I revel in the cannibalism and abuse.

>but there's still foo-

CANNIBALISM!

Gods... I hate Wiccans. My grandfather hated them too, even before they tried to get into the chaplain corps.
Do you think I'd be out here on the frontier if I felt otherwise?
Yes, Rome needs a strong frontier.
No, Rome doesn't need unwashed hippies clamoring at her gates. That's why I'm here. To bring Roman order, to stinking San Francisco. Revenge? That'd be good too.

This war with the hippies won't take long, and when it's over, I've got plans. The Santa Cruzians. The Reddingites! The Freznans and the San Joseans too, and then... To Los Angeles. To New Rome.

After all. The man who controls Rome... Controls the world.

fuck I remember when I was in afghanistan I was like if some shit like this went down I would be fucked. Then I thought If I tried to walk from eastern afghanistan to western europe then sail to america it wwould make a sweet ass movie if I dont get greased.

Also, I enjoyed the book.

>>13458391
The loyalty of the Catholics has always been to Rome, my brother! Mexico is with you!

>>13458391
I would join this man and serve as an intelligence chief in his army. Spies are always needed. I would also help with weapons working as I know how to build seige weapons and armor. I would take whatever books I have, take up my mother's bow (It's a black widow recurve, but /tg/ probably has no idea what the fuck that is or how good it is.) And join this man in saving rome.

>The loyalty of the Catholics..

They will be eaten first and their churches will be turned into abattoirs.

>>13458433
Seconded on behalf of Serbia.
Eastern Orthodox? There are no Eastorcs here, not after ten days without electricity, guns, and a shared border with Hungary.
But can we count on Italy to fall back in line?

This is the worst kind of science fiction. Bullshit of a particular kind happens, but where it would be plot-inconvenient to happen it just doesn't. No explanation, just a miraculous "for whatever reason," don't bother to fucking question it because there isn't a good answer, I just pulled the premise out of my ass so I could write about Mad Max, okay?

>>13458460
>>13458444
>>13458433
Then it is decided! The New Roman Republic shall stand, united, in the face of all comers. We shall acknowledge this new "ChristGod" as the holiest of all holies, for we respect his might, and the nobility of his people.

To commemorate this occasion, Saint Andrew Jackson shall be canonized. All opposed will be crucified.

i will simply be OPERATOR with bow and sword instead.

>>13458460
That jackass president of theirs won't care as long as he's got a chariot and a big house. He'll fold, but the Alpinos will make a useful addition to the armies of Rome.

>Implying any Swede would survive more than an hour without electricity
I am leaving this country in less than a week, can the change happen then?

Also Elephants. They are easier to get thanks to zoos, and a bit easier to train so long as they get fed and taken care of.

>>13458495
HAIL, ROME, VICTORIOUS!

>>13458502
You mean tacticool crossbow with laser sight, front grip and silencer?

>Civilization collapses
>Slow reformation from the ashes
>Wicca becomes a dominant new religion
WHAT.

>>13458539
Laser sights no longer work, unfortunately. You could go ACOG though.

>>13458560
ACOG is batter operated, lawl.

Living in England, I'd get the fuck out of town, onto farmland/invade and fortify a village, and preserve as much knowledge as possible. If possible hole up with a few hundred people, get all of them trained in using shields and later on various weapons.
The big plan would be to get all the people I can who're skilled in something useful teaching the people who are not so we can farm, fight, loot and survive. In the end I think the medieval swiss would be my closest model, with added hoarding of books. Seriously, Brotherhood of Steel type hoarding of knowledge.
Big problem though would be people seeking refuge as a fortified camp would be obviously a safer place than most, and having shanty towns building up around is a potential nightmare of disease and bad shit so gotta get out there and drive off the useless leaches with force.

>>13458495
>>13458391
TRUE TO CAESAR

You know what, I would also stock up on body armor, I am not sure if it would work as well I would think. I need a sci person up in this house to determine if something that regularly stops high caliber rounds would stop a sword or crossbow bolt.

Upstate NY here, I'd probably head north into the harsh and bitter wastes of Canada. Ek out a living there so I have natural protection from raiders. I might die but, hey, its better than getting raped to death and then eaten by redneck pig farmers.

>>13458597
Kevlar is also known as a 'stab vest' since it is worn really to prevent being stabbed and it only moderately protects against small caliber pistols. So a kevlar stab vest would provide protection from crossbows and swords fairly well. A PASGT helmet would be nice too, since their padding is way better then medieval helmets.

>>13458391

As a representative of the Midwest we would like to join New Rome

>>13458495
Our first objective should be to acquire as many high quality bows, crossbows, any missile weapon that still functions, as possible.
These WILL break over time, but they will give us an early lead in weapons tech that should carry us until we can re-establish the legion.

Imperator, I recommend that we not try to be fancy. Discard all modern materials, do not try to scavenge: We must get back to basics quickly and master them first. Chainmail, broad shields and short swords, in proper Roman style. We must establish trade-schools to educate others in the construction of such devices.

Aside from this, the extremely fertile valleys in the south must be our first conquest. I would recommend that this be our first move.

>>13458597

Generally, yes, modern body armour would still be good against what you'd be encountering. It'd certainly be better than nothing by a country mile. If you go and combo historical with modern, good gambesons with kevlar would be great as you've got the shock absorption of layers of fabric/stuffing and the wonderfully tough nature of kevlar that'd be good for stopping stabbings and cuts.

>>13458649
All are welcome in the glorious Republic of Rome.
However, some culling will be required. We have heard of this dangerous phenomenon called "Protestantism," and while I hold no conviction on right and wrong myself, religious conflict within our borders is unacceptable.
Any who even suggests that our glorious nation is unholy are to be crucified. Have you the stomach for that, midwesterner?

>>13458658

Slings, if you've got companions (and you really should) and you can't get crossbows for everyone, get slings. Nothing simpler for making throwing shit at other chucklefucks easier and better. Even kids can use them after all.

Guns don't work? Like guns the machines? Or the bullets don't work? If a gun wouldn't work i'd have my doubts ever being able to reach the end stage of crossbows again.

All silliness aside, I think Europe would fair better than most places, since there's still plenty of old castles sitting around, ready to become the new nexii of what remains of civilization.

>>13458693
I've read the books, it's the bullet part. Cannons don't work either, nor bottle rockets even.
This is never adequately explained, mind you.

>>13458658
That was the downfall of Norman Arminger.

THE WORLD HAS FALLEN. OBVIOUSLY NOTHING INVENTED IN THE LAST 500 YEARS HAS ANY WORTH.

I'll be over here adapting pre-built sewage systems and figuring out if I can reproduce antibiotics.

Fuck the New Roman Republic, I intend to recreate the greatest empire in history, THE MOTHERFUCKING MONGOLS. THE MIGHT OF OUR BARBARIAN HORDES SHALL CRUSH ALL THAT STAND BEFORE US AS OUR SOLDIERS RAPE AND PILLIAGE THEIR WAY ACROSS THE COUNTRYSIDE. So yea, fucking horses and recurve bows.

>>13458658
>.Chainmail

Mail will take too long to get a lot of, you'd be better scavenging metal for plate armour, and better off for it protection-wise. Even just kitting out your soldiers with a helmet and breastplate will help keep them alive and confidant.

>>13458698
Parts of it, definitely, but I think the real winners of this whole enterprise will be Turkey, Egypt and Northern Africa.

I side with whomever will keep me alive the longest. I make a crude sword, and hope to whatever the hell is up there, that all the time I spent as a kid spazzing out with a plastic sword will somehow help me not get killed.

>>13458717
Mongol Empire was 4 times the size of the Roman empire. Just sayin'.

>>13458717
And watch it fall apart as soon as you die since it's held together by a single warlord.

>>13458703

That's a lot less retarded. I mean, it's still a big trip into the fantastical, it's slightly easier to rewrite the chemistry books than the physics ones.

I'd set off to make the modern day Library of Alexandra; there's a gap in society where there's no weapon of authority and class division. People are going to fumble around with how to intimidate and control. This isn't going to come again, ever. I'd use that time wisely to preserve what we had before.

>>13458753
The Mongol Empire also collapsed periodically every 15 minutes.
And much more importantly, the Mongols were a strong people. In 500 years of desperate siberian goat herding, maybe you will be half as strong as they. But probably not.

