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File: Underground.png (1.8 MB, 1226x721)
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Keeping the Beasts Out Edition

>What is this?
/TG/ DEVELOPED A GAME
IT IS PLAYABLE. IT HAS BEEN PLAYED.
EXPEDITION is a ~1870s era, Jules Verne-inspired retro-futurist, underground blood soaked cook-off adventurescape.
It is a Skirmish wargame. Two players with their own expeditions, on a hexgrid map, cook off and fight each other for victory (and the best meal).
A campaign mode is currently in the works, hoping to post a first Campaign Scenario within the next week or two. (you) are more than encouraged to contribute.

3 versions of the rules exist, TWO of which have been playtested. The main one is 2e, to be found :
> https://app.mediafire.com/us7vnek39dc6k
as with maps, tokens and lore ressources.

>TL;DR Doc
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1LxdaGoBlJRTMuziMDupG5TeeFwNDnsIW2pfaRAcFDgA
>Main Lore Doc, including links to anon-written short stories and additional lore in "Recommended..." section
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1bRrxdD1BMLmcMDFeszwqg2Rcjrt8DDo7tjAxoOB6KQ8
>3e Rules Doc (READY FOR MORE PLAYTESTS)
https://docs.google.com/document/d/14ZpHhEyUbjt-SCx2xuAd0lyh7Rs4J7rK5kHkljqykhk/
> Unit Spreadsheet - Currently outdated, requires an update
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1rcleQtrT4Q0INiBW50-kq2ZXWJ-cjLOeVTLTJg_oX5E
>Unit Design Doc
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1n0X89OdMPXJKQGm6kYcOABjhjE4NZER1fvmpDmDX1JA

>What can I do?
Shitpost, meme, get comfy. Read over the docs to settle in.
Familiarize yourself with rules and plan some playtests.
Contribute if you have ideas. Give feedback on contributions if you don't.

> TQ : Please suggest names for Map Anon's settlement maps (see next posts). It doesn't need to come with with any large blurb, the name itself is fine, if you have a reason and want to explain it go for it, same for a little bit of lore, but its not 100% necessary.
>>
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1 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/88453902
2 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/88499775
3 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/88521841
4 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/88546020
5 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/88573764
6 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/88609944
7 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/88644608
8 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/88673440
9 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/88692518
10 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/88708594
11 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/88727682
12 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/88778228
13 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/88870359
14 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/88914758
15 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/88977888
16 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/89025754
17 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/89115225
18 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/89200203
19 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/89297989
20 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/89382116
21 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/89461008
22 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/89544852
23 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/89631080
24 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/89713196
25 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/89792722
>>
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26 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/89869127
27 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/89947037
28 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/90025795
29 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/90105561
30 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/90181640
31 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/90257150
32 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/90336310
33 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/90413108
34 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/90499203
35 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/90584650
36 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/90673309
37 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/90753468
38 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/90829747
39 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/90908926
40 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/90986494
41 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/91065344
42 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/91137325
43 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/91204984
44 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2023/91275538
45 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/91338794
46 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/91416168
47 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/91510472
48 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/91592820
49 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/91701936
50 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/91784100
51 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/91857566
52 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/91925480
53 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/92067118
54 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/92133409
55 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/92198903
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56 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/92268614
57 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/92338736
58 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/92416368
59 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/92493882
60- https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/92579565/
61- https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/92646124/
62- https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/92679993/
63- https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/92748455/
64- https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/92815189/
65- https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/92949461/
66- https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/93012689/
67- https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/93073590/
68- https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/93142524/
69- https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/93213106/
70- https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/93343390/
71- https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/93406555/
72- https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/93611222/
73 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/93679678/
74 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/93813764/
75 - https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/93876241/
76- https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/2024/93937759/
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Forgot to like the old
>>94053855
>>
>>94152628
Map of the 3rd layer -settlement's names- updated thus far.
>>
>>94152639
I remember there being debate over Atlan naming conventions, did that ever get settled? It was a Greek vs Aztec thing
>>
>>94152634
Map of the 4rd layer -epigean settlement's names- updated thus far.
>>
>>94152696
Also, until suptg comes back online, someone should save the previous thread on their pc, just in case it comes back online after the thread was erased.
>>
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>>94148784
>I'm up on the 15th if you're available.
Awesome!
I'm in nightshift mode rn, so preferably somewhen after 19-20:00. My timezone should be +1 hour from France.
You are EEST? I'm GST, not that its any issue at all. Can absolutely arrange something.
And I will absolutely need some handholding with setting things up since the last time I've played tabletop was in a loony bin with fellow draft dodgers, using a single d6.
Kek, don't worry about it at all, we can run an intro game, I'll walk you through the whole thing. Do you have a faction in mind, and would you like to build your own list?
>>
>>94152712
Good idea, done.
>>94152705
>I remember there being debate over Atlan naming conventions, did that ever get settled? It was a Greek vs Aztec thing
I think what worked best for most was the most heavy handed fusion of both possible. Like
> Tlacopanikos
> Chiconatlan
> Thassalotlalmanalco
> Hekatepec
That kind of shit. The older settlements should probably have purely Greek-derived names however.
>>94152734
I fucked up the replies on this post but hopefully you understand.
>>
>>94152709
British settlement 1 is known as Folly
No one's in particular, just Folly
>>
>>94152734
Yeah, I'm EEST.
I was thinking something simple-ish like France. And I can build a list, no worries. The usual is around 140-150 silver, right?
>>
>>94152702
>>94152709
A lot of colony names were originally intended to be settlement names. New Kirkwall, Kitezh, Vladiagartsk, Ys, Franklin, New Alamo, Kagoshima-no-Yomi (like its literally just Kagoshima), Nouvelle Alger was also named after Alger/Algiers, as in, the city, but we could rename the colony itself to Nouvelle Algerie and name the city something else.
t. came up with most of them
Anyway here are some more proposals
>Franklin terr. any
Jubilee
>Third Sicily 5
New Palermo
>Reconnexion any
Vernes
Also maybe I should have just named Reconnexion Reunion instead. I didn't want it to sound like the island but it's still much better.
>>
>>94152768
I would rather use Greek names for simplicity sake. We can say that they are Atlantis's names that everyone who doesn't know the secret and/or incomprehensible tongue of Atlan (you know, like Dwarvish. Could even have the thing about people being exiled for speaking too much of the secret language around slaves). We could also or instead say that 'Atlanish' looks mostly the same (identical for our purposes) as written Greek, but is spoken rather differently, with some different meanings and uses for the same words, a fair amount of unique phrases and idioms, as well as different grammar. So an Atlantean looking at Atlan writing would think it was written by a complete and utter psycho. The point being it would allow use to use the simpler and more evocative Greek or Greek-sounding names, without abandoning the Proto-Proto-Mayan idea.
Using Greek (or you could argue geological/chemical) names was also established by the chart with Phosphorus, and, at least currently, supported in the books with the weapon names and unit names. As far as i can tell, only Toltaikos is named as an Aztec-Greek mashup, the rest either use either English or Greek names.
>>
>>94153721
>without abandoning the Proto-Proto-Mayan idea
Haha yeah who would want that
Certainly not the same guy who accidentally started the whole damn Mesoamerican angle
Wouldn't that be ironic
>>
>>94152709
New Kirkwall territory could be renamed Elizabeth Bay, and the first big city could be given New Kirkwall. 4 could be Mary Falls or Rosy Falls. I think 3 was named, but i'm not sure and i don't remember what it was.
For Franklin, how about we make Jubilee the big city, and make 4 Leeward, and 3 Leeway? 2 could be Tecumseh.
>>94152709
Could we make New Alamo the name for 1, and Jefferson the name of the territory? That would match Franklin, and just generally makes more sense as a territory name.
>>
What are the rules for Fragment of Forgotten Lore again?
>>
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>The Red Weed: (2 Silver)
Hyperborean
PAIN: 10
AP: -
Movement: -
Accuracy: -
Strength: 2
Discipline: -
Labour: -
Evasion: 1
Awareness: 1

>Armour:
4 in all (represents toughness not difficulty of hitting)

>Health:
-

>General Abilities:
-Difficult Terrain

>Special Abilities:
-Crawling, Crawling:
Each time this unit is activated it may deploy one Red Weed tile adjacent to itself, and may additionally deploy in any adjacent water/wetland hexes for free for as many water/wetland hexes it starts activation adjacent to. It also automatically deploys into any adjacent hex with a Pain token on activation and subsumes the token. Any part of the Red Weed may be harvested, giving a unit with a PAIN counter one pain for each tile harvested, and giving any other unit a [/] Poison wound. Explosive or Fire damage attacks automatically remove as many hexes as they affect.


>Equipment:
None


>Recruitment:
Firmament Foe (Possible Hyperborean TORMENT-FARMER unit? {it’s a very funny name})

>COMMENTARY:
It’s like a pain bank, good tool for ranged hyperborean lists who might have trouble collecting pain otherwise. Certain hyperborean units should spawn it to represent seeds they’re carrying, Derelict tripod should definitely scatter 1d3 on spawn.
Inspired by the other plant units from yesterday.
>>
>>94154726
>What are the rules for Fragment of Forgotten Lore again?
Fragment of Forgotten Lore Value : 20 Silver
A model equipped with this may spend 2 AP to to Test Awareness. If successful, its owner may choose one result for either sides of the Conditional Rule Table, it is now in effect. If failed, the owner rolls twice on it, his opponent chooses which result will take effect.
>>
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New wave of beasties.
>>94155047
I will use this but I think it would work better as a calcified form of Pain token than a bank that allows you to put in multiple. I'll come up with a proposal, you let me know what you think.
>>
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>>94156560
>>
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>>94156573
>>
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This one for the Roof Raider.
Something about the image of some poor BAP getting snatched up by a gigantic sloth hanging from the Roof's stalactites makes me happy.
>>
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And an old threat resurfaces!
The Beastiary entries are nearly complete, about 5 left, then Nests and Ingredient/Item drop rules, and then cleaning up/fixing... I will try to push ahead for uploading it tonight but it might be tomorrow after the game if I get stuck somewhere.
>>
>>94152880
>>94153655
>>94153913
Added the new suggestions, but for now I'm not changing the already established names, both for settlements and colonies, as we'd have to go back to the loredumps and change the names.
>>
>>94156658
>The Beastiary entries are nearly complete
Where's the list?
>>
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>>94156939
Being assembled at the same time as the profiles are being made. Here is where is stands at. I was more giving an update and timeline on it than anything else, so that I can move along to other things. Its a hundred profile so if I don't do this I could stay on it for weeks or months yet and it'll become an excuse not to work on other things. If the profiles that I shitpost annoys or seem like they wouldn't fit, they can be replaced later on, no issue at all, and we can always come back to it and turn some of the tables into d20 ones if anons have inspiration on it.
>>
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>>94153275
>I was thinking something simple-ish like France. And I can build a list, no worries. The usual is around 140-150 silver, right?
Yes, 150, you don't have to spend it all. Fair warning, France needs a bit of cleaning up and perhaps some rework so some of it is a bit broken right now, the tiger brigade car in particular, so you may want to avoid it.
Please use picrel for the weapons loadout and cost (guns got buffed, this is a bit more expensive but a lot better too).
I want to do a Husk mercenary list, I'll take a look to see if its functional and come back with a list.
>>
>>94158033
>Pelagic Problems
Fire Breathing Sea Dragon (like the real animal but dog sized and breaths fire).
>>
>>94158033
Colonial Criminals 7
Heinous Huntsman
>He seeks the Most Dangerous Game
>Wields a rifle from horseback
>Mobile, but fragile
>Accent is incomprehensibly posh
>Pith helmet optional
>>
Pitcher plant monster that can be equipped as armor, sacrificing a unit for a temporary power boost. Is this anything?
>>
>>94156560
>Calcified Pain
Makes more sense to me. You could do it where calcified pain nodes are tough structures while the stuff that grew naturally on water/wetland can be passed through if you hack at it.
Maybe the calcified pain nodes are blood-red crystal statues of what made the pain in the moment it was made.

>>94158033
Someone already beat me to the remaining units! Blast! Here they are anyways:
>Pelagic Problems:
Greater Morlock, they never stop growing, like goldfish
>Colonial Criminals:
Questing Grail Knight

Also: (I might be beaten to these too as I write them)
>Prehistoric Predators
>Psysaur (Nerfed version?)

>Roof Raiders:
Razorglider: (Like a flying wing aircraft if it was alive, small, and also very sharp.)
>>
The Axe of Gorg is a curious artifact. It was forged by gentle hands, hands which knew neither hatred nor war.
The Children of Gorg had been cursed by the jealous Star Ancestors, for their power was as nothing before the power of Gorg. To hurt him, they cursed his children.
Madness and witlessness overtook the Children of Gorg. They tore down their beautiful city, which they had built to honor their father. They slaughtered one another like animals.
Gorg was not a warlike god. He was kind and gentle and loving, even toward his foes. To see his most beloved creations turned wicked and foul broke his heart.
He found one of his children, one who had been an outcast for his violent and wicked ways even before the curse fell upon the Children of Gorg.
Gorg's tears flowed into him. Gorg's axe was thrust into his hands. Gorg's words fell upon his ears like a great weight on his shoulders.
"Take this. My one weapon. Never before have I and never after shall I create its like. There is no kindness in this. Avenge your brothers. I bless you and I curse you with this."
And through Gorg's tears, he gained vitality such that death would never truly claim him.
And through Gorg's axe, he gained strength such that no foe could ever truly best him.
And through Gorg's words, he gained purpose such that no pain or sorrow or guild could ever truly stop him.
And Gorg wept, and wept, and wept. An ocean rose from his tears.
The Children of Gorg narrowly escaped, but Gorg drowned in his own suffering, for no force lesser than himself could ever hope to destroy him.
And the Hornless Gorg swore to avenge those responsible.
The Hornless Gorg vowed to destroy Mu.
>>
>>94158289
Seconding.
>>94158033
>Pelagic Problems
Fire Breathing Sea Dragon (like the animal, only large dog sized and fire breathing).
>Roof Raiders
Dire Cave Cricket. Just a weaker Roofworm. Still really want Glow Wyrm, but that can come later.
>Prehistoric Predators
Vemonsaur. Of course.
>>
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>>94158715
>Vemonsaur
The Vemonsaur.
Not to be confused with the elusive Venomsaur, of course.
>>
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>>94158289
>>94158334
>>94158372
>>94158715
>>94159496
Thank you for these!
>>
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>>94158093
>Please use picrel for the weapons loadout and cost (guns got buffed, this is a bit more expensive but a lot better too)
I assume something must be wrong, because the weapons in both the French book and the Rule book are more expensive than in the image (3 for Gras, 4 for Beaumont etc.).
>>
>>94160829
I double-checked, you are right, I had in mind the cost of the formula price list which are higher. The one >>94158093 is the right one (for now at least).
And I was trying to build a Deep Drunk Commander + Husk list but it really doesn't work as well as I thought it would, I will rather go full Kurtz and run a Deep Drunk Commander + Devolved Deepfolks list.
>>
>>94161171
Alright, here's mine:
Francis Garnier - Horse (34)
Troupes de la Marine x 2 (20) - Gras and Bayonets, x2 Rations each (8)
Foreign Legionaire x 2 (18) - Gras and Bayonets, x2 Rations each (8)
Garde Nationale x 3 (21) - Lefacheux and Daggers (3) (They don't have rifle options, right?)
Army Medic (8) - Lefacheux and Sabre, + 1 Medkit (4)
Mitrailleuse (20) - Lefacheux and Sabre (3)
Should be 147
Are we doing Obscurity?
>>
>>94161588
>Are we doing Obscurity?
Nah. Thanks for the list, will set it up. Is 20 your time good?
>>
>>94161606
Yeah.
>>
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Did we ever settle on something for the Eloi?
>>
>>94161588
Deep Drunk Commander (17)
Saber 1, Lefaucheux 1
The Deep Drunk Demolitionist (23)
Dynamites x6
2-Horned Gog 16 (20)
Mace x2
15x Devolved Deepfolk 5 (6)
Sword, Buckler
>>
Ungern-Stermberg shenanigans?
>>
>>94164049
Remind me, what was the Discord.
>>94164115
My guy, he's not even born yet.
>>
>>94164281
https://discord.gg/WrZqkTbj
https://www.owlbear.rodeo/room/r54k2tjh5byl/ThePriorPull
Doing the pngs of lists right now, wont be long.
>>
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Unfortunately disc*rd is being (predictably, its more on me than anything else at this stage) really stupid so we'll have to reschedule to tomorrow, I'll look for another voice chat app by then. Posting a snip of the gang in advance because this is beautiful to me.
>>
Suptg is starting to come back online, but the archives aren't online yet. A reminder since we still have to archive last thread.
>>
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>>94166006
Thank you for letting me know!
> picrel
Proposal for rules for Nests. Nothing too fancy, still not sure what to do for the Giant Ant Hill but it'll come to me eventually.
>>
>>94166817
Nest for Colonial Criminals; Seedy Hideout
Randomly contains rations, alcohol, materials, guns, treasure, or a Hired Hand held hostage.
>>
>>94166817
Hollow Stalactite that can fall on you?
>Ant Hill
Speaking from experience they're either really big and noticeable or you have no idea you're standing on one until the pain begins. So maybe whoever controls the NPC that turn can try do deploy it under a pre-existing unit?
>>
>>94164849
I poked around in TeamSpeak and it seems to work for me. The channels are temporary, but it should suffice for running games once in a while.
>>
>>94167154
Maybe it's a three hex unit with 3 AP, and whoever controls it can chose to either place one hex of it within 4 of a existing hex, or deploy an ant on a 3 hex anthill...?
>>
>>94166817
Reposting ideas for Thunder Mole Nest and Giant Thunder Mole

>Static: any model that Attacks this model becomes Stunned after resolving the attack. This model counts as Light Source 3.

