fish while at the same time sending us all their Pakis and flaunting about having the largest social security on other people's money.

All unions eventually dissolve because one member gains much more than the others while doing much less. Only reason the fracture happened in EU between UK and France before it happened in America between California and Texas is the Anglo-Franco hatred runs much deeper.

>>82060495
?whos they

>>82060816
Nope. Sorry it's racism. BBC told me so.

>>82060844
WotC

>>82055007
>>82055699
megatron

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>>82044245
The same as any other nation? The livestock are just humans instead of chickens. What special considerations would there need to be? I suppose it would have an opposite day-to-night cycle as most of the surrounding nations, which might be problematic.

>>82044245
Criminals and prisoners become bloodbags

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>>82060914
really? fuckin hillarious
where i can read that? or find more?
tell please

>>82060914
Explain for those who dont play childern`s card games.

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>>82057102
Well Vampire girls are only interested in consensual marriages for the purposes of procreation, so it depends on how the human cultures view having kids

>>82060944
How is he relevant here?

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>>82044521
that looks so cool

>>82057878
genuinely made me kek

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>>82061382
Tehy're usually sterile/barren.

>>82047679
RIFTS has some of the best fluff out there. It's really a pity that Palladium Books couldn't figure out a way to license their IP to a video game developer.

>>82049964
Why would anyone agree to "diplomacy" with someone they knew could control their mind?

>>82056205
>they don't have to supply a military. They are the military.
No matter how physically powerful you are, you don't do your own dirty work if you don't have to. And a ruling class small enough to sustainably feed on the rest would have a hard time guarding all their land's borders personally.

>>82055738
How do you feel about vampires who are transformed humans instead of monsters possessing a dead human's body?

Lots of people talking about "blood taxes" so no one subject has to give enough to kill them; but wouldn't that maximize the risk of pathogen transmission? And what about anemic subjects and others with elevated risk from blood extraction? How would you separate the genuinely at-risk from the ones just trying to dodge the tax?

>>82056287
Abundance leads to breeding. Or conversion if that's what vampires do.

>>82057148
Ask the unwashed.

>>82055738
Folk vampires took weeks or months of continuous visits to kill their prey (because they were illnesses, not vampires, but w/e), there's more precedent for vampire feeding not being lethal than for it being lethal.

>>82057955
>vampires don't need to eat.
Do they violate thermodynamics? We shouldn't be letting them rule us; we should be using them as a power source.

>>82044245
Blood donation clinics would be like soup kitchens, I bet.

>>82058066
And if they don't?

>>82063879
By not being retarded. A single vampire ruler would need no more than 30 people who can all be selected with utmost scrutiny to ensure they'll be both willing and able to fulfill the blood tax for a prolonged time in exchange for some earthly commodity. Most likely living within the vampire's estate for additional protection and comfort.

There's no need to subject the whole population to some Hunger Games blood lottery unless you're going out of your way to look like a villain.

>>82058353
Thanks for identifying the artist, but there was already a domain name in the corner.

>>82060510
>vampire have term limits of 10 years and a immortality tax which is every 100 years you lose half your assets to be circulated between mortals. Vampires in the military lose all ranks after 30 years and are not allowed to enlist again but a severance that last forever in the form of personal blood donations and cash. Also a cap on the number of vampires would be good.
Why would the ruling caste impose all this on themselves?

>>82064195
to keep the sheep in check because then you can elevate them to take your place without an insane amount of bloodshed. Also the trick would be to make sure vampires recognize themselves as human and not separate from humanity.

>>82060252
>>82060413
Pro Tip: When Satan left the Garden of Eden into the world of man, too things sprouted from his steps, one was onions, the other garlic. Garlic also has roots in Egyptian and Semitic mysticism to ward off curses.

>>82060269
The nation has two rulers who are both head of state and figureheads for the state religion.

The first is the Hierodule, a human who, for the people, is the spiritual manifestation of the summer, dawn and day and the religious sovereign over the concepts of temptation and compassion. A living saint who represents the slavery inherent in mortality and the power that time and age has over all living things. When necessary, a new Hierodule is chosen from the finest of the nation's youths. Candidates can be from anywhere in the nation but are most often chosen from within the intense religious schools of statecraft the nation promotes and confirmed from the consensus of the nation's cloistered religious sects in grand coronation. For all intent Hierodule can rule until advanced age makes them unable as they are considered sacred. Their word is law within the nation's court from dawn til dusk.

The second is the symbolic Hierophant, a vampire consul who, for the people, is the spiritual manifestation of dusk, winter and the night ruling as the religious sovereign over the concepts of temperance and conviction. Chosen by vampiric bloodrites of augury and prophecy by the oldest undead in the nation's night sects, the Hierophant is considered the sacramental godhead for all the unliving within the nation as they can rule for centuries. The word of the Hierophant is used as the deciding vote within all the nation's courts from dusk til dawn.