>>13458757

Welp, Alexandria lost an 'i'. This is what happens with the decay of historical knowledge. You maniacs, you blew it all up.

I suspect you Americans did it. Or China. Or the Swiss.

>S. M. Stirling
>Don't really dislike books, but the best explanation he can give for a premise is "Giant Space Bats fuck with humanity."
>mfw

>The Change occurs
>wiccans and renfairefags are major powers

This, but with a crossbow.

>>13458677

Yes for you see long have we the Catholics of midwest hated the Protestants. this shall be a day celebration one to be remembered for many years. You shall find our stomachs more than suitable for this task.

>>13458707
Obviously Rome desires a strong sewer/aquaduct system, but what I am sure my dear Tribune here means is that we must not scavange off of the corpse of the old world.
And he is correct. If we satisfy ourselves with cannibalizing car doors for shields and football pads for armor, then really, aren't we just the Legion from New Vegas?

And I'd rather not be them. We will use what we can, and we will repair what we can, but we *must* focus on regaining the ability to produce for ourselves, to make our own cities and our own swords and armor, while we still have people with the knowledge to educate us.

>>13458791
Then we welcome you. Orbis Et Domina, Frate.

>>13458341

>HERP A DERP CHEMISTRY AND PHYSICS NO LONGER WORK AS THEY USED TO FOR NO REASON

>>13458787
Actually he explains it later as "the ancient gods decide to save humanity by taking away their technology which is too dangerous."

Of course, doing that KILLS 95% OF THE WORLD'S POPULATION, but no one thinks to bring it up when the Celtic gods show up to chat.

Which actually answers my question. If this happened, I would declare any worshippers of the gods that slew nearly everyone enemies of all humanity.

Then I dedicate my life to bringing down their temples and finding a way to strike back.

I will create an Eastern New Roman Empire
in Miami.

>>13458864
>>13458864

>Actually he explains it later as "the ancient gods decide to save humanity by taking away their technology which is too dangerous."

>Of course, doing that KILLS 95% OF THE WORLD'S POPULATION

Fucking Miracles, how do they work?

>>13458707
>I'll be over here adapting pre-built sewage systems and figuring out if I can reproduce antibiotics.

This is the attitude that will be keeping mankind out of the dark ages, and exactly why I will be creating a grand library, a center of science and engineering. We must re-learn the arts that have been lost or at least kept only to the few in the western world, though thankfully my home town is chock-full of people with useful knowledge of what did and did not work in the past.

Unfortunately most of the people will have to very quickly re-learn how to farm. or at least take orders from people who know what they are doing, and dig. So much digging, can't even plow properly until we manage to loot enough horses and bulls, train them and equip them.
Theres a good amount of farmland in this area but not a lot of it is actually food crops, more rapeseed oil and sheep/beef cattle. Well, taking a hint from king of dragon pass, cattle is essentially wealth. We're all actually in a good position as far as livestock goes due to the insane production of milk, eggs and so on, along with the greatly increased size of most farmed animals over the ones from previous centuries. So at least we can all feed more with what we have.

With the downfall of the capitalist world, the revolution can begin afresh! With my loyal comrades in arms, we will spread the teachings of Marx throughout the world!

>>13458878
And where will this library be, frate? Er, brother? Friend?

>>13458864
That was actually Dale Cozort, and even he said
>"Just say to yourself, 'The elder gods or alien space bats took our toys away and that’s all there is to it.'"

Wikipedia is your friend.

>>13458885
I am now realizing how much better those books would be if he replaced the fucking wiccans with communists.

>>13458873
As is just and proper, brother. I shall see you in the middle!
...So, which of us has to take Alabama?

>>13458877

And I don't want to talk to no Deity. Those motherfuckers be lyin' and getting me pissed!

>>13458885
If you and your ilk dare set foot in the Midwest I can guarantee you and all of your godless Marx will be crucified!

>>13458940
You dare interfere with the rightful progression of the world? Prepare to taste the wrath of our hammers, fascist!

>>13458908
Wikipedia IS my friend. It's where I found this out. He says that in one of the start books. In one of the later books the Celtic gods show up to the Wiccans and say "LOL IT WAS US ALL ALONG."

Then they give the head Wiccan a magic sword.

Not shitting.

>>13458864
>"the ancient gods decide to save humanity by taking away their technology which is too dangerous."

THIS IS WHY NOBODY WORSHIPS THOSE FUCKS ANYMORE!

>Wreetche spirits
That they are, Captcha. That they are.

I already live in a rural area. I actually live on a farm, next to a hunting preserve, can ride horses and have access to two, am learning how to hunt with a bow RIGHT NOW from a sportsmen's club and a seasoned hunter, and have a library full of titles about homesteading, animal husbandry, and agriculture.

I'll be fine.

>>13458940
Fear not, Frate. We Californians know well how to handle communists: A third of our people have already fallen to their taint.
But they shall be the first culled, for the American Communist is the weakest creature on this Earth... Except perhaps the Swede.
All will fall before the might of Rome. This is inevitable.

Oregonfag here. So... you know. Live in salem... Go hang with Eric?

>>13458971

>Break Physics, where combustion, such as burning wood, can work, and combustion, such as burning oil in order to power machinery, cannot work.
>Create Magic Sword

These books have an interesting premise and a completely non-conflicting, believable setting in which a person can suspend their disbelief in order to enjoy it.

>>13458971
Oh fuck that. I'm a secular humanist, so help me nonexistent God I will take mass and convert before I hear I was saved by fucking Lugh.

>>13458979
The pathetic capitalist pig-dogs lack the organization to truly recreate the roman legion, and will be overwhelmed by highly organized communist forces!

>>13458901
Good question. Problem is theres plenty of good urban sites for it within a 20 mile radius of my home town, but combining that with farmland and moving people, eh best best would be if I take a reasonable amount of territory would be Oxford.

Or at least, stealing everything possible from Oxford and every library in a 100 mile radius of the eventual settlement and fort would be great.

>>13458979
By Your word
>>13458968
But this fool mocks us. How should we proceed my liege.

>>13458997
>Oh fuck that. I'm a secular humanist, so help me nonexistent God I will take mass and convert before I hear I was saved by fucking Lugh.

>>13458864
>Of course, doing that KILLS 95% OF THE WORLD'S POPULATION, but no one thinks to bring it up when the Celtic gods show up to chat.

Just pointing out that you were not saved, just less damned than the majority of humanity.

>>13458999
Capitalist? You Bolshevik weasel, we are not capitalists, we fight in the name of an idea, a united, glorious, sacred Rome!

>Live in Olympia, WA
>Everything north is a deathtrap
>Eastern WA sucks
>Olympic peninsula is way too empty and mountainous
>My only hope for a relatively happy life is sneaking past Portland and joining up with Mike Havel or the Mackenzies.

Good thing I'm an endurance runner and a quiet person.

>What do you do,

Dive of starvation along with several; billion other people.

Mechanized agriculture and transportation networks are necessary to support the planet at its current population. If the tech stops working, 95-99% of us are dead.

>>13458971
....Not really. One of the things about the emberverse is that any 'magic' has a plausible explanation, so that you can decide for yourself.

Honestly, I can see a lot of the crazy fundie christians hitting the wiccans and various other heretics and heathans pretty hard, especially in the US where protestantism has its crazy dialed up to 11.

>>13459016
It starts off that way, but the later books make it blatant.

THE GODS SHOW UP TO CHAT.

THERE IS A SWORD BLAZING WITH LIGHT.

Granted, it's like 8 books of as you say, 'magic' before these last 2 go into MAGIC!

>>13459023

I'm okay with fundie christians being angry, just as long as the Church Universal and Triumphant keeps to their caves in Montana.

>>13459008
Calm yourself, my carnifex, calm yourself. There will be time enough for the rough words of a rough beast. And you have my promise, that you will be that beast, when that time comes.

>>13459002
They are beneath your concern, consul. How many peoples have risen up from slavery and demanded an imaginary freedom? How many have promised the world and a jug of wine?

We offer more than a dream. We offer a reality. We offer an idea that we know can work, has worked, works even today. But with the collapse of all order, it MUST work again, or else all will fall to ruin.

man.. this would be the worst apocalypse i know of.