>Discharge: if this model has no Walls connecting it to another model of the same name, any model that is adjacent to it or a Wall connected to it at must check Strength at the start of turn, becoming Stunned if it fails.

>Electric Terrain: Walls adjacent to or that directly connect Thunder Mole Nests count as Light Source 2 and any model that attempts an Excavation against them suffers Electrical Damage for every Thunder Mole Nest connected.

Giant Thunder Mole:
Beast
AP: 1
Movement: 8 Accuracy: - Strength: 5 Discipline: 2 Labor: 6 Awareness: 2
Health: 4
Armor: 000
[Immune to Electricity] [Immune to Obscurity]

Eletro-Web: When a model moves into a hex that is directly between a Giant Thunder Mole and a Thunder Mole Nest, it suffers -1 Accuracy for the rest of the game for every Giant Thunder Mole on the board. This model may not Attack or Charge.

Dig: When this model succeeds an Excavation, it may move into the Excavated hex for free.
>>
I thought i had posted this before, but it looks like i hadn't. 3 Hex Model?

Woolly Trunk Bat:
Beast
AP: 2
Movement: 5, Accuracy: 4, Strength: 6 , Discipline 5, Evasion: 5, Labor: 2 Awareness: 3
Health: L3 B2 H2 T5
Armor: 134
[Flyer] [Immune to Obscurity]

PRÖÖÖT: (1 AP) All models in front of and Engaged with this model must test Discipline, those that fail become Stunned and suffer Knockback 1.

Echolocation: If this model used PRÖÖÖT last turn, it gains Quick Strike this turn.

Attack: [ // ] / [ X// ] Reach + Deadly
>>
>>94155246
Thank you. Idea for Doodlebug

Doodlebug:
Beast
AP: 2
Movement: 1, Accuracy: -, Strength: 3, Discipline: 6, Evasion: 5, Labor: -, Awareness 4
Health: 1
Armor: 000
Horde [3], Terrain Affinity: [Desert]

Scrawled in Sand: Models adjacent to this one count as having a Fragment of Forgotten Lore until the end of their Activation.

>comments
I think Fragment of Forgotten Lore will feel more in-line with how i picture them. It will also be simpler to resolve, i imagine.
>>
How could a model throwing another model work?
>>
>>94168616
How big is a given hex? Like, in square feet.
>>
>>94168616
We already have attacks with knockback, so that's covered.
>>94168710
No set scale, don't worry about any implications
>>
>>94168616
Similarly as Knockback, I would assume.
It would be an offensive ability, right? Something you'd do to the enemy? If so, I would say a Face to Face Strength test, if you win but the opponent doesn't fail, it gets throw 1 away, if you win and the opponent fails throw d3?
Most thrown weapons are Range 5-6, d3 is already a lot to wrap your head realistically for a 1 hex model to throw another one around, so that could be for bigger ones? If you are envisioning a 3hex or 7hex character doing it them it could be a lot more than that.
RL scale is definitely not something you should worry too much about otherwise than "Adjacent = close enough you can stop someone flanking someone else, 10~12 = average rifle range, everything else is in between that".
>>
>>94169373
>>94170186
I was thinking of giving Titanium Golem an ranged attack where it picks up a friendly model and throws it at the enemy like a baseball. But i've been stumped for a while on how to go about it.

Also, new Crystal Iconodule traits

Thiolphile: This model and up to 3 Spring Gunners may be equipped with Ranged weapons from the Ottoman list. (2 Silver)

Experimental Alchemy : Attacks made by Friendly models with Terror Tonic or Burden Balm also inflict Fire Damage on Critical hits. (1 Silver)

Servant of the Wall: This model gains Icon, Bodyguard, and Wall Veneration if it does not have it. (5 Silver)

Heavy Metals: When this model takes a Critical hit or fails a Fire or Electrical Damage roll to a Location with no Titanium rule, test Awareness. If you succeed, gain Titanium on that location. Additionally, when this model dies, place a Mineral Vein in the hex it died in. (12 Silver)

Crystal Eyes: [2 AP 1LP] Target an undiscovered Mineral Vein within LoS and check the Random Mineral Table, adding +3 to the roll. When it is Excavated, the Ore found is the one determined by this roll. (10 Silver).
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>>94168135
>it suffers -1 Accuracy for the rest of the game for every Giant Thunder Mole on the board.
Ngl, this one bugs me a bit. It feels weird not having an attack profile, like we are purposefully avoiding the reference when very quite obviously a reference. Mechanically, its the kind of thing that will either guarantee its taken out first every time, or if by some miracle it works and somehow you manage to spam it, it'll just drag the game into a slog instead pushing toward resolving it.
>>94168210
I'm pretty sure you have, I had opened from suptg until a few days ago, had to go dig back for profiles, I realized the libertalian pirate wasn't done when I thought it was. In any case, thank you, it was among the last ones to do.
>>94168232
I did the Vampire Mosquito too quickly and filled up the last remaining spot I had for the bug list, but this is too good, so I'll remove the Giant Scorpion for now.
>picrel
Please suggest some items for drops, ingredients and meals. Since we'll no longer score the silver from the kill directly picking up items will be a (rather very) small compensation for Expeditions who won't Loot.
Also, sorry for making you guys repeat yourself so much, but please repost the ideas you had for the meals you suggested (I think Saur Steak, Megasaur Omelet & the Aphid Goo (what was the name?) had some rules posted with them but I can't find them right now). If you forgot I'll go dig up the archives tomorrow so its not that much of a worry.
>>
>>94170307
>Hyperborean Artifact
Mystifying Bauble
Exceptionally valuable, but causes units close to it to fight each other to get to carry it. Holding it makes it extremely difficult to look at anything else. Possibly made from calcified pain, crystallized suffering, or some other such esoteric material.
>>
2e anon, are you ready to try again?
>>
>>94172716
Yes, pouring some coffee and I'll be on it, won't be long!
>>
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During an inspection of a remote guardpost in Basse-Guyenne, Colonel Garnier receives a disturbing report. A friend, which had been assigned to a trading post not too far, has failed to send messages for the last few months. Fearing the worst, Garnier assembles a small team and braves the wilderness.
Unfortunately, his friend has gone off the Deep end a while ago, and now styles himself the deity of a Devolved Deepfolk village. No longer recognizing his former compatriots, he assembles his tribe for a fight.
>>
The horde of Subhumans pushes ahead, safely hidden behind a rocky outcrop in the middle of the valley, with two pairs splitting off on each side. The French spreads out to meet them. The Garde takes a few shots at the Devolved on the right side of the map, one shot hitting, but the Devolved luckly crit dodging it. Nothing else happens.
>>
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>>94174163
The horde's speed catches even the Deep Drunk Commander by surprise. The 2 on the right side manages to charge and wound the front Garde, but one of them is promptly killed in the exchange. The two Devolved on the left flank attempt to do the same with the Foreign Legionnaires, but fail to connect, and one is also killed right after. The Mitrailleuse shots at the group of Devolved coming out of the center, killing one, and another dies to the fire from Garnier's group at the center. The Commander rallies uses all his Leadership to Rally 3x.
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>>94174210
The Deepfolks coming out of the center pass splits into two, one group assaulting the Marine and Garnier, the other going off to reinforce the flailing right flank charge. This time one Garde bites it, and another one takes a deep wound.
The Marines manage to hold the onslaught, getting scratched up badly in the process, but keeping Garnier safe.
However now its Gorg time. The 2-horned Gorg activates and tests for Deep Drunkard, succeeding, and thus gaining 1 AP, allowing him to charge at the 2nd Foreign Legionnaire from the center, and boinking him dead on the head.
>>
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>>94174253
Between the Marines, Garnier and the Medic, the front assault of Devolved melts, 3 dying very quickly and suddenly bringing me very close to having the whole gang shaken. I Rally twice with the Commander, the Demolitionist test for Deep Drunkard, succeed and gain 1 AP, and chucks 2 Dynamites, injuring one Marine (Garnier is sitting on Evasion 8~9 at this point so explosions don't do much to him). The Foreign legionnaire finally manages to kill the Devolved it is engaged with, and with a Crit iirc, bringing me back to Shaken. The Gorg goes for it and charges Garnier, hoping to kill him, and hits him 2x but fails to kill.
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>>94174300
The right flank evaporates, two Deepfolks dying as well as one Garde, leaving one Deepfolk free to charge the Marine and hitting, bringing him a scratch away from death. The Medic heals Garnier (I forgot to mentioned he heals a Garde as well earlier). who goes on to fight the Gorg and hits him twice. Having screwed up their reload last time they shot, the Mitralleuse crew charges the Gorg and hits him, but only for a graze. The Gorg swings back, but between the 4 attacks only manages to him Garnier once, breaking his other arm. The Demolitionist once again tries for Deep Drunkard but this time fails, costing him 1 AP for the round, and his Dynamite throw catches Garnier, the Mitrailleuse and the Gorg in its blast, but they all manage to evade it.
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>>94174355
Garnier starts by shooting at the Gorg, and gets a Crit, killing the Gorg and completely taking any chance of coming back away from me. We call the end of the game.
> End result
France : 94 Silver, 1 Dread
Deep : 28 Silver, 8 Dread
Victoire pour la France! (mais pas pour le Français ... )
Actually went better for me than I expected, I thought the game would be rather simple since it was an intro but anon had already a really good grasp of everything, his list was essentially a finished list (probably better than my French ones... ) with pretty much all the tools necessary to face off most opponent.
Balance-wise, the Devolved Deepfolks are pretty darn good as a swarm unit. Probably a bit better than Morlocks. They die pretty quickly but they reach their target and they do hit at least. And nimble gives them an alright chance of evading. they could either keep the same speed but lose at least 1 or 2 Accuracy and Evasion, or lower their speed to 3.
French list seems to have worked quite well, less fiddly than I remembered.
Thank you again for the game, it was awesome, let me know when you'd like to schedule another one!
>>
>>94174445
Thank you too, was an epic game, especially the Garnier-Gorg standoff at the end.
>>
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>>94174823
Yeah, since the Commander didn't get killed let's say he escaped Garnier, I want to do something more with these two, with Gorgs and then with Husks.
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>>94175014
The Deep Drunk Duo is blasting off again.
>>
>>94152712
4plebs does have an alternative backup of everything on /tg/ so no need to worry.

>>94153913
There definitely needs to be someplace named after Queen Victoria for the brits.

>>94158662
Very cool, added to the lore doc.

Also finally have figured out what I want to do with Swan King Ludwig, will post some lore on that in a bit...
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>>94177782
>>94177274
Love these two.
>Picrel
Should any of the Whalurs get direct access to Hyperborean weapons? Also, if we go with Ur-Ca summoning through the old way, then perhaps this is a bit overcosted (although not that much, he's still a beast and able to score 100 silver through the whale alone). We could add something to it or lower a bit.
The Meteoric Harpoon I'll put in the special weapon list since it could be exported elsewhere.
Also, I kept it as such, but the Long mod for the Fox is +1, when its always been a minus, but since its a short weapon that actually sorta work.
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>>94178304
>Should any of the Whalurs get direct access to Hyperborean weapons?
It could be neat.
>>
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>>94180638
Alright, I'll figure something out.
Here's the Sailor. I modified a bit the wording on his Tune rule, but otherwise it works the same.
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And this beautiful boy, which I can't wait to see in action.
Now back to the Beastiary for a little bit.
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Incoming drop of beasties.
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Will add something to the effect of at least spawning a few water tiles to this one.
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Added Chitin as an item drop for this one, so there would be some incentive to killing them.
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This will be a high priority to remove. I put Floater instead of Flyer to have the "gliding" aspect reflected through the Wind direction rules. Didn't really have a better image...
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For this one, what was this intent with giving it a Trunk (I assume that's what it is) Location?
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>>94181726
Maybe there should be an Aquatic special trait to cover things like this?
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>>94182029
Good thinking, would also resolve the same issue for the Gunboat.
I'm making good headway on the Beastiary and on the other project, Atlan anon, would you be up for a "game" tomorrow evening? I put this one in parenthesis because it wouldn't really be a game yet, more of a setup toward one, no need to build a list yet.
>>
>>94182148
Is it worth having separate Aquatic and Naval traits to distinguish between animals and boats, do you think, or is that bloat?
>>
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Made it so you can choose to leave him be a Neutral at the cost of Obscurity and lost AP, and try to get it to trigger at least Asking for Direction once so you avoid him turning into a potentially large threat (if he buffs up his AP) that will be very hard to remove through killing it. If you do chose not to trigger Asking for Directions, it'll tick down to a Dread bomb. Might lower its Discipline so that can hit faster (or bump the Discipline debuff to 2... )
>>
>>94182286
I don't see it as necessary outright but it could be made to work differently enough that its relevant. For example, Aquatic might say you have to drop a number of water or swamp hexes across the map without specifying much else, while naval might say have to set one side of the map in water all along, then players alternate dropping a number of additional water hexes adjacent (could be simpler, could just be one side of the map is 3 hexes of water to allow for bigger units)
>>
So after playing and getting a better handle on the game, some thoughts (if I repeat myself, consider it a confirmation):
1. Moving to Strenghth vs Strength damage model was a 100% right move. It makes it much more useful.
2. Even something like 3 Discipline is kinda okay with the way Dread works now, so trimming down the stat on some units might help making it more impactful. You could also adjust Dread states themselves to a non-scaling model like:
Dread = Disc - Shaken
Dread = Disc + 2 - Panicked
Dread = Disc + 4 - Broken
That way you can actually feasably trigger Panicked and Broken states even on someone with Disc 5-6.
Could also make Rations pricier, as you can have ridiculous Dread mitigation for spare change.
3. I wonder if we can make Evasion (when not Dodging) more relevant on unarmored models with simple tracks. From what I've grasped (and I might have grasped jack shit) as of right now it boils down to checking if you crit evade, outside of some special rules like Headshot.
I was initially concerned that location damage might slow the game down, but it doesn't seem like it does too much, honestly. So I wonder if giving non-mooks separate boxes for limbs, body and head might work, assuming it's one box each 90% of the time. They'd be both harder OR easier to kill based on rolls compared to the usual 2 box track, so it would make Evasion more relevant without impacting game speed too much.
4. There are a lot of new WIP rules not in the books, and its understandable, but I still feel the need to point out that theres nothing for Rally in the main book, despite it being one of the more established rules.
>>
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>>94182468
Thank you very much for the feedback.
1. I don`t want to credit the wrong person, I believe this was Atlan anon's idea (sorry to brit anon if that's wrong, it sure wasn't mine), and yeah it skips one step of checking back and forth the profiles and makes instinctual sense.
2. At the very least I think everyone I've played with at this point has mentioned its weird that Shaken isn't when Dread = Discipline. I regards to your scale I'm worried it might break a few things that don't readily come up to my mind right now, but at the same time I also really like that because it makes it possible for much higher Discipline models to go Panicked.
> Rations pricier
Do you mean Alcohol? Rations manage AP, Alcohol manages Discipline. But Rations could also be a bit pricier.
3. Yes. Headshot!, Bucklers and Shields were a start that way, but since not every models can get them its not sufficient. I'm thinking making being behind Barricades counting as having a Shield could help, since that's something pretty much everyone has access to.
> Complex Health for more models
We could expand it to Specialists and Elites without too much of an issue. I would very much appreciate other anon's feedback on this, especially if you have played.
4. You aren't wrong, I'm sorry about that. I'll put some time this evening into cleaning up the main rule book and making sure everything on the mediafire is up to its latest version, including the Merc book.
>>
>>94158334
This could be something, would your picrel be the end product once harvested and turned into armour?
>>
>>94182705
I was referring to the Cooking rule from the lore book, it's probably obsolete.
Remind me, is the most recent rule that Shields protect Limbs specifically or am I misremebering stuff?
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>>94184713
>I was referring to the Cooking rule from the lore book, it's probably obsolete.
I assume you mean the main book, in which case yes something happened there, that's at least 2 updates away. Checking up on what's wrong right now.
>>94184713
>Remind me, is the most recent rule that Shields protect Limbs specifically or am I misremebering stuff?
Proposed rules is if you succeeded your Evasion test and are equipped with a Buckler, you get +3 Armour to Limbs, Shields are the same for both Limbs and Body.
>>
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>>94184713
So, I'm really not sure when I fucked up, because Cooking rules haven't been this way for since at least 0.3, but I checked and you are right. I did a quick review and here's the most up-to-date version.
>>
>>94181777
Evolutionary holdover. At first i had a thing where he could extend his truck through Long Coils, but before i posted it i saw it was jank and too strong so killed it.
>>94174445
Got home yesterday and read this while eating. Very Comfy, Glad the first game went well.
>>94175125
Colonial Criminals boss?
>>94175621
Name the second big city after her?
>>94182148
11pm work?
>>
Suptg is back online.
>>
>>94187550
Thank you!
>>94187061
>Evolutionary holdover.
Alright, will remove it!
>Glad the first game went well.
I'm really glad of how it turned out as well. The Deep Commander and Deep Demolitionist will escape on to more drunken adventures, that's for sure. I'm especially glad the Gorg was strong, useful, but not at all unkillable.
>Colonial Criminals boss?
Hey I didn't think of that. How about I'll play him another 2~3 games and if he doesn't get killed by then, I'll add a spot for Kurtz (not a very French name admittedly, but maybe he's Legionnaire...) in an eventual expended list for Colonial Crinimals?
>11pm work?
Yes! Might not take as much time as I think either, but it'll give us an occasion to discuss a lot of important details and decide when we've put enough stuff on the map.
>>
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Did this one quickly this morning.
I reworked the wording on his Reserve rules a bit, but functionally its the same, with the added caveat you can always deploy the reserved models one at a time to go reinforce the line.
He is going to be *very* good, but I think he's costed appropriately, and Skobelev was seen as the best general of the 1880s by many accounts so its not like him being great comes out of nowhere.
>>
>>
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Last pass on missing Beasts, its 98% ready, I'll bring it up to 99% and then post it tonight after the meet up with Atlan anon in order to do a pass over it.
> Olm wyrm
I did this more or less from memory without digging the old profile back, does this seem close enough to your intent for the moment?
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Didn't have a better name for this one, let me know if you have inspiration.
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Didn't think it was necessary or useful to include Pain token mechanics on this one, since it probably won't spawn most of the time with a unit using it...
>>
>>94192133
>Wyrm
Looks good to me. Maybe add something making it clear you can only attack from the head with biting. Also maybe boost move or AP to make encircling a model in one turn easier if you devote AP to it.
>>
Just saw your message Atlan anon, I'm on, take your time.
>>
Would probably help if I shared the room...
https://www.owlbear.rodeo/room/r54k2tjh5byl/ThePriorPull
>>
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Water of chaos
Have invaded all space
The flood on earth again
I have to find the whales
That once did guides us
To dry lands of life
I won't despair
I'll break this dark all around

