>>13072096

Battleship crews range in the hundreds of thousands.

For comparison, according to Rogue Trader, your average escort (Destroyer, Frigate) has a crew ranging from 20,000-28,000. A Light Cruiser averages 50,000-65,000. A Cruiser has around 90,000 on average.

So a Battleship probably has two or three hundred thousand souls aboard. Maybe half a million.

Of course, automation can greatly effect this, the Mechanicus Lathe-class Monitor-Cruiser (a light cruiser hull) from Into the Storm has a crew compliment of only 35,000, most likely thanks to the Red Priesthood's advance technology.

>>13072151

Hey, thanks. So if the Imperium wanted to conquer/colonize a planet, what kind of ships would it send? How many people?

I just read Dead Men Walking and they mentioned that the planet it took place on was a "new" world with only nine billion residents. I assume that means the Imperium sends colonists in the hundreds of millions range at least. Is there a canon mention of how many people troopships or colony ships carry?

>>13072227
Every human-colonisable planet has most likely been colonised and then forgotten about. For the rare few that have no population, then yeah they'd probably just pack freight and battleships with human colonists.

>>13072227
Read up the Tau fluff if you want to learn how the humans conolinze things, it begins with them trying to colonize T'au, but the colony fleet got lost in a warp storm.

It made no mention of a military escort, but that doesn't mean there wasn't one

>>13072227

What sort of "new planet"? Newly colonised, or new to the Imperium? Remember most worlds were colonised back before warp travel got difficult, and some are still being added to the Imperium's control.

>>13072315

Was this in the Tau codex? I was thinking I'd have my Guard regiment come from an Imperium conquest & colonization fleet that got lost in the warp for a generation and the troops are actually the descendants of the original batch of soldiers, mixed in with some aging veterans.

>>13072227

Transports (light cruiser sized, about half the crew requirements) full of materials and colonists.

If they expected trouble there would be no colonizing force just military ships escorting transports full of Imperial Guard regiments who, after being tithed, are traditionally trained on board ships on the way to their deployments.

The successful/surviving soldiers are sometimes allowed to leave service and form the core of a colony population, with further colony ships adding more people.

>>13072353

Oh, of course, the original fleet sent to colonize the Tau homeworld. Maybe that'd be a good source for the ship. Cool.

>>13072227

Oh, dedicated transports you can probably squeeze a couple million into the cargo holds, though the conditions would be absolutely squallid.

Military troop transports carry entire REGIMENTS (sometimes several), as well as training facilities (see what I said above).

>At just under 4 kilometers in length and just under 2 kilometers in breadth at its widest point, the Apocalypse is a colossal starship with only Emperor and Retribution-class battleships besting it at size.

40k wikia is wrong here, it is definitely longer than that, since a Lunar class cruiser is 5 kilometers according to Rogue Trader rulebook. The Armada document which is the only cited source does not state Apocalypse's dimensions.

>>13072096
Gotta remember that 40K lurves fuckhueg things. So comparing population density to a highly dense aircraft carrier is probably way off.

>>13072410
Then edit it. English lexicanum is terrible though, they deleted the article on the god Vaul for being "unsourced". Apparently the German one is a lot better.

Troop transports

Carry multiple regiments (+camp followers according to Gaunt's Ghosts), plus all the armor and equipment to support them

TANKS TANKS TANKS!

>>13072410

GW fluff is wildly inconsistent, however I personally prefer to consider Rogue Trader's measurements and compliments as "Canon", as they've so far given plenty of examples for a variety of hulls.

>>13072428

Yes, aside from the size thing the 40k wikia's article is OK.

Just keep in mind that you've got "crew" and then you've got all the other people on the ship that aren't crew.

There's a really cool picture in the BFG rulebook of thousands of men rolling a giant mouse weel like contraption with their feet and being whipped by tech servitors to power something in the ship

In the 41st millenium gally slaves still have there place

>>13072481
We had a funny thread once focused on the ignorance of Imperial ship crews and their roles on the ship. Of note was the whipmaster, his understand of physics in terms of whips and his belief the engine was a ring of whips, whipping each other.

>>13072481

Where there's a whip...

>>13072502

there's a way.

Imperium does use old military ships as transports when need arises.

I doubt though that they'd use a battleship or a shiny new battlecruiser to do that considering the prestige associated with them.

>>13072410

Oh my. Okay, so raising an entire Guard regiment from the disaffected children of a single ship's crew would be far from out of the question, then.

I was thinking of starting up Battlefleet Gothic as my local GW store is going to be doing a BFG campaign in January. I thought that having a strong connection between my 40k Guard regiment and my Imperial Navy fleet would be pretty cool.

Has anyone played Battlefleet Gothic before? What's a good strategy for putting together a small fleet?

>>13072535

A Small fleet? Start out with a few cruisers and some escorts, assuming Imperial.

I play Tau BFG, and I find them hilarious.

>proclaims Remode

>>13072535
Honestly, BFG is an excellent game that can be a lot of fun. Imperial fleets have a strong torpedo advantage compared to most other races, and I've seen a lot of opponents structure their list around that. You also have excellent prow armour, so rushing in with overwhelming firepower is a viable option.

>>13072567
Also: NOVA CANNONS!

