Yes

i use throwing knives, i'm also a hatchet thrower, and i can tell you the only difference is weight and wrist movement. you're less likely to fuck someone up with a knife, sure, but there is still a good chance of inflicting harm. if nothing else you get to distract them from shooting, etc. that's why spec ops and such are still trained with throwing knives, granted, to a lesser extent now than in decades past.

rocks thrown or otherwise would still fall under simple weapon proficiency, btw.

So is this the new "Masterwork Katana" schtick?

poop

what if I tie the knife to a rock and throw it

Fuck that, a small sling is high tier. Feel the concussion, bitch.

>>8638712
This, thrown knives are not really there to kill someone. Just distract them enough for you to get away. After all most people will duck when sharp, pointy bits of metal are flying at them.

That's it. I'm sick of all this "Throwing Knife" bullshit that's going on in the d20 system right now. Big ol' rocks deserve much better than that. Much, much better than that...

What if I tie a rock to another rock and then throw it?

Purpose made throwing knives are daft, but picking a knife that can be thrown effectively and learning to use it like this is a smart idea for a backup weapon. It's the sort of cheap trick that can turn the tables in a bad situation, especially if the blades good enough to punch through the skull. Also worth bearing in mind that thrown knives hit harder than held knives because of the spinning force.

>>8638816
Congratulations, you just made a bola.

Francisca here. Don't mind me, just being the best thrown weapon in the history of forever.

>>8638816
Then it counts as two attacks.

>>8638793
Idea; a quick self-deploying trap, when dropped on the ground fires off the mechanism and sends several daggers hurdling towards whatever direction the front of it is facing. Good for escapes, better when you know how to use it.

Yet throwing knives are still really cool looking. Sure they are not the most effective, but if effectiveness mattered more than coolness, spears would be the iconic fantasy weapon in fiction, not swords.

Besides, throwing knives look really impressive when they hit.

>>8638792
Concussion, only? Dude, they don't call sling ammunition bullets for no reason, a sling shot projectile is most likely going to embed itself in your skull, break your skull, take out and eye, chip out teeth, or seriously fuck you up if it clips you any other way. While it would suck to be in a castle siege armed with a leather sling while the guy next to you has a long bow or crossbow, but your still going to kill someone, or ruin their day.

Slingshots are serious business.

>>8638864
Boom, I win.

>>8638901
Oops, wrong pic, but slingshot wounds to the head or face feel just as painful and permanent

shrapnel missed him, and the couch he ducked behind absorbed most of the blast, now he comes at you with the axe!

A thrown knife has deeper penetration and more force behind it than a knife wielded in the hand.

>>8638942
I lol'd

>>8638816

What if I tied a knife to a rock, then that rock to another rock, gave up, threw that crap away, and tied a sword to a van instead?

>>8638988
Try it. Take a knife and stab it into plywood. Throw same knife into plywood (assuming you're capable of it) and you will get better penetration with the thrown knife than the held knife no matter how you stab the plywood.

rolled 14, 3, 6, 20, 17, 31, 18, 3, 4, 2, 29, 7, 14, 17, 12, 17, 7, 9, 17, 2, 30, 31, 9, 12, 26 + 33 = 390

>>8638793

>This, thrown knives are not really there to kill someone. Just distract them enough for you to get away. After all most people will duck when sharp, pointy bits of metal are flying at them.

Ask anybody who actually knows shit about ninjas and they'll tell you this is exactly why shurkien were invented.

Ninjas were Special Ops, so often they'd end up running like fucking hell with OVER 9000 seriously ripshit pissed off Samurai chasing them. Nothing stops people from chasing you like pointy things flying out of the dark at their faces.

Javelins and darts (i.e. small javelins) are another story, however. Also, shot-put, discus, etc.

>>8638901
Slings were some of the top missile weapons for a good period of human history. The prime advantage they have is that a footsoldier can use slings against other infantry, then switch to his real weapon when they get close. They've just got a strap of leather as added weight, compared to a large (and fragile) bow to worry about. Plus, you can use it as a tourniquet, lashing, strap, etc, giving it multiple uses outside the battle.

