>>27284375
>starts thread with highly messy and unorganized rune that just makes a statue

dude.

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From the end of last thread:

How about this as a way to stop a Sustain loop? This will shoot fire at a target till it is dead.

Also, verbs with the same number of corners should be performed together at the same time. eg: Sustain and Contain for the fireplace

>>27284416
hey, it's an example of how complex this shit can get, to do something relatively simple

and how cool that is too

>>27284426
you cant put the project in the inner circle, thats already manipulating the created fire, thats getting put in an outer circle. You cant modify whole circle levels either.

>>27284469
to clarify on the last point:

from the rules:

>If one wants to modify a rune rather than affect it, a smaller circle is placed overlapping the rune in question creating a combined rune. This combined rune is then effected by all runes interacting with them.

runes. not circles, not levels, you only can modify runes

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>>27284437
This one would have been better to use.

It's a little inefficient, but it is very pretty.

Just brainstorming over personal, off-the-cuff spellcasting.

So, say wizards have a spellbook, into which they pen spells. They cannot make/modify spells in their book whenever they want, however, that requires "points". Wizards earn points parallel with experience or whatever. Drawing new runes costs points. So, as a wizard gains experience, he gets to write new spells or add to existing ones.

Now, this is just for combat spellcasting and the like. Ritual-style spells would be more free, but take much, much longer to prepare.

>>27284426
How do you determine the target?

>>27284437
It's also overengineering.

Make a damn clay man, inscribe the runes

((CREATE affects LIFE) affects EARTH)
or
(CREATE then LIFE affects EARTH)

on it.

>>27284497
oooh, yes, you are right, that one IS sexy

>>27284497
and, assuming "self" is a valid rune, which I, as a GM, wouldnt do, but whatever, it actually does something usefull.

From last thread
>You'd have to design the circle itself to accept those things as alternate forms of fuel. Or (in a more fun option) design a circle to transmute those forms of energy into ambient energy that the other spell then draws upon. Interesting idea though.

Well... yes? Yes, I guess. I would imagine that keeping the "energy conversion" from any->magical would be more effective (and safe) if kept inside the spell circle its meant to power.

>there is the option of horendously expensive and hard to make crystals and blood sacrifices.
Crystalised mana and life energy?

>>27284426
>Modifying a modifier

Pretty sure that's some illegal syntax.

You'd need to use a Stop rune affected by a Living Target or some such.

>>27284510
yeah, you can make another circle with the whole raise earth and put em in a bigger circle, if you want. But dont just cram everything in

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>>27284513

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>>27284487
My mistake, drew it wrong. How about this?

>>27284538
>modifying ANYTHING other than a rune

definitely illegal

>>27284538
We need to make a container rune that mimics a circle it's connected to, so we can store complicated effects in a modifiable wrapper.

>>27284487
Why couldn't you? I thought that was the whole point of multiple circle levels, to encompass a runic "phrase" as a single unit to be affected or modified as a whole.

>>27284573
But a rune plus a modifier creates a new rune, which can be modified.

You just need to put the modifier on the enclosing outer circle, not on the modifier circle.

Do we have a compendium of runes, or atleast a LIST of runic words / arguments?

>>27284536
>Crystalised mana and life energy?
what about it?

>>27284571
still has project, which manipulates the main element, in the focus cicle.

rules:

>The red circle is the focus for the spell, the blue circle will contain runes to modify and affect the red circle. You can have as many circles within one another as you want, the more complex the spell you want to cast.

sorry for being pedantic.

also, Im not sure how the target death thing would work. I mean, using the death rune doesnt just say "if death is observed" but it infuses THE PLATONIAN IDEA OF DEATH into the circle. you have a fucking deathmaker.

So, I've been thinking about fleshing out our whole circle language here. Not the runic vocabulary, but the syntax itself, for making more nuanced and complex spells.

First off, let's review our basics:
>A complete spell consists of, at minimum, two circles
>The center circle contains your primary rune, which sets the primary thing your spell is acting on
>The outermost circle circumscribes the entire spell
>Additional runes also appear, each contained within its own circle or another geometric shape
>A rune whose circle intersects the circle of another rune modifies the latter rune
>A rune connected to another, more central rune by a curved line affects the more central rune, exerting an effect upon it rather than describing it
>Runes within the same tier of centrality can also have hierarchies of affecting one another, determined by the shape enclosing them; those with more corners affect a connected rune with fewer corners, circles being the bottommost level, acted on last
>Additional circles may be used to enclose groups of runes as a unit, allowing them to be modified or affected as a whole

So, how can we expand upon this?