Chaos has much more ordiance of the non-torpedo variety though

>>13072518

Well, there we are. My Guard regiment is from an Exorcist Grand Cruiser sent to colonize T'au, lost in the warp, and then recovered millennia later thousands of light-years away, though only about twenty subjective years had passed on board. They were reorganized into a small (by Imperial Navy standards) task force, assigned some escorts and sister cruisers, and sent out again to conquer whatever fallen habitable worlds they could find.

>>13072567
>>13072583
Oh yeah, I forgot, Nova Cannons are an excellent Imperial toy. Lastly, I'll give you a heads-up that BFG is pretty well balanced, but there are a couple of outliers. Mainly: Necrons are strong, and Orks are kind of weak.

>>13072535

Try to pick ships that work together and remember that you need ordnance cover (torps/fighters). Lances and weapon batteries are both needed.

This is very much simplified, exactly what ships are available depends on the fleet list, at the moment there are three lists in GW's site (Bastion fleet guarding the Eye, Armageddon Fleet List and Gothic sector fleet list, although you can make up new fluff for them).

Only the Bastion fleet for example has Grand Cruisers of any kind, Oberon class battleship is in Armageddon list only, and the Dominator class cruiser is only in the Gothic list.

>>13072614

>Necrons are strong

Understatement of the gods-damned century.

>contrasti czaock

>>13072610
Sounds good, but not to shit on your parade:
>My Guard regiment is from an Exorcist Grand Cruiser sent to colonize T'au, lost in the warp, and then recovered millennia later
Purged by the Inquisition right there.

>>13072610

So Bastion fleet list it is, if you plan to use the Exorcist.

>>13072643
Well, I don't want to take the edge off the rape-knife that will be his first engagement with a Necron fleet.

>>13072645
Nah, lost in the warp doesn't mean disregarded complete. Subject to intense purification tests most likely, but even Titus lets you go if you pass his crazy purity trials.

Could I use a Vengeance model for an Exorcist? With its fighter & bomber wings the Exorcist could be the centerpiece of a small carrier battle group, I'm thinking...what other ships would you all recommend taking along with it for a balanced force?

>>13072660
Could be a nice addition to your background fluff actually, al lyour soldiers had to be mind-probed, stick their hands in boiling oil, and then beaten into a gooy, homogeneous pulp by a Grey Knight Captain.

>>13072660

My Guardsmen have a Lord Commissar from the Steel Legions as their HQ currently. Makes sense if they're not entirely seen as reliable.

I'm sure if they showed up out of nowhere and saved a planet under siege by the Ruinous Powers, they'd at least get a chance to prove themselves to the Inquisition. The Imperium might be crazy but it's not known for refusing to use the tools it has at its disposal.

Okay, so I'd need a Bastion fleet list if I wanted to take an Exorcist. What two cruisers should I take with it? Lunars are well-balanced, right? What'd do well with fighter & bomber support?

>>13072724
When writing his fluff, make sure you take into account that Armaggedon is on the other side of the Galaxy from T'au (Segmentum Solar and edge of Segmentum Ultima respectively)

>>13072666

Vengeance, Exorcist, Avenger, Executor and Retaliator grand cruisers all share the basic hull. Just slap batteries and launch bays and you've got the Exorcist.

Swords are probably the best escort for the cost, and provide batteries for killing Eldar. Dauntless is without doubt the best light cruiser. Of actual cruisers, Gothics are good but require battery support. Lunars can get a Nova cannon, and are your cheapest way of getting them since the Bastion fleet has no Dominators.

Tyrants pay too much for their range upgrades and Dictators are only 10 points less than Exorcists, with same lauch capacity, much less durability and weaker, shorter ranged batteries. Of the grand cruisers, Vengeance is good and worth squadroning with the Exorcist if you can spare the points for it, but if we are talking about a small fleet of 1000-ish points, it is hard to do unless at least three of the four cruisers needed are Dauntlesses.
.
Mars, though expensive, is the best of the three battlecruisers and has everything (lances, batteries, launch bays and a nova cannon) but it is the Exorcists replacement so you'd have to figure how to justify not making it your flagship instead.

>>13072786

Oh, he's a recent addition from the Departmento Munitorum to keep the regiment loyal, I'm sure. Usually commissars aren't from the same world as their regiments, right?

When Krieg started producing regiments, they added commissars and standardized their organization but otherwise just sent them into combat.

>>13072824
They are generally not from the same world but there are a few exceptions (I believe Drookian Fen Guard have commissars from the same worlds as the regiments because they respond very, very poorly to offworld commissars).

See, there are so many Imperium ships, it's hard to keep track of them.

Tau ships are easy to remember...mainly because there is one for each class.

Custodian Battleship, Protector Cruiser, Missionary Cruiser, Castellan Escort, That Radar Ship, and That Tiny Ship Nobody Gives A Fuck About That The Custodian Carries.

>toffic "Erinnerung

>>13072792

I figured the Exorcist would be a good starting point for the fleet as its fluff fits my needs perfectly. It's about a quarter of my 1000 points there. If I add a pair of cruisers I'll put the rest of my points into escorts. Does that make sense or do I need more cruisers? Maybe a light cruiser or two?