Going to try and stick with >>13458878 maybe. i know my book learnin' and i am willing to dig with blisters until i get those nice useful callus.

But overall? if things were never going to get better in a technological sense?

fuck.

might just shoot my.. right, nevermind that. replace that with "i might just develop a mild cough from working in cold weather that quickly becomes rampaging pneumonia, acting as a drain on resources and manpower until i finally expire, because the rather simple medicines that would cure me are farther up the tech tree then "use rock to kill things, cook it with fire"

bad end.

>>13459008
You are trying to build that idea off of American citizens. Yes, I am as well, but given the communal nature that would be necessary for survival, it is more likely that my ideals will succeed. Add the fact that you are foolishly trying to build your "Glorious Nation" in a desert. I will scare the buzzards away from your bones, fascist.

>>13459002
You have my bow. And my access to Kevlar stab vests. I have always wanted to go back to my place of birth and page it of communist. I had this urge after reading the zombietime blog.

We should also capitalize on airships, namely balloons. Helium will still work.

>>13459039

From the very beginning I felt calling the series science-fiction was a bit of a misnomer. When that happened later on I felt vindicated.

It's just fantasy with the modern world as a backdrop.

>>13459050
For got the 'hot air' part. Oil lamps use 'UNHOLY COMBUSTION.'

>>13459016

>One of the things about the emberverse is that any 'magic' has a plausible explanation, so that you can decide for yourself.

Explain how you can burn things, but not use the energy to burn things in order to power engines.

Explain how you can burn things, but not ignite a known explosive material to create heat and pressure in order to fling an object.

Explain how magnets and electricity, for no apparent reason, refuse to work when used by people, but, the exact same principles behind electricity which results in effects like lightning can still work.

Explain how the multitude of chemical processes in a person can work, but not the simple chemical process to produce electricity in a battery.

>>13459039
*Cough*
>Wikipedia is your friend
>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Emberverse_series#Myth_and_magic

>>13459073
Alien Space Bats fucking with humanity.
Directly from either the first or the second book.

>>13459065
We shall own the land and the skies. Now all we need is a ship builder and we shall own the seas.

>>13459048
Los Angeles will be the heart of our Empire because it has the San Fernando valley, whose farmland is some of, if not the, most fertile in the United States, and because its irrigation system could theoretically be operated without electricity... And also because it is completely unassailable. The only more natural fortress-city in California is San Francisco, and we will take it quickly from the weaklings who hold it for just that reason.

I have not simply chosen a location arbitrarily, I in fact make my dwelling today nearly a hundred miles from that city, but it MUST be the center of our nation if we are to survive.

>>13459075
Wikipedia really IS your friend.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Sword_of_the_Lady

>There Rudi is transported in front of Maiden, Mother, and Crone who have taken the form of Rudi's mother (Juniper Mackenzie) and Marion Alston and Swindapa from the Nantucket series. They explain the reason behind the Change, alluding at the humanity's importance (the Fermi paradox) and that certain forces saw the need for humanity to mature more before it self-destructed due to abuse of technology. They also explain the powers that are aiding CUT as a result of a disagreement between those forces on how best to guide the humanity. Rudi is last seen removing the Sword of the Lady from its sheath. Back in Montival, Juniper calls on the help of the gods against the CUT in a ceremony. During the ceremony light emanates from Juniper's hands and she proclaims the coming of the High King.

>>13459089

And that is a shitty explanation which says nothing about how the exact same processes can work or not work depending on how you apply them.

>>13459090
Santa Cruz here. We've got a department at UC that made a longboat a few years back, and apparently Redwood is fucking fantastic for that, so we've got the materials too. Shouldn't be too hard to round the professors up again, nobody here can walk more than a block or two once you take their Priuses away.
But we'll need some proper Roman rule here, these people are completely out of control.

No more capital/labor division. No more useless corporations or class based unions. Once more the owner will be one of the craftsmen, the master leading the journeymen and teaching the apprentices.

The guilds are back.

I'm ok with this.

>>13459117
Leave the anarchists and the communists of california to me...

Since fires and boiling would have to still work for anyone to survive at all, I propose we begin THE NEW GOLDEN AGE OF STEAM.

>>13459050
They shall be taken with great humility and respect, and together we shall kill this socialist disease!

>>13459117
Santa Cruz... That is in the north. Very good, brother, very good.

So, we have the Midwest, Los Angeles, and a foothold in NorCal. Once we seize San Francisco, we will have sufficient population and industry to halt expansionism and begin consolidating our gains.

When the time comes, brothers, speak the words "Roma Nobilis" to any you meet. If they are my agents, they will point you to me. For now, I go to that tedium that is life.

>>13459162
It will take some time, but my friends and I who live in the capitol hill of this country have some sway, give us some time and we shall cross the Missouri and Rockies and gain more allies to join you.

>>13459150
>GOLDEN AGE OF STEAM

>i'mokaywiththis.jpg

>>13459114
And yet the books are not hard science. However, neither are they fantasy. Even with the gods and magic, none of them actually do anything, leading to the possible explanation that they are hallucinations.

>>13459104
All I see from that is one character has a vision that shows him a vision of his mother, as well as a bunch of wiccians participating in a ceremony where they might or might have not ingested drugs that would cause hallucinations, I haven't read the books in a while so I can't recall, I'm sorry.

>>13459089
Magnetism stops working. All life on earth dies as atmosphere is blown away by solar winds.

Oh, you poor fascist fools. Do you not realize that the northeast has the best chance of survival? While you try to scrape together a society amongst the ruins of your dissenting cities, the Party will swell to the point where you cannot resist...

>>13459162
I look forward to our liberation. I will begin training the troops.

With our Imperator gone (probably to a poor paying job at Staples, alas the mighty have small beginnings) what are our alternatives? If, god help us, Rome should not come to pass, how will we endure? What other options are there?
Aside from the communists of course.

>>13459150
Because the "Change" appears to be selective, it's likely steam power wouldn't work either since it's 'technological'.

Given what we know about the Change, it's likely to assume rather than changing the laws of physics, the mystical powers behind it simply disable any technology advanced beyond medieval when used.

Which of course, means that killing them ends the Change.

>>13459193
You share a half of the continent with New Jersey. You are dead men.

>>13459204
Have you read The Salvation War, my good sir? I believe we may have a solution for our problems.

>>13459214
Let me begin my psy-ops campaign proper, and watch their "party" turn into nothing but Jersey Shore expies fist bumping and saying "Fuck Yeah this is a party!" No one will take them seriously...

>>13459204

That's just...

You know what, fuck this universe.

I'm going home.

>>13459195
No matter what, you'll do well to secure horses and begin encouraging equestrian society, even if you have access to, say, bicycles and the like.
We'll need cavalry, and the best way to get cavalry is to get people who can ride and teach them to fight, rather than get people who can fight and teach them to write.

>>13459233
>teach them to write
Jesus Christ, Ride. I mean Ride. Writing too, that is probably important, but Ride moreso.

>>13459214
Oh, ye of short sight. First, we shall stay in the woods and rural areas, building up out capacity to feed our armies. Then, when the hordes of capitalists who seek the flesh of men die off of hunger, we shall descend into the cities, using their metal, their rubber, their relics of knowledge, to bring back the glory of the past! And then, we shall sweep to the south, like the scourge of god, unifying all before, spreading the glorious manifesto!

I'm just wondering how this would actually happen.

I think the most pressing thing would be water. Within 2-3 days most people would have exhausted their immediate supplies and start to look for public sources. In rural areas it wouldn't be that bad. In urban areas it would be extremely difficult. Water sources would be majorly contaminated.

In the first few weeks and months there would be major looting. Fire's buring out of control. The military and government would probably stand up quite well, but incredibly slow to respond and pretty much unable to respond on a large scale.

They would probably form a basis around which refugees would cling, but in turn lead to unsanitary conditions of diseases and starvation.

I'd say within 6 months 50-75% of the population would be dead of starvation, disease and public disorder.

The society that would emerge out the other end though would be probably quite stable. I'd imagine the military specifically and as result the government would actually survive quite well. They're simply too organised to fall apart completely.