First: What can we do with the "modify" syntax of a rune interrupting another circle?
We can have nominative and genitive case to go with our curved-line "affects" accusative case.
>Noun modifying another noun
Genitive case; the modified noun belongs to the modifier
>Noun modifying a verb
Nominative case; the modifying noun is performing the verb.

>>27284586
>>27284592
This is true.

You can technically modify a rune which is already being modified, but you absolutely can't modify a modifier.

>>27284586
you can affect a circle, you cant modify one. you can have a new layer of spell that affects and uses the old layer, you cant just straight up modify it

>>27284592
>But a rune plus a modifier creates a new rune, which can be modified.

If you mean it that way Im jsut talking semantics

>>27284608
Frankly, I think a compendium of runes is a low-priority objective for getting this fleshed out. Vocabulary is easy to expand, but without a solid grammatical foundation you can't do much with it.

>>27284630
If you write something up, put it in a pastebin and I'll add it to the pdf if I get the chance.

Not OP, by the way, just somebody who took an avid interest.

>>27284642
okay, I agree, what you mean just not called modifying in the rules, which is why I was confused

>>27284608
whatever you do, dont use the ones in the OP image. He just made up a bunch that were already established and used multiple times.

Worst of all: His look worse!

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Just tossing some ideas, don't know if this has been discussed.

>>27284705
Maybe add some sensor rune system for the triggers.

>>27284705
well, Im against it, since Im a purist and it doesnt mesh with the initial idea of runes representing concepts/words, it makes it into an actual programming language.

Then again, go for it if you want to, to each their own

>>27284705
Naw bro, that would just be an affect loop.

>>27284619
Eh? But "project" affects the fire like "create", not modify it. The red circle is the circle around the fire rune.

Oh yea, for the target death thing, it is a boolean, not a "affecting" relation. I could make it a straight line if you want.

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Did I fuck it up?

>>27284705
>>27284734
yup, its just programming now. Oh well.

>>27284752
Yes.

The spell will just elecrocute anything nearby

>>27284790
Yeah I forgot project[target] but that's obvious shit, does the bouncing mechanic work?

>>27284742
Agreed.

Let's not have anything capable of remote activation or autonomy aside from looping.

>>27284748
>Eh? But "project" affects the fire like "create", not modify it. The red circle is the circle around the fire rune.
ah okay, you are right, its just not how Im used to it. You are very much so correct. you can make project circle form no probs.

>But a rune plus a modifier creates a new rune, which can be modified.

you would have to make a circle around whatever is not affected by death (which it would mean) and then connect it to death.

You cant say "if dead -> stop". It doesnt work like that

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>>27284645
>you can affect a circle, you cant modify one. you can have a new layer of spell that affects and uses the old layer, you cant just straight up modify it
Says who? This is a work-in-progress, and there's nothing in the original rules that explicitly forbids it. Allowing whole layers to be modified would be a very useful bit of spell-grammar.

>>27284705
And speaking of useful grammar...
I definitely agree we could use some sort of trigger/conditional mechanic, though I'm not a huge fan of that particular one. The way I figure it, a trigger or conditional would always be tied to an effect, right? So then, it should modify an "affecting" clause. I'm thinking something like so. Indicate the conditional "if" statement by enclosing it with a circumscribed diamond rather than a single shape.

You could also use this for conditional modifiers if you were to allow modified modifiers, using the conditional circle-diamond rune to modify the modifier.

>>27284642
Why can't a modifier be modified? It would make phrases like "half-dead person" possible if you can modify the "dead" modifier with "half". It is possible to add adjectives to adjectives.

>>27284790
>>27284752
the outer circle wont even do anything

>>27284803
Since there's no escape clause, it's more like a chain laser.

>>27284821
>Says who? This is a work-in-progress, and there's nothing in the original rules that explicitly forbids it. Allowing whole layers to be modified would be a very useful bit of spell-grammar.

says only me, based on

>f one wants to modify a rune rather than affect it, a smaller circle is placed overlapping the rune in question creating a combined rune.

so, I see it as illigal. I will use it as such. But I am a mere individual.