>>13072841
>(Unofficial Designation)
I envy the Tau their torpedoes though.

Also, the first time you come up against some fleets in BFG it will be a complete bitch if they are competently played. Either Eldar fleet and Necrons are the best illustrations of this. Necrons are insane, whereas the Eldar playstyle is just complete dicks.

>>13072847
50% of your points on cruisers is a good minimum, in my experience. More if you can.

>>13072847

Exorcist+Fleet Admiral
Gothic+Lunar or Lunar+Lunar
3 Swords

is 745 points which makes for a decent 750 point bracket fleet.

>>13072841

The colonization fleet drew their troops from multiple systems anyway, the regiment would probably welcome a veteran of the Third War for Armageddon with respect and open arms.

I've only played a few games with my 500-point Guard list so far but the Lord Commissar has already distinguished himself as my most consistent killer of space marines. He took down most of a squad of Space Wolves practically by himself (he defied the odds and got four of them on a charge and then finished off the lone Wolf remaining in their assault phase). Oddly enough he has yet to be killed before the rest of my platoon (I always remind my opponents that he's an independent character and they can target him separately but they've always focused on killing my 30-man Guard platoon first, even though the LC is the only thing keeping them from running away and getting sweeping advanced to death).

>>13072918

Removing one Sword and taking two Lunars would allow for them both to take a Nova Cannon as well.

>>13072940
Two Nova Cannons in 750pts is pretty nasty.

>>13072911
>>13072918

Thanks gents. You're helping me out a lot here.

Now I just need to figure out the name of the Exorcist that'd also go well as a name for my regiment (I figured they'd be named after the ship instead of their many disparate ancestral homeworlds).

Any suggestions for something that'd be awesome as a ship name AND a regiment name?

>>13072960

The Lunar Whale

>escape, boleries

>>13072967
88th Lunar Whales, Jesus.

>>13072960
The Litany of Litany's Litany

>>13072960
Battle Barge: Maximum Fuck

>>13072960
Rape Bus

>>13073039
The Emperor's imperially imperial imperium.

Okay, a Grand Cruiser, two cruisers, and three Sword frigates comes in at $70. Worth the price of admission, I think...that's about the price of one X-Box game or what I'm going to spend to put my 750 point Guard list up to 1000.

As far as expanding that up to 1000 points, what would you all recommend? More escorts? A pair of Dauntlesses?

>>13073090
Dauntless Light Cruisers are downright sexy

captcha: Herped

>>13073090
At least one more cruiser, maybe bulk up the Sword squadron to 4 ships.

>>13073090

Two dauntlesses and another Sword would get you to exactly 1000 points.

I could take eight Cobra destroyers for ZOMG TORPEDOES.

>>13073120

Huh, that's not a hard decision. That way I'd have 4 cruisers - ready to throw in a battlecruiser or battleship to go up to 1500.

It says I can have a grand cruiser or battlecruiser for every two cruisers, and I can have a battleship for every three cruisers - this doesn't mean I need five cruisers to take a grand cruiser and a battleship, does it? I'll have four cruisers - I can get a grand cruiser and a battleship legally, right?

>>13073232
That's how I've always done it. I also thought Grand Cruisers counted towards Battleship allowances though, which your post seems to imply is not the case.

>>13073241

Grand Cruisers don't count towards battleship allowance, this should be fixed in FAQ2010.

Three cruisers will still allow you to get a grand cruiser and a battleship. Two cruisers would allow a battlecruiser and a battleship.

>>13073241

In this fleet list (the Segmentum Obscurus, Bastion Fleets List) it specifically says they do not.

What battleship would you recommend? My options are:

Apocalypse class battleship . . . . . . . . . 365 pts
Emperor class battleship. . . . . . . . . . . . 345 pts
Retribution class battleship. . . . . . . . . . 365 pts

>>13073285

Emperor and Retribution costs have been swapped. The proper price is in the Emperor's profile in GW's site.

>>13073327

Ahh I see. Yeah, I thought that was strange. So, the Ships of the Imperium pdf is more up to date?

>>13073285
Would suggest Emperor or Retribution. Apocalypse can be useful in the right situation but is generally considered the worse of the four battleships available to Imperial fleets. You only get the choice of three obviously, but the Oberon isn't a crippling loss.

>>13073360

If I take the Emperor: Shark assault boats? Only 5 points?

>>13073382
May as well, unless you really need that five points for something.

Battlefleet Gothic 1500 point Fleet List

Fleet Admiral 75 points
with extra reroll

Emperor-Class Battleship 370 points
with Shark Assault Boats

Exorcist-class Grand Cruiser 230 points

Lunar-Class Cruiser 180 points

Gothic-Class Cruiser 180 points

Dauntless-Class Light Cruiser 110 points

Dauntless-Class Light Cruiser 110 points

Sword-Class Frigate 35 points

Sword-Class Frigate 35 points

Sword-Class Frigate 35 points

Sword-Class Frigate 35 points

Sword-Class Frigate 35 points

Sword-Class Frigate 35 points

Sword-Class Frigate 35 points

Comes out to exactly 1500. Good?

Oh man, I've been reading the rules wrong...I assumed 6+ armor meant that you had to roll 6+ to save against damage...looks like it's the other way around. Damn, ships are tough.