Yeah, it sucks compared to a bow, which can put 10 out of 10 arrows at the correct range, but it's better than doing nothing when you're facing down a charge.

rolled 9, 22, 10, 11, 9, 30, 33, 22, 1, 18, 14, 22, 28, 13, 1, 7, 31, 29, 16, 33, 32, 20, 30, 4, 21 + 33 = 499

>that's why spec ops and such are still trained with throwing knives, granted, to a lesser extent now than in decades past.

I'd also note that, much like the Spetznaz's backfipping hatchet attack, it has less to do with them expecting to actually USE that in combat and more with instilling the mindset that no matter what they have, even if it's a bendy straw, they can and will kill the enemy.

>>8639002
Then... Fuck Year.

That's it. I'm sick of all this "Masterwork Dart" bullshit that's going on in the d20 system right now. Throwing knives deserve much better than that. Much, much better than that.

I should know what I'm talking about. I myself commissioned a genuine throwing knife in Europe for EUR 500 (that's about $700) and have been practicing with it for almost 2 years now. I can even pierce slabs of solid steel with my throwing knife.

European smiths spend years working on a single throwing knife and fold it up to a million times to produce the finest blades known to mankind.

Throwing knives are thrice as sharp as darts and thrice as hard for that matter too. Anything a dart can pierce, a throwing knife can pierce better. I'm pretty sure a throwing knife could easily bisect a knight wearing full plate with a simple throw.

Ever wonder why medieval Britain never bothered conquering Europe? That's right, they were too scared to fight the disciplined peasants and their throwing knives of destruction. Even in World War II, American soldiers targeted the men with the throwing knives first because their killing power was feared and respected.

So what am I saying? Throwing knives are simply the best thrown weapon that the world has ever seen, and thus, require better stats in the d20 system. Here is the stat block I propose for Katanas:

(One-Handed Exotic Weapon) 1d12 Damage 19-20 x4 Crit +2 to hit and damage Counts as Masterwork

(Two-Handed Exotic Weapon) 2d10 Damage 17-20 x4 Crit +5 to hit and damage Counts as Masterwork

Now that seems a lot more representative of the cutting power of throwing knives in real life, don't you think?

tl;dr = Throwing knives need to do more damage in d20, see my new stat block.

>>8639023
That's plywood.

We are talking human flesh.

A hand held knife will get more strikes on the person and wound much more often, expecially in the hands of a knife fighter.

Throwing knives only give you one shot, and fucking it up means not only making the other guy laugh, but give him a sharp, pointy weapon to stab you with.

Again, throwing a pointy object at somebody will make them duck. Throwing Knives are an escape weapon, not a killer.

>>8639068
Unless you cover them in poison.

Or shit. Shit works just fine.

>>8638632
Rocks are heavier and tire a thrower out faster.

Knife throwing is a lot easier than the average person thinks and wounds can be pretty deep.

I'm not saying they are the best weapons ever, but they don't suck.

>>8639092
You could also throw shuriken, they'ree the same basic idea without the chance of hitting with the hilt.

>>8639092
NOBODY GETS TIRED FROM THROWING WEAPONS IN FANTASY ESPECIALLY NOT D&D

>>8639078
Shit works quite well

>>8639078

Yeah, cause killing them with gangrene five weeks from now is an excellent method of self-defense.

>>8639078
Covering your weapons in shit is pretty fucking worthless. Sure, it makes wounds more likely to get infected, but by the time they start feeling under the weather, you've been dead for a week.

Better to use cyanide or a neurotoxin if you want your poisoned weapon having a tactical use.

>>8639149
It's not about self defense, it's about making sure they die.

>>8639139

I like how he has an untiggered monologue about his shit-sword.

Throwing knives are concealable. Any rock big enough to seriously wound someone isn't.

>>8639061
Damn fine copypasta but you slipped up once before the stats.