Did you guys see the two ways for storing spell in this mechanic?

This would also work, I think both could exist in this mechanic depending on the casters preference.

If the caster doesnt mind shouting his attack out i think the "unlock" would be faster.

But the power off, power on runes were also tossed about earlier so both should work, you just have to complete the circle connecting to on to turn the spell on

>>27284826
I would define that as a "qualifier" not a modifier. Also adverbs can modify other adverbs

>>27284826
Because you would just create a [dead : [person]] rune, and then modify that with a [partial], creating [partial : [dead : [person]]]

IE, a person who is partially dead.

>>27284821
I like your version of conditions, but what if I want the condition to be tied to multiple effects?

>>27284854
That's an exceptionally restrictive reading of the concept, considering it's not really intended to be complete and final gospel truth. If encircling a phrase can allow it to be affected, I see no good reason why it couldn't also allow it to be modified.

>>27284876
"Modifier" in the context of this runic system basically means "qualifier" -- a descriptor, basically. The overlapping-circle "modifier" notation essentially serves for both adjectives and adverbs in this language.

>>27284926
I see. Still by the rules of grammar, a modifier can modify other modifiers. Adverbs can describe other adverbs as well as adjectives.

>>27284898
Draw your curved lines so that all of the effects cross it?

Logistically speaking, this would limit the number of effects you could tie to a single condition, just because of placing the lines, but you could at least fit two or three.

You could also repeat the conditional rune separately if you run out of space.

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>>27284890
It is more troublesome and messy to make that though.

>>27284926
>That's an exceptionally restrictive reading of the concept, considering it's not really intended to be complete and final gospel truth. If encircling a phrase can allow it to be affected, I see no good reason why it couldn't also allow it to be modified

makes the concept more arcane feeling, I suppose. To be able to slap an adjective on whole sentences is too far removed from the rune-on-rune interaction ive found intruiging when I first saw the first thread.

But thats personal preference, the direction has already changed, so you roll with that.

>>27284967
I guess, but it allows you to be much more flexible and looks much neater.

Because technically the second modifier there isn't even modifying the subject.

>>27284967
we are talking magic here though. It looking awesome and feeling arcane is a big part of it.

Or was, looking at this thread.

>>27284967
The second one is an incomplete 'sentence'. First one works as far as I can see...

>>27284967
Personally, I think the nested version looks better than the chained one there. And I agree with >>27285010 that keeping it aesthetically pleasing is important; the only way chained modifiers would look good would be if you had each successive modifier in a smaller and smaller circle, spiraling off in a curve. But concentric circles look a lot cooler (especially if you minimize dead space and have them nearly touching where possible).

Functionally it works about the same anyway.

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>>27284958
My initial idea for condition runes is to place it like a modifier rune around an effect or groups of effects. Problem is that the language is read from inside to outside, and it doesn't flow very well.

Oh god I have been following this since post one and my brain hurts.

>>27285047
How is it incomplete? They're basically identical, just that in the first, (part) modifies (dead) modifies (person), whereas in the second (part) modifies ((dead) modifying (person)).

Do we have a 1d4chan yet?

>>27285094
Yeah, the order of reading would be problematic. Also, using conditionals similar to modifiers is (IMO) less aesthetically pleasing than having them lie tangent to the "affecting" line.

>>27285094
Lets say the noun is fire and the verbs are Project and Condense

If you dnt give it direction you are assuming that it will flow towards your enemy but it could very well flow into you.

>>27285113
"Partially affecting Dead-Person"

Partially is a modifier affecting a [dead : person]. It should be modifying a verb that is affecting the [dead : person] by that syntax. Logic error.

1: [(part : dead) : person]
2: [part : (dead : person)]

>>27285165
Unless the condition is something vague like "An enemy appears" and even then

>>27285113
Why not link the modifyers on opposite sides of the rune?

>>27285165
Condition- (TARGET : NOT-DEAD) or something similar would do well enough. As long as we go by the "mage controls who/what target is with mental-memory allocation"

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I have been reading this thread throughout the day. I don't see it really working in a pen-and-paper sort of game, but dammit if it wouldn't work as fiction or even a vidya. But yeah, programmer's magic is absolutely fantastic.