>>13459189
But there was nothing ingested mentioned in the ceremony... You're really stretching it here. Beyond that.

>As both ships arrive at Nantucket, reality begins to change as alternate versions of Nantucket begin to appear at random.

If you say all that could be hallucinatory despite no cues or clues in the books, then you can apply the same thing to every other franchise.

Maybe Luke Skywalker just hallucinated all those floating rocks and stuff on Dagobah. Star Wars leaves it to you whether or not the Force is real.

>>13459241
Your woods will be burned under the fire industry while your men and women fall to the temptations of sloth and and the trappings of New Jersey, New York. Your people will not retaliate, they shall not wish to. Your woods will not exist, I will ensure that your woods and your wildlife are harvested for the glory of Rome.

>>13459241
Ah. The barbarians. You are necessary for Rome to exist. Shadow must have light. I think we will be good friends, in our own way.

>>13459273
I am normally unconcerned for our Empire, but God help us if we should reach New Jersey.
That means we have already absorbed Utah. And what horrors that would involve are beyond me.

>>13459273
By the time you have walked from your soft, Roman cradle in the southwest, we men of the north will have created our utopia. And with these hardy comrades behind me, I shall lead the last, great revolution.

Wait, is Roman-Hitler gone? Because I wanted to ask him if we would model our armies after the Marian legion or the later, Plumbati-armed legionaries.

>>13459302
The arena my friend, the glory of the Coliseum. It needs to draw it's strength from somewhere. Believe me when I say every darkspot for Rome shall have a spot of light.

>>13459241

In south you will find a stubborn proud and very religious society. One where your godless max has no sway and in there hour of need we shall come to aid them and you and your failed ideology shall be wiped out!

>>13459233
bicycles and horses would be super important to any fledgling society. Gotta have information about the area and communication, gotta have animals strong enough to work the land and to pull transports capable of moving large amounts of items. Without that, where is trade, or migration? Self-sufficiency can only get you so far.

Binoculars and telescopes would be very handy, as would every single plank, board, nail and tool that can be used to build with. Those first few days would be critical in saving, storing and preserving food, seeds and animals. If you don't get to good farm land or defenses against the inevitable hordes of the desperate, starving and violent refugees then say bye-bye to any chance of rebuilding. If you start out in a coastal or other area with lots of rivers and lakes area then you are at a hell of an advantage.

>>13459259
essentially, my argument is that S. M. Stirling is a soft sci author, not a fantasy author, because magic doesn't really have any effect, as far as I can tell.

As to that particular scene, that's perfectly acceptable, since that specific landmass got transported through time and space in the Nantucket series, which would imply that it would be able to do so again.

>>13459318
>Roman
>Soft
Holy Christ, you do not know what you are up against. Long before we ever meet, being as we are on opposite sides of the continent, we will have fought through Arizona, Colorado, Utah, Texas, Nevada, Alabama, Nebraska, New Mexico, every harsh, horrible environment on the continent, every agrarian people and every warlike folk. Our warriors will be men of Mexico and the Mojave, our horsemen, the slayers of the great state of Dakota, and the remnants of the Comanche, the Apache, the Navajo.

What do you have to offer in, of all places, *New England*, that could threaten us?

>>13459349
Cannibal hordes numbering in the millions, desperately fleeing New York City and other overly urban areas. Similarly, we'll have been fighting in the colder climates as we expand throughout the northeast and Canada. The great lakes will be rough, but we should be able to handle it.

>>13459383
Our great leader said nothing of Canada. Even he is not so bold as to attack those northern reaches. If that is your desire, than I encourage you to rid us of yourself by bandying with that savage folk.

>>13459318
You underestimate the yeomen who control the lands beyond your urban death traps, you marxist swine.

You will be ridden down by our riders, skewered on our spears, and riddled with our arrows.

When your masses of unfed desperates are too large to be directly overcome, we will evade your strength, bleed your flanks, destroy your logistical train, and strangle the serpent that is your red army.

Your blood will make next years crops grow that much stronger.

And if these faux Roman pretenders want to play in the northern forests and northern plains, we will show them why their namesakes kept the fuck off the taiga and steppes.

Sterling was a nitwit, those 40 bottom plows that are useless without tractors can be disassembled with hand tools and turned into single bottom plows that can be pulled by a team of strong men, an ox, or a horse, and the amount of land that can be turned by that method is sufficient to feed the 10-15% of the worlds population that lives where food is grown.

>>13458864
DAMN THE GODS
I assume that any omnipotent beings such as YHWH are passive in this setting, so humanity must only deal with gods not Gods.
I first sail across the pacific to the lands of Japan and India, home to many spirits, perhaps among them humanity can find a few allies willing to betray their kin. Following this I must trek across Asia, a certainly difficult journey, but I may gather more mortal allies.
After this I will reach my true objective: Greece, where Prometheus lies imprisoned.
I'm sure that the Titan which gave fire to humanity will be dissatisfied with this state of affairs, and be grateful if freed from his eternal torment.

After that, I do not know what, the beings on the side of humanity will still be few, and the odds of even making it this far are low. The journey will be dangerous and take years.
IF YOU ARE A TRUE HERO AND PURE OF HEART YOU WILL JOIN ME ON THIS QUEST
we are the new Argonauts, and I am Jason

>>13459349
He won't even get past New England. I have much riding on the extermination and cleansing of the hippies and communists. He shall be my first capstone. Though I am sure new england granola girls will make excellent working stock and gifts unto my west coast friends. Though communist are always so dour they usual internalize struggles and remain aesthetically pleasing.

>>13459403
Ah... Well. Here in Rome, we wear sandals, not closed shoes. The northern climes, you see... Not our cup of wine. You may keep them, I am sure the Emperor will agree.

>>13459383

The peoples of the Midwest have laid claim to the great lakes, if you want them marx filth come and take them!

>>13459410
I would be your Argus

>>13459410
You have the blessings of Rome, brother Jason. Give them hell.
We will prepare for the extermination of the Gauls. What was done once will be done again; properly this time.

>>13459410
I will follow you to hell and back, sir... If for no other reason that we will probably have allies there who seek to return humanity's most efficient and horrifying means of killing one another to them.

>>13459403
Unification with the yeomen would be an essential element to success. With the communal nature of the Party teachings, they would be able to feed many, who in turn could turn to thoughts of industry, creating the infrastructure necessary for the many conflicts to come. Indeed, peaceful union would be preferable to conflict, and would be offer before the sword. The neo-facist romans, however, would be dealth with on the point of a spear, for what they will no doubt do the communist sympathizers in the south west.

>>13459403
>why their namesakes kept the fuck off the taiga and steppes.
Because the steppeland is worthless empty space, and Persia is incredibly valuable?

>>13459253
In the books it's stated somewhere that 95% of everyone died in the resulting chaos and mass starvation.

>>13459229
I have not, but I like the sound of it...

>>13459478
Because the dudes in the steppes would kick their ass. And will in the great plains.

>>13459476
In the immortal words of Lucius Felix Sulla:
"Bring it, commie."

I still say this would make for a nice RPG.

>>13459410
Sounds like quite a party. Sure why not, better die in style than from the plague.

>>13459514

Only if you like a dick railroading DM who shuts down everything and doesn't allow any progress whatsoever technologically.

>>13459455
I will need a restored steam powered ship, I am sure there is at least one antique one in a museum on the west coast, several competent seamen, and navigator to make it to Japan.
From that point on, I know not what I will need, standard adventuring gear, but that is cheap. Also many speakers of foreign languages.

>>13459075

>>The Change was caused by the Powers That Be because humanity was showing more and more irresponsibility with its current technology levels. The god(s) decided the best course of action was a "do-over" in order for humanity to mature more as a species before inheriting their tech. This is why we were bombed back into medieval times, rather than having history wiped clean. The idea was to learn from the first time through, so we were better prepared for the next time.

Kinda makes Old Testament God look like a loving parent.