>>8639155

Crusading Hooker?

>>8639181

Funny thing, rocks. It's as though you can find them just lying around everywhere.

>>8639235

Except indoors

>>8639227
Hookers would have been more effective than the children's crusade.

>>8639204
Here you go:
That's it. I'm sick of all this "Masterwork Dart" bullshit that's going on in the d20 system right now. Throwing knives deserve much better than that. Much, much better than that.

I should know what I'm talking about. I myself commissioned a genuine throwing knife in Europe for EUR 500 (that's about $700) and have been practicing with it for almost 2 years now. I can even pierce slabs of solid steel with my throwing knife.

European smiths spend years working on a single throwing knife and fold it up to a million times to produce the finest blades known to mankind.

Throwing knives are thrice as sharp as darts and thrice as hard for that matter too. Anything a dart can pierce, a throwing knife can pierce better. I'm pretty sure a throwing knife could easily bisect a knight wearing full plate with a simple throw.

Ever wonder why medieval Britain never bothered conquering Europe? That's right, they were too scared to fight the disciplined peasants and their throwing knives of destruction. Even in World War II, American soldiers targeted the men with the throwing knives first because their killing power was feared and respected.

So what am I saying? Throwing knives are simply the best thrown weapon that the world has ever seen, and thus, require better stats in the d20 system. Here is the stat block I propose for throwing knives:

(One-Handed Exotic Weapon) 1d12 Damage 19-20 x4 Crit +2 to hit and damage Counts as Masterwork

(Two-Handed Exotic Weapon) 2d10 Damage 17-20 x4 Crit +5 to hit and damage Counts as Masterwork

Now that seems a lot more representative of the cutting power of throwing knives in real life, don't you think?

tl;dr = Throwing knives need to do more damage in d20, see my new stat block.

>>8639139
What comic is this?

>character concepts you REALLY want to play, but can't play in D&D and be useful without restructuring the party and most of the game

>European smiths spend years working on a single throwing knife and fold it up to a million times to produce the finest blades known to mankind.

LOL! a million folds would destroy the metal. Fucking katanas were only folded a couple thousand times

>>8639274

Crecy, by Warren Ellis. It's full of Anglophile populist bullshit, but it's entertaining.

Throwing knives aren't very useful, but fucking awesome if you somehow get a kill with them

>>8639279
>character concepts you REALLY want to play, but can't play in D&D and be useful without restructuring the party and most of the game

So, Fighters?

>>8638896
This.

Plus a knife is going to be much better at killing someone than a rock if the person is trained in throwing knives. Untrained, rock all the way.

>>8639332
>character concepts you REALLY want to play, but can't play in D&D and be useful without restructuring the party and most of the game

>>8639149

I can't believe this post exists. I'm just flabbergasted.

>>8638632
They can double as a concealed assassination weapon in melee a la Assassin's Creed.

I prefer the cheese grater myself; small and easy to conceal.

>>8639418
It's actually true that covering weapons in shit was a rare practice. Mostly because it's a good way to get your teeth pulled out and your spine broken on a rack if the other guy won. That sort of 'low' behavior could compromise much of the protection afforded to knights, which meant that practicing it was an atrocity.
Not that the English cared, but then Patey happened, and they got theirs.

The problem with knives is a slight change of distance will make them hit with the butt, regardless of how much damage it might cause.

They also have much worse range than actual ranged weapons, and share with them the problems against armor.

About the sling, i'd say it's underpowered in D&D yes, considering it could break a skull. Perhaps it should have x3 crit, but remain at 1d4 damage, i'm not sure.

Though one thing to remember is that which stone you use actually matters, the Romans made lead bullets for slings (shaped like a small melon more or less) for example, so assumming you'll just toss whatever rock you can find wouldn't be a good idea, as each would fly different making aiming harder.