Under the heavy sea
I'll search the flight of whales

Beneath the seas I searched
And had a different view
Of us on earth
The sinking ship of men
But it's beyond the stars
I found the place
Where they were
And they finally came to light

Over the winds
They dwell in light
Like the arrow in the sky
I found myself on higher grounds
From up here
For I see them in flight

Now I can see the whales
Looming out of the dark
Like arrows in the sky
I can't believe my eyes
But it's true

Huge tunnel ends in light
Like banks of clouds they gather
See massive shape of flesh
Swimming giants in the clear
The mightiest comes to me
I'm on the wing, wide open
They teach me how to fly
Slowly moving in the air

So much told with no words at all
Powerful presence for only speech
Breath

Over the winds
They dwell in light
Fly

https://youtu.be/eg_OyqkITSE?si=JZxfnXmbahZEpW7s
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Sorry for the lack of posting today, rl stuff taking over. Here's a Giant Thunder Mole profile in the meantime.
After the talk and prep session I had last night with Atlan anon we've realized the Hostile&NPC list really needs to be put on a curve, easiest way to do this right now would be to turn each d10 list into a 2d6, which would open up a spot in each list. We talked about a really interesting Glow-Wyrm one for Roof Raiders (mix of Devouring Hanging Garden and the Olm Wyrm mechanic) so that one spot is taken and reserved for Atlan anon to make the profile, but for the rest let me know what you would like to see. Sorry if this delays the upload of the book a bit, but some of the result we had during test rolls were really egregious (still want to try the game, it'll be funny if nothing else.)
Also, regarding the game we are prepping for Monday, I'll post the list right away since I may not be able to later on, I think I'm really not as fucked as we thought I'd be, but I had to build a really different list than what we had discussed and envisioned in order to have a chance, so here it is (not complete but this will be the general idea... ).

Commandante 15
- Horse 6
Magma Mining Crew 5
- Horse 6
Ash Slave 2
- Shovels (Free)
Capitano 20
- Vetterli 2
6x Soldato 8
- Vetterli 2
Carabinieri 7

- 45 Material
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any more unit gaps to fill?
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>>94201090
>unit gaps
Don't know if you meant units left to do or holes left to fill in rosters, but thinking about the second is cool, made me think I should come up with a sort of "role roster" we can apply to all Factions. Not that all needs every role filled, but it could give us an idea of what to prioritize.
>>
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We should do something with this. Don't know what though.
>>
>>94198274
New U.S book needs to be uploaded before i can make my list.
Proposal for Glow Wyrm

Glow Wyrm: Cost 50
Beast
AP: 1
Movement: 5, Accuracy: 9, Strength: 2, Discipline: 7, Evasion: 5, Labor: 0, Awareness: 4
Health: L6 B2
Armor: 000
Light Source 3,

Melee:
1. Pen 9 [ High Altitude Fall and lose Caught ] / [ 0 ] Reach
2. Pen 3 [ 0 ] / [ GG ] Deadly

Luminous Lure:
This model does not count as occupying the hex it is in. Models overlapping with this one gain Immune to Obscurity and +1 Accuracy. Grounded models may only resolve Long Ranged Attacks against it. This model always counts as Dodging, but may only Attack models Engaged with it. Any model Moving or Dodging adjacent to this model must immediately resolve a Face-to-Face Strength test with this model, and if it loses becomes Engaged with this model and gain Floater and lose Flyer if possible. When a model Engaged with this one becomes un-Engaged, it must resolve a High Altitude Fall.

[Very Long Coils]
>>
>>94182468
>Dread = Disc - Shaken
Agreed. Maybe Broken is when Dread doubles Discipline, and Panicked is when Dread is 3 over? I was thinking we could have a conditional rule that makes Dread tick up by 1 or even 2 at the end of the turn.
I think to represent them being out of their element, Colonial followers should generally have lower Discipline than Agarthan ones.
>>
>>94202047
My take is that colonial military should have good discipline due to training, Agarthan military (Specifically professional military like Atlantis and non-slave Atlan) should have good discipline too, while civilian colonial followers should have poor.
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>>94203839
What about units that could be considered zealots, fanatics or madmen?
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>>94204042
Big discipline if fanatical, low discipline if insane.
That's how I've been statting them anyway
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>>94204090
Insane should be low disc with conditionals like Frenzy etc. They may not be cowards, but they ARE unstable.
>>
>>94204489
That's what I have already been doing (See the Demolitionist for an example)
I really do like different models having different dread conditions. If anything I think we should make it a general rule to have someone frenzy when shaken or attack self when broken or such. It adds variety.
>>
>>94201284
>>94201090
Here is something I should probably have done many moons ago. The role descriptions I threw quickly so don't think too hard about those right now, its more to give a very very rough idea.
I kinda tried to go with something like
Mediocre = Combat stats (Acc, Str & Acc) 4~5
Average = Combat stats 5 with access to good guns
Good = Some combat stats reaches above 6
Great = Combat stat 5~6, perhaps 1 "7"
Excellent = Combat stat 6 and higher.
I'll do the Deep Factions tomorrow.
>>94202047
>Colonial followers should generally have lower Discipline than Agarthan ones.
>>94203839
>My take is that colonial military should have good discipline due to training
This was my logic stating them as well, however one other thing that could be done to represent more >>94202047, would be to spread the Fear rule more liberally among Colonial units
> Fear […] : This model suffers -1 Discipline whenever within 3 of any number of models designated in bracket.
or Primordial Fear [Colonials] (same thing as fear except its on the enemy model and if there is nothing in bracket the owner get to chose a unit which it affects) on more Deep units, along with reworking the Morale Threshold mechanic.
Now on to do a billion scatter rolls...
>>
>>94204933
U.S book missing Superintendent and new traits.
>Fear
Good call on that.
>>
>>94204933
I think that Fear[Deep] Should be pretty common on colonial units (With something like France you might have to split who gets it based on who lives underground)
>>
>>94206393
>>94205522
Alright, I'll come up with something.
I'm thinking Discipline is relevant enough of a stat to include it in >>94204933 anyways so it'll give us a good tool to figure out how to balance it.
Atlan anon, something came up so I'll have to move the game tomorrow to Tuesday if you are also available for it. It'll also give me time to finish setting up and the game doc so that everything is ready when we do start.
>>94201599
>New U.S book needs to be uploaded before i can make my list.
I don't understand, I remember making the profile but I can't find it now, not even in my clipboard... I'll redo it tomorrow afternoon, now I have to go to bed, if I need to dig in in the archive it shouldn't be an issue, if you do have it handy closeby and can reupload it that'd be appreciated, but its not an issue if you don't.
>>
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Do we have a crazy chef? The kind that went to Agartha to seek luxury ingredients for his dishes, and went the deep end?

Also, do we have a full WIP unit list?
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>>94209929
Italy has a chef unit, and any unit in their roster counts as off the deep end in my book.
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>>94208372
New Officer Traits:

Halve Mean: Gains Engineer Keyword. Friendly models with Faraday Suits also count as Light Source 2.

Eau douce: This model may treat Alcohol as a Warm Meal.

Miskatonic Graduate: Morlock Grunts and Morlock Mariners are recruited as Faction units.
[Hatred: Mu], [Fear: Hyperborean] Academic Keyword.

Utterly Exhausted: This model may not Rally. All Mercenary Follower models in your expedition gain Semi-Expendable. Any models that already have Semi-Expendable gain Utterly Expendable. May only be taken if this model is a Leader and has the Paraguay Veteran Trait.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
New Ranger Traits:

Lone Star : This model gains +1 AP while 8 or more hexes away from the closest friendly model. (3 Silver)

Big Iron : Whenever this model makes a Ranged Attack with a Pistol or Revolver weapon, its target suffers -2 Evasion and -2 Armour (in addition to any Penetration rating that weapon might have). (2 Silver)

Bishop of the Wild Frontier:
This model gains the Academic keyword. As long as this model is Steady, add +2 to all rolls for control of NPCs from 2 Hostile Lists of your choice while within 3. (5 Silver)
>>
What time again, or about?
General idea for my list is Tennessee Vols + Rangers, with maybe a Superintendent. Rest would go to a few Prospectors and Materials.
>>
Probably some Hired Hands too. One for each Prospector maybe.
>>
>>94212070
Thank you! I remembered adding it on, must have somehow deleted the new version and uploaded the old one, I don't know how I did that but its the only explanation for it and the traits missing but not the Volunteer... I was going nuts but you posting the png profile makes me less worried I'm developing early Alzheimer...
Let me know if you spot other fuckery in the USA book, hopefully stuff like Officer Bubble is up to date.
>>94212380
>General idea for my list is Tennessee Vols + Rangers, with maybe a Superintendent. Rest would go to a few Prospectors and Materials.
Will very likely work really well, with this you can afford to focus on the econ side right away, for me I have to absolutely have enough firepower to deal with the big boy, so I went for something that gave me some Line Fire... If my ass is tucked in noodles (lol) I might be able to catch up to you because of how much pelts I get when I do kill him... But that seems like a pretty big if.
>>94212380
>What time again, or about?
Anytime past 7pm I'd say?
>>
>>94213123
>Fuckery
The book on the Mediafire is 4 not 5, but i'm sure 5 was up there at some point. 4 doesn't have any of the new stuff, save Bubbles.
(5, i think, is the exact inverse of 4, in that it has the new stuff, save Bubbles.)
>Anytime past 7pm I'd say?
Cool. That works. Will see about exact time later.
>>
File: USA(1).05.pdf (780 KB, PDF)
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>>94213193
Hopefully this is fixed. Somehow the traits were in already. Bubbles is in, hopefully to the latest version. Weapons are updated, I took out the remington 187x and the trapdoor gun for the moment, but they can be added back very soon. Replaced the hyperborean weapons by the latest ones too.
>>
>>94213476
> Mu attack on New York
How much do we know about this? Is there lore written about it?
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>>94213525
No lore written specifically about it, the idea was that Saur Knight Orders are constantly pushing New Mu to find more conflicts (possibly because traditionally you can only become a Knight after participating in a war) while New Mu is stuck dealing with the aftermath and as such tries to limit the repercussions of it by sending it after targets that won't trigger lengthy conflicts. There was no long term plan.
It is also the event that led to the Feds giving attention at the Morlock situation in New England, however (as opposed to the obvious Mythos analogue where fishfolks got interned and culled following the fed raid on Innsmouth) the New England Morlocks were emphatic in condemning the attack and turned out to be really useful during the following rescue operations in the sunken parts of New York, so they were seen as victims of Mu subjugation instead of the dangerous pests many would have taken otherwise taken them to be.
If you wanted to fluff out more the even it would be awesome.
>>
>>94213689
>If you wanted to fluff out more the even it would be awesome.
Sure, I'd be up to. Where can I find the bits written about this? To avoid contradicting previous stuff. Also is the relevant saur knight and mu stuff on the lore document?
>>
>>94213750
Also, this happened before or after the Paraguay incident?
>>
>>94213476
Looks good.
>>94213750
I'm sure whatever you come up with will be good. It isn't a huge deal, but the U.S is diffidently lacking in concept in comparison to other factions. It has a lot going in, but doesn't have much in the way of a unifying theme or style.
Rough Riders could be in part a response to Saur Knights. Just an idea.
>>
>>94213750
>>94213840
1876, in the old general doc.
> "Mu launched a failed attack on New York City, damaging the Statue of Liberty"
Which either implies its after [current moment] or the Statue was delivered a bit earlier in this timeline.
>>
>>94213974
>Which either implies its after [current moment] or the Statue was delivered a bit earlier in this timeline.
Scratch that it just means the Statue had to be delivered earlier.
>>
>>94213974
>>94213840
>damaging the Statue of Liberty
I don't think we should be beholden to this part. Not that it should be discarded, just not something worth holding on to if it makes more sense not to have it, i think.
>>
>>94213689
>so they were seen as victims of Mu subjugation
Do you think they deliberately cozy up to Abolitionists; who then push for conflict with Mu to liberate its many, MANY slaves?
>>
Something I've been cogitating on
Should Ape-Men/Neanderthals be their own faction? They've got the three cities, maybe different breeds of ape could fill the role of different unit types.
>>
>>94213476
Will post list in a minute regardless, but what do you think about these changes/fixes?

>Give Tennesse Vols Deadly on Shotgun instead of Training, Training on Muskets instead, lose Dogged.
>Henry to lose Headshot!
>Thundergun is meant to be Hyperborean
>Hyperborean Bayonet missing
>Dirt Man, Half-Husked Gunslinger, Morlocks, and Whalers missing from Mercenaries
>>
>>94214565
I'm fine with just Bleg unless you had something in particular in mind for them.
>>
Leader: 36
Superintendent (30) Horse (6)
Followers: 70
3[ Tennessee Volunteer, Shotgun (5) ] {45}
4[ American Prospector, Bradsburg (1), Shovels ] {24)
5[ Hired Hand, Shovels ] {5}

Hope we don't have to delay, but it's okay if we do.
>>
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>>94214954
I do have some ideas for them, yeah.
A becoming-people, clawing sapience from the cavernous depths of their own empty skulls. Aping more advanced societies as a crutch while they slowly develop their capacity for invention. A pidgin comprised of half monosyllabic barks and half loanwords stolen from every language they encounter.
But I also have other stuff I should be working on instead, and I'm not sure we need another minor faction.
>>
>>94215253
No need to wait, tomorrow around 7pm right?
I'll get the Merc book up tonight in a bit.
>>94214885
> changes
Sure!
>>
>>94215295
We have a bunch of surfacer minors but I don't think we have a purely underground minor faction unless you count Morlocks or the Tribals.
I've thought about spinning off a couple more Saur units to make them their own merc microfaction at some point, since IIRC they weren't actually Mu-exclusive in their chart form.
>>
>>94215695
>We have a bunch of surfacer minors but I don't think we have a purely underground minor faction unless you count Morlocks or the Tribals.
Surface is kind of easier to make minors for. It's easy to go "What was Poland up to in 1880 and how can we make that weird? What was Albania up to? What was Scotland up to? What was India up to?"
For the Agarthan factions, we have to invent them wholesale.
>>
>>94215950
It's a different challenge. I think Neanderthals as a minor faction is a good idea, but not high priority. Maybe just some more mercs for now, and we can flesh it out later. It would be good to get what we have more or less solid first, so there is less cleaning up we have to do. A good amount of it is inevitable, but you get what i mean.
The first thing that comes to mind for me, is the Lost City of Ough mentioned a bit back, the differences beteween Ape-Men and Neanderthals, and what about Troglodytes? Maybe Ape-Men are to Neanderthals what Neanderthals are to Epigeans, and the Troglodytes who founded and later lost Ough are to Neanderthals what Old Lemuria is to Lemuria.
>>94215364
>tommorow
Oh thank god. I need to purchase then proceed to boil, mash, and stick some potatoes in a stew. Really do not deserve the luck i have. Tomorrow around 7pm is very right indeed.
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>>94216181
>Oh thank god.
I'm sorry if there was any confusion.
Everything will be ready.
The map is fucking gorgeous.
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>>94216181
>Lost City of Ough
How do we feel about Neanderthal Necromancers?
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>>94215695
>I don't think we have a purely underground minor faction unless you count Morlocks or the Tribals.
As always the gorgs are forgotten...
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>>94216410
The Gorgs are forgotten. The Gorgs have forgotten. Gorg is forgotten.
I remember.
>>
Can someone post the latest world book?
>>
File: Worldbook(3).005.pdf (7.98 MB, PDF)
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>>94216523
Here!
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File: Merc.05.pdf (1.79 MB, PDF)
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And here is Merc updated.
Getting to a point where I won't be able to avoid having to make an index to this one, 77 pages is something to wade through...
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>>94216785
Did you add the bits that were mentioned were lacking?
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>>94216992
Which ones?
The edits that were suggested about ~3 threads ago after I last uploaded it are not in it yet, no. I was busy today and couldn't finish the Deep Nations unit list but it is started, if I have the time tomorrow before the game I'll finish that and then get unto the edits.
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>>94216834
Likely should have had an index from the start.
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>>94213689
>New Mu seeks to send the saur knights to conflicts that can be short and painless
>Sends them to attack the city of New York

How does that make sense? How would that result in anything but a lengthy colonial war between the USA and New Mu? There must be dozens of targets of opportunity they could have attacked, but an assault to one of the most populated city in one of the epigean powers? How does that not end with an US declaration of war? Even if it is the post-civil war/pre-wwii USA, which did not have an army on par with the other world powers (navy sure, but not army) and having to deal with a big agarthan power underground, how can the US not respond with a declaration of war?
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>>94219926
My take is that "New Mu" is not really something you can declare war on. It'd be like declaring war on the Hellenistic world as a whole instead of just one Polis.
Hell, some city states might have even offered aid to the US since they were getting tired of the saur orders starting shit. Old Mu is the only uniting force between a lot of Muan protectorates and unless they slither up from the waves to deliver a directive I can't imagine New Mu having a very unified strategy.
I do notice a few parallels between the US fighting the more nomadic sorts of Mu and the US fighting the plains wars, I think that might be something to work with (Little Bighorn style battle but with dinosaurs is a really cool image)
>>
>>94219926
>How does that make sense? How would that result in anything but a lengthy colonial war between the USA and New Mu?
Projection causes fuckery, of course, but New Mu on the 4th alone would be about the size of Eastern Europe + Russia, if not Eurasia. It is the most populous Deep nation, by far, and the one with the strongest backing (Old Mu). Early enough the US would simply not have the logistics to prosecute a war against them. Late enough they would realize that it would be too costly when New Mu can be reasoned with.
New Mu itself probably had no clue how much of a threat the US could be if they did establish proper influence.
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I wonder what Cecil Rhodes is doing in this timeline. Think he's still fucking around in Africa or he's gone off the deep end in Agartha?
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>>94221851
>>94221825
The thing is, if the NY attack was anything beyond a couple drunken saur riders thrashing some streets, the entire nation would surely be asking for blood. The yellow press would push article after article to force public opinion into war, in a similar way they did in real timeline's Spanish-American war. Only in this case, they would not be pushing for war against a dying empire to push the Monroe Doctrine and get some colonies, they would be pushing for rightful selfdefense against the evil-barbaric empire of the deep. An excuse such as "it was just one city-state" would not suffice to calm the population, especially on an USA growing more weary of agarthan stuff by the day.