>>Another theme of the series is that First World countries are likely to survive the Change better than Third World countries. Stirling speculates that the developed world is a larger repository of handicraft lore than the undeveloped world, because the latter group heavily relies on First World castoffs and is too busy on a day-to-day basis to keep up the old ways, while people in the First World have the leisure to become expert horse riders or bow makers.

lolwut.ecf

>>13459508
Incidentally true if at all, since they never had the chance to invade the steppe to begin with for lack of drive and conquest of the upper Balkans, and also unlikely to be true to begin with. Rome's later conquest of Parthia after that singular disaster with Crassus is evidence enough that the Empire could handle horse archers, and with an actual Empire behind them, rather than the rabble we would face here. With fortune, and the knowledge of history on our side, we shall hold them at bay as well.

>>13459483
>In the books it's stated somewhere that 95% of everyone died in the resulting chaos and mass starvation.

That is such total bullshit. Author is obviously a privileged American. Fuck in some third world countries the loss of technology wouldn't even be noticed by the masses, they're still living in the dark ages. 95% my ass.

>>13459530
>Another theme of the series is that First World countries are likely to survive the Change better than Third World countries.

Stirling just went full retard.

Actually, if I was just handwaving this setting, the Midwest farmland would be dominated by communists. I mean, it's the Midwest! The rustbelt, Chicagoland, etc.

You are either a communist or in the Mafia.

Let's put all of those unemployed steelworkers and cement pourers to work making fortifications and arms.

>>13459540
In all fairness, 95% of everyone is mostly Chinese urbanites, Indian urbanites, and other city folk. They may well suffer the heaviest losses.
But I do agree that it is patently absurd that the 3rd world would be hit harder.

>>13459551
The Mafia is Italian. There is as good a case for Rome to be made as for the commies.

>Another theme of the series is that First World countries are likely to survive the Change better than Third World countries. Stirling speculates that the developed world is a larger repository of handicraft lore than the undeveloped world, because the latter group heavily relies on First World castoffs and is too busy on a day-to-day basis to keep up the old ways, while people in the First World have the leisure to become expert horse riders or bow makers.[26]

Funny how all these books seem to work their way back around to reaffirming the Glorious White Master Race.

Good thing we had all those LARPers and yuppie horseback riders to keep us fed instead of goat-herders and rice farmers.

>>13459253
I'm not so sure the military would do all that well without easy communications and weapons that do not work. If anything the military would dissolve into localized organizations, probably out simply to protect their own. Anyone who gets organized would probably stand a good chance against them in the long run if they want to oppose them rather than join them (or have them join their own communities).
In my own country they'd be a right threat as they still do bayonet drill if I remember right, and I'd much rather have local military and police on my side, or at least not directly against my efforts to save my and my comrades collective backsides. Though couple of hundred people evacuating an urban area, fortifying land and trying to save lives would probably much less of a priority than masses of rioting, starving crazies.

Heres a question for you guys, how well off would the old nuclear bunkers do without power? I'm assuming little better than caves for the most part but I'm probably wrong.

>>13459523
Jason I know one place that can even the odds in our favor. under Vaticanin old Rome lies a great repository of knowledge. gathered from the far corners of the earth for thousands of years there we find the tool and the means to fight these so called gods. After freeing Prometheus you must go there. what you will find I do not but it may just be the key to our victory.

>>13459557
Africa, man. You're forgetting the massive number of people in Africa. People who are not so reliant on tech because all their tech in crappy hand me down stuff that we in the first word stopped using decades ago. Africa alone make the 95% a load of bullshit.

>>13459508
Except Commies don't exist on the plains. The midwest would be the most staunch supporters of the New Rome. Your yeomen and marxist pretenders to this new earth exist almost exclusively in urban population centers and areas where they can benefit privilege. You would be leading a rabble of nothing more than angst ridden whelps who have no understanding of what the real common man would fight for. We would have an effective cavalry up and running before you even teach your "party" basic combat

>>13459572
I don't like it any better than you do. The developed world may have more luxuries, but its people are also soft, weak, and inferior. I hold low hopes for Europe, and lower still for the United States: Which is why I believe that Rome is our best chance. A return to form, a brutal re-learning of ancient lessons.

Whichever heathen gods believed that returning us to the dark ages would better us will be disappointed. We will spill rivers of heretic blood, we will build castles of human bones. The gods will remember the day they thought to condescend us.

I guess for me, having the mind of a scientist, figure out how the change happened and reverse said reaction so I can get Humanity back on it's feet.

>>13459551
No good sir you shall the ones who think themselves Mid westerns that live in places like Chicagoland depend too much on technology while those of us like myself that live in what your Marx filth call the boonies. As the fleeing mass's leave those places they shall joins us as part of christian New Rome or die.

>>13459611
If you insist upon resistance, you shall be met with the spear. It takes a long time to teach a man to fight from horseback. It takes a minute for him to get jammed onto a peasant's spear point.

>>13459623
Meanwhile, Yahweh is laughing his ass off after having turned off the power. The norse gods are handcuffed to radiators.
"Why'd you do that Wodan?" he snickers, "why'd you put 'em back in the dark ages, you brute?"

3rd world countries would just carry on being 3rd world countries, unlikely to prove to be a threat to anyone but themselves and their neighbors. They would technically have a head start in redevelopment, but both socially and culturally redevelopment of large scale civilization would have a far better chance to start again somewhere else, or several other places at about the same time.

>>13459611

You don't know shit about the Midwest, son. Midwest farming country is an opaque veneer of Christian, Rush Limbaugh conservatism over a thick meaty pinko underbelly. These are people who believed in farming co-ops before hippies existed, who will kill you over farm subsidies, and who know the only thing worse than a gummint official is a banker.

It's really only the last 30-40 years of race-baiting and religious-right politics that has made the Midwest vote conservative. Poke a hole in that, and you'll find SOCIALISM.

>>13459652
Eerie.

Eastern Europe and Africa would probably do the best. Africa cannot get worse and Eastern Europeans still remember how to deal with post-apocalyptic environments. China also has that experience but the population density is so high there is simply no way they can adapt without crazy losses of life.

>>13459678
If that is what we find, then we will keep on poking.

>>13459695
Oh, and Mongolia. They will mostly likely just remind everyone how to build a composite bow and then go conquer a few million square kilometers because they can.

>>13459704
And find more supporters of the revolution. Things aren't looking so rosy now, are the, fascist?

>>13459590
A good idea, perhaps is anybody in Europe is in the thread, they could make it there before us.
I will also bring an offering from the Roman empire to the Pope if requested.

Additionally, I realize that our route from India to Greece will most likely lead us through Jerusalem.
I am certain that the area will be war torn, but perhaps somebody there can help us, after all, the city is extremely important to no less than three major religions.
I am also worried about traveling through Muslim lands while being funded by new Rome, but if we keep our heads down and don't make a fuss we should be safe.

>>13459717
Yeah, all six of them.

>>13459727
We had Serbia near the top, I don't know if we've still got them.

>>13459743
Nobody kills muzzies like the Serbs. They will be a useful ally.

>>13459572
So, did the author even try and use other gods than celtic ones?

>>13459727
>A good idea, perhaps is anybody in Europe is in the thread, they could make it there before

Britfag here, count me out, I'd need a boat. And the French, Scots, Irish and Welsh would also all have boats so I can't see that working any time soon. Image would be very related, but with more sails rigged onto modern ships.

I will stand I shall fight. I know communism is horrible in practice and only looks good on paper. I will stick with my romans and fight you where ever you stand, because I am already trained and I already have armor.

>>13459678

No sir that is not you will find. What you find is deep and ever growing right wing religious movement. When the power goes people will turn to each other and god for support. No we wont be shining beacon of freedom and old world capitalism. We will be what we always have God fearing commie hating Christians and the farmers not the workers shall have the mid-west !

>>13459775

Why would he? This is a series about GLORIOUS WICCA.

(Which is as much of a modern invention as Scientology, amusingly enough.)

>Eastern Europeans still remember how to deal with post-apocalyptic environments

>be polish
>be aware most of our farms are still fucktiny family enterprises easily managed without any mechanical help
>Still have plenty of workhorses
>have some damn fine arabian stables around the country as well.
>medieaval reenactors, fausands of them.

It would be terrible. And then it would be glorious.

>>13459818

>We will be what we always have God fearing commie hating Christians and the farmers not the workers shall have the mid-west !

Absolutely, brother! God and freedom and fraternity!

Now, you've paid your dues to the grange, right? Cause the harvesting teams are going to be working Fraternity fields first.

Also, barn-raising next Saturday. Bring potluck.