>>13073538
Well, Imperial ships are especially tough on the prow. Chaos ships near-universally have a 5+, and Eldar ships are fragile as hell.

Your list looks okay. I would aim to proxy it a bit to get it down. Imperials have a variety of tactics available, and you should find out which one suits you best.

>>13073573

I was thinking of possibly taking two Firestorms, two Cobras, and three Swords (same points cost total) just to get some variety in there.

Additionally I was thinking of taking torpedoes on both the Dauntlesses - 3 lances vs 6 torpedoes, what do you think?

What are the downside of lances? Not as useful against hordes of escorts? I'm still getting a feel for how the game rules work.

>>13073624
Not useful against eldar

>>13073624
Lances lack raw firepower but make up for it with the special rules for lance weapons. A mix of lances and batteries is a good idea. I am not a big user of escorts so I don't really feel comfortable giving you advice on them.

Remember large sections of the ship will be abandoned

Eldar laugh off lances. Got it. Is there a fleet that ordnance sucks hard against? My two big ships are both carrier types.

I'm trying to copy IG ground tactics somewhat - send the expendable stuff forward to soak up hits while keeping the big heavy stuff back and firing from long range.

Did Craftworld Fleets ever get fleshed out? There's only rules for super "we saved money by using no armor" pirate ships.

I heard there were Dragon Ships that were the craftworld Fleet.

>>13073818

Yes, Craftworld Eldar PDF is in GW's site.

They have armor that is equal to that of Chaos ships, but still take crits easier like Corsairs. The fleet is more cruiser focused than the Corsairs but has worse escorts.

Funny how Dark Eldar ships are actually the toughest Eldar ships.

Maybe I'm reading the rules wrong here or something, but...

What is the point of using fighters to defend bombers in a wave? If you're targeting enemy ships with the wave, wouldn't you be better served in every case by sending nothing but bombers?

>>13073798
Nova Cannons or torpedoes are probably your best long range hitter. You can't neglect other ordnance, but non-torpedo Imperial ordnance is usually run as interference against enemy ordnance. Chaos will outgun you at close range, so your tactic of bringing long-range guns to bear is actually a fairly good one. Just make sure you have the weapons to do it, and the necessary defences.

>>13073912
Ordnance v. ordnance, I think. Of course, Orks don't have to make that choice, that's one of their strengths.

>>13073912

You'd want to include fighters in a wave because you can split them away to intercept stuff if need arises. The fact that they can defend bombers is just a bonus.

>>13073953

Spess Mehreen Thunderhawks also perform both fighter and assault boat duty.

>>13073953

Okay, so let me get this straight - if one squadron of fighters jumps a wave with two squadrons of fighters and two squadrons of bombers, it'll take down one squadron of escort fighters but the rest will get through, right? Or do they all get removed?

What about if you have a wave of four fighter squadrons that hits a wave of two torpedoes - do two of the fighter squadrons get removed, or all of them? Or just one?

Okay, counting it all up, at 1500 points I'll have 28 torpedo tubes and twelve squadrons of attack craft, eight of which can be assault boats.

I figure I'll keep the Firestorms back with the carriers to try to lance any major concentrations of enemy ordnance, but the other escorts can go forward at full speed and try to come about and flank the enemy once they pass them, if they don't just die. The second line will be the light cruisers, cruisers, and Firestorms, with the Emperor and the Exorcist in the rear, maintaining extreme range until the enemy is crippled by long-range fire, at which point they can safely advance and finish the enemy off with the help of their gun batteries. Seems good on paper. I think.

Well, good luck. Remember to try before you buy if you can, using proxies or something.

>>13074155

Yeah, for sure. I think I'd like to have a model for my Guard regiment's ship anyway, though, and that's half the price of my 750 point list, so that at least is kind of a no-brainer. The manager of the local GW is nerding out about running an epic BFG campaign for the store, and I wouldn't mind getting in on that, but we'll see how he follows through on it.

It's pretty easy to see which of the Imperial Navy ships are meant to advance forward. Heavy prow armour combined with torpedoes or nova cannons means advancing, long range weapon batteries and no prow armour/weapons (except turning batteries) means stay abeam and fire.

Emperor, Oberon, Exorcist and Vengeance are meant to go abeam and shoot the enemy with long range broadsides and launch attack craft. Lunars, Dominators and the like are meant to advance forward shooting their torps or nova cannons and start utilizing their short ranged broadsides when that advance brings enemies to their firing arcs.

Oh hey - if I hit them with bombers and torpedoes at the same time, their turrets can only fire at one or the other. Fortunately, I'll have plenty of both. Could be the way to deal with 5-turret battleships - either take d6 hits per bomber squadron or let all those torpedoes through. Ouch.

I should give all my ships Culture ship names.

>>13074233
It's not as easy to arrange as that in practice, and as I say non-torpedo ordnance is something Imperial fleets are often outpaced at, but yes. If you can pull that off, very good idea.

>>13074252
I will hunt you down and kill you slowly, and I read Culture novels.