Pic somewhat related. It was an old concept I had for something similar, though not NEARLY as far-reaching as your concept. Feel free to steal whatever you need from it.

>>27285165
Direction could be determined by a modifier on "Project" for a compass point, or you could use a nominative-case clause to provide guidance over the whole spell. Use a general indicative rune (call it "This"), which refers to whatever object is on top of it. Have the caster stand on top, and have the "This" rune modifying a verb. Caster is now the one performing the verb.

>>27285262
Imagine a spell editor in an MMO using this system. I can imagine being a magical programmer getting paid [gold equivalent here] for making powerful and aesthetically pleasing spells.

>>27285251
I would add a not alive circle too so it only attacks the undead

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>>27284821

Here's a few boolean operators from the first thread. People didn't like them though.

>>27285302
Maybe make it a great way to teach gamers how to program.

>>27285194
Not exactly a logic error, but I see what you're getting at. #2 would imply part of a dead person, not a part-dead person, so #1 would be the correct "phrasing" for the intended meaning.

Looks like chained modifiers are the way to go, then. I stand by my insistence on aesthetics, though -- each successive modifier must be smaller than the modifier it modifies, and the chain must curve away in a spiral sort of path between the curve of the ultimate modified object's circle and the next most outward circle.

>>27285306
thats because they wanted wizzardry and magic. In this thread, people are all about computers. It will be used.

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Fucking paint.

>>27284536
Idea is a impact-powered light-creator. Kinetic flashlight, one might say?

>((Impact) Energy (Create((Small) Light)))

>>27285300

I think one could define projection direction by using a numeric system based on degrees, counted clockwise from the top.

>>27285342
Yeah that's what I meant. In any case, I absolutely agree with you on aesthetics.

So gang, what happens when you're in the middle of writing your circle and someone shuffles through it with their feet? What happens?

>>27285332
the basics of programming, in a badass, magic way? I like it!

>>27285371
Would i stamp my foot on the kinetic symbol to power it

>>27285371
It works.

You could expand on this by shaping the light and moving it alongside the creator.

>>27285414
Maybe the whole game could be a matter of spellcraft. The players are the wizards-for-hire which create the spells for adventurers, a'la Recettear?

Alchemy Ho!

>>27285306
Probably because to anyone who does programming, digital logic, or discrete math they look like other things. Especially the NOT, as multiplication is the same as AND in boolean algebra.

The IF makes me thing of an || operator, which is OR. Or a sideways equivalence.

The OR looks like the NOT in a digital logic schematic.

The AND just looks like a K. It's fine.

>>27285378
>yfw sling fireballs along vectors

>>27285406
You start crying because they ruined your beautiful magic circle.

Otherwise, nothing. The spell wasn't running yet.

>>27285306
I think Boolean runes are a bad idea, but ability to implement Boolean statements via the syntax of the circle's construction is something we ought to have. Runes are for concepts; circles and lines are for grammar. Booleans are more of a grammar thing to me -- clarifying relationships between functions.

Right from the start we already had two Booleans as grammar constructs anyway -- AND is implied anytime you have two or more modifiers, and NOT was present with the exclusionary double-circle. All we really need is IF and OR, and we can get those easily.

I've already proposed an IF (conditional) construction with the circled-diamond. That just leaves OR. Given that AND is the implied default for multiple pieces and we've got double-shape constructs for NOT and IF (double circle NOT, circled diamond IF), I suppose we ought to have some manner of double-shape for OR as well.

>>27285406

Bograth the Conqueror once strode into the temple where the Omniscience Glyph was silently running, as it had been for the last 200 000 years, and planted his foot square in the middle of the design.

There were no survivors. On the whole continent.

>>27285450
take it up a notch.

The students spells they create are submitted to the devs of an MMO, who decide if it is cool, and add it into the game as a craftable/writable spell.

>>27285477
What about a sustained spell in action then?

>>27285432
You inscribe it on the soles of your shoes.

As you walk, they light up.

You are now the idol of elementary-school children everywhere.

>>27285432
Maybe the energy circle? the Kinetic/Impact would only, well, "harvest" impact energy directed inside the Energy circle, I guess.
This is somewhat fun.

>>27285306
Because the system is *supposed* to be esoteric and finicky. Creating Boolean runes just makes it really boring.