>>8639551
IIRC, throwing knives are weighted so they don't spin, but travel point first (like a dart)

That being said, a spinning knife would have a much larger force behind it (rotational + translational velocity)

>>8639696
That's mostly a matter of how you throw it, though if it's unbalanced it might turn on it's own even if you throw it "like a dart". From what i've read that kind of throw is used when accuracy is more important than power.

Then again the problems with knives could be solved by using a "double knife" (which i think could have some use in hand to hand too, but i've never tried anything like that) or just a blade without a handle, with two points and sharp all around. That way it'd be hard to not cause damage.

Throwing axes are still pretty damn manly, though, right?

My tempest fighter with Deft Hurler Style kills so many minions with thrown axes.

>>8639834

Or you could make it flat, with multiple bladed points.

>>8640007
I think we're onto something here!

A while back, I was trying to learn to throw knives, and it pissed me the fuck off, as over half the time I'd hit the handle, not the blade. I found someone on youtube, who showed sharpening the ends of music wire (about 5-7 inch lengths) or even drill bits. Even untrained, these 'throwing needles' or bo shuriken were a LOT easier to hit their mark.
as >>8639104 said, when the entire thing is pointy, it doesn't matter much which point hits

same reason caltrops work

>I'm pretty sure a throwing knife could easily bisect a knight wearing full plate with a simple throw.

Trollface.jpg

>>8639696
No the weighted ones that don't spin are darts and thrown with a different motion, they impact with less force.

>>8640007
Yes yes, funny joke.

But to take a realistic stance, there were multiple kinds of shuriken. The flat ones with blades all around are the most well known, but they had ones that were exactly as the previous poster described. Two sided blade with no handle.

The all around blade was much easier to actually get the pointy bits into someone, but it didn't do as much damage because the length of each spike was limited.

If you were more skilled, you used other kinds that needed a better throw. Harder to get in the target.. but much more damage.

>>8640152
The "double knife" style sounds like it'd pack the most punch (maximum inertia on each spike so to speak), unless we get into throwing axes of course.

>>8638632

Heavy ass rock upgrade. Gauntlets may be required

>>8638942

If it makes you feel any better, I know you are right. Fuckwads here never threw a knife. Also, I know for a fact spetsnaz still get trained in knife throwing.

>>8640215
To be fair, you don't need power if you can get one of the flying disk type shuriken in the neck. Any vital point, really. If you intend to actually bring someone down with these things, that is what you'll be aiming for anyway. Otherwise just throw them for the distraction, and power hardly matters then.

That said.. you could learn to throw a short sword. Musashi apparently could do it. He even recommended it as a secret technique. This implies he learned how to do it reliably.

Granted he was more monster than man...

>>8640236
>>8640236
Fuck yes. Minesweeper.

>>8638632
Not according to the LOTR SBG, They aren't.

Throwing Knives will butcher you and your village.

>>8640264
Hell, the black knight longsword toss from Monty Python and the quest for the Holy Grail was apparently done sometimes (though probably against unarmored targets).

>>8640255
It sounds pretty odd though, a thrown knife having more force behind it than one in your hand.

>>8638712
very few special forces ever get knife throwing training. it's next to useless.

if you throw a knife, it is going to land in a spot that is likely to cause a scream of pain. soldiers don't just stand around with their necks more visible than the rest of their bodies, and even if they did, they would still be likely to gurgle or gasp until they bled out, if they bled out. not to mention that getting close enough to throw a knife so precisely often means that you are close enough to just run up to the fucker and tear out his jugular anyway.
a suppressed weapon, while still loud, does not sound as distinct as a scream and is more likely to be ignored, or investigated with less haste.
and please, a backup weapon? for a sword, maybe. but you know what the ideal backup weapon is for a gun? ANOTHER FUCKING GUN.

>>8640331
Well, all this is really dueling stuff anyway. You couldn't do any of this in a proper war. Duelist might not be as comprehensively armored.. depending on how rich they were.

You might have an opening to throw at a vital.

Hm.. would a properly thrown shortsword make it through chain armor? Or at least do enough damage to fuck a bitch up.