>>13074233

Remember that Tau Gal'leath, Emperor and Oberon are the only 5 turret battleships. Retributions, Apocalypses, Despoilers, Desolators and Demiurg Strongholds all have 4 turrets. Tyranid, Necron and Eldar ships work a bit differently but don't have more than 4 turret equivalents in any case.

Tyranids are probably the most durable fleet against ordnance, since spores can intercept both attack craft and torpedoes at once and their launch bays can maintain twice their number of attack craft on the table.

Another thing to remember is that Imperial ships are extremely big but a lot of it isn't doing anything, a great deal of the walls are just flat and bare of any weaponry or bays of any kind, rather inefficient really. Still, it gives them bulk and it's harder to hit their weak points when you don't know where the hell their weak points are meant to be.

>>13074306
I took this as BFG advice at first and I was like, "Wait, no. Look. This fires in three arcs." Then I realised you meant fluff and felt like an idiot.

Of the playable fleets, humans and orks are the only ones that emphasize broadsides, and Orks probably do that only because their ships are so often built of looted human stuff.

Tau and Eldar concentrate their weapons to the front arc, Tyranids slightly less but much more so than humans, and all Necron weapons can shoot at multiple arcs and even divide their firepower between them regardless of facing.

>>13074348
Because Necrons are overpowered dicks.

Some upcoming changes, since HA is completing the FAQ and additional rules for submission to GW:

Concerning the Apocalypse, FAQ2010 allows its broadside lances to shoot up to 45 cm ranges on Lock-on orders without penalty. The Thrusters critical hit suffered from shooting 45-60cm does not cause a damage point loss either anymore, although it must be repaired like a normal thruster damage.

Mars and Armageddon class battlecruisers can buy additional turret for 10 points, in addition Armageddon can swap its torpedoes for a Nova Cannon for 20 points, and Overlord class battlecruisers get a 15 point cost reduction (to 220 points).

Imperial Navy's Grand Cruisers count as cruisers for battleship selection, and prow critical hits against Vengeance and its variants (Exorcist, Avenger, Executor and Retaliator) will be treated as if no critical had happened, meaning no reroll in crit table. Exorcists launch bays can take Shark Assault boats for 10 points.

>>13074613

Where are you getting this FAQ?

>>13074265

Those are two good Culture-style ship names!

>>13074306

Why would Imperial ships have large empty/useless areas? Aircraft carriers aren't bristling with weaponry from every available surface yet they still cram people on board very densely. I don't think they'd leave large areas of the ship vacant in combat just purely for damage control purposes if for nothing else.

>>13077323
Pretty much this.
Steel is cheap, it's usually the electronics which is most expensive. Reducing the ship mass might make it faster but I don't really think that is a priority for Imperial ship designers. Durability will probably be much more important. That extra hull space can be use as ablative armour, cargo area etc will would add much more to the flexibility to Imperial ships

I'm going to bump this because I am also interested in starting BFG, although unlike OP with a Chaos fleet. Can anyone give me some advice on Chaos ships?

>>13079345

lol chaos

>>13079345

There is a chaos ship with S16 side batteries. Get that. Get plenty of that.

>Sears Polocket

>>13079345

Choas cruisers are awesome. Their escorts aren't so good (imo).

A Styx class heavy cruiser should form the primary ordinance launching capability of your fleet. Not to mention that they look banging!

A Desolation class can be used for ordinance in lower point games. Their 60cm lances are very nice too.

Get Slaughter class cruisers. Firepower 14 to one side is not to be sneered at, and at only 165 points too.

Carnage class cruisers are excellent. FP10 at 60cm or FP16 at 45 will actually make mincemeat out of any eldar that so much as breathe near them.

>>13081155
>>13081067
Alright, thanks. Cruiser squadrons sound like a good option for Chaos?

>>13077125
https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0Bw_dULEfC3rbZGVmYjJiOGYtZmI5ZC00NTg1LTk4YTctNDgxZDE2NmE1ZGY4&so
rt=name&layout=list&pid=0Bw_dULEfC3rbYzUyNjQzZTAtMDZiMS00ZjRlLWJjNzMtYTE5YmNjZjdjODQ1&ci
ndex=2

Chaos players might find it interesting that the Styx cost is being dropped to 260 points.

and check out
https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0Bw_dULEfC3rbNmNhYmI3MDktMGE3ZC00NWU2LTk0M2EtMzcyZTkyOGNmZDkz&so
rt=name&layout=list&pid=0Bw_dULEfC3rbYzUyNjQzZTAtMDZiMS00ZjRlLWJjNzMtYTE5YmNjZjdjODQ1&ci
ndex=4

>>13081223

A superb option infact.

Group all of your slaughters in one squadron, and your other ships in another (Styx, Desolaters if you have them, and Carnages) in another.

The roving squadron of slaughters will be the main forward strike force, and when the firepower is combined against 1 or 2 targets, will easily be able to destroy a ship or 2 a turn

>>13081260
Wow, I would love to have one of these as a centrepiece but they seem a little underwhelming. Can you recommend them to me or point out why I'm wrong?

OP here. Looks like we have like 12 people committed to starting BFG at my local GW store.

The campaign will be combined BFG and 40k, fighting over a series of planets. For BFG, we'll be playing 1000 point games, and they haven't decided yet what the plan is for 40k (I'm guessing 1250, which means I'll have to pick up a lot of models). Looks like a lot of fun.