In either case, each figurehead also has deciding votive powers regardless of night or day for purposes of breaking deadlocks among the ruling assembly. Aside from these two religious rulers the nation chooses its delegative representatives from human and vampire among the offices for war, agriculture, infrastructure and municipal or civic judiciary. Naturally the nation's coinage also represents both Hierodule and Hierophant, as each is on one side denoting the age of the coin as per the individuals minted on them.

>>82045465
Yes but op said non dystopic. As in not a horrifying dystopia

The vampires in the Ixalan plane of Magic the Gathering are the nobility of a Spanish-conquistador themed empire. They practice noblesse oblige and don't feed on the unwilling, and being transformed into a vampire and joining the ranks of the nobility through meritorious service or being the squire to a vampire knight is a form of social mobility.
The vampire do not see themselves as different from the humans they were originally born as, and essentially serve as the warrior caste of feudal society the same way that knights and samurai and similar groups did in other countries.

I always thought it was kind of retarded in stories where vampires are just regular people who got bit and transformed that even newly turned ones would somehow put on airs and look down their nose at humans. Come on bro a 23 year old vampire has more in common with humans and his mommy than he does some 40000 year old nosferatu.

I like the idea that the nation is really down to clown in terms of law. Everything is structured and orderly due to the excellence in experience you'd get out of immortals in a vampire government. Humans in the nation aren't allowed to be fed on unless they're seen as criminal or they willingly approve which would grant them greater citizen rights. It means that foreign influence is checked without the means of a sort of passport that gives the foreign element, like traders and diplomats limited immunity (which can be revoked). It has a sort of behave or else feeling that's near distopic but not bad yet.

Question: Werewolves, second class citizens, equals, or automatic crims? I would personally find it funny of humans are relatively high in this nation's hierarchic structure above monsters and other forms of undead aside vampire.

>>82064874
no, werewolves don't exist in this world.

>>82064917
Really? Thank Dracul!

The human nobility in this nation has potential to be the most prickish, egotistical motherfuckers depending on how old the nation is.

>>82064971
Why would there be human nobility? This is vamp country.

>>82064982
Because the premise is a non-distopic nation so there would need to be some power concessions like very high human positions in the nations civil and religious sectors so a pseudo-mortal nobility would emerge sort of like the American Kennedy family.

>>82065001
I don't agree with that. I can concede that there'd be humans who are powerful by position, charisma, wealth, or any combination of the three, but that'd be rare. Vampire nobility presumably spends energy to make sure humans don't get too much on top, and that their own power is secure.
Not having human nobility doesn't make anything dystopic.

Does mortal magic exist in this setting? Because without sorcery or some shit like advanced technology, I don't see other rival nations posing much of a threat to a primarily vampire run civilization. Like what does a neighbor do if this nation declares war? the second the sun sets the vampire military wing would win any national conflict near instantly.

>>82065031
There needs to be checks and balances to stop powerful humans from stomping the vampire element in the nation during the day or the reverse happening to humans during the night. A duel nobility would help with this, or at least some sort of intermixed religious caste to quell unrest.

>>82061179
The three major factions of that expansion of Magic the Gathering were Noble Savage Native American stand-ins, mixed race pirates, and the obvious badguys, imperialistic conquistador vampires.

Everyone liked the cartoonishly evil vampires way better than the politically correct factions.

>>82065045
We don't *have* a setting kathleen.
>>82065066
Having a human nobility would only encourage humans to gather power enough for a rebellion. No thanks. Having a happy but generally uninvolved herd is much safer. If the populace's needs are met, they're won't strive for more.

Given how contemporary the nation is set, the idea of halo-jumping vampire night soldiers in heavy kit is pretty cool. Crack paratroopers that don't need parachutes and shit.

>>82065091
>herd
That's dystopic language. For the nation to work for OP's premise, the humans involved would need to be totally down with their situation and not seen as cattle by most of the vampire element.

>>82065109
I didn't mean it quite that way, it was a bad phrasing. I just meant population at large. If the people can go to work, farm their lands, petition their local vampire lord for help with issues, and go home to bed safe, they're not going to see much reason for rebellion.

It would be identical to human society and they would farm blood the same way we farm milk from cows. What a dumb question.

>>82065155
The nation, by virtue of being vampire-centric, would be pretty insulated. Rebellion usually arises from a combination of an underclass+foreign influence+religious degradation.

>>82065170
Given technological level the question of how vamprisim actually works arises. Because perfluorocarbon artificial blood exists and can be manufactured.

>>82065199
>foreiign influences
>religious degradation
Why do you think these are important causes?

what if the middle and lower class are also vampire, the peasants are vampires, even the homeless are vampires.