I imagine many politicians would want to push for war while the generals and those more versed in agarthan affairs would be having an aneurism just thinking about the logistics and diplomatic implications of it all.

I imagine that, at the very least, the USA would be having backdoor conversations with the british and the french, to see what exactly they'd be dealing with here.
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>>94223293
>>
Let me know when you are ready for the game, everything is set up on my side.
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>>94223432
Probably close to 8. Sorry.
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>>94223570
No issue at all!
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>Mu misjudges the size/power of the US, thinks they're just some surface backwater to be raided at leisure
>Mu misjudges the political unity of the US, thinks that other states won't jump to defend their rival New York as quickly as they would
>Mu misjudges where they are, meant to raid some other city underground but took a wrong left turn and wound up in New York before they realized what was going on
>Mu forgets to pay someone, an army goes rogue, one thing leads to another and New York is sacked
>Saur Orders discover a new transitory point between layers, decide to launch a raid through it before anyone with authority can figure out whether or not they're allowed to
>Old Mu deliberately arranged to involve America in the politics of the underworld for some reason, tricked New Mu into attacking them to trigger a retaliatory invasion
One or all of these may be true, or perhaps none, who can say for sure?
>>
>>94219926
I'll be dead honest. It doesn't really. It was a random idea someone had. That's it.
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>>94223586
>Mu misjudges the political unity of the US
Makes me wonder if their first contact was with some Kentuckians.
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>>94223586
>>Old Mu deliberately arranged to involve America in the politics of the underworld for some reason, tricked New Mu into attacking them to trigger a retaliatory invasion
This is the only way that attack works really. If it's about Old Mu playing 4D chess to end the game itself, you can justify all sorts of wacky shenanigans. Every other explanation boils down to Mu (both New and Old) being retarded.
>>
>>94223586
> Tallymen realizes they'll be short come tax season this year.
>>94223622
There's a lot of that, but I find the idea of dinoriding knights rampaging through New York too comfy to pass on.
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>>94223743
>Every other explanation boils down to Mu (both New and Old) being retarded.
Armies doing completely fucking braindead shit is more likely than you might think, especially in an era before instant communication.
>>
>>94223779
Is that the one where half of the army went to get drunk at a gypsies camp, then the other half proceeded to attack said camp?
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>>94223779
That may be so, but the implication here is that any random group of raiders can just pop up wherever they fucking want on the Surface because they had nothing to do underground or just took a wrong turn. That's just dumb and also reinforces the idea that people can just enter/exit Agartha at any point of the map willy-nilly which, if applied consistently, will break the setting completely (consider how much of setting's politics revolve around entrance control). It had to be coordinated on a very high level, likely impossible without some Old Mu sorcerous fuckery and thus couldn't have passed their notice. At that point we're presented with a clear cut choice:
>The eldritch abominations plotting to end reality from the shadows are retarded beyond comprehension
>The eldritch abominations plotting to end reality from the shadows planned all of it
Which makes more sense?
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>>94223839
Depending on the size of the raid you'd only need a few Imaterii and a good lung capacity to get boys upstairs. But I don't think anyone except Old Mu can hand them out so that really just reinforces the point.
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>>94223839
>It had to be coordinated on a very high level, likely impossible without some Old Mu sorcerous fuckery and thus couldn't have passed their notice. At that point we're presented with a clear cut choice:
Step 1 : Get a New Mu Priestess in your Saur Knight Expedition
Step 2 : Cast Boneless Body on the Saur Knights, granting them Tight Squeeze
Step 3 : Find a crack, any crack.
Step 4 : Profit!
(sorry for the glib answer it just seemed too easy).
>>
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Maybe a rogue faction of Saur Knights was used as both a scapegoat for the plot to get America underground as well as to manufacture an excuse to destroy that Saur Order? New Mu assists the Americans in hunting down these "treasonous" knights (actually operating on orders from Old Mu) and concessions are offered in order to smooth things over (as well as to entice the Americans to search for further artifacts underground).
The real question is why would Mu want America to explore Agartha, I wonder?
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>>94223581
Ready!
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>>94223925
Yeah, I was thinking the same thing:
>Oh, that whole business? They were acting on their own. Rest assured everyone involved is paying for their crimes in ways we are unable to convey through mere speech. Except for one - we have made this gold encrusted cup from his skull. Please accept it as a token of our apology. You are always welcome in Abaskun if you are interested in more of such quality Mu goods!
>>
>>94223690
Kek was thinking the same thing. Maybe some Kentuckians were telling tall tails about the war.
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>>94223925
>The real question is why would Mu want America to explore Agartha, I wonder?
Part of the Loop theory. Mu (apart from the Khan and the Mother, who have a secret deal with the Star Ancestor), Shadows are born from the INNER SVN and represent the degenerative forces that transform Humanity as it descend into Agartha?
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>>94223956
https://www.owlbear.rodeo/room/r54k2tjh5byl/ThePriorPull
On discord right now.
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>>94223964
I don't like the idea of confining the Star Ancestor shit to only those two and linking Old Mu to the INNER SVN in non-antagonistic ways. It messes up the theme without any payoff that I can see. It would be better for all Old Mu to be unreality pilled, trying to spread their influence and break the cycle. It could be that by actively encouraging people to descend into Agartha they are accelerating and destabilizing the Loop somehow or it could be that they are doing the opposite of Lemurians and are trying to enforce outcomes that mess with fate (they may, in fact, be failing terribly)?
As for Shadows, considering their link with Malcolm and some lore about their connection that I hazily recall, I though that maybe they could be remnants of some other Loop, clinging to reality out of spite? They are in a state similar to what Old Mu are trying to achieve through their practice of self-reduction, but the difference is that while Mu are trying to "shed" reality from themselves, the Shadows hold on to it. They are no longer "people" or "beings", but just echoes of a world destroyed, blindly fighting the lost cause against a world that exists without them. But Malcolm's own lost cause and despair resonates with them on some deeper level.
>>
Instead of sitting on this idea for one million years while I procrastinate TBFTBOTT, here is my proposal for the 8th Layer.
>It goes by many names, across the many tongues spoken in Agartha. Perditio. Barbaad. The Great Wastes. The Land of Countless Dead. Davy Jones' Locker. Hades. Hell. Niflheim.
>None stick, but it collects them all the same.
>Truly, the Eighth Layer is where the dregs of Agartha collect. They pool there, in the drain of the great sink that is the world.
>Ruins from countless civilizations, countless cycles. Everything that never was winds up in the Eigth.
>The place is a quagmire of half-sunk ruins flooded with filthy, stagnant water. Travel by boat is nearly impossible, too much rubble threatening the hulls of even the shallowest vessels. Travel by foot is beyond harrowing, for you would be lucky to find somewhere only waist high to cross.
>Mu disdains the Eighth, and yet, Mu is obsessed with it. It represents something primal and terrifying within their cosmology. It is both the goal of their omnicidal ambitions and a grim reminder of what will happen if they fail.
>There are so many Morlocks, and they are wilder and bolder than their kin in upper layers. The black water sickens lesser Morlocks, and their cousins on the Eighth are quick to devour the weak.
>Husks are surprisingly rare. Bodies are common. They wear all manner of dress, from civilizations past and present and future. Some claim to have found their own corpses down there, but these claims are of dubious merit.
>Shapes in the Shadows are perhaps born here, or merely dwell here in far greater numbers than elsewhere. Oneirophobia is common.
>Sleep is fitful and brings nightmares.
>Clean water is incredibly hard to come by, and boiling the waters of the Eighth only attracts Morlocks to the light.
>The INNER SVN is completely absent. It cannot be seen from any point on the Eighth layer.
>The Palace of Shadows resides here. A sprawling ruin of impossible size.
>>
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>>94224253
>The Palace of Shadows is a landscape unto itself. One of the only mostly dry places in the entire Layer.
>It is a truly massive structure. Ruined fountains that could pass for small lakes. Gardens that seem as entire jungles. Towers that stretch into the sky as if they were the very Pillars of the Layer itself.
>Shapes in the Shadows infest the place, but it was not always so. Only after the King ascended to his throne did they arrive in such numbers.
>It is seemingly of Old Lemurian construction, but the materials are unlike those used in other ruins of that era. And, of course, it is far from Lemuria.
>Lost Men trade volleys with La Ombre for control of hallways and courtyards. In between exchanges, Morlocks raid both sides. Warlocks from all parts of the Deep bring their dark sorceries to bear, competing for a piece of the puzzle.
>Lost Men have the most control over the structure, but that says little. They have a number of fortified positions within the Palace, in which they conspire with Fateless mystics to study the ruins.
>Malcolm occasionally returns here, when his presence is not demanded elsewhere. The Shadows part for him like loyal retainers. Secrets are revealed to him which he does not share.
>Lady Jayanyati rarely visits. The place sets her nerves ablaze. She theorizes that some alternative method of Cultivation, opposite to her own in some way, played a vital role in its construction.
>Bleg thinks that she thinks that Malcolm still hasn't forgiven her. Many of the men agree, though few would voice it openly. The Lost Seer has done much to earn the loyalty of the men, and those who speak ill of her often draw the Lost King's ire.
>It is considered both the single most important posting for the Lost Men and the single worst. It is a great honor to be sent. It is a cruel punishment.
>Napoleon visited once, before Malcolm's arrival. When asked why he did not claim its power, he said it was ill suited for him, and he has other ambitions.
>>
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>>94224324
Not mentioned: Akhmnandag, Smentycist Plulophs. But we can assume they're there somewhere.
I tried to fit all of this in somewhere, but I don't want to write too many posts at a time.
The Palace could be an interesting place for people to have fights, as the place is too damn big for any one faction to actually control. A far ranging expedition could encounter another, especially if multiple parties are interested in surveilling the Lost Men.
It is NOT meant to be the Lost Men's primary fortress, they've got places elsewhere that they organize. The Palace itself is important to them, though, and full of weird artifacts and ancient magic besides.
As for why La Ombre is duking it out with the Lost Men for it? Maybe Malcolm missed poker night or something, and Napoleon is upset. Or maybe he has plans within plans, as usual.
>>
>>94224420
Yeah, I know we've memed about the Auldest Alliance etc, but IIRC Malcolm's motivation for attacking people in Agartha was described as him trying to stop them from unearthing something that will cause the Deluge (or simply completing the Loop). Meanwhile Napoleon is just marching down there and trying to mess around with some reality warping powers beyond his comprehension. Their interests, even if both are enemies of Hyperborea, should be opposed. I feel like a lot of people have defaulted to looking at Napoleon as some kind of protagonist of the "metaplot" who is destined to save everyone, but I feel like it's a bad approach. If he is 100% right, if there are no downsides to Napoleon's plans it removes a lot of tension from the central conflict of the setting.
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>>94224702
> beyond [Napoleon's] comprehension
> MFW
I see Malcolmites and Bonapartistes having very little reason to oppose each other. Before even getting to the metaplot their aims and methods are pretty different, La Ombre is closer to a crime syndicate than a guerilla force. In regards to the metaplot both are more or less working against the Loop's completion. According to the OG lore and the early threads discussions, they did have a rivalry, but it was specifically between Napy and Malcolm, and they eventually "resolved" it in a 3-way fight between them and Cromwell, choosing to gang up on Cromwell, which is when he got eaten by the Memory Engine.
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>>94223586
>>94223925
You know, it might not be Mu behind the attack at all...

>>94224127
>trying to spread their influence and break the cycle.
My personal view is that Old Mu isn't trying to break the cycle at all, there's only one man insane enough to pull that off. Old Mu is comfortable where they are, they're entropic but not necessarily inclined to pure chaos. They've accumulated so much power they know nobody can mess with them so they barely use a fraction of it in the day to day. Take the story about the Titking vs Khan, titking barely escaped with his life while the Khan had the best exercise he's had in years. If he really wanted to he could steamroll Atlan in a week but where's the fun in that?
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>>94224253
I've always thought that the 8th is an eerily empty layer, very idyllic except the total absence of all life beyond a few extremely isolated locations. It would be paradise, a new Eden even, just... nobody goes there. There's just the Alph, lazily snaking towards the Ninth.

Though, the two concepts need not necessarily clash. The Palace of Shadows and the Eighth as you've described it could just be separate locations, I do really like the idea of a piling up of detritus and ruins. Or perhaps a mini-layer between the 8th and 9th?

>>94224702
My understanding is that Napoleon is either going to save everyone or doom them. His ambition knows no limit, and whether or not that'll lead to his fall or triumph remains to be seen. The loop itself is something that will always result in the return of civilisation, in some form or another, but to break that loop...
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I’ve rather fallen off the wagon in regards to Agartha so I figured I would step back in with some quick lore ideas.

>Splendid Isolation, the Grimsvotn Guards, and Bethlem Royal Hospital
America has the Mammoth Caves, and France has Paris. These entrances are centrally located and easy to access. Britain has not been so fortunate. Doggerland remains both infested and contested, while Iceland has proven very expensive to develop. From an outside perspective this is undeniably a problem, something which sets the empire on the back foot compared to its rivals.
The government of Britain holds a different opinion entirely. For all the boons Agartha can bring tenfold curses are just as likely. New vices, virulent diseases, infestations of otherworldly beasts and even enigmatic infiltrators flow upwards from entrances as colonists head below. It is not known as “Fortress Iceland” only because of who it keeps out, but also what it keeps in. This is the duty of the Grimsvotn Guards.
Each ship coming up through the canals is inspected thoroughly when it enters the locks and when it leaves. The official line is that no ship has failed the second inspection due to the diligence of the guard, but the rumours have it that the guard never turns a ship back after failing the second inspection. They simply merely mark the vessel in their logbooks and dispatch a gunboat to deal with the problem, leaving the ship laden with hidden explosives and sabotaged engines to make doubly sure. As to why they might take such a dramatic approach, speculation suggests they do it just to save time and prevent shipping holdups.
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>>94225427
The so-called “Silent Blockade” has ensured Britain is one of the last places where a veil of normalcy can reign. The only Morlock population on the island exists in the London Zoo, the only Deep Tribals allowed to walk free are those entirely free of abnormality, and the only official place where Agarthan Artefacts can be stored or studied is the Royal Society itself. Grimsvotn detachments ostensibly rotated for recuperation or training help enforce this state of affairs, but always with brutal discretion.
Off the record, any record, is where smuggled artefacts and Agarthans are sent. Bethlem Royal Hospital had been improving its reputation when Paris was rediscovered, but in the chaos of the following years it was shuttered and condemned. The inside was gutted, the facade reinforced with steel and brickwork. The inside is now half prison and half laboratory. Some of the inmates are treated humanely enough, ironically often the less-human inhabitants. But former subjects of the empire who turned to smuggling or worse then face experimentations nigh-unspeakable. Parliament is only vaguely aware of the situation, and even Lord Cunningham has never paid a personal visit. Directives are delivered through the telegraph in code, reports returned likewise. Exactly who runs the hospital now is so classified it remains a distinct possibility that not a single person knows. Perhaps no person at all has run it in a very long time indeed.