>>27285485
i loik da soikle doimond

>>27285378
I thought it was decided you could use that or an arrow designating direction or even target as manually chosen by wizard?

>>27285515
Accumulated energy explodes outwards as the spell crashes.

>>27285477
Speaking of spells not running yet, did we ever reach a consensus on when that happens? Does the spell go off as soon as the circle is complete, or are we going to incorporate a bit of OP's idea regarding outside energy sources and have a completed but dormant spell activated by energy input?

Or default to activate-on-completion with trigger-activation requiring special clauses?

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>>27284890
>a person who is partially dead

>>27285378
You can do that, or you can just adjust the variables in your head.

Basically, modifiers all have variables, like a text box on a program, where you can put in a given value on runetime.

>>27285513
Sounds like fun to me. Each expansion would add a (small) new set of runes and a number of dev-approved player-made spells that would become craftables by all the players (with the By: Usernamehere tag on it, of course.)

It would be a mad dash to be the next great spellcrafter!

>>27285537
>*the kinetic/impact modifier

>>27285571
OP came back and said that you need to expend a small amount of energy to initialise an array, at which point it begins drawing mana from the air/crystal/blood until it has enough to complete itself, and then it goes off. Or begins sustaining, in the case of a Sustain rune.

>>27285589
>Basically, modifiers all have variables
I think this was sort of floating around in the general tacit consensus, but I'm glad it's been said. For one thing, having it said outright really helps the role of "target" click for me -- as a modifier-rune, "target" is intrinsically fuzzy, so to speak, with undefined parameters.

Another way to say it would be that modifiers all have variables, AND only modifiers CAN have variables.

>>27285599
An in game spell editor/creator would be fucking awesome, with more advanced functions/runes being available to better wizards.

Imagine, setting up shop far out in the wilderness and making and designing trap spells for hunters, except that you make it that the paper they are inscribed on combusts after each use, that way the hunters have to buy more, unless they decide to kill you or learn how to spell.

>>27285627
Sounds good to me. Spells immediately going off on completion seems a little bit too finicky for my liking.

>>27285645
It would make sense, yes.

Modifiers are basically the equivalent of variables on a program.

>>27285627
This is my favorite By far.

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Tried my hands at a Chain Lighting spell. Didn't really work since there is no way to clearly define preposition (I wanted to Project Lighting from a noun to another noun). I also ended up using a second variable rune and variable manipulation runes.
The spell is also extremely dangerous, continuously bouncing among all living targets beside the caster till they are dead.

As a way of rewarding skilled and/or daring mages:

>>27285070
> But concentric circles look a lot cooler (especially if you minimize dead space and have them nearly touching where possible).
The less dead space between circles, the more cost-effective the spell is in regards of mana or leyline juice or whatever. It's also riskier: if two circles touch each other where they shouldn't, then [negative effect against mage]

>>27285718
I see what you're trying to do here, but you've got your logic wrong.

You're trying to project lightning before creating it. Remember, it works from the inside out.

>>27285627

I really like this, because it means that you can limit overpowered spells by mandating a high activation energy cost for the glyph.

>>27285718
I think the Target rune should be altered into a form which is always clearly visible and identifiable, but has multiple forms to account for multiple targets.

>>27285670
Oh yeah! First 5 levels is spell editor only to get used to the runes and basic positioning, 6-20 grants you access to lessons about more advanced techniques, and 21+ allows you to straight-up code your spells.

However, there is one flaw. As much as I like the whole if-your-spell-runs-into-a-fatal-error-you-bork-reality angle, it could turn into a terrible trend of griefers intentionally botching spells to fuck with the game world.

>>27285627
So it basically charges before casting

>>27285670
>Inscribe runes on paper/vellum/cloth
>Easily concealed, but consumed on use

>make wooden carvings
>druids are permitted to use only this

>clay tablets
>shattered or snapped to use, potentially able to reverse engineer the spell

>stone or metal
>high durability, potentially able to make molds, likely to get stolen

>>27285790

Would it be possible to make a "more than 1" or "multiplicity" modifier rune to represent this? Or are we still forbidding modifying modifyers?

>>27285497
Fuck you Humphrey Bograth

>>27285794
Then make it bork you not everyone else like backlash

>>27285794
someone get a gamedevfag working on this, NOW!