>>8640391
Rifle/Carbine -> Pistol -> Knife. Isn't that standard?

Also the aim is to cut the carotid artery, not the jugular vein (though they're so close the jugular gets cut anyway), mostly because the artery is the one bringing blood to the brain, not away from it, so the death will be faster.

>>8640393
I wouldn't count on it, i think i'd rather keep the sword. As far as Europe goes, duels were usually either full armor or no armor (unless you count leather gloves as armor). I don't know about Japan before it became unified.

>>8640471
Well, I also mean conflicts that aren't large enough to count as battles. Smaller personal level fights. Plenty of reasons for those to happen.

>>8640504
It could be a noble raiding another, where they'd be armored, or self defense, though i doubt bandits would attack armed nobles (who i'd guess rarely traveled alone) often. Still, worst case they'd probably be unarmored and have sword, buckler and dagger on them.

Eh, generally a knife is used in close quarters... throwing is a great method to get them to back off but it takes a great deal of skill. Now, whether its lethal or not is usually important because it could be the difference between self defense and man slaughter. Assuming your an average joe that has a single knife secreted on his person for defense, you want to be able to surprise your attacker(s) long enough to flee like the fucking north wind. A knife to a soft bit will do that plenty quick.

Of course, I've had the luck to practice with rubber weighted throwing knives, and when it strikes their chest hilt first and they catch it, then proceed to liberate your kidneys from your viscera, yeah it sucks. Just make sure as soon as it leaves your hand, you are already running, and you should be fine.

My two cents for what its worth.

Problem with throwing knives is that they are not particularly good at other things, like holding an edge.

>>8640622

The way I see it, the edge only has to be held once, unless they are your practice knives. In which case you should maintain them regularly.

>>8640639
What I was saying is a throwing knife that is actually designed with throwing in mind won't be good for much else and you wouldn't be wise to use it as an all purpose field knife. The different steel used and the specialized blade shape hinder it's function as anything but a throwing knife. The weight wasted on a throwing knife would be better spent on something more important.

I think the biggest point here is that yes, throwing knives are useless in real life as an offensive weapon.

However, in D&D and other fictions, characters are larger than life and beyond human in capability. Characters who specialize in throwing knives are usually limited to "that mad skillz guy", the one who goes backflipping over his enemies, dodging everything, and generally dispatching the badguys with tact and finesse. Reliably killing people with something that'd be extremely difficult in the hands of an everyday joe is part of the mystique.

>>8640669
The only point of that kind of weapon is being easy to conceal and multipurpose (and perhaps cheap), otherwise you'd at least use a dagger, with something resembling a handguard and probably a bit too long to be thrown spinning.

So for rogueish characters it could make sense... except most of the time even the rogue carries some sort of sword (or two), maybe a crossbow and god knows what else, so concealed weapons don't help much (though if we're going D&D there was some way to use hidden weapons to get a "free" sneak attack i think).

>>8640669
Yeah.. to bring up Musashi again..

He had the right idea. You don't want a dedicated throwing knife. That's silly. What you want to be able to do is be able to throw your one normal backup weapon in a pinch. It's a one shot thing that you won't use very often. Hell, getting the chance to use it is rare anyway so just as well.

But all you need to do is get the ONE clean open hit to put someone down. Better to be able to do it than think, "Damn.. I wish I had practiced knife throwing," right before you die.

>>8640745
To be fair in 3.5 thrown weapons are pretty worthless overall (crazy optimization aside), mostly due to the good old problem of "you need 4 magic weapons with the Returning property since it only brings them back at the end of the round, also don't move too much or you're gonna lose them".

>>8640779
So a balanced bowie knife?
(I think that is what the first modern throwing knives were, big ass bowie knives)

>>8640799
A big ass knife would work.

Fuck.. if Musahi could accurately hit a small target with a friggin SWORD.. you can certainly muster the balls to do it with something smaller.

>>8638632
Uh-huh.

Slings should also require a proficiency to use since they're a hell of a lot harder to aim than a bow.