>>13459818
let me sum that GOD Before GODLESSNESS which is and your Marx peaches GODLESSNESS. So will stay conservative god fearing Roman racists. Deal with it!

>>13459789
steam ships that burn coal would still work fine, and people have swam the English channel if I recall.
plus, you could just tale the chunnel (although it's probably infested with demons or bandits in this setting)

fuck, now I want to run a campaign

>>13459476
"Unification" to us is simply theft.

You have nothing to offer, without power, your industry is nothing. The small hamlets that dot the great open spaces will be capable of providing every service you can offer, of duplicating every feat of "industry" you can muster. All you have are mouths that need to be fed, mouths attached to empty brains, undeveloped bodies, and idle hands. No, there is no reason for the yeomen to accept the communist, for the communist can bring nothing to the table except demands. And since you cannot attack us with tanks or artillery, these Kulacks will not fade away.

>>13459875
take the chunnel, sorry

So this is the image that I'm getting of the united states.

The west coast is quickly taken over by the New Roman Empire, the progression of which is slowed as they move through the desert and improve their infrastructure in the area. Meanwhile, Roman advance colonies are fighting against Religious Fundamentalists for control of the southwest. Communist forces are struggling for control of the great lakes, with the citizens of the midwest in the midst of a civil war between their Pro-Religious and Pro-Communist communities. Meanwhile, large tribes of horsemen fight throughout the plains, making cross continent travel difficult for any of the above factions.

Best. Campaign. Ever.

>>13459864
Rome will be founded upon the ideals of human equality, I promise you. Any man with proper Roman virtus and a willingness to work for the glory of the Empire will have a place amongst our number, and all will be accepted. We already count the Mexicans amongst our most loyal and courageous supporters, we care not for the color of your skin, but for the redness of your blood and the strength of your arm.

And as many so-called racists will tell you (and are determined to tell me on every bus, subway and bar) this would satisfy them. We will be an entire nation of "the good ones."

>>13459916
And in every way, superior to the original.
Congratulations /tg/, you are better than S.M. Sterling. Which is... Not much of a compliment. Sort of like being better than C.S. Goto.

>>13459882
>>13459875

I would but theres the French on the other side, and they probably wouldn't take kindly to a small warparty of English wandering through their country. Still, Dover Castle would be a kickass place to hole up for a while.

>>13459875

In the setting, it isn't burning coal that's the problem; it's that steam won't pressurize enough to drive engines. Basically, one of the primary physics-tweaks of the world is that the ideal-gas behavior changes.

So no, steam engines don't work.

What I don't get is how the Romans aren't having any trouble uniting California into their little dealie, while the commie faggots are having on hell of a time getting new england to accept the principle of strength in numbers.

Fun fact, new england farmers! Without technology, you'll need man power to both gather and protect your harvests! And most of it would just go to waste if you tried to keep to yourself anyway.

>>13459917
A realm of heart and minds, there is something to see.
>>13459916
I am so freaking running it.

>>13459935
Bearkillers, PPA and Boise are the only good things in there. And he insists upon fagging up Bearkillers by making them pseudo-Wiccan instead of good and Christian, like the pimps over at mount angel. And he makes Boise CUTs bitch, for additional faggotry.

>>13459882

50 kilometers of pitch dark, bad air, and obstructing car wrecks? Sounds like the worst thing in the whole world.

>> The reason is simple. The farmers who live outside of the urban areas aren't going to want to listen to a bunch of butt hurt city who for the most part don't know how to survive without modern convinces. Because while they have also had dependencies on tech it's not as bad as the urban folk. why the fuck would anyone want to let them lead!

>>13460085
>impyling I live in a city.
>implying a communist party would have one leader instead of a communal decision making body.
>implying they aren't as dependant as city slickers.
>implying implying.

>>13459996
Given that this is New England we're talking about here, I doubt the communists will have much trouble. Maine is ripe for the plucking, and I say that as an honest, Godfearing Roman citizen. In a heavily agrarian state without any mechanization, your options are basically slave labor, serfdom, or communism.
The Californians will not have a choice. The folk of the east... They may well choose that third brand of unity.

>>13460036
all the more glory when you emerge on the other side
try to find Excalibur first if you're worried about it

>purely mechanical systems like guns fail
>bows still work
What is this retardation?

>mfw people stop being DERR COMMUNISM BAD and start thinking about why it would work

If I may we have yet to bring up one important player in North America what of Canada

>purely mechanical systems like guns fail
Protip, you might want to look into what actually propels the bullet. It's not mechanical at all.

>>13460199
Communism doesn't work because of human nature.

Figure out a way to overcome human nature, and we'll talk.

>>13460206
most of it is empty land
the southern parts where most pf the people live will likely be dragged into whatever drama is happening in the US.

>>13460217
Okay. I thrust the world into a situation where a vary large portion of the world is cut off from their food supply. I then get them to realize that they can work together as a community, or starve as an individual. Oh look, we're back to this thread.

>>13460210
Yes, it's chemical. But unless every single grain of gunpowder on the planet is suddenly damp, which is also bullshit, there's nothing that says guns won't work.

You guys just want to fap over some pseudo-medieval apocalyptic fantasy.

>>13459829
They also use Norse gods. People start worshipping them within one generation with no real explanation given.

>>13460206
Probably end up collaborating with either the Mid-Westerners or joining the communists, or fighting for control of the Great Lakes. Meanwhile the people in Vancouver are faced with similar choices about the Romans.

>>13460256
Hurr durr the Mackenzies saved us, it must be because of their religion and not just because they happened to own good farmland and could get the supplies to survive, best abandon catholicism.

>>13460247
It's explicit in the books that gunpowder doesn't ignite.

>>13460247 You guys just want to fap over some pseudo-medieval apocalyptic fantasy.

Well yeah you're not telling us anything we don't know, this is /tg/ after all, we're all about fantasy.

>>13460285
Never read 'em, sounds like I don't want to. I'm allergic to bullshit.

>>13460291
So am I but I don't worship bad pulp novels

HEY GUYS

GUYS

I JUST REALIZED

BOOKS ARE SILLY

SO STOP TALKING ABOUT BOOKS YOU READ

BECAUSE THEY'RE SILLY

>>13460319
Thats nice, so why are you telling us? Feeling persecuted by the creativity and people having fun with an idea?

In this kind of hellscape, do you want a bunch of fags recreating what they think Rome was like two thousand years ago or do you want the kind of people that are still brutally collectivizing low-tech agricultural backwaters to this day?

If Mao could turn the techless interior of China into a functional republic with nothing but a bunch of illiterate farmers, the same could be done to Dies the Fire 'merika.

Compare that to some RenFair actor who thinks the Romanz were totally l33t.

Choose the brand of totalitarian brutality with a proven 20th century track record: choose communism. Because do you really want to be the subject of an AMATEUR tyrant?

>>13460339
>>13460348
Apparently ruining your readers' suspension of disbelief is a perfectly acceptable, nay, admirable thing to do

>mfw people complain about the plot device that allows the series to take place.

seriously, complain about something legit, like those fucking wiccans. Or how there was never a knock down drag out fight between the coalition and the PPA, because the PPA would win without a contest.

My dog is sitting on my left leg, I can feel it's anus clenching every few seconds. I will fear no evil.

>>13460364
get more rugged suspension then, or keep to modern fiction only, because Sf and fantasy will likely offend your sensibility more often than not.

>>13460238
I would clarify on your behalf that 'communism' is not actually what is being discussed here in any but the most pedantic sense. Here, we are all talking about subsistence agriculture with different hats on it. The Romans will accomplish it with something pretty much identical to a communal farm, except with a private owner rather than a state one.

>>13460394
>telling the guy with William Gibson, HG Wells and Tolkien on his bookshelf SF will offend his sensibilities
idontthinksotim.jpg

>>13460348

Mostly just revolting against a silly alien space-bat induced cozy catastrophe.

>>13460361
If I wanted to starve 20 million of my own people, I'd be a communist.
...That joke fell apart, because what you're talking about is actually the thing most people use as a stereotypically ineffectual agricultural state.

Oh, and considering this is essentially Tom Jefferson's dream world, expect some paleoAmericans running about doing things like Yankee Doodle.