>Tl;Dr: British bureaucracy and secrecy may or may not have become a self-sustaining feedback loop run by mindless computing engines somewhere in Essex. At least that's what Barry down at the pub told me.
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>>94225042
>I see Malcolmites and Bonapartistes having very little reason to oppose each other.
Well what if Malcolm and/or Jaya see something sinister about Napoleon's plan? Something he may not know/wish to know?
Or what if he isn't running a charity and expects to not only save the world but to rule it?
Come one, are you all really buying that his Satan/Antichrist-coded 9th Circle of Hell ass only has everyone's best interests at heart? Nah.
>>94225217
>My personal view is that Old Mu isn't trying to break the cycle at all, there's only one man insane enough to pull that off.
My personal view is that it does Old Mu a disservice. Like the unreality shit was what little they had, really. Without that they are just kooky Lovecraft parodies squatting down there, in the dark. There is, however, an obvious difference between breaking the cycle (Napoleon, absolute madman shit) and breaking everything, including the cycle (Old Mu, pretty mundane in comparison).
>If he really wanted to he could steamroll Atlan in a week but where's the fun in that?
Yeah, exactly where's the fun in that? Why deliberately remove stakes and conflict from this? I genuinely don't understand.
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In the meantime, here's Przewalski:

>Nikolai Przewalski
Cost : 30 Silver
Leader, Character, Soldier, Diplomat
Leadership : 5
AP : 2
Discipline : 6
Movement : 3
Evasion : 7
Accuracy : 7
Labour : 5
Strength : 5
Awareness : 7

>Armour:
0 everywhere

>Health:
1 Limbs
2 Body
1 Head

>General Abilities:
-Rifle training
-Pistol training
-Cook

>Special Abilities:
- Inspired Hunter:
All of this model’s Attacks gain Deadly against Beasts.
- Well-Traveled:
At the beginning of the skirmish pick one of the following bonuses:
- Well-Traveled: Far East: all Soldier and Specialist models gain Terrain Affinity (Forest, Woods, Shrub) and Woodsman
- Well-Traveled: Central Asia: all Soldier and Specialist models gain Terrain Affinity (Sand, Dune, Badlands) and Dune Warrior
- Well-Traveled: Tibet: all Soldier and Specialist models gain Terrain Affinity (Hills, Moss Hills, Broken Hills), may equip Climbing gear and gain +1 on Climbing tests
- One with the Land (2 LP 1 AP):
Until the end of the turn, all Soldier and Specialist models within 5 of this model gain Camouflage for the terrain types chosen for Well-Traveled.
- Overwatch Order (1 LP 1 AP)
Pick up to 3 models within 5 of this one. Until the end of the turn, as long as these models do not Move, Charge or become Engaged, when an enemy model enters their weapon Range or Activates within it, they may immediately use AP to resolve Ranged attacks against it. Resolve these attacks at +1 Accuracy, without applying the Long Range malus.
- Parley “Tough Negotiator” (1 AP):
Target an enemy Leader, Hero, Character, Noble or Aristocrat model within LoS. The side that loses the Face-to-Face Awareness Roll gains 1 Dread.

>Loadout:
Berdan II rifle, Dagger
>Opt. Equipment
S&W Model 3, Bayonet, Horse, Lantern, Torch, Rations, Medkits, Alcohol, Cl. Gear
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>Commentary
So Nick here is mostly known for his trailblazing expeditions in Asia, I figured it would make sense to base his playstyle around Terrain. I used Affinity even for Terrain types that aren't Difficult (I think) but it's just for the purposes of the One with the Land rule.
The idea for him is to have your guys hold positions in advantageous terrain and harass the enemy with overwatches while Przewalski himself tries to Dread bomb the enemy into leaving with Parleys, which I think is a good enough representation of the more tense moments in his expeditions.
Hide would make sense on him too, but I didn't want to overdesign the profile.
Inspired Hunter is just Professional Hunter from Big Game Hunter but a bit better.
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>>94225657
He would also absolutely qualify as an Academic, but again, didn't want to stick too much shit on him.
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>Malcolm
Wants to prevent the cycle from entering its next stage and, failing that, fight Hyperborea to the bitter end to prevent the extinction of mankind.
>Napoleon
Wants to free humanity from the cycles, ideally before the Deluge happens, but will switch focus to fighting Hyperborea once the Deluge does occur. Can’t free mankind if there’s no mankind to free.
>Cromwell
Wants to usher in the Deluge and, ideally, wipe Ireland from the face of the planet.
>Khan
Wants to plunge the whole of reality into the unreality that he and the Star Ancestors come from. Doesn’t want the Deluge to occur because fighting Hyperborea will take resources away from this plan.
>Mu at large
Mostly unaware of Khan’s plans, but would probably support them regardless. Upper echelons probably believe that they will
get turned into Star Ancestors once reality is undone, or something.
>Brain Manifold
Tool of impossible calculations used by Hyperborea for a whole bunch of purposes. Seems to be plotting its own destruction and Hyperborea’s downfall. Was once a man!
>Gustave Eiffel
Keeps building anomalous shit, just because he can. May be responsible for the Cycle, Hyperborea, and the structure of the Layers as a whole. Maybe not!
>Rakkad
Literally just wants to be left alone with his fractured mind. Plausibly has an alternative personality somewhere that wants to support any of the above.

That’s the gist I got. Did I miss anybody important?
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>>94227006
>Eiffel
>May be responsible for the Cycle, Hyperborea, and the structure of the Layers as a whole.
I wish I could just laugh this off as an obvious joke, but I can't be sure some people won't actually try to run with it at this point. So let me say it plainly, just in case: this is a very, very, very, very, very, very, very bad idea. This is worse than cancer. This is like if cancer had AIDS. I would more readily accept time travelling Nazis than this.
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>>94227335
Fair enough. The anomalous buildings okay?
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>>94227006
>Rakkad
Since he's a direct analogue to his book counterpart he also wants freedom from tyranny for all men, morlocks, and whales. It's the only consistent thing between his states, though he has less power projection to accomplish it compared with others on the list.
It's also less of a split personality thing and more like there are 5 different individuals called Rakkad but only one exists at any given time. They might even look drastically different. It's weird.
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>>94227394
Well yeah, I'm pretty sure we bent at least some laws of physics with the Tower, so we might as well say it was intentional.
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>>94225217
What would Napoleon get out of America going underground?
>>94224127
Mu seems to have some connection with water, and are the only faction with real presence on every layer. Maybe they believe they can weather the Deluge? Like a sort of inverse Hyperborea, they are trying to profit off the loop, but in gold instead of in pain. Maybe they believe the Star Ancestor will save them, for a price.
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>>94227969
>What would Napoleon get out of America going underground?
Maybe he believes that if the American Giant is wakened to the threats above and below, they will be of use during the Deluge to come.
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>>94228196
America is the most experienced of the Colonials at dealing with Hyperborean bullshit.

Also did we ever nail down what happened with Halifax? The info is hidden in some archived thread but I don't know which one. I remember something about Fenian husks.
>>
Theory: Lore discrepancies are caused by Time-Stranded Contractors. They’re all from different timelines, and some of those have wildly different histories. Some of them don’t even have Agartha! It usually takes a while for people to suss out whether or not the information a given TSC has is of any real value, which is plenty of time to spread misinformation around a campfire.
>>
What if we push the attack on New York down the timeline, and/or change it from an attack on New York to somewhere that has an entrance near by? There is a lot going on in America, and little of it fits together well.
Paraguay should be looked at more skeptically too, i think, scale-wise particularly. New Alamo/Jefferson should probably happen after the Civil War, in tandem with the Alaska purchase (which is justified with the possibility of having entrances).
If Mu is to be involved with America, wouldn't the natural thing for them be to try and subjugate the natives?
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>>94229081
I'm fond of the "This is a wargame from the 80s with an already schizophrenic lore which has been iterated on in 4.5 editions of varying quality" excuse myself.
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>>94228659
Deepest of lore (being the intent of the author, me being the one that came up with the whole Halifax Entrance explosion thing) :
La Ombre did it.
It incepted the idea of going through the 3rd Layer in the Fenian's leadership, then leaked the info to the Brits, caused misinformation on both sides to escalate the conflict at the border, then built the Hyperborean Nuke and detonated it.
In part to get Brits more worried about Hyperborea, to get Americans (who are already worried enough about the Heavens) to look Underground as well, and to simply fuck with Perfidious Albion in general...
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>>94229720
>Britain has three different underground factions devoted to pushing their shit in specifically, no questions asked (Lost Men, La Ombre, Lemuria)
No wonder Cunningham wants to purge the place.

Do you have a timeline of the events? I had an idea to write for about the latter portions following the explosion itself but I would like to know how it all went down for context.
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>>94227006
>Wants to prevent the cycle from entering its next stage and, failing that, fight Hyperborea to the bitter end to prevent the extinction of mankind.
In my mind Malcolm's understanding of Hyperborea is much younger and he was always mostly aiming at getting freedom for his people.
The whole "fighting the Deluge" thing should probably be framed as a complete act of foolish desperation. Maybe there's a way to stop the Deluge, maybe not, but to ego-driven individuals like Napoleon, they'd straight up refuse this impossibility. And it can't possibly hurt to be as prepared and to offer as much resistance as possible. Especially for Napoleon, who believes he has a way, buying time is the primary concern. Getting America underground while simultaneously keeping them prepping up for the initial onslaught could be a "Layered Defense" strategy where he plans on prolonging the fight as much as possible in case reaching beyond the 9th ever took more time than he planned.
I personally never thought Humanity stood any form of chance vs the Deluge, beyond either Napoleon being right, or some individuals find some weird way to escape it, and these are stories which by form are not that satisfying to see play out, they are much more interesting to leave as open ended points. Which is why I think the Deluge itself should not be fleshed out too much beyond its start. There's already the Great War which we could stretch a while as a point when things start visibly going to shit and hyperborean raids become more common.
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>>94229755
>Do you have a timeline of the events? I had an idea to write for about the latter portions following the explosion itself but I would like to know how it all went down for context.
I took out the mentions of most US events from the latest timeline (Paraguay, PACT foundation, Halifax) because it seemed like we were going to retouch a lot of those eventually. When the [current moment] was ~1774, it was set to be something that was one of the latest events to take place, with US and Brits now awkwardly moving toward a Detente, so the 3rd Fenian raid was supposed to be ~1774, but if you want to flesh this out, do not feel too restrained by that. I like that the 3 main Colonials are closer to being friends than foes, and that there is cooperation at the same time as competition, so I really like that we've move the timeline further and this leaves time for the US, Canada and Brits to simmer down... The important elements (to me anyways) are that it comes after PACT, because pressuring Canada independently from the Brits is in large part what launched the whole thing, the Mammoth Entrance plot and that it got leaked to the Brits who sent in an advance force, Pr Mollman's (sp?) meek personality allowed both the 3rd Fenian raid to happen by not wanting to involve himself and charge the Fenians after the 2nd raid (as it happened in rl) and helped solve the situation because he really didn't want a war so he did everything in his power to defuse it and not fall to Grant's rhetoric. I also thought mentioning how Prediction Engines had helped the Brits mirror every maneuver from the US could explain how the Americans were a lot more hesitant to engage on the front lines themselves.
Its a lot, but that one's been swimming in my head for a while. I'm far from the most knowledgeable on American history so that was my only contribution to the American lore, its probably not that great, feel free to suggest any changes.
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>>94227969
Well yes, they do believe SA will save them, in a way. They want to collapse reality into the primordial chaos/void beyond time and space, because they believe it's actually some kind of higher state of (non-)existence. Or at least to ascend/escape there somehow. That's how they avoid the Deluge or anything else about the world they find disagreeable. That's their answer to The Loop. "You are walking in circles, stumbling in the dark, when the dark was the answer all along" - Mother. The price is probably everyone/everything else.
And I'm not just spitting headcanon here. That's what has been pretty consistently written for them, by several people too, and for a long time. I don't understand why some have such a hard time with it or choose to ignore it in favor of... I don't even know what, frankly. They're just chilling? They want gold? Come on now.
>>94229172
>Paraguay should be looked at more skeptically too, i think, scale-wise particularly
To what extent? Assuming you want to keep the American intervention and the PACT you'd still want it as a big enough deal. Otherwise you might as well retcon all of it.
>>
I know campaign mode is still in dev, but I had an idea for how to work sponsors in casual play too. Mind if I give it a go? Essentially it would be:
>Take the Eccentric Investor unit
>Remove any actual unit
>Change what causes you to lose/gain extra silver and also how much
So it would essentially be like taking the Neptunium Baron or Eccentric Investor or Big Game Hunter or Whalur Captain or any of the other units that give you a side objective except you don't actually take an extra unit, you just get a side objective and maybe some other sort of special equipment/action or just a little extra silver.
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>>94230192
I didn't mean that as a replacement for anything, just an addition. May fault for not posting something like this the first time. I like the image of underground cities of gold, and taxes seem to have become part of Mu's identity. It's odd to me that Mu would expand so much and collect so much wealth if they are dead set on killing everyone and thing. Why bother? What do they need it all for? Why is a people so focused on death and nothingness also the most populous and wide spread? The answer i'm thinking, is that they need to 'feed' the Star Ancestor gold, or they need a certain amount of gold, before he can really do some work. It doesn't have to be gold, but gold has sun and star associations, and cities of gold are kino.
Undoing everything is a nice goal and all, but it's rather abstract and therefor rather hard to see how any of what Old Mu is doing is working towards it. Having something as solid as gold represent progress toward that goal allows us to better imagine what Mu would do in a given situation, and to convey the threat that they are in a more impressive way. It also neatly explains the existence of New Mu and why it works the way it does. Perhaps they have some way to use dead bodies to turn silver and/or other metals into gold.
The idea what the Star Ancestor is that the Khan doesn't feel rushed to get everything done before the Deluge, because, he thinks, worst come to worst he and his gold can stop existing for an eon or two while everything sorts it's self out, then pick back up more or less where he left off. Maybe he has told a good portion of Old Mu the same is true for them. What i'm looking for is an explanation for Mu's seeming lack of urgency with an approaching Deluge. Just an idea i threw out, so feel free to do the same.
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>>94225627
I really like this one.
>Overwatch Order
Why did i make it so damned complicated when doing that for Spring Gunners?
>>94229913
Agree about the Deluge. I like the idea that, at least for now, we don't develop things past the Boxer Rebellion.
>keeping them prepping up for the initial onslaught could be a "Layered Defense" strategy where he plans on prolonging the fight as much as possible in case reaching beyond the 9th ever took more time than he planned.
Maybe, in addition to that reason, there was something in Halifax he didn't want people to find. Maybe something to do with his escape? Whatever it is wouldn't be stated explicitly, ofcourse. Just an idea.
>>94230987
>To what extent?
I don't know. I just thought it was something worth bringing up, given the topic at hand. Maybe it's fine.

Thoughts on moving the Mu attack down the time line? There could be a hurricane instead in or about 1876, so all the Morlock stuff is fine. Mu could still have conflict with the U.S early on but on the 4th or 3rd instead. Could change the attack on New York to an attack some some place less important in New England before the Halifax disaster, which leads to the discovery of the Halifax entrance in the first place. Just spit balling.
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Tell me about the Mosque of the Red Death.
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>>94231835
What if they are going use all the bodies, gold, silver and probably orichalcum too, as well as a bunch of other obscure materials to ritualistically craft some kind of giant artificial "heart", that they could then use to "capture" a part of the INNER SVN's essence? They could then destroy it, "killing" the SVN through sympathetic magic, or simply manipulate it somehow and loosen the bonds of reality until it pops?
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>>94231977
Geological formation found by the husked Ottomans on the 4th. Plans for a building involving the site are in the works but nothing final, certainly no construction has started. Many husked Ottomans travel to see it, and as a result a town has sprung up around it. That's all i got for now.
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>>94230987
Whoops nevermind it turns out they already exist in a battle-form in the America book. Good thing I checked. I do hope to get some for other factions up still but it's nice to have a thing to work off of.
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>>94227969
>What would Napoleon get out of America going underground?
The Mu vs Atlan war seems to be at a stalemate, if a new player enters and tips it in Atlans favour Old Mu might have to intervene, or be sufficiently distracted to pay attention to someone moving things between the layers. Or something else entirely.

>>94229179
It was all downhill from 2e. The Atlan Atlantis split should have never happened.

>I took out the mentions of most US events from the latest timeline
I don't know about that. At least in regards to Paraguay and the PACT, there's not much wriggle room with the civil war and it being affected by any changed timeline. Remember the fall of Paris is when everything really starts kicking off, and the Paraguay war ends about a decade after the fact in 1870.

>>94230192
In regards to Mu, I feel like it's too much to have them planning a vast apocalyptic collapse of reality at the same time as the other one. They think they're beyond the loop is my understanding.

>>94231892
I'm happy changing the date of the Mu attack on New York.