In 1000 points I'll have:

Fleet Admiral - 50
Exorcist-class Grand Cruiser - 230
Lunar-class Cruiser - 180
Gothic-class Cruiser - 180
Dauntless-class CL with torpedoes - 110
Dauntless-class CL with torpedoes - 110
Sword-class Frigate x4 - 140

I was checking out some of the other guys' fleet lists tonight - the Tyranids look goddamn terrifying. One of the employees is doing a Chaos list with some pretty nasty-looking cruisers that's a good matchup for mine - he doesn't have my 24 torpedo tubes but he's got a ton of weapon batteries, and he's got a slight edge on attack craft. The Ork player has a kill kroozer, a terror ship, and the rest of his points are in escorts, including EIGHT ramships.

The only fleets we don't have so far are Tau and Dark Eldar. Oh, and Necrons - which are banned from the campaign for being unbalanced. Woo.

>>13081574

The Styx can launch six attack craft squadrons per turn. That's a lot - my Exorcist can only manage four. Its lances and batteries also have tremendous range for a cruiser - double the Lunar's. It's also nearly as fast as an escort ship. It pays for this with fewer shields and hits and a higher points cost. It's not exactly a glass cannon, but it's got a lot of firepower and launches a lot of attack craft at the cost of being less resilient.

>In 1000 points I'll have:

Looks to me like you've got a bit more than that listed, chief.

>>13081260

If the changes go through, one possible 1000 point Chaos fleet could be:

Chaos Warmaster (50 points)
Desolator class Fast Battleship (300 points)
Styx class Heavy Cruiser (260 points)
Carnage class Cruiser (180 points)
Carnage class Cruiser (180 points)
Iconoclast class Destroyer (30 points)

Everything goes abeam

Otherwise one could try

Chaos Warmaster (50 points)

Hades class Heavy Cruiser (200 points)
Devastation class Cruiser (190 points)
Devastation class Cruiser (190 points)
Murder class Cruiser (170 points)
Murder class Cruiser (170 points)
Iconoclast class Destroyer (30 points)

Devastations go abeam, Murders and the Hades rush into the enemy. Eight launch bays and twelve 60 cm lances to one direction.

>>13088331
actually his list comes too exactly 1000 points, like he said.

>>13084878
I meant the flagships of the traitor legions, sorry. Should have been more clear.

>>13084336
That is no fun, you have to play Necrons in BFG at some point.

Tyranids are fine, Orks are a little weak and as you would expect Chaos are an excellent match for Imperials and vice versa. Encourage people to take up the Tau or Eldar, though. They are both fun to play and play against and you'll get bored coming up against the same three fleet types all the time.

>>13089887

They're pretty good, actually. Wage of Sin has the firepower of a Desolator Battleship with 15 cm lower range, same speed and on top of that six launch bays - worth of a cruiser's full broadsides.

Terminus Est has already been officially statted (link below) and the version is pretty much the same as it is here, the other Legion flagships are designed as roughly equivalent in power.

http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1280016_BFG_Powers_of_Chaos.pdf

>>13089956
Which would you recommend? I think they just maybe require a bit too much multitasking or skill for me to use properly right now. They seem like complex ships, apart from the Khorne one.

I'm now imagining an Aporkalypse-class battleship with a chainsword twice the rest of the ship's length affixed to it

WE'LL CUT THOSE FUCKERS PLANETS IN HALF

>>13089986

They all have lots of special rules, but if you're not afraid of them or using reload ordnance orders a lot, I'd suggest City of Light for funsies. Wage of Sin is a fast battleship and a carrier at once and hence obviously really good.

>>13090032
I think I'll try out the Wage of Sin first then. Can I ask you one more thing? I'm looking for advice vis a vis daemonships.

This thread must stay alive.

I realized that I could fit this into 1000 points exactly:

Fleet Admiral 50
Exorcist-class Grand Cruiser 230
2 Lunar-class Cruisers 360
2 Gothic-class Cruisers 360

Or I could drop a Gothic and take six Cobra-class destroyers. I kind of like the idea of just taking five cruisers, though, just because then it'll only cost me $75 to buy 1000 points, and it'll be simple to manage on the table.

>>13090350

Hmm...the tactic here I guess would be to break their line up with long-range torpedo volleys, reload, move into 30cm range and hit them with one they can't dodge, and then go through their line so hopefully I can get both broadsides firing. Meanwhile the Exorcist stays out at 45cm range providing fighter cover and fire support. Yeah, I'm okay with it.

>>13090574
I know nothing of the rules of BFG, but as far as general strategy goes, that sounds like a good plan. Just remember, if you get between their ships to fire both broadsides, you expose yourself as well, so make the best of it and try to cripple any broadside weapons they have with your attack.

>>13090727

The clever thing about what I'm doing here is that my ships have a pretty heavy lance armament (12 per broadside), and lances don't care about the direction their targets are moving, they hit instantly. So by attempting to move abeam past the enemy, their gun batteries are less accurate while my lances are not. And if I get between two enemy ships, I can give each of them a broadside from each ship, while they can only return fire with one broadside apiece.