You know, any change that would stop steam engines and batteries from working would kill all humans.

>>13460413
And even THAT is debatable, since whoever controls the agriculture will very quickly become the state. Just like Rome. Pretty soon the only form of class mobility will be military conquest, because the only wealth is land, and the only way to get it is taking it, and homogenizing the people so that they will not rebel.

It's formulaic Imperialism, except this time the Gauls aren't a war-hardened people with balls of steel and millennia of combat. The Gauls are... Nebraska.

>>13460426
Its like dealing with the world's most narrowminded GM who is trying to put the party through an unpassable puzzle. Every answer "well, if all electrical devices are destroyed, we will make more" is countered with an on-the-stop cover "yeah, electricity does not even Exist like that any more" which prompts more workaround "well, steam power could.." and more response "nope, compressed gas cannot perform work any more. or magnets either.. gosh, why are you guys not solving this?"

and then the DMPC wiccans ride in to save the day and everyone facepalms.

>mfw no resurgent elephant population in the US in that series.
>mfw Stirland pussied out because he didn't want to put in elephant calvary.

>Go grab and sharpen my grandfather's greatsword
>Fashion some rudimentary armour
>Become the Blade of Australia and strike down all rapists
Beyond that i think i would just roll with whatever group becomes biggest quickest.
Unless they approved of rape, in which case death by the sword.
I don't like rape.

>>13460465
Oh yeah, we covered that early. It's a completely ridiculous setting, mostly we're trying to screw with it by subverting the author's preposterous assumptions that some fucking boyscouts and wiccans would end up taking of America.

When apparently, it is Romans, Canadian Mongols and Communists who would arise from the ashes of the old world, to tread the gilded ruins of man's folly beneath their sandaled feet.

>>13460416
HG Well's most famous War of the Worlds is even more unlikely than gunpowder stopping to work selectively, I hope you do know that?

>>13460470
Rome joins the communists without even realizing it.

justasplanned.jpg

>>13460477
This. Thanks for wording it better than I ever could.

>>13460499
Nobody's coming to Australia, dude. That place was hell back when it had running water, electric fences and flamethrowers.
Now it's like Jurassic park but with giant spiders.

>>13460501
Of course, because it's set roughly a hundred years ago. For its time though, it's a rather enjoyable little read.
And it's still more plausible than "LOL PHYSICS DOESN'T WORK LIKE YOU THINK IT DOES ANYMORE"

>>13460512
>Now it's like Jurassic park but with giant spiders.
now this sounds like a campaign I could roll with.

>>13460501
(different guy)
it was reasonably possible given scientific knowledge when it was written though.
Also, it's an analogy for what the British were doing to Africa

man, now I need to reread that

>go on /tg/
>see this thread
>medieval communists vs retro-romans

I don't even need the other boards anymore.

>>13460413
3 kinds of successful, non-industrial, non-feudal farming.

Latifundia, The roman model, leads inevitably to Feudalism, but might take a couple centuries to get there. Great for providing bread and wine to a population of urban dolists.

Yeomanry, everyone works a small plot with their sons, great for creating and feeding a professional army (excess sons have to do something), not so good at supporting large cities.

Pasturalism. Follow the animals and don't give a fuck.

Communism and communally held farms routinely fails to provide enough food for a population except in certain circumstances. The Pilgrims couldn't make communal farms work, neither could the soviets or the chinese.

The exception is when you basically create a guild system and call it communism, like a Grange or a Kibbutz.

A society that chooses Yeomanry will have larger, stronger, more educated soldiers with higher endurance, greater ability to react to the unforseen, and a more flexible doctrine.

The Midwest Reds will actually be pretty well off, because it's a combination of the best qualities of highly organized industrial trade unionism and more fluid agricultural grangerism and farmer-laborism (see Minnesota where the FL is legendary).

Maybe instead of Maoist totalitarianism it would be a Norman Thomas type Christian Socialist thing and actually be pretty ok, for a filthy combustionless world?

My face when the Reds are the only ones who maintain democracy...

>>13460502
I wouldn't say joins. The situation is essentially thus: There is exactly one way to survive and thrive on pre-industrialized Earth. Massive, organized agriculture.
The problem is that once you strip away the trappings of "the worker" or "the slave", all organized agriculture basically looks the same.
Rome here differs in that its motive for agriculture is not agriculture. Its motive for the organization of the peasantry is so that it can expand and consume more peasantry. A true communistic state would, of course, be peaceful, as the people do not desire war for the profit of the wealthy ruling class, and will only take up arms to defend themselves or to help new allies defend themselves.

So one is passive and diplomatic, multicultural and egalitarian, the other is aggressive and uncompromising, homogenizing and ruthlessly darwinist. They are the two quintessential societies. The question is, which one will triumph?

Well. That's for your PCs to decide.

I am now picturing phalanxes supporting hammer wielding horsemen, all marching under the Hammer and Sickle.

Across the field, the glorious legions of Rome, marching stoically forward while their warmachines begin to unleash their deadly cargo. On the flanks of both sides are horse archers, collaborators for the communists, mercenaries for the romans.

Fuck you Stirling, /tg/ made your universe better than you ever could.

Something to keep in mind: the influence of Masonic lodges in crappy areas like West Virginia. I mean, infiltrating the Freemasons was how the Second KKK spread to rural POS backwaters all over the nation - no just the South but California, Rhode Island, etc.

And there's a mention of the Mason Lodge in that song about West Virginian bootleggers. "Daddy had a big black dodge, got it in an auction at the Mason lodge".

So yeah, Masonic hicks.

>>13460580
This is of course not factoring in the goat herders. They are the X factor, but since the defining aspect of such a civilization is that it is incapable of maintaining an empire, its influence will likely be sporadic, to keep the dust from settling for too long at a time.
Everyone else got used to them, so you'd better get used to them too.

>>13460611
>JustTakeMyMoneyDammit.jpg

This needs to be archived. How does one do that shit?

>>13460611
Oh my god I would play it. It could be an RPG, it could be a wargame... The miniatures would be awesome.

>>13460646
I see to it.

>>13460611
God dammit, the one problem I have with this set up is no PPA pimping it out in the northwest. If they were fighting both sides, and expanding into Vancouver, it would be perfect!

>Andrew Jackson
No, the Sons of Jeffer shall prevail. All of us cling to the concept of a bug-out bag. In any eventuality, we will be prepared to face it. If we need never DEAL WITH IT, our sons, or the sons of our sons, will be properly equipped.

We need to develop additional factions for this.

>>13460661
Oh. Already done. It's on sup/tg/.

See, the one problem I have with communism in this setting is that it would make no sense for the officers to dress in the peaked caps and trench coats. Maybe the artillery commanders...

How about a pastoral (wandering herdsmen) Celtic-ish/Kurdishish/etc. badass culture forming from the various old neighborhood type clannish culture groups pouring out of the cities?

Irish-Italian-Black-Polish-Greek-Iranian-Jewish-German-PuertoRican-Scotch Conan is now a playable character.

>>13460708
Recommendations: Texas and Mexico, though they have pledged their hearts to Rome here, may be more hesitant in actuality. A New Mexican/Texican republic might make for a pretty badass faction. Give them really strong Apachean influence, they'll be winners.

>>13460717
Needs a shorter name.

>>13460708
A return to form for, let's say, Arroyo, might be called for. Most of them would probably be white folks, but the way of life is sustainable, and could probably do well in such an environment.

>>13460736

The Nomads, each band is named after cultural heroes. Maccabees, Fianna, Petro, etc.

>>13460708
A heavily nautical state, maybe Florida and the Carolinas combined (swallowing Georgia, obviously) could become our Portugal. Extensive trade with Europe, the absorption of Cuba, etc.

What was that old song?

"Now we can't live forever on fuel from the ground, the prices go up and no more will be found, if we're still around for the next age of sail, we might hear that shanty-man hail..."

Okay, so the way I see it.

New England/Northeast in General: Communist Hordes.
West Coast to the four corners area: Neo-Romans
Canada: Partially absrobed into above factions, some small guerrilla factions fighting, paticularly in the Great Lakes and Vancouver Regions.
Vancouver-Portland: The Portland Protective Associate: Because they were far and away the best faction in the series, and fairly successful.
Southeast: Religious agrarian society, fiercely capitalist.
Texan Republic: Lotsa horse archers, with light calvary from american indians that join with them.