>>94232026
I like that idea. They're building a gigantic chamber to contain the INNER SVN, perhaps to even power something...
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>THE DELUGE
There is one truth, evident to all. War is coming. Skirmishes between the great powers above and below continue to happen daily. British trade shots with French over the rights to a cache of mummy tongues. Atlan and Mu test each other constantly over ever shifting borders. Libertalian pirates do battle with brave Atlantean sailors.
War is coming. And worse.
The Deluge is something spoken of in whispers. Something only those initiated into ancient mysteries dare to speak of. It goes by many names, but the crux is the same. War is coming.
The Paraguay Incident was a prelude to it. The growing unrest in China is its herald. The next age is coming, emanating back through history from some impossible future.
The Deluge will be a period of great upheaval. Of revelation and betrayal and sacrifice. Entire nations will be scoured from the world before it is through. Brave men will fight and die. Cowards will hide and die. Innocents will pray for salvation, and they will die.
Suffering untold. War is coming.
The Cycle continues, as it always does. The rainbow specters of Hyperborea shall descend from the heavens to avenge themselves upon mankind. The Bleaching shall be repaid tenfold. The forces of Old Mu shall make their play, and unimaginable torment awaits those who resist. La Ombra and the Lost Men and Cunningham and all the others will throw their hats in the ring.
Blood will be spilled. The fate of reality itself hangs in the balance. The odds are against us.
War is coming.
It will pour down from above. It will seep up from below.
War is coming.
And it will be a Deluge.
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>>94232700
>They think they're beyond the loop is my understanding.
At the very least many of the Royals are beings that survives throughout multiple Cycles, the Khan and Mother being immortal.
>>94231892
I'm fine with putting it down the timeline, although I feel the issues of it being foolish are exasperated the more time Mu and Americans would have had to have contact with each other, but perhaps then the Raid is retaliation by Mu for some event and then its a lot less random...?
I'm also fine with the Morlocks stuff. The only thing is I would rather keep it aimed at New York, in large part because of how pulpy and comfy it feels. For me, the aesthetic of the event justifies trying to hammer it in, even if you have to say that it was stupid
Also, picrel for Uberman? I think otherwise the other inspiration was Hellraiser looking dudes? Scorpius lookalikes?
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>Caesar cast the die when he defied the Senate, and won an empire. There have been others who have defied their peers and seized the world. But I? I dare grasp what no man has won, I gamble with Fate itself!
>>
We still good, Atlan anon?
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>>94234876
Seems like there is a delay, I'll be running to do some errands, I'll be back in about 30 minutes if you are available then.
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>>94233075
kek.
>>94235106
Oh shit it's in the morning. Yes i'll be ready when you get back. Sorry.
>>94232026
I don't exactly love the idea. For starts it is elaboration past the point of inherit benefit, so it's naturally being held to a higher standard in my mind. It seems to circumvent the Star Ancestor, or at least makes his involvement less direct. Secondly, it is too explicate, i think, regarding the INNER SVN's nature.
>>94232700
>I feel like it's too much to have them planning a vast apocalyptic collapse of reality at the same time as the other one. They think they're beyond the loop is my understanding.
We can have it both ways with this one. If they think they are beyond the loop, then they have time to plan and enact their apocalypse. The point is they aren't worried about The Deluge, as they think it isn't their problem, and they aren't pushing harder because they think they have all the time in the world. The key is they think they have all the time in the world to enact their plan, so their apocalypse isn't imminent.
>>94232700
>new player enters and tips it in Atlans favour Old Mu might have to intervene
I can see that.
>>94233049
Pic is good for Ubermen.
>American timeline
I need to think about it more and reread some lore. Now i'm thinking we could move the Mu attack to before Halifax, and have it be on someplace or places closer to Nova Scotia and less important. That could be what leads to the discovery of the Halifax entrance.
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>>94235265
>Oh shit it's in the morning. Yes i'll be ready when you get back. Sorry.
Just got back. We could push it back to the evening honestly that would fit better for me, but its not much of an issue if you cant.
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>>94235398
Let's do that then. 7-ish again?
>>
Ok, so I've been thinking about the New Mu attack on New York. A couple of questions we need to solve:

1. When did it happen?
Easy one first, but what year was the attack? Depending on the date, and knowing the setting’s latest date right now is 1883, we’ll need to take some things into account.

2. How did New Mu and/or the Saur Riders the target?
By the second half of the 19th century, New York must be one of the fastest, if not the fastest-growing city in the entire world, backed by the biggest power in the American continent. There is no way they chose it deliberately knowing all this. Someone, somewhere, at some point, fucked up. The question is how and if it was a deliberate fuckup.

3. How big was the attack?
I’m going to assume it’s something between a couple of streets crashed (the damage equivalent a drunken saur rider group having a party) and the damaged suffered by NY during the 1835 Great Fire (between 500-700 buildings razed to the ground). Anything below that is not enough to cause great historical impact, and anything more than that would cause the United States to fully gear towards war (and maybe even try to get other epigean powers to join in to divide New Mu between them all). However big the attack was, it caused enough impact to send shockwaves into american society and get the morlocks to reveal themselves, but not go beyond a punitive expedition (which is, realistically, all they can do until logistics become faster and safer).
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>>94235405
Yes that works perfectly for me. Thank you!
Also, to the anon who tried coming into the room, I have no issue with having spectators in the future but this one I want to be extra careful with it because if the room crashes and I somehow lost the whole thing, redoing it from scratch... well fuuuuuck that.
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>>94235446
4. What was destroyed in the attack?
I imagine the attack would center around some of the poorer coastal areas and spread from there. Maybe many civilian vessels were destroyed as well (no military vessel, though, an attack on the US navy would cause the nation to fully gear towards war). Reconstruction of the city would probably include morlock volunteers, which would gain them both recognition by US society and sympathies due to their shared Mu enmity.

5. How did the United States react?
The reaction of the population is clear. The yellow press would push hard against something like this, campaign after campaign demanding the US to declare war on New Mu to “civilize the barbarians underground”. A good chunk of politicians would jump on the bandwagon, so tensions would be high in Washington. On the other hand, the military and the few diplomats and politicians who truly knew what Agartha and New Mu is would be having a horrible time trying to either calm the tide or to plan the seemingly inevitable conflict. Logistics would depend on when the attack had place, but either way, a US invasion of New Mu is not feasible. I imagine a retaliatory strike would be the most viable answer, but then we’d have to explain why the war is not continuing further.

6. How did New Mu authorities react?
Once they learned the saur knights attacked not a random target, but one of the most important cities in Epigea, they must have imagined war with the surface dwellers was a possibility. Would they want war, or would they want to avoid it? Would they sell out the saur riders who did this? How would inner New Mu politics react to this? Would they even know what they attacked? Also, would Old Mu know about it, and how would they react?
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>>94235461
7. How did other epigean powers react?
How did the british, the french, the stardom, the germans, the austro-hungarians… react to this? I imagine the French and the british would help the americans, advising them into epigean stuff they didn’t know and New Mu diplomacy (especially since the US settlements in Agartha are quite far away from New Mu settlements, both on the 3rd and the 4th layer, so contact is probably rare). The british and the french would also want to know how the saur riders managed to attack New York without being detected or intercepted, wanting to know the ways to the underground or the tools they used to travel. The other powers would probably support the United States’ actions against New Mu, but whatever they did they would stay far away, having no reason to support one or the other, preferring to keep them busy while they sell weapons to either side.

8. How did it end, and what were its consequences?
We’d need to answer the previous staff before, but there must be some consequences to the attack. If the US is not at war with New Mu anymore, some settlement must have taken place. The american public is probably extremely weary of the New Mu, and if this happens after Paraguay, I can see them developing a Manifest Destiny rhetoric towards the entirety of New Mu, seeing them afterwards as dangerous barbarians to be driven out.
Also, just a random idea, I like the idea that the Statue of Liberty was made by French settlers in Agartha as some sort of monument to the attack, with the torch having some sort of agarthan item that is said to protect New York from further attacks. What exactly, not sure yet.
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The original date was 1876 and it damaged the Statue of Liberty. It was supposed to be constructed earlier using Agarthan materials (look we had to cram a lot of shit together I'm not proud of it). I suppose at this point you could move the current year to like 1886, the actual construction date, and have it be a recent event (something like that was already proposed anyway and the more I think about it, the more it seems like people who insisted on moving to mid eighties were right).
You know, one other reason for the attack could be that some kind of material or relic valuable to Mu (old or new) for whatever reason was used in the statue's construction.
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>>94236021
In fact there's really nothing to be done to the setting to justify the statue being up earlier than 1886. The proposal (in rl) dates back to the early 1860s, the Franco-Prussian war delayed its construction, and parts good parts (the whole torch and arm were in Philadelphia in 76) were already delivered and exposed before the 80s. The simple fact we don't have the Franco-Prussian war in our timeline means it can be done earlier.
I'm not against moving the [Current Moment] to 1886, but it doesn't really seem that necessary to justify it on its own.
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>>94238634
That's a good point about the Franco-Prussian war. I do like the angle of >>94235468 including Agarthan settlers in it, though. Maybe after it gets damaged, Mu runs off with the torch and Paris sends a replacement with some kind of anomalous quality?
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>>94235446
> 1. When?
I personally prefer the explanation that it was due to gross miscalculation/misunderstanding of what America was on the part of the raiders, and this is more likely earlier than later, but its not a huge issue. If we tie the Morlock thing to this, ideally it should be earlier too for it to led to things like Sgt. Bubbles.
> 2. Why
I prefer a series of innocent fuck ups to a deliberate one, but then again, Old Mu probably doesn't hesitate too much before throwing some New Mu citizens into the fire.
> 3. How big?
I agree with your assessment, I don't think there's much sense in prolonging it or making it worse than that, a couple hundred buildings raised, a few blocks flooded, the attacker driven back or completely wiped within a few days if not even on the same day it happens.
> 4 What was destroyed
I had always picture t-rex riding saurs, but a naval attack may make more sense, and Elasmosorus riding knights are no less kino. Plus, if its the port and surrounding quarters that are mostly hit and not residential areas it could explain in part why the american populace wasn't more incensed... They'd still be, but if the casualties were somehow unexpectedly low for the shock of the event, people might be left more dumbfounded then angry... ?
> 5 How did the US react?
Immediately, seek the Entrance used (they probably wouldn't know about Imaterii). When (if?) that fails, then assess the possibility of launching retaliatory strikes in conjunction with their allies (depending on the moment, Brits may not be an 'ally', but may, and neither them or France have any affinity toward New Mu). When they realize that's essentially getting caught in a land war in Asia, but you can only drop feed troops and material down there at a fraction of the time, and there's dinosaurs, then they would shift to heavily increasing the military strength of their settlements.
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>>94240925
>>94235461
>6. How did New Mu authorities react?
I think the New Mu City-States masters would scramble between trying to go through their colonial contacts to hope to delay any retaliation on one side and on the other trying to get some confirmation from Old Mu as to what they are supposed to do. I know the City-States are supposed to be independent entities so having them all be of one mind seems weird but I can't imagine that they would see profit from a long term war with any Colonial power on Epigea of all things. The nomad tribes (apart from the Keshiq) might be happy at the chance of tasting some Colonial, the Keshiq would probably laugh at the idea of taking arms to defend the honor of Knights who put up such a poor showing, Imaterii (in the 3rd anyways) do an internal audit to see which moron decided to greenlight this fuckup. And yeah I think everyone would be absolutely 100% fine throwing the Saur Knights under the bus for it.
> 7. Other Powers
British and French would likely extend some form of aid and certainly intelligence they've gathered about New Mu, given that I don't see how that disadvantages them.
> 8. Consequences
I like the Agarthan settler's angle, but its making me think, Eiffel (in rl) built the megastructure for the thing, no reason to change that here I think, and regarding Eiffel's World, I kinda prefer the idea that he's not really aware of what he's doing, it manifested itself to him in a liquid-titanium-shower-fueled fever dream, and so, maybe, he had already built something anomalous into the first Statue and that's why Old Mu backed the attack?
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>>94241038
>maybe, he had already built something anomalous into the first Statue and that's why Old Mu backed the attack
Oh, I like this. I'm less and less sure if the attack was ever a good idea desu, but if we are to stick with it this angle works.
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>>94241130
>I'm less and less sure if the attack was ever a good idea desu, but if we are to stick with it this angle works.
I seem to be the only one who really likes it, it was a single line, we can cut it.
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>>94241140
Kinda sucks however because it removes weight from the Morlocks renouncing Mu and getting America's affection for it.
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>>94241130
I still think the attack can work. If it's a misdirect/false flag by Napoleon to drag America into a war with the Mu then I think it still makes sense, or perhaps a Muic cult summons a bunch of Saur Knights and terrors The Horror at Red Hook style.
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>>94152639
> New Mu .6
> Lost City of the Kadahari
Weird fucking story. In 1885, a Canadian funambulist by the name of William Leonard Hunt, aka Guillermo Farini aka The Great Farini became the first westerner on record having crossed the Kadahari Desert, which is a pretty big achievement in itself, its a major chuck of the sourthern part of Africa. However in his book retelling the trip he also claimed to also have a Lost City in it in the middle of it, writing this note : A half-buried ruin - a huge wreck of stones
On a lone and desolate spot;
A temple - or a tomb for human bones
Left by men to decay and rot.

Rude sculptured blocks from the red sand project,
And shapeless uncouth stones appear,
Some great man's ashes designed to protect,
Buried many a thousand year.

A relic, may be, of a glorious past,
A city once grand and sublime,
Destroyed by earthquake, defaced by the blast,
Swept away by the hand of time.