>>82065235
Human foreign interests by rivals and enemies would absolutely be against a vampire nation and a potentially socially destructive foreign element would be watched for unless the vampires in question were idiots. And gradual religious degradation or sudden schism has been a part of every empire falling throughout all of history, which is also usually the fault of the religion in question to begin with because of corruption.

>>82065244
Sure, a vampire falling into various forms of destitution could happen but it would depend on the size of vampire population. If said population is relatively small and the ruling class, one would think there would be numerous safety-nets to prevent it.

>>82065306
Vamps would probably have some sort of Vampire Inquisition to keep themselves in line and keep their numbers safe

>>82065285
And what would the foreigners say? They wouldn't have very good arguments if the populace was well-tended in the first place. They wouldn't even need pressure if the populace was fucking furious, either. I don't want to dismiss foreign pressure out of hand, but I just see it more as a auxiliary than a main contributor.
As for religion, I understand it plays a great role in peoples' happiness. The troubles usually comes when group's religion is declared wrong, or a former state religion is demoted.

It all leads back to the populace being frustrated, exploited, and out of other reasonable options. It all comes back to happiness, or the extreme certainty of awful, horrible death.

>>82044245
Watch daybreakers

>>82044427
Love this one, going to adapt much of this.

>>82065364
You saying that a world of humans wouldn't see a nation of blood sucking vampires where they rule over humans that are apparently cool with it as something to subvert and try everything to get rid of? The vampires attempting something non-distopic would have their work cut out because the second any sort of vampire mind control is put on the table a non-dystopia flies out the window. The humans in question would need to be set up by the vampires to be so nationalistic and or religiously fervent that any foreign power could not convincingly gain a foothold, and that sort of untenable loyalty brings questions of its own.

More than one war toward neighbors by the vampires would need to be engineered and won to drive home a national consciousness and cultural superiority in the nation's humans.

>>82057878
The invisible hand of the market, more specifically the Invisible Man. We give him our blood and he'll create more blood-making opportunities. Trickle-down economics always works!

>>82065438
That's not what I'm saying, no. I'm saying there's little other nations can do short of war if the vampires are excellent stewards.
You're right that mind control changes the equation a great deal, but we could just write mind control out of the story. But even the unfounded rumour of mind control would be an issue, I suppose.
We can't really have them exceedingly nationalistic and religious either, because that's kind of dystopian too.
For the people in the country, living there has to be a better deal than living in other places, otherwise the whole thing falls apart. I see it as presupposition that the people in vampire country are taken care of well enough that they're hard to sway.

>>82065438
The only reason we devolved into representative bullshit is because the kino form of government, autocracy, is plagued by the poison of succession.

A king that never dies would invoke fervor.

>>82044245
just give them empathy or some other inborn reason to care about people

vampires with their long lives would actually be superior rulers to short-lived humans in such a case, they have inherently more reason to think of the big picture

>>82065558
Depends on the kin of course. An immortal vampire version of Richard I would be loved by the nation but a goddamn blight for everyone else.

>>82044294
Vampires that don't have to kill people each time they feed are lame. Its supposed to be a curse not a blessing of superpowers for sipping a little blood occasionally!

>>82064117
Thats only because they can't mix blood types without clotting themselves up. One victim at a time is way safer.

>>82064874
> All the stories of murderous shape-changers is based on truth.
> The Vampires know that there are others out there like them, waiting in the dark for an opportunity to claim their pound of flesh.
> This is why vampires do not go out to sea.

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>>82058925
You had me till >but under vampire LORD's

I want to serve a cute vampire lady, shiny catsuit optional.

>>82044342
Whoa. Cool it with the anti semitic remarks.

>>82057102
They're not common but enough to be counted. They're used as the nations police against the vampires

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>>82065306
>Sure, a vampire falling into various forms of destitution could happen

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>>82063824
That's how it's supposed to work on principle, but everyone has hired help. You're not supposed to do it as a matter of honour and pride but everyone does and everyone knows it. It's one of the symptoms of a sick world.

Of course, when the Vampire Empire rules the world there'll be no war and the vampires will jsut be doing anti-bandit activity and police work and such and they have the numbers for that.

>>82050692
It's still 4chan, don't ask too much of the random brainroter around those parts

Would popular people, like sport or rockstars, taste better than regular folk? Maybe nerdy scientist would have richer flavour? Or vegans? How could we market different blood types to the vampires?

>>82044245
Vampires, like nobility historically make take up the roles of the warriors/military of society. The decision to become one is often seen as self sacrificing due to having to perpetually put yourself up against some sort of invading force of blood demons that they are restricted to feeding on.

Maybe include a religious piety element to it and don't go with some sort of subversive element and make them legitimately pious.

>>82068342
Think every vampire would have his own preference and that subtle comments and remarks on each other tastes would be a common source of bickering among the nobility

>>82044245
They don't.