Various mongol style tribes in the great plains fucking hate everyone.

>>13460779
Mexico: AZTECS BACK IN BLACK MOTHERFUCKER.

>>13460713
damnation, you archived too early! The faction list is not in there!

>>13460779
I'd suggest that you get something less like the mongols, and more like the Berbers, or the pre-islamic Turks. Mongolia had a really weird set of circumstances that these guys would lack.
This is not necessarily a bad thing, as those guys could to fuckmassive crusades as well as the mongols, but relied less on charismatic leaders, and more on tribal impetus.

>>13460811
It updates automatically, and if a person resubmits it, it gets updated again.

>>13460779
Hey, I don't have any actual experience with the series, what was up with the PPA?

>>13460858
It's the SCA, except under the direction of a Chaotic Evil history teacher, whose wife is Queen Illeosa crossed with Cersei Lannister.

>>13460858
Basically a bunch of hardcore renfair folks kicked the shit out of all the rival factions in portland, absorbed them into their army, and created a working faction that could supply a large number of people before anyone else. With that in place, they reintroduced feudalism, and started propping up castles all over the place and started taking over large amounts of land. Their army consisted of moderately trained men at arms supporting really, REALLY elite knights, which incidentally were the best heavy calvary in the US. Oh, and their flag was the eye of Sauron.

>>13460895
>Their flag was the eye of sauron
What a good fucking idea.

>>13460779

The Northeast: worst population to food ratio in the country. The New England fishermen are still there, the insular Dutch-descended farmers of sparsely populated New Hampshire and Vermont are still there, as are the Pinies of New Jersey, everyone else either flooded out or was crushed in the process. The people fleeing Boston, New York, and other dense urban areas moved through the farmland interior of Mass and upstate New York, rolling the locals into them like a Katamari, and migrating down into rural Western Pennsylvania - with elements of these Nomads venturing from there into the Midwest, others up into the Appalachians, and some down into the South.

Along the Mississippi and the largest rivers that feed into it: Boat people.

Right along the rim of the Great Lakes, on either side: More boat people.

Appalachian folks, swamp people of Louisiana and the Great Dismal in the upper South, Ozarkians...

>>13460911
I would know so exactly whose side I'm on if I saw that flag.

Great now we need to think of faction bonuses.

>>13460911
>>13460928
It's them or the Wiccans. Or the Bearkillers, whose flag is an admittedly awesome picture of a pissed off bear

Aw FUCK. I'm Californian, I'm going to get Rome'd.

>>13460942
Most of them are pretty self explanatory. It depends on what sort of game you expect them to be in.
In something like Alpha Centauri?
Something like Warhammer Fantasy?
Something like D&D?
All would differ.

>>13460950

Embrace it! Brother!

>>13460895

Don't forget all the SLAVERY SEX SLAVES NUDITY COLLARS BONDAGE SLAVES.

AND THEN THE WOMEN ARE SLAVES AND THEY GET RAPED.

Because S&M Stirling.

>>13460950
Comrade, pretend to cooperate with the Fascist Romans. Build support for the party. When the time is right, we will need your assistance.

>>13460975
Egh. Dammit Stirling. You know that name means "pure?"

>>13460975
yay! i mean, wait.. you might have a point there.
never read the fire book, but have read more then enough about Drakas.. those biological rape machines.
>oh my

>>13460976

Those who want to leave can. only those who fight fight us in the open will be crucified! Those who try to corrupt us from within will be crucified! Those who support the things did this too us ... well you get the point.

add on comrades

No Dark Elf style psycho pirate nation? Preferably in canada? /tg/, I am dissapoint

>>13461047
My paint program is shit, but I'd recommend California, the souther part of Arizona, and Nevada as being Roman. Oregon, maybe part of NorCal, and then maybe out to the Dakotas as the Protectorate? I'm not sure how far they made it in the series, but probably not far enough.

>>13461047

Need to move the Communists a little up and a bit more to the right.

>>13461083
Like so?

so, what's the UK?

personally i can see a new order established with the Queen at the helm.

>>13461088

Is it bad that I found the concept of moving communists to the right amusing?

>>13461124
>Communist
>Iowa

You'd best be joking, boy.

More factions added

Major/Expanding Cultures (the kind likely to come into conflict, preferably on a miniature scale on a well furnished game table) -

Rome (agrarian)
Communists (agrarian)
Feudalists (agrarian): PPA basically
Yeomen (agrarian): Yankee doodles
Nomads (pastoral): survived escape from the cities and are now a fiercely loyal band of badasses
Vikings (pastoral): oh hai Midwest Commies, the Nazi Vikings from everything between East Washington State and St.Paul are here.
moar???

>>13461146
... I forgot about them midwest viking types.

>>13461124

No way Indiana is going communist fully you'll see a divide toward the middle with most of the southern half going Kentucky because they can relate more with them.

ITT /tg/ handles a setting better than the author who created the setting.

>>13461155

The Minnesota Vikings sacked St.Paul and then they turned West, gathering all of the inbred white assholes from here to Idaho to their horde. Now they're back, god save us from the Norsemen.

>>13461136
This one's Rome makes more sense. Pushing into Arizona would be crazy hard, and pointless, but pushing north secures you some of the best port-land (pun totally intended) on the coast.

>>13461136
I'd recommend the re-establishment of the Morman nation. Given their relative simplicity to begin with, they might actually hold together throughout such a crisis. Probably not expansionist enough to spread past Utah, though.

>>13461212
Deseret is a dead fucking dream. Though their close-knit nature and willingness to identify themselves as Christians might save them from the bootheel of Rome, if they can offer enough. At the same time, they could certainly see the appeals of communism as well.

You'd have a strong dichotomy, where they are adjacent to a force that could crush them like a hollowed egg, but with whom they share (theoretically) a religion, but are more sympathetic towards a distant force.

>>13461125
The original series had a cool few scenes in England, with one of the princes having taken over and fighting a war with Barbary pirates.

>>13461136

Southern Indiana is not going commie is least not willingly!
.

>>13461290
All lands have their internal conflicts, I imagine. Most of the game would be the resistance of partisans fighting with support from other factions.
Hate dem commies? the Sons of Romulus show up to back you up.
Hate dem bromans? The Red Liberation Army sends agents to back you up.

>>13461322
>Sons of Romulus
VENI

>>13461322
In the grim darkness of /tg/berverse, there is only war. Alot of it. And a good portion of that is civil war.

Also, mfw I realized that antebellum south is both plausible and likely.

>>13461359
Best name. Also like the Broman name.

Here is another map.

>>13461322

Here's what's going to happen in my county. We hate the people up north they go commie, we do two things, first fight guerrilla warfare from the hills and woods then scorched earth whatever we lose then if lose all of the state fall back to Kentucky. PS: FUCK THE GODLESS COMMIES!!!

>>13461408
Fight the good fight man.
Sons of Romulus sounds like an awesome name for our new Roman Faction.
Communist need a faction name too besides the godless commies, those asshole commies, etc.

The Sunsworn are here to grind corn and champion the cause of justice! Ya Basta! Enough is enough!

>>13461452

Thank you brother for those words. But we need more suns base down in the Ohio river vally area its were most conservatives are,or at least I live is anyway.

>>13461452
The Peoples Republic of the United States.

>>13461427
>The Northeast
>hugely liberal
>not communist, instead, unaligned.

The hell?

>>13461408
Well every farm into a fort.
Every State Park into a little Vietnam.
Every Town or township a strong point.
You want Southern Indiana? FUCKING TAKE IT FROM YOUR MARXIST SWINE!!!!!!!!!!!!!

>>13461539
zero food, too much people, survivors who escaped the cities are the traveling Nomads

>>13461565
Fair enough. I would imagine there would eventually be parties sent back to grab useful tools like telescopes, binoculars, and the like after the initial few years of lol starvation.

Sons of Romulus
The Grange
Portland Protective Association
Nordic Horde
Texas Republic
Sunsworn
Plantation League
Nomads
Yeomen
Appalachians

>>13461682
I wish I had a picture to convey my expression at this consolidated win.

This still alive?

captcha: womankind reagul