>>8640669

ah, that is understandable. You might be able to use a throwing knife to ward blows with the blade, but a for anything other than that your boned. A larger knife is significantly harder to conceal though. At least, in a place that is easy to retrieve.

I feel like the spiked chain is way more dumb than throwing knives.

>>8640890
Truth.

>>8640859
When translating from old sources it's hard to be accurate, he probably meant the wakizashi, but it might also be the tanto. Still, dart or javelin style toss isn't all that hard, though i'd guess for a surprise attack he'd use an underhanded throw. It could also be spinning of course, but that again has the problem of hitting with the butt.

>>8640960
Tanto sounds more realistic. Still, it's a good example to follow.

Real battle is all about the one decisive blow. Everything leading up to it is just trapping your opponent so you can get the blow. Doesn't matter what the last show is though. A knife in your face will kill you just as well as a sword in the face.

That said.. I think the OP was picking on the idea of dedicated knife throwers. Which is indeed a purely fictional archetype. The list of problems with it just mounts ridiculously high.. even in RPGs.

>>8641067
I think it'd made more sense if it was a knife/dagger specialist, with melee, grapple and throwing, using them whenever it fits, instead of D&D style fighting that tends to make those who use ranged weapons run away all the time to stay at range instead of switching to melee when appropiate.

there is no such thing as a knife fighter in the real world, there are people who brandish a knife to try and intimidate. and those who just walk up to their target and take it by suprise

I am really sad how little the world knows about melee combat.

Knives are for stabbing, not throwing. If you throw your knife, you lost a knife.

Imagine being so skilled that you can hit a target from any throwing distance with the right end of that knife.

Now imagine that you're fleeing, and you're throwing it at a target who is running after you. Can you still hit him?

Would you just prefer to run? Yeah. Yeah you would. Maybe drop some caltrops if you're a ninja or some shit.

If that guy catches up to you and gets in close, you'd be much happier to have kept that stabby, fast, nearly invisible weapon.

>In D&D, a wizard who studies books and spells and shit all day can throw a dagger at someone, but takes a -4 if he throws a rock at someone. How fucked up is that? Apparently the wizard happens to be a master fucking circus knife-thrower in his spare time

That's...a good point. Honestly this never occurred to me before, mostly because my players usually think that throwing weapons are for pussies anyways.

>>8641694

I teach knife fighting (well, edged weapon defense) to special ops... Am I a knife fighter?

>>8641937
Knife fighter fights knives.

The Fight against Knives.

Fighters Against Knives.

>>8641932

It just strikes me as weird that something, which in the real world is so incredibly difficult that it never actually gets used in combat, gets lumped in D&D along with every other 'basic' missile weapon--crossbows, javelins, etc.

Clearly the reason is that it's "cinematic"--people expect to be able to do it because it's common in movies and books. But then, it's stupid when it happens in the movies too...

itt: people know nothing about weapons.

Throwing knives is really fucking easy. Going out the back for one day with your kitchen cleaver does not constitute training.

>>8641903
I dunno about that. If I had three knives and my opponent had two, I'd probably take advantage of the time he'd take to run up to me to throw one at him. Even if it doesn't connect solidly it might be enough to cause a small wound or at least take some of his focus away. What else am I gonna do with my third knife?

Throwing knives were probably the poor man's semiranged weapon. You can hide them on yourself (unlike bows or crossbows) and they don't weight a whole lot (much less than rocks), plus other weird-ass weapons (like slings) are awkward, at best you could carry a slingshot or a blowgun disguised as a cane and even that is a bit long to set up. In any case, having them is better than not having anything to throw (aside from random objects) or throwing your real melee weapon/weapons.

Situational at best, but I can see why they exist.

How is a guy being able to reliably throw a dagger into people's throats any more ridiculous than all the other shit that goes on in the series?

>>8642017

Good lord, that is a stupid way to holster knives. You could fit the same number far easier on your gauntlets.