>>27285794
Just have it called Chaos Magic, with the results being skewed towards self harm

>>27285718
>since there is no way to clearly define preposition
This. We should work on this. I'mma try to get my brainstorm on.

Incidentally, while your circle is all kinds of messed up, you sparked an idea for me as far as the general grammar and syntax of the rune-language:

Superlatives and comparatives. You used "closest". To that I say: NO.

There should not be separate runes for superlative and comparative forms of a modifier. Instead you just have the descriptor -- "close", "large", "hot", etc. To that, you attach a separate rune to make it superlative or comparative -- "more", "most", "less", or "least".

>>27285771
I thought they were already limited by huge mana consumption which causes them to chug like a motherfucker unless you're literally jamming crystals/blood into the thing. I guess high activation energy is just an extra cost on the side.

A spell to summon meteors would have an activation energy equivalent to a lightning bolt, and take months to complete in a circle the size of a small town, for example.

>>27285867
So closest would become (close(most))?

>>27285828
Nah, I think it's established that modifying modifiers is not only valid, but necessary for proper expression of anything remotely complex.

>>27285828
No modifying modifiers.

But really, you don't need multiple versions of the target rune, because the spell itself should define what exactly is being targeted, with the mage only inputting specific variables on runetime.

>>27285835
That could work, though I always wanted to see a game world that is permanently changed by the shit that fucks it up. Something like a Minecraft world, but in a more permanent, MMO-level-of-shared sense. But for purposes of keeping players in the game, botches only causing problems to the user of the spell is much more agreeable.

>>27285840
Very yes. Where's Neon Skull-fag when you need him?

>>27285371
Following similar principle, but without painful paint (and I was starting to receive strange looks at work).

>((Fire) Energy (Create (Frost)))
Just for the irony of freezing your leftover food midcamp while using your campfire as a generator.

>>27285824
nah man, the only bonus to using tougher/stronger materials is that the spell will be more durable, unless you do the following.

spell on paper, can rip easily, but is cheap (make a rune to combust[self[define[rune]]])

wood can be snapped, burn, or decompose.

A spell on stone would probably last for a great while until the spell weathered away into intelligibility.

a spell on metal would be almost invincible , unless you melted it, but in addition you would have to be a blacksmith yourself to make it, or find a blacksmith who can follow PRECISE instructions.

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>>27285899
You got it backwards -- (most(close(<thing>))

>>27285881

I think you can combine this. Either the spell has a small activation cost and takes a long time to complete as it drains the ambient mana around the activation site, or it has a large activation cost and shorter completion time. This is why blood magic can be an attractive option - sacrifices can provide a lot of energy for a large spell's high activation cost.

>>27285928
Or enspell a rune on a pen that cuts metal and draw it yourself

>>27285962
Sorry on phone but yeah

>>27285962
Technically correct, since the modifiers are, on a syntax level, *inside* the rune itself. So they come first.

>>27285769
But...I have to enclose the entire loop in a circle to sustain the entire thing and leave the Create out of the loop...
God, this reading from inside out is a pain, since it means that the first action must be within the smallest circle. What happens if there is two loops of similar size anyway.
I feel that the "focus" should be the first effect to take place instead and giving a special marking instead of having to place it in the smallest circle. Imagine a computer code that you have to read from the smallest segment.

>>27285771
>>27285794
>>27285881

By estabilishing a quantified ammount of Mana/Energy consumption in a given spell, it would be easy to estabilish limits of reality-warping, power, exaustion and deadly backlashing.

>>27285972
thats just cheating bro, but I imagine whichever wizard has the idea of doing so will keep it a secret so he can mass produce metal spells, and sell them at a high price.

>most of the magic in the game is actually for the purpose of corporate espionage
>the only people who 'use' magic are scriptkiddy equivalents

instead of chainlightning just simplify it by having everyone within a circle be struck by lightning

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>>27286016
Definitely could work. Maybe make each element of a spell have a set mana cost. Mana cost not only has an effect on a spell's potency and wait time, but also the backlash should it happen.

>>27286040
Fucking brilliant! An economics MMO masquerading as a wizarding game!

>>27286052
Big circle = Higher energy cost

He's trying to make a bolt that bounces from person to person, seeking out enemies that aren't dead.

>>27286014
Too bad, nignog. Find a way to fix it, and make it look pretty.