>>82065672
Even if we say that, vampire led societies could still be pretty stable depending on how many vampires you need and how often they need to kill (or else incapacitate through blood loss). You could easily just kill off criminals or prisoners of war, and you probably wouldn't have a significantly more draconian legal system than medieval kingdoms without vampires. You might need a dungeon to hold your blood bags if you get a big batch all at once due to a war or whatever, but that's not a big problem.

The main problem I could see if you had two vampire states at war with each other expanding the number of vampires in order to gain the upper hand. At the end of the war you might end up with more vampires than can be sustainably fed, but that sounds like a great plot hook.
>The local vampire lord has hired you to decimate his thralls-at-arms in full harness
>if captured he will deny ever having hired you to avoid a civil war

>>82044245
>expecting a functional, non-dystopian, nation ruled by a race of immortal glowniggers
After Fedoravania, I'm tired of people not understanding the nature of power.

How about if there are differing types of vampires that feed on different things?

Can't exactly use a blood tax to sustain vampires that feast on emotions or drink dreams.

>>82070445
I've always thought emotion vampires were kinda stupid. Feel free to speculate further if you want, I guess.

>>82070516
So did I until I was introduced to Colin Robinson

>>82069846
There's no reason that vampires should be as morally bankrupt as glowies.

>>82070590
Yes, yes, what we do in the shadows is funny. I still don't like emotion vampires as a broad concept.

>>82067474
Vampire women can be lords too, cmon.
>>82068342
Ozzy eating a bat is a message to every vampire who thinks he can try and take his blood. Even if someone manages to they wont survive whatever flows in Ozzys veins.
>>82070445
>vampires that feast on emotions or drink dreams
And where did that ever happen?
>inb4 start vampires
One of these shits supposedly killed and ate Abdul Alhazred, so nah.

>>82071780
Star* vampires
Yeah

>>82065672
not giving the full succ each time should require a lot of self control, so even if vampires can feed non-lethally, they are always at risk of descending into hedonism

>>82065672
>>82072921
Vampires not complete draining the victim in one bite is prety como in fiction since Dracula and is consistent with the original myths/legends
I don't see it even being a problem

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Could vampires and humans live side by side in peace?

>>82075324
fuck off with your waifu posting you cunt.

>>82044245
Vampires are parasitic, it's stupid to have a nation ruled by parasites that is good because it goes against the metaphor

My setting has vampires drinking demon blood instead of human

>>82044245
>literal blood-sucking upper-class
>non-dystopic
Ok retard.

>>82044245
Two class system like Starship Troopers but vampirism instead of military service.

>>82076082
>it's stupid to have a nation ruled by parasites that is good because it goes against the metaphor
no, it just makes them symbiotes instead of parasites

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>>82057878
>Who would educate the children in vampire math?

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>>82044294
Yeah, but eventually a fat bipolar witch will fuck everything up for you. It's just not worth it.

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>>82053434
He's already got a PC rolled up.

>>82070628
>There's no reason that vampires should be as morally bankrupt as glowies.
>no reason to be evil
This is why we are exploited.

>>82044245
It would be interesting as a reverse Batman. Where all the crime would happen during the day exclusively.

>>82063752
The mind control anon, the mind control

>>82075690
???
don't come into a vampire thread and get upset there are vampires, anon

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>>82075690
>fuck off with your waifu posting you cunt.
or what mortal?

>>82079463
Old Count Redeyes de Magpyre on the other hand was loved by the people and seems to have been their ruler, on and off, for thousands of years.

He knew how to die.

>>82063752
Because the alternative is you getting mind controlled. What about this do you not understand? You can probably come to an understanding, but if you play retard they will just overtake you politically anyway and you won't get shit.

OP said "non-dystopic" so presumably these Vampires aren't just spamming their powers all day and being generally evil.

>>82044245
>nation
I use good aligned vampires quite often because I'm a faggot a nation would probably be a bit hard unless it was confined to a few of the top leaders a small village or something is incredibly easy though depending on your system and setting
>party comes to a remote village on the edge of a kingdom that's going through a rough time
>heard rumors about the area and none of them seem good but they need to pass through
>village seems to be rather simple but doing well despite this
>they're willing to trade with the party and let them stay the night but aren't very talkative and make it clear they don't want them sticking around
>party stays the night and spends the next day attempting to get info from the villagers despite how rude they're being
>after a few slip ups they learn that people are almost afraid to talk about their local lord
>after quite a bit more digging they learn that he's a vampire
>everyone knows but lets him keep his rule because unlike other lords he doesn't demand anything other than to feed off of the occasional villager
>feeding isn't lethal and he picks a new person every so often
>he actually gets a fair number of villagers who simply volunteer for it as well since he keeps things running smoothly
>village being so isolate has helped him keep his role and he's worked for years to spread rumors that the area is cursed to keep out any unnecessary visitors