>that's why spec ops and such are still trained with throwing knives
difference in protection. BDU offers less protection from knives than chain mail or even leather.

>>8639279
I want to play this fucker right here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ezOofCCGxj4#t=11m26s

I don't care if it's weeaboo bullshit, I want to make a character who fights with a couple dozen, even a hundred, swords.

But the concept is basically unworkable in most standard RPGs. Unless someone knows a whole bunch about D&D 2e they aren't telling me.

That reminds me of my Neuroshima character.

We were ambushed by one of Moloch's Hunters - 12' tall, something like a robot tiger covered with blades and guns.

It took out one of our teammates instantly, shrugged off an EMP blast and some shotgun slugs, and then turned towards me. It got a tungsten dart directly into the optic sensors and went blind, and then a second one that severed its power supply.

We've ended up with an almost unharmed Hunter to be salvaged. And a dead body, but that's the name of the game.

>>8642380

Exalted can do it.

>>8642278

And spec ops aren't superhumans.

Poison.

>>8642394
I'm sure it can, but I have a policy of not playing Exalted.

Far too many bad experiences.

Beyond that, I don't know if I'd go quite so overboard as the video.

>>8642394
no it can't. artifact weapons are all that matter nowadays, and unless you're in a super high-end campaign where you can just churn out daiklaves, you're not getting more than one or two. and if you have that sort of infrastructure, you could just drop essence nukes on them.

>>8642453
at range a crossbow bolt would be better

up close - a dagger is great. But not for throwing - just stab a guy in the crowd seven times in the kidneys.

>>8642471
Crossbows can be heavy, and expensive. A throwing dagger has the luxury of being cheap, easily concealable or disposable. While a dagger is obviously a better weapon, there's times when you need few extra feet of range.

And if we've learned anything from mmorpgs (I haven't, not much at least), it's that it's a good way to start a fight. Pull now.

>>8642594
Sure, but there's better weapons.

Like a throwing axe, which is far more dangerous than a knife thrown, mostly because it doesn't even need to hit with the blade.

>>8642632
Heavier, though. Throwing axes are more of a warrior thing. Look at Gauntlet.

It's a matter of choice. Thieves/rogues traditionally use daggers, throwing or not. Can't afford the hand crossbows until later, and a light crossbow can be great, but it's more intensive than a throwing dagger. Slow reload, too.

>>8642139 Throwing knives is really fucking easy

They aren't effective; no army in history ever equipped their soldiers with throwing knives. They're just really unlikely to hurt the person you thow them at - what're you going to do, aim for the throat or the eye of a moving target who's just going to duck out of the way, anyway?

Ones that are actually big enough to do some damage & weighted for throwing are heavy, as well. For the same weight you could take a sling & some lead shot and have a more compact, easier to use, deadlier (a hit from a long sling could punch through ribcages), longer ranged and more accurate weapon.

tl;dr: They weren't used historically because they suck. They're used in movies because they look cool.

Slings are fucking powerful in real life. I believe (and not even trolling here) that they should do d6 blunt & piercing damage in 3.5e.

I've seen a guy with one hand woven from materials available about two thousand years ago put a hole in a 1/3" sheet of iron with a lead bullet. Scary as fuck, really, and not too difficult to become proficient with - took me about a day to learn well enough to hit a regulation archery target at 100 yards about 80% of the time.

>>8642730
The problem with slings was wind up time and space.

Really though, all weapons but bows get the shaft in D&D.

>>8642730

Yep; they're surprisingly powerful weapons. Only real downsides is they aren't as good against armored opponents as bows, and while they're more accurate than you'd expect, they aren't as accurate as a bow. Oh, and you can't group slingers tightly together.

On the plus side, they weigh practically nothing, and you don't need much muscle to use them - you can equip everyone in your army with slings for backup weapons (and this was common practice in parts of pre-roman europe), and the ammo is just lead shot or small rocks, (while arrows have to be made by a fletcher), so you can shoot all damn day without bankrupting your army.

When fighting a Goa'uld accept no substitutes.