Hopefully when I launch that spread of torpedoes, my opponent will go "OH FUCK TORPEDOES" and it'll mess up his strategy, giving me the initiative when we close.

>>13091308
Yes, but remember that your ships will still be between two enemy ships, so you could still suffer 2 enemy broadside attacks.

Eldar BFG player since release here.

Your tears are delicious.

>>13091445
Bah, your kind is annoying but not rage/tear inducing. Play necrons and then we'll talk.

>>13091464

I tend not to do too badly against our resident Necron player. Just force him to slipt his fleet up and and rape him with mass bomber attacks.

Although I generally stay the fuck away from his tombship though.

As opposed to our Ork and Tyranid players who I dont even bother playing any more, poor guys, have yet to lose against them.

Also fuck Nova Cannons and Blackstone Fortresses.

>>13091431

Yes, but if I have two ships and they have two ships, I take two of their broadsides and they take four of mine. And mine are not much weakened by moving abeam while typically theirs would be.

If I can divide their ranks by firing torpedoes at them, and fly between them, I'll have quite an advantage.

>>13091445

Yeah I'm not looking forward to fighting Eldar with my torpedoes and lance-heavy armament. My 12-lance broadside averages one hit against holofields, ugh.

>>13091514

If your opponent has only had a few games with Eldar then you should stomp all over him. If he's a veteran then yeah......you should probably prepare your anus.

DON'T MIND US, WE'RE JUST PACKING YOUR FUDGE WITH BOMBARDMENT CANNONS

Against Eldar it's fair to keep a necron fleet of only scythes+tombship at hand. A good tactic is just zooming to them, zapping their ships with holofield-negating lightning arcs and disengage to win via victory points.

>>13091514
Ahh, I see what you mean. I assumed you'd fit one ship between each of theirs.

And don't torpedoes do better against holofields? Since they explode instead of being a thin beam like Lances and all that.

>>13072502
>Where there's a whip...
>there's a way.
Oh you fucking glorious bastard. Brb youtooban.

>>13091593

Holofields give you a 2+ save vs ordnance. And standard torpedoes hit on a 4+ anyway. So my 24 torpedo volley will mean two measly hits, assuming they don't just get dodged by the Eldar's sneaky speediness.

Best fleets for taking out Eldar:

1. Necrons - fast enough to catch them, durable ships and their weapons will strip the eldar of their defences and hit into their tender nether regions
2: Other Eldar, use weapon batteries to ignore holofields. Craftworld and Dark Eldar have a slight edge due to more durable ships
3: Chaos, plenty of max range weapon batteries

>>13091770

Funny how the guys Eldar were created to fight against are the best at killing them, and have rules that specifically counter Eldar rules.

i've always wanted to try Battlefleet Gothic, with a small Imperial fleet. i'd like to represent a Rogue trader fleet, with some lovely nova Canons. What kind of vessel do you advise ? Is it mandatory to use battleships, even in a 750 pts list ?
i'd rather not have larger ships than a Battlecruiser...

>>13091873

No, you aren't forced to take any battleships, grand cruisers or battlecruisers at any point level when playing Imperial Navy. The BFG devs have been putting together a proper Rogue Trader fleet as well, it will be submitted to GW for review in a few weeks and if passed added to their site.

https://docs.google.com/leaf?id=0Bw_dULEfC3rbYzIyNDljYzEtNDAxNS00NjY2LWI2YjYtMTI2YzcwMGI1Yjhm&so
rt=name&layout=list&pid=0Bw_dULEfC3rbYzUyNjQzZTAtMDZiMS00ZjRlLWJjNzMtYTE5YmNjZjdjODQ1&ci
ndex=5

Any tips for a new tau player?

>>13092017

Here's how you cheese out the Tau.

If you play the Kor'vattra fleet which is the only one in GW's site at the moment, just take 1:1 ratio of Explorers and Heros, and fill the rest of your points with Orcas.

Drown the enemy in Mantas and laugh.

The above tactic is not the only way to play the Kor'vattra, just the easiest. Demiurg ships are fun to include and the Stronghold is really good.

>>13092057
That cutting beam looks like fun, and the FW models are the coolest things around. i guess blasting the other fleet with small spaceships that count as an entire bomber squadron holds true for the FW fleet? as i recall the ZOMG torpedos effect doesn't work to well because the torpedo ships need a big brother, so i'll try and keep the enemy in front & buried in flying titans

im liking the new marine rules-str8 bombardment annons? ta very much

im planning on running a very small scale campaign-players choose a 400point imp fleet each and have to patrol,with larger fleet actions made up of several players vs an npc fleet,

bad guys are chaos with some orc raiders,

finale will be a nid fleet attacking
any ideas/suggestions/input?

>>13092750
Necrons are the only suitable BBEG.

>>13091514
How's the campaign working? If you can have reserves in the campaign fit in other ships more suited to fight Eldar, and cycle between them as appropriate. Beware your tactic when going up against ships, especially fast ships, with very powerful guns. Necrons and Chaos will activate their rape engines unless you cause enough damage in the initial rush.

>>13092017

Start with Protectors. They are your backbone. Then buy one Radar Ship that negates column movement. Then back them up with Castellans. Lots of Castellans.