Despite being a weirdo, Hunt did things in order and presented his notes and some pictures which seemed to suggest ruins to the British Geographical Society, and so a lot of people went with it, it became known as the Lost City of the Kalahari. (sidenote : Elon's granddad participated in the search for it after)
Perhaps the least likely turn of the story however is that it wasn't a hoax (probably). When researchers claimed that he probably had not even made the trip and set out to do it following his instructions (which they thought were invented), they actually found the "Ruined City", a formation of large igneous rocks that had been grinded down into squarish slabs and genuinely looked like dystopian ruins, but were in fact entirely natural (kinda like the Giant's Causeway).
Also, he adopted a wolfboy.
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>>94241413
I mean, I never liked Morlocks living in surface US too (even if them essentially being a migrant community in New England is unintentionally hilarious in the context of Lovecraft's racism). But that's just me.
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By the by, 2eanon, I'm down to play on the 27th, 30th or 31st, if you're available. Same deal, any time from 19:00 to maybe 02:00 UTC+3. I wanted to try Atlan or maybe Italy to see how they play.
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>>94247130
I'll be available on the 30th! Anyone you would like to face?
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>>94247707
Not really, your pick.
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Does anyone have any idea what size of roster the Tsardom will take? Its small but playable at the moment, especially with mercs.
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And for the Partisan I upped the price a bit, even if they can't hide again starting hidden is a big advantage because on most other models it costs 2AP, so there's an upfront cost you don't have to pay with these. And they are good stat-wise, even without hidden they would probably be ~10, the Insurrectionist rule is cool but it will probably not trigger nine games out of ten.
Also, what keyword(s) were you thinking for it?
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>>94249926
Shit should attach pic.
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>>94242003
>Muic cult
That could work. Could also be distract America with Agartha so they can gain influence in the still fresh west (gold in the Black Hills). There are many reasons, and while it is fun to discuss, it isn't necessary to flesh out right now. The only thing that really bugs me about it is how they got to New York. The natural answer to me is through the Catskills somehow, but i'm unsure about adding an entrance so close to Halifax, Mammoth Cave, and an already big and important city like New Yotk. Halifax is tempting to me, mainly because Saur Knights hunting people through New England would be kino. Maybe there could be a sort of Legend of Sleepy Hollow retelling with a Miskatonic Advisor and a Saur Knight. Though, Halifax to New York is a rather long way to go, that is the only real downside to that option I see. It would need to happen before the Halifax Disaster, meaning Mu has even more of an excuse for being unaware, and that we could tie the two events together somehow.
I was thinking that trying to find the entrance used by Mu for the attack leads to the discovery of the Halifax entrance. I realize now that Mu having actually used the Halifax entrance isn’t necessary for the attack to lead to it’s discovery, although it isn’t a point in favor of Mu using Halifax for the attack, it is a point in favor of, at least for now, ignoring the Statue of Liberty stuff. Who’s to say Mu can only attack once? Maybe the first attack is a mistake, and later there is a more deliberate and Old Mu backed attack.
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Some ideas brought up in the last session.
> Making Olm Wyrm Neutral
Unless this goes against the OG idea for the unit, this doesn't seem too much of a stretch, he is incredibly tough, probably has very few natural predators, so it would probably be pretty chill unless its annoyed too much.
> Adding a [Criminal] keyword
There aren't many "pure" keywords left (as in, tags referred to by other rules), since Medic and Cook had a Special Rule part to them I moved them entirely to that section. There's enough units that could get it to make sense for it to exist (all the Criminal Colonial hostiles, the Golden Syndicate leader, the Post-Confederates in some ways if not all, etc), and equally there are "law enforcement" models (Tiger Brigade, Policeman of the Future, etc) that could use this tag.
> Hostile Activation
Something something "if a Hostile only has LoS (+ Awareness range?) to models owned by a single player, the opposing player automatically gain Control of this model during the Hostile phase.
> Hostile can attack each other across lists
The issue here is that if you can't, you can cockblock an opponent's Hostiles by moving your own in the way. Having Hostiles ignore other Hostiles during Movement seemed like an even weirder situation for me, and so allowing them to attack each other at least means the Terrorsaur wont waste its entire activation because you also rolled Swarmsaurs and threw them around it (perhaps a bad example, Swarmsaurs could easily have something that says they don't provoke Engagement and can be Moved over because its the size of a chicken... ).
> Weaker version of Deadly
Something something "if the Evasion roll on this attack/charge was failed, increase the lethality of this attack by 1 degree (Not sure if it should spill over, could be either or, spilling over would make / and X more relevant). This could be put rather liberally on a number of melee weapons but it could also be put on model profiles as well.
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>>94252920
>> Weaker version of Deadly (cont.)
Which also made me think that if we want to make the Evasion roll more relevant, we could also change Stun and even Knockback to work the same way. Currently its on a Critical (which stacks a lot of effects on Criticals, won't happen that often, and the rate of it happening only increases if you stack things like Quick Strike or Dual Wielding on top of it, not by either increasing your stats or decreasing the opponent).
It could either be the same way, fail the Evasion, its triggers, and/or, it could be something that works off the Location hit. If you hit the Head location you trigger Stun, if you hit the Body Location, you trigger Knockback... ?
> Removing Dread lowering by Crit Dodging.
Would help with making Panicked and Broken a bit more likely to happen. There were a few situations in the last games where I wasn't too far away from winning, but the only thing that could be done would be to attack a very high Evasion model with Nimble and then after 2 crit evade I'm no longer in a position to win because the opponent is no longer bordeline broken. Narratively its cool, but given how much drowning your opponent in Dread sometimes becomes the only manageable way to win, it sucks to have it robbed through doing the obvious thing you should be doing, without having any ways to mitigate the chances of the enemy crit dodging.
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>>94251655
>I was thinking that trying to find the entrance used by Mu for the attack leads to the discovery of the Halifax entrance. I realize now that Mu having actually used the Halifax entrance isn’t necessary for the attack to lead to it’s discovery, although it isn’t a point in favor of Mu using Halifax for the attack, it is a point in favor of, at least for now, ignoring the Statue of Liberty stuff. Who’s to say Mu can only attack once? Maybe the first attack is a mistake, and later there is a more deliberate and Old Mu backed attack.
I like the idea of a Muic cult, it would make sense for some less scrupulous individuals would try to bargain with Mu through the Morlocks immigrating, despite the latter's warning not to do so. It could also explain why New Mu was not involved at large, the cult was mostly dealing with representative of the Saur Order that led the attack and the rest of Mu was mostly unaware of it... ?
And this could still lead to the discovery of the Halifax Entrance.
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>>94247782
I'll go with Atlantis then!
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>>94249926
No keywords needed, they're not professional soldiers or workers really
>>94252920
>Wyrm Neutral
Works for me. The original idea is that you summon it with a horn item and it barrels through the map like a locomotive as you try to get your guys out of the way.
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The life of the average Ape-Man, or Neanderthal as they are commonly named by the Epigeans, is brutish and short. Most Ape-Men perish in infancy or childhood, a symptom of poor diets and worse medicine. Just as often as natural causes, violence claims them, as the brutes compete for mating rights among the females and often kill their existing children as a means of motivating them to mate again.
Life among the Ape-Men of their three cities, however, is starkly different.
The Apes of the cities of Ook, Eek, and Ack are a curious breed. They are smarter, better fed, and more organized than their kin outside the walls of their cities. They have mastered metallurgy when other apes struggle to comprehend bone and rock as materials. They practice agriculture and eat a diet that consists of more than just scavenged fruit and meat.
But it would be wrong to call the apes of the cities "smart" or "intelligent" and, indeed, they would find it offensive. The City Apes are keenly aware of their own incompetence, and their civilization is the result of them trying desperately to make up for it.
Ape-Men come in many shapes. Some quite closely resemble some of mankind's more troglodytic ancestors, the hirsute cave dwellers of old. Some resemble chimps, gorillas, orangutans, or other mundane ape varietals. Most exist in a sort of halfway point between ape and man, with the bulk of an ape stretched onto the upright frame of a human.
Regardless of species resembled, the Ape-Men can be distinguished from their counterparts by their intellect. While they rarely achieve such lofty heights as your average Englishman, or even that of a Frenchman or American; the Ape-Men are capable of tool use and language. Even the Country Apes, as their city-dwelling counterparts call them, make use of tools and language extensively.
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>>94240925
>Sgt. Bubbles
Who?
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>>94254277
Examining the Ape-Tongue reveals the secret of the City Apes' civilization. Little more than a pidgin, the language consists primarily of monosyllabic hoots and grunts. Most of these words describe very simple concepts and are used in conjunction with each other to construct more advanced ideas. The word for red and the word for water (as well as most other liquids) are combined to form blood, for example. The City Apes take this a step farther, using loan words extensively to communicate more complex ideas. Atlantis, Atlan, Lemuria, and Mu are all used as sources for words and other ideas; what the Apes cannot create on their own, they copy from humanity.
That is the secret of the City Apes' success. They recognize their own incapability, a source of seething shame for them, and steal voraciously from every source they can find. Humanity is both an object of envy and admiration, for we have created much that the Apes yearn for. They struggle to achieve with brute strength the things that mankind makes trivial through invention, and so they learned to copy us.
The Apes do not hide this fact. They do not claim to be smarter than their Country Ape kin, simply less proud. Indeed, there is a deep-seated self-resentment in the culture of the City Apes. They loathe themselves for their own stupidity. They look up to their smarter kin, raise them up as leaders, and those same leaders look down at their brethren and wonder if they even deserve leadership.
One must wonder what it is like, to live as a paragon of intellect among a people who view themselves as fools.
In general, the Ape-Men do not match humans for information retention or creativity. While the City Apes have yet to adopt technologies such as firearms and chemistry on a wide scale, their collective ability to swallow their pride suggests that they might rapidly advance their own position underground if the secrets of surface technologies were allowed to fall into their hands.
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>>94254336
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>>94254416
One might be forgiven for assuming that, based on the prevalence of Ape-Men that resemble Orangutans and Gorillas among the leadership of the Apes, there is some degree of social hierarchy based on breed at play.
Rather, the Apes tend toward an exceptionally meritocratic system of governance. Apes who are skilled at leadership are pushed by their peers toward the top. Few wish to shoulder the burden themselves, and so they look to their peers for the smartest and strongest among them to follow. As those breeds of Ape-Men tend to be both intelligent and athletic, the Orangutan-Men and Gorilla-Men find themselves unwillingly at the helm of their society. Chimp-Men, Mandrill-Men and the Caveman breeds also often find themselves toward the top, but rarely reach such heights due to their comparatively weaker frames.
Among the City Apes, aggression is seen as a weakness and a sign of lesser intellect. Violence is not shied from, and they are still a greatly carnivorous people who practice cannibalism regularly, but violence against one another is discouraged. Violence toward children, especially, is seen as a sign of low intellect and a disease of the Country Apes' primitive society. Perhaps it is for this reason that abandoned or lost children of human settlements throughout Agartha occasionally find themselves brought to the three cities and raised (or ransomed) by their Ape-Man captors.
The cities of Eek, Ook, and Ack are primitive by human standards, but they are a shining beacon among the Apes. It is here that traders from abroad may deign to treat with the Ape-Men, trading iron and steel ingots (which the Apes can work but not produce) for exotic meats, worked bone, and of course gold.
It is these three cities which are the hope of Ape-Kind. If they are ever to produce a society capable of matching mankind, it will be within one of those walled cities.
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>>94254527
Some stuff I didn't include but thought about:
>Ape breeds have significant bearing on what kind of children any given union will produce, but any kind of Ape-Man can produce any other kind in theory.
>If an Ape-Man ran into a caveman and a caveman-type Ape-Man, it could instinctively tell the difference but not articulate how.
>Children that get abandoned for having weird mutations frequently get adopted by Ape-Men of the three cities. They could definitely have a grown up wolfboy as a hero, with a bunch of mutations as traits.
>Ape-Men have a very strong sense of tribalism that supercedes any sense of kinship among breeds. A bunch of Chimp-Men would rather hang out with a Gorilla-Man who bullies them but is their cousin than organize with a bunch of weird Chimp-Men they don't know.
>Ape-Men hate Morlocks because they're stupid and Olms because they're passive. And also because, in some regards, both groups are more successful than them.
>Bleg, despite being smarter than your average Englishman, is seen as a buffoon among Ape-Men because he's brutal and bloodthirsty. Fighting is good, but enjoying fighting is bad.
>City Apes love foreign art and show it off to portray themselves as cultured. This is a big deal to them.
>Country Apes resent City Apes because they know City Apes have better technology than them, so they often rob City Apes and piss on their stuff, especially art.
>Sports are a big deal as well, as a means of letting off natural aggression in less destructive ways than fighting. They have LOTS of different sports and rarely agree about how they're played.
>Mercenary work is seen as respectable, but it's also an avenue mostly used by Apes who wouldn't fit in back home due to being too violent.
>Apes hate guns as a symbol of mankind's ingenuity triumphing over the Apes' raw strength.
>Axes are favored weapons due to being relatively simple to make and working well with raw strength.
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>>94254277
>>94254416
>>94254527
I've got to say I always hated how the Neanderthals are just ape people and not actual Neanderthals. I suggest just settling on calling them Ape-Men, because that's what they actually are.
I also think you might be overplaying the uncivilized angle. I like the general idea that they are aping (heh) other cultures, but I think they would've figured iron smelting out or at least copied the process.
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>>94254833
I wasn't sure whether to include iron or just steel there. I think they definitely rely on importing steel rather than producing it themselves, but they can certainly have iron.
As for the Neanderthal thing, I think it was put in The World Book that they vary significantly in appearance and some of them really do resemble straight up Neanderthals. I tried to incorporate that with the many different breeds thing.
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>>94254833
I disagree with the Ape-Men thing because that's generic as hell. Weird idiosyncrasies help sell the setting like the Atlan Republic being a dictatorship and the Atlantean Kingdom being semi-democratic and both having similar names. Our Morlocks are fish people and our Neanderthals are apes and that makes it cooler than if we just called them fishmen and apemen.
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>>94254983
>>94254833
I find the mix-up endearing and relatively understandable from the point of view of most epigeans, who would not be terribly familiar with the difference. I do like the fact that there are (perhaps more educated) people in setting who find it annoying.
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Every time Eiffel's World is brought up this song starts playing in my head. Maybe New Mu thought the Statue of Liberty was like one of their idols, and that's why they attacked it. Maybe it really was.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QXR3kB0V5Cw
>>94251655
Continuing this if Halifax is the entrance used by New Mu, they could still have come through the Catskills if there was a cave connecting them to the Halifax entrance. Just looked it up and turns out there are some proper caverns in the Catskills. So maybe they came up to the 2nd through Halifax, but instead of following the river through to the Atlantic, they followed it to Howe Caverns. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Howe_Caverns
>>94253080
I already had the above typed out and hadn't posted it yet. I like the idea of either an honest mistake or elaborate plan best. The cult thing seems like a can of worms.
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That isn't to say cans of worms can't be good, just that i think we have enough worms for now.
>>94231977
>>94232225
Maybe there is a special red sand that the Ottomans use for a sort of ‘baptism’. Maybe they believe it is where the rest of John the Baptist is buried. The sand is stained red with his blood, or maybe even is his blood.
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>>94254983
There's weird idiosyncrasies and then there's sounding like somebody slept through their class on human evolution. Every example you've listed makes sense on its own. Countries having names that don't reflect their actual politics is a classic. Morlocks aren't real, so I don't mind having a different spin on them. You know who were actually real and not just abnormally intelligent apes (unless one wished to sound particularly misanthropic)? Neanderthals.
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>>94254675
>Apes hate guns as a symbol of mankind's ingenuity triumphing over the Apes' raw strength.
I think it's more fun if they adore guns and gunpowder, and i agree that the uncivilized angle came off a bit acute. Also, i still think referring to City Apes as Neanderthals and Country Apes as Ape-Men gets the idea across better. The rest all looks pretty great.
Any ideas for the Lost City of Ough? I saw Necromancy, and i'm unsure about it. I still think having a more evolved Troglodyte ancestor race that built the cities in the first place is a good idea. That way we can have dumb monkeys in magical looking places without compromising on them being stupid. It also reinforces the loop themes nicely. I think Necromancy might could work, but am unsure about how.
>>94255384
>There's weird idiosyncrasies and then there's sounding like somebody slept through their class on human evolution.
On the Origin of Species was published the year prior to Paris's fall.
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>>94255564
>I think it's more fun if they adore guns and gunpowder
Explains Bleg. I do think there should be some reason they're slow to adopt them, though. Maybe they're easily frightened by the sound of gunfire? Like, they wish they could use guns but then they try and they mostly get scared. Then Bleg comes along and starts really drilling his men in using them, it spreads from there, and a century later we've got gorillas with gatlings.
>Any ideas for the Lost City of Ough?
I think I do actually want Neanderthal Necromancers, if only for the fun alliteration. That said, they can still certainly have moved in after the whole city was destroyed and huskified. Maybe they learned necromancy by studying the husks there?
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Fig. A, a Hyperborean of a previous Loop where Neanderthals were the dominant species of the planet.
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>>94255384
>Morlocks aren't real
I take personal offense to that.
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>>94255964
Morlocks. Aren't. Real.
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>>94255628
Neanderthals WERE the dominant species. Then Homo Sapiens showed up, pushed their shit in, and banged all their women.
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>>94256058
that was the first completed cycle any hominids experienced.
We will not be discussing the Olm's Deluge or any cycles that preceded it. Things got a little Shadow Out of Time with it.
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>>94256020
> MFW
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>>94255964
>on the internet, nobody knows you're a Morlock
>>94256020
Maybe Morlocks in America, above or below, are required to be tagged, and any Morlock without a tag is fair game (unless your in Maine [why would you ever be in Maine?]). This way they can give false tags to the New England Morlocks that make it look like they are imports from Franklin, rather than locals. Some states probably have laws that protect chaperoned Morlocks.
Maybe Morlocks "reveal themselves" when they are discovered by prospectors looking for the entrance used in the New Mu attack.
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>>94256274
I smell a black market for falsified tags. Maybe refugee Morlocks from Mu bribe their way into the States and buy fake IDs?
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>>94256274
>>94256301
> Morlocks mistake the tag as a sign of belonging to the US and are thus really proud of wearing them.
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>>94255564
>On the Origin of Species was published the year prior to Paris's fall.
Not my point. The argument I was responding to was that it would be a selling point (Who are we "selling" this to, anyway? Nobody cares about /eadsttcoteg/, let's be real here). I would argue that to many it would just sound kinda dumb. Case in point: myself.
>>
I’m not opposed to ditching the Neanderthal name. Maybe we keep it as something that is used mostly by regular people, a misconception that academics frequently have to correct?
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I've been writing the New York attack writeup. I'm halfway done, but I've hit a roadbump and I'm not sure how to continue. I'll post what I have thus far, maybe you can think of a way to fill the gap.
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>>94260055