>scrutineer Epedgi

>>13091915
These escorts are sexy as hell, although it's a shame they just labelled every unique Xenos weapon a lance. The Rogue Trader Cruiser and Light Cruiser make me sad.

>>13093515
theyve called em all lances because all they are are a fluffed version of a rolled up ship.

i agree that the rules for rogue trader cruisers are poop- personally id use it as a counts as for a chaos murder or summat simular

>>13093460

What should an Imperial player take when hunting Eldar? Lots of Sword frigates and try to flank them? They are fragile when they take hits but good lord are those holofields some powerful protection.

>>13093872
well you want weapon battaries since they ignore holofields.
Personally my imperial fleet is grand cruiser heavy, long range themed so most of my eldar killing is done by my Vengeances and Emperor battleship. Though using a large number of swords to trap them sounds good. Try to manouver things so the eldar either no where to hide since they'll either be in escort range or cruiser range

>>13094000
Don't batteries get shifted one column by holofields?

>>13094126
oh you still have that i think. but they don't get their 2+ save so its still eldar rape.

>>13094126
but they hit on4s crit on4s an eldar dont get a 2+ inv save against them

>>13093832
Eh, Rogue Trader ships should be modular.

What do you do about Spess Mehreen strike cruisers en masse? Lances will work out against them, right? And staying at range is probably a good idea. Weapons batteries should probably be reserved for knocking out Thunderhawks.

>>13094536
yeah, use your lances and often enough superior range too cut them up. also they have a small number of launch bays so its not too hard to maintain ordnance superiority.

This thread still lives?

I have a question TG!
When I launch fighters/bombers, where do I place them relative to the ship?
Does it matter if they came from the Port or Starboard launch bays?

>>13094740
>TG
>TG
I am ashamed.

>>13094740
place em touching the base then move them off, doesnt have to be in a certain facing,

also you can combine all ordnance into one wing- so if you could launch 2 from either side you could place a single wave of 4

>>13094707

You can fit 6 strike cruisers into 1000 points. And then give one of them Terminators. That's 12 Thunderhawk squadrons up against my 4 fighter squadrons. Pretty terrifying.

>>13094921
that would rape, if get forgeworld ones it would also be rather cheap

so what workshops this campaign happening in?

>>13094921
Ouch.

>>13094921
oh you're asking about your fleet specifically.
yeah your gonna have trouble against that many launch bays, but any fleet thats massively ordnance outnumbed is.

Try keeping your ships in base contact to mass turrets so you get more shots against his waves, also remember he doesn't get his 4+ resilience save against this.

Also focus your fire initially to cripple his ships and them move on, a crippled ship has its launch capacity halved.

>>13094778
So effectively they all fire from whatever side I want. Neat.

>>13095280
Kroot would be nice if they weren't so damn slow.

>>13095182

It's at a mall near DC. Unfortunately I'm going to be in California for most of January so I'm going to miss the 'let's take a couple of weeks to assemble and paint our lovely new models' phase of things. I think I'll be able to catch up on that pretty quickly when I get back, though.

>>13094214
>>13094231
Oh batteries rape Eldar for sure, I just meant that the holofields do provide a small measure of protection.

why are ork roks so awesome

Hell yes I'll jump on this I've been wanting to get into BFG for forever and needed a little advice.

I have a 3000 point Tyranid army and wanted advice for the cheery old Tyrry fleet.

>>13095574
Is that an actual GW store? The one near me in Virginia closed a while ago, feels bad man. I searched for the closest and it was up near D.C., which is why I ask.

>Closest is almost 3 hours away.

Ah man, BFG, good memories from when I had people who played that with me.

Good old Necrons.

>>13095846
kit bash from 40k models, a box of termagants can easily be turned into 36 escort sized ships, more if you've got greenstuff. Warriors and Ravenors (3rd are the best ones IMO) are a good base for cruisers. I've seen a lot of people use fex's as a base for hiveships, though its not too hard to make one out of bits and green stuff.

Also if you take any hive ships you want more than 1, and the cruisers aren't needed but aren't bad either.
Also just note some game groups rule the extra upgrades as opponent permission only in one off games.

>>13095868

Ha, that might be my store, it's in Fairfax near GMU.

I work at the Gamestop right around the corner - between hanging out on /tg/ all the time and seeing the GW store every day at work it forced 40K into my brain. Now I have a bunch of intricately painted little plastic men and soon I'll have spaceships and I don't even know how I got started on it.

I thought Battlefleet Gothic was a dead game? What's all this about new .pdfs being released? Is it coming back?

Tyranid ships for that Tyranid guy

so ive been reading the new rules for chaos, is it me or are the slanesh abilities a bit good?

all ships within 15cm must take a ld or do nothing that turn but move for +10points

dont forget mark of slaanesh gives all enemies with 15 -2 ld

dont forget orcs and nids are limited to 15cm range for a great number of their weapons

>>13100249

That PDF is still on draft, and the devs have been informed (they respond to feedback, the first incarnation of the Inferno was an OP light carrier, look at it now). It and the Tzeentch ability will probably not make it to the final submission.

>>13095662

I've heard nasty things about the Eldar fleet.

Is it so bad that Necrons are actually required to counter them?