The 1876’s New Mu raid of New York is one of the most important event regarding the relations between the United States of America and the denizens of the underground. The saur attack to the city of New York and later retaliation by the US Army a couple of years after the Paraguayan War would make the American people truly conscious of the reality of agarthan affairs, turning the nation’s relation with the deep a highly discussed topic in American politics. The resulting wave of rejection against most agarthan powers and New Mu in particular caused a push in favor of American military presence and expansion in the underground as well as paving the way for the creations of institutions tasked to explore and learn about the possible agarthan menace. This incident also caused New Mu politics to grow increasingly interested in epigean politics and diplomacy, as the retaliation of the American forces was an effective proof of the potential strength of the surface dwellers, putting a halt to further major expeditions, such as the 1867’s takeover of Hokkaido. The events of the raid are also well known for forcing the morlock community in the United States to reveal themselves, using the population’s rejection of New Mu to gain the acceptance of the American people. After the retaliatory measures were finished, the morlock-american community received an official recognition of their citizenship by President Grant himself as thanks for their work repairing the damages New York suffered during the raid.
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>>94260067
The initial causes of the attack are not well known, though experts have suggested a couple of factors that could have stirred the incident. From what we know after decades of exploration of the 3rd and 4th layers and the repeated (and not always peaceful) contact between the british and french explorers and New Mu, the New Mu society takes a form similar to those in antiquity. The reports of each of the cities that compose New Mu paints a picture of a loose confederation, almost in a similar way to the League of Delos back in Ancient Greece, with each city being its own political entity with only certain ties to each other. In particular, the groups known as “Saur Riders” have a warrior-like culture that necessitates constant war and conflict for social advancement, honor and recognition. This causes these groups to find fights anywhere they can, regardless of the possible consequences of their actions, with Saur Riders from one city-state attacking an allied city-state, just because their need for battle supersedes any other consideration. Due to this, the authorities of their respective city-states developed the habit of sending them far away from their territories and their allies’, just to keep the fallout of their rampages far from them. In turn, they sometimes receive the assaults of Saur Riders from far away cities in turn. This has developed a culture of what some call “resigned acceptance”, where each city-state is always ready to combat assaults of Saur Riders, and this causes little to no diplomatic incidents between New Mu cities anymore, seeing them as hooligans and brigands more than an actual military threat.
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>>94260075
All throughout the 19th century, contact between Agartha and the epigean nation began growing quickly, with many epigean nation carving their own dominions on the 3rd and 4th layers. This gave many Saur Riders an opportunity to gain fame and glory by fighting these new interlopers, while the New Mu city-states could send their riders into lands even further away. Saur Rider attacks were thus began being spotted over the years in Epigean lands, though usually these were far from the eyes of the major epigean powers, and thus gained little attention. The biggest of these was the New Mu attack of the Japanese archipelago, with the island of Hokkaido being taken over while the Kyushu island sank into the depths of the ocean (to later be discovered to have ended up in the 3rd layer, forming what is now known as the Satsuma Domain). Still, outside of a few powers like France, Great Britain and the Tsardom, Agarthan affairs were still quite a mystery for most nations in the surface. During this time, the United States of America was on its way to getting a foothold in Agartha. The 1861’s US-Mexico deal over the Chicxulub Entry and the exploration and colonization of Franklin Territory during the late 1860s saw the American giant’s first steps into agarthan affairs, though it would not be until the Paraguay Incident and the formation of PACT when the government started taking the agarthan matters seriously.
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>>94260082
At the time, however, most of the American public still saw Agartha and all the mysteries and madness that came with it as a faraway thing: a matter that they would read in the papers and hear in pubs and clubs, but not something that could have direct consequences in their lives. Many believed that agarthan expansion was less impactful to American politics and business than the growing US intervention in the Caribbean after the war with Spain, the finishing of the conquest of the West and the reconstruction of the South. The colonization of the US territories below ground was seen as a secondary priority when California was now accessible through train, with the first transcontinental railways being finished by late 1860s. The lack of easy communication between the layers simply meant that there was little to no knowledge of what was going on below ground, and thus the American public ended up reading more about the british and french adventures in Agartha rather than their own. As far as the majority knew, the underground was home to savages, wild monsters and unholy mystical powers that, for the betterment of all, should stay far away from the civilized above. Dangerous to be sure, but incapable of threatening their lives.
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>>94260090
This perception changed during in July 4th 1876. During the night celebrations, the city of New York was the target of saur riders, who attacked the city during the night. The details of the events are still quite murky, but what we do know about half a dozen saur rider clans (about 100 riders in total) arrived to the shores of the city during the nighttime celebrations. Mounted on war plesiosaurs and carrying other riding saurs, about 30 of them landed on lower Manhattan while the rest landed on Brooklin, along the Gravesend Bay. Taking advantage of the festive atmosphere and the lack of vigilance for an event like this, the saur riders were successful in assaulting multiple docks without much fanfare, and from there they managed to mount on their saurs, a mix between dimetrodon and ankylosaurus. To this day, noone really knew how they managed to bring these specimens from the sea, some suggesting agarthan wizardry, while others believe they used some sort of unseen vessel. From there, they moved inland attacking the passersby. Panic and confusion quickly ensued, causing crowds of people to quickly run away in fear of the creatures. Despite the gravity of the situation, the local authorities took near an hour to respond, as they assumed the news of strange men riding giant lizards was a result of the heavy drinking and dismissed it. It was only when multiple police officers swore to have seen the creatures with their own eyes that the authorities were dispatched in full.
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>>94260096
While the police and other local authorities began trying to move the civilians out of the way of the saur riders, a message was sent to the military units available, who quickly tried to organize a force to dispatch. Meanwhile, the bulk of the damage at this time was being caused by the panicking citizens, who at this point were running away in the hundreds, trying to hurriedly find a safe place to be. Thousands upon thousands, a sea of humanity moving around screaming about monsters coming from the sea, eating people alive, ridden by savages who attacked all who they saw. Some were fleeing to their homes, others trying to get out of the city, some taking up arms and offering themselves to fight these horrors, and the longer it went, the more mayhem was unleashed. Soon, many blocks had either been looted or burnt to cinders, a growing fire being added to the list of worries of the night. In actuality, the saur riders had not advanced that much from their original starting locations, since apparently the great number of fireworks and the smell of gunpowder had dazed and frightened most of the beasts, and only a few of them had actually gone deeper into the town, while the rest of the riders began looting the city on foot. As American forces began arriving in force, the few clashes that actually occurred resulted in massacres, as by that point, the saur knights had looted multiple cellars and warehouses, and according to one witness “[they] had no natural defense against American-made spirits”. At one point, a small gunboat that was stationed nearby managed to find some of the beasts who had been left behind, and began to shoot at them. While the crew failed most of their shots, the great noise from the cannons spooked the saurs, who began stampeding towards the American army’s positions, and got quickly shot down by concentrated fire.
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>>94260104
By morning, the local authorities had regained control of the situation. The casualties mostly revolved around the saur riders, as more than 100 bodies were discovered, but none of the riders was capture alive. Almost all of the beasts had been gunned down, though six ankylosaurs were captured by the New York authorities, and were sent to the recently open Central Park Zoo, where they became a sensation for years. Despite multiple witnesses seeing the aquatic lizards, none of them were reportedly gunned down or captured, assuming some of the riders escaped on them. On the American side, only civilian casualties were registered, as by the time the army managed to arrive to the scene, the saur riders were in no condition to mount an adequate defense, though multiple policemen were wounded. Current estimates show that about 100 people died, between the fires, the looting and the panic that ensued. About 100 buildings were either burnt down, and many establishments were looted. A fishing boat was sunk down by a gunboat, mistakenly identified as a plesiosaur during the chaos, though fortunately all onboard managed to survive.
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>>94260110
Once the news arrived to the rest of the country, the reaction from the public was immediate. A fever swept over the nation, a mix of outcry and paranoia, putting agarthan matters into the spotlight overnight. The belief this could be the preamble to an invasion was seen as a darkly real possibility, especially after the recent incidents revolving agarthan powers. Newspapers argued that if these agarthan barbarians had managed to push the british out of India and sunk an entire island into the sea, surely there was a tangible threat coming to America: maybe even the first stage into a war that would now take place in American soil. The fact that the attack had occurred during the 4th of July celebrations was also seen as a mocking insult, an affront that needed to be avenged. For months, the nation began preparing for war, in case this incident was just the initial stages of the dreaded “hordes of the deep”. However, no further attacks took place, and the war fever gave way to unease. Many questions were asked by the public, and no real answer was possible. The lack of any further clues made the public grow frustrated with the government, as paper after paper demanded justice for the horrible atrocities committed in New York.
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>>94260116
During the winter of 1876, another event shocked the american public. Out of nowhere, the morlock community that had been living amongst the rest of the nation, decided to make its existence known. The visit of multiple morlock chiefs to the authorities of the state of Maine quickly drove public suspicion towards them, but as their stories were released to the public, it became clear that these communities were not the ones behind the New York attack. Indeed, their readiness to help at any opportunity, the numerous stories of their hard-working nature and their own tales of having ran away from their homeland due to persecution rang a bell in the american public. As hundreds of morlock volunteers offered to help the American authorities undergoing the reconstruction and even in the underwater search for the saur riders, a local newspaper famously declared them “these yellow-eyed fishmen are more patriotic than any so called american who calls for calls for railway strikes in times of great need”. The morlock community also gained a great interest due to them actively accusing New Mu for the attack, giving the public, still blinded by the confusion of agarthan affairs, someone to rally against.
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>>94260128
The reality was much complicated that the public knew. Immediately after the attack, President Grant had reunited with his war staff and as many agarthan experts as he could find. A thorough investigation was ordered to find the culprits, and a series of envoys were sent to the 3rd and 4th layers to find any information of the event. And after months of investigation, there very few solid leads, though thanks to the help of british diplomats and explorers, the bodies had been identified as saur riders from the 4th layer, possibly from a New Mu origin. Other than that, there was no way to identify who they were, where they had come from, or why they launched an attack into the United States. The appearance of the morlock community and their accusation of New Mu to be towards the attack nearly derailed the whole investigation, as even though they had suspected that for a while, New Mu was massive, being composed of dozens, if not hundreds, of independent city-states. And even if they had identified which city was the source of the raid, the United States would have little in the means of conducting a full scale war in the deep. The american accesses to the agarthan underground were slow and the exits were very far from New Mu territory, and control over their own agarthan territories was still in early stages of development, with some areas still not explored and not under real effective control. Launching a war was simply impossible, as even if the americans had the technological superiority, they would have little in the way of effective logistics, knowledge of the terrain and manpower.
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>>94260135
Right now, what I had thought is this:
-New Mu realizes what some saur riders have done, as some of the survivors were caught selling american goods looted.
-Thinking the US is gearing for war, New Mu quickly tries to contact the US to try to find a way to make up for the attack.
-The US, not expecting New Mu to come to them, listens to what they have to say, and the US government and New Mu make a deal to avoid war.
-However, public outcry still wants blood. New Mu and the US stage an attack on a city that had broken ties to New Mu, and make it look like a retaliatory strike.
-New Mu gets a unruly city punished and avoid war with the US, the american government shows its strength in the underworld and continue to expand through Agartha.
-The Morlocks get their citizenship recognized and they are forgiven for hiding their identity.
-The Statue of Liberty is finished, is left as a memorial for the dead of the attack.

Would this work? Any suggestions?
Also, bump limit reached.
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>>94260110
>>94260104
>>94260096
>>94260090
>>94260082
>>94260075
>>94260067
I really, REALLY fucking love this. In my mind this is the perfect degree of facts and questions provided at the same time. The captured saurs being sent to the Zoo after is perfect, imho.
President would not be Grant, he's Commander of the Armies in this timeline, although I guess 1876 was an election year so ...
The one thing that somewhat jumped at me is that the League might not be a good example, because of how much complete fuckery that was on the part of the Athenians ("Oh guys lets move the treasury from Delos to Athens, and no, why you ask, we won't totally use the money to fund new temples. But also, stop sending us troops and boats, those aren't fungible enough, just cash now pls m'kay? Oh you don't like that? That's treasonous talk, we're a military alliance, so I guess we'll genocide your people..." ). It could work if you specified that Old Mu plays the role that Athens had, while the other City-States are the other members of the Delian League.
What is getting you stuck, because really, this seems almost if not complete?
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>>94260371
Oh shit I thought it was finished sorry about that will keep reading.
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>>94260164
Personally I find this the perfect resolution for the event.
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>>94260371
Glad you're enjoying it. I was afraid it'd be too bloated.

>President would not be Grant
Who would it be, then?

>League might not be a good example
Any other ancient confederation we could use as example?

>Old Mu plays the role that Athens had
Would any epigean power know Old Mu well enough? They are in the 6th and below, they have only contacted the lemurians, New Mu and Atlantis. Old Mu is probably some rumor that the epigeans are piecing together the deeper they go.
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>>94260371
>What is getting you stuck, because really, this seems almost if not complete?

Mostly I'm not sure how would the "New Mu authorities find out what happened and organize a settlement with the US". If New Mu is a city-state confederation, how would they organize it all? Would they have to go through Old Mu representatives, or would they do it themselves? And if the latter, how?
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I was thinking that one of the cities of the 4th layer, the ones farther from the main power centers in New Mu, was causing trouble, and they decide that, since it is closer to the US' New Alamo, they can launch a punitive expedition faster than they can. New Mu not only gets to clean house, but get the US to do it for them, while also avoiding war with the US on a relatively vulnerable area (again, the New Mu areas closer to US lands are the least populated and least defended of their territory, so their numerical advantage might not work well if a conflict erupts). The US gets to play the role of great power by punishing the "perpetrators" of the attack, calming their population while showing strength to the other epigean powers, and all the while avoiding an actual war they might not be able to win effectively.

Everyone wins, except the poor city that's going to be razed to the ground, March to the Sea style.
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>>94261659
Oh wait, that's Atlan, nevermind the image.
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>>94261784
Now it's fixed. It would be something like this. It would be a very difficult undertaking due to them travelling through savannah and desert areas, and I imagine it would be quite an expensive affair that would depend on hiring many locals (maybe drawing Hannibal comparisons?). There would be many towns funded that would be a mix between american and local agarthan, and the morlock volunteers would be essential even though these areas aren't the ones more suited to them. Also, it would create a ton of adventure literature, which was the style at the time.
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>>94261426
>Would any epigean power know Old Mu well enough?
I think any degree of diplomatic contact with New Mu would result in at least an awareness of Old Mu, though it might be (not inaccurately) assumed to be a religious thing. New Mu speaks of Old Mu as a uniting force, a divine power that guides them in their affairs with one another and distinguishes them from the rest of the uncivilized underworld. They don't name names, except to invoke figures like the Nameless Khan and Mother Unknown in much the same way a Roman might have invoked Jupiter and Juno.
To outsiders who don't know about the truth of what squirms below, Old Mu may as well be the same as Old Lemuria; a mysterious and long gone civilization that is worshiped in some capacity by its descendants.
And that's all true, except for the "long gone" part.
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>>94261426
>Who would it be, then?
Probably too heavy-handed of a joke for many, but back then anons had landed on a made up meek bureaucrat of the dubious name of Pr. Mollman (sp?, I think there's supposed to be an umlaut in there) who'se lack of decisiveness is both a blessing and a curse to the US in general.
>>
Why don't we have mole men, anyway?
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>>94262622
No specific reason, I remember speaking about it once with Atlan anon during a game, and I think we were both agreeing they would 100% fit. If I'm not mistaken a lot of North American cities have urban legends about them, right? I know here in Montreal the idea that the Mont-Royal is infested with them is common.
It could be something nice to add on for Deep minor factions next to Morlocks and Apemen
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>>94262604
I remember seeing stuff about that. Grant is too iconic, and his years only go to 1876/7, so he should still be president for that time. After that, shrug. I don't love the idea, but it's fine. I think i would like the idea better if he was an obvious La Ombre plant, but only from the perspective of a player or reader. Otherwise, you have to wonder how he got elected in the first place.
>>94262784
I don't remember that conversation, but that doesn't mean much. I would say they could fit. I'm not too keen on the idea at face value. I feel it isn't as interesting as our other animal men and intelligent animals, and would just detract from them some. I don't think "mole men" is interesting enough to be anything more than a single hostile profile. I'd rather "mole-man" be a derogative for Agarthan human's or colonial humans who live or spend alot of time down there.
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>>94261821
Or we could just add more New Mu. The 4th layer as a whole needs some major changes anyway.

-U.S and Atlantis too remote
-Dalai too crowded
-Atlan too big and oddly shaped
-Not enough water

Just for the big things.
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>>94263161
>U.S and Atlantis too remote
How so?
>Dalai too crowded
Yeah, I've also been saying this for a while now and proposed some changes. Things were easier when I just opened up paint.net and made some scribbles, redoing stuff is much harder for mapanon with his high-effort maps.
>Atlan too big and oddly shaped
Everything's too big, frankly. The maps were originally based on Earth, but the distances are giga-fucked on the 4th already. If you actually apply them to the surface Mu and Atlan would be some of the biggest empires ever, which was not at all intentional.
>Not enough water
Well it's an arid layer, but more lakes or some such wouldn't kill anyone.
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>>94224253
>>94225282
What if the 8th has multiple distinct zones, completely isolated from each other by rock walls? Which one you wind up in depends on which entrance you took, leading to conflicting reports about what the 8th is actually like.
>Perditio: Half-sunk ruins full of morlocks and sickly black water. An awful place to be, really. The detritus of past Loops collects here. Ruins of countless civilizations that were old when Mu was young.
>Parachae: The sprawling Palace of Shadows dominates this Layer. It stretches from one wall to the next, filling the entire landscape.
>Ulida: A silent, idyllic landscape. Most do not linger here, filled with unease. Not because there's anything horrible going on, but because people can't help but feel like they sully it with their presence. Akhmnandag lives here, among the countless lazy curves of the Alph. He has a very nice estate, though his garden is woefully undertended.
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>>94249900
I think I might've made the overwatch too strong, so maybe drop the Long Range negation.
The way Tibet works might actually make it necessary to declare the ability before the game start (to buy the gear), which would make it necessary to know hom the map looks beforehand.
Cook was added by mistake, everyone can cook.
>Does anyone have any idea what size of roster the Tsardom will take?
I was planning to add 1 more Leader (Belyaev-inspired), 1 generic Hero and 3-4 units beyond just touching up the others.
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>>94263597
>How so?
Aside from the massive desert/badlands separating them from each other and the already somewhat removed Nouvelle Alger, there are the three pillars cradling Atlantis and the myriad of mountains to the north and west of them. Aside from being far from the only real point of interest that is the Dalai, they are also far from New Mu and Atlan. Atlantis is even farther from Atlan than the U.S. New Mu only borders Atlan.
>Everything's too big
With New Mu can get away with it because they likely don't have real control over all the land that is marked as theirs. It's easy to just say all the land marked as theirs, is only theirs in the sense that New Mu city states are all or mostly located in the marked area. You could make a similar excuse for Colonials, with the land marked being what is allotted to them in some treaty or another, or just what they claim. Atlan doesn't have either of those excuses, at least not nearly to the same extend. Also, on top of what they have on the 4th, they also have a large and substantial holding on the 3rd. Not getting into the 5th. Not only do they have a ridiculous amount of land, it is thinly spread. That central pillar is the size of an ocean, they have no rivers in the west yet have decided to expand farther into the desert, their entrance to the third is out on the fridge of nowhere, they don't follow the river in the east to the south side of the central pillar, but they somehow have a ladle shaped holding completely detached from the rest of everything. Sorry this one is hardly elegantly put, but if i kept waiting to put down right i never would at all. Yes, everything is too big, but i don't think that is worth helping. Atlan has a particularly severe case of gigantism.
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>>94263597
>The maps were originally based on Earth, but the distances are giga-fucked
If we wanted to make the layers smaller than Earth, one way we could do that is to make the pillars get larger each layer down.
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>>94264444
>I think I might've made the overwatch too strong, so maybe drop the Long Range negation.
Will do! It did strike me as very strong but its on a 30 Silver profile so having one strong ability is not an issue.
>>94264444
>The way Tibet works might actually make it necessary to declare the ability before the game start (to buy the gear), which would make it necessary to know hom the map looks beforehand.
I will think of a way we can get around that, the issue is sure to pop up in other situations.
>Cook was added by mistake, everyone can cook.
Its still a special rule (and no longer a keyword), just means you roll 2 dices for your cooking action.
>>94264444
>I was planning to add 1 more Leader (Belyaev-inspired), 1 generic Hero and 3-4 units beyond just touching up the others.
Alright, I'll hold off on posting the book then, thanks.
I gotta sign off for the night, could anyone take care of baking?
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>>94264742
>I gotta sign off for the night, could anyone take care of baking?
Thy will be done.
In a bit.
I'm working on DBZ OC Donut Steels right now.
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>>94264785
Thank you!
(I did Alexander the Nth's profile a bit earlier, as well as started the Field Chirurgeon, I will post these in the morning in the new thread. Good night!)
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>>94264995
>>94264995
>>94264995
It has been done.



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