>>27284497
Managed it. Why can't you? Part of the fun is finding a way to scribe an array properly without wasting any space and still making it look nice.

>>27286014
No dude, the inside-out reading is pretty damn important to the aesthetics of the magic circle system.

It's not really that difficult, I think. What's the main thing you want to work with? The primary thing the spell acts on?

For your chain lightning spell, it's obviously lightning. "Lightning" is your center rune, there within the innermost circle.

From there, what are you doing with the lightning? You create and project.

What do you want to do after that? Encircle your basic lightning bolt and add more actions and modifiers as appropriate.

Build from the inside out, simple to complex.

Sorry I just got here, what determines numeric effects, like exact radius, cast time, etc?

>>27286052
Nah. Job security.

>>27286076
not just wizarding economics, but an entire fantasy/adventure MMO with the high jew-wizard lords in a constant struggle for economic dominance, and the right to sell their spells to the plebian hunters, warriors, rogues, and 'mages' beneath them!

I'm trying to get a hold of this. If I just want to make a flame, not even sustain it, what does the code look like?

>>27286089
Have a spell that marks people and then center a lightning spell to attack everyone marked.

>>27286076
In this world, Intellectual property lawsuits are hilarious.

>>27286137
([create[flame])

>>27286105
Numeric effects of the spell are determined (within an appropriate range depending on the runes used) by the caster at the time of casting. All such variables must be indicated with modifiers. For example, if you want a big fireball, your "Fire" rune needs to be modified with a "Large" rune; just how large is "Large" is up to the caster.

>>27286128
I still want to see it minecraft-esque, so I can feebly research spells to enhance my crops so I can live off the land or harvest my alchemical herbs more effectively

>>27286139
Sure, give the other classes some monsters or goals to quest for. But the core of the game would be about customization. If we want to be fair (pshaw!), you could create other mechanics which would let the other classes customize their own shit. Though it is difficult to really customize Hit Things Until They Fall Down and Die.

>>27286105
They're variables that the caster determines at runtime, with specific limits depending on the modifier used.

Cast time is altered by the relative power of the spell and the amount of abstraction it contains. A spell to destroy the universe would take infinite time to complete because it would never draw in enough mana. A spell to make a campfire is near instant because there is plenty of mana in the air to do that.

In the beginning, there was All. And All was not divided, and without shape or time.

Then, All knew itself, and understood that there was All and Not-All, and that All would one day become Not-All. And so began time.

And All feared Not-All and wanted to remain. So All looked inside itself, and saw that it contained multitudes, all different ways of being. And All separated itself into a myriad ways of being, and called them Words. And the Words begot matter. And so began Space.

And All, being weak and feeble from all its division, looked within and made a final separation, between that which could see the Words and that which could not. And to that which could see the Words was given dominion over all Space and Time, to ponder it and understand it, and to combine it in new ways until All understands that it is All, and again is One. And so began the Mind.

>Just a small creation myth that this setting inspired me to write.

>>27286148
Hilariously..... deadly.

>laughingdoctorevil.jpeg

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>>27286105
This
>>27285645

And while there's some appeal to the idea of degrees of turning on different planes or describing distances in three dimensions, I believe that would hardly fit with the tone of ye olde that the system is going for. The addition of that and boolean conditionals wouldn't be out of place on a more technomagicky setting.

>>27286197
sure, just don't accidentally create a spell identical to a arch-jew's (and let them see it).

basically it's just like real world software patents, you have to add large amount of useless pieces of code to stay out of trouble (sparkles, flashes of light, smoke, ETC..)

>>27286163
So a "normal" fireball might be size 10 by default, while "large" could be a modifier of 1.5x? Thus if the caster decided to use 10 energy they get a size 15 fireball, or 50 energy would yield a size 75 fireball?

>>27286237
More or less? We don't have any solid figures for these things yet, but you have the basic gist of it.

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>>27286052
>tfw no preposition syntax
I tried my best to make "disperse lighting at large area surrounding targeted point".
Not being able to wrap the entire shit in a circle is a pain too, since I have to start from innermost circle.

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Are the semantics right for my America spell?

>>27286288
More hamburger

>>27286221
I dig it.

>>27286231
I can see it now, the poor herbfag who had to add so much fluff to his farming spells. Not only does a dome of condensation form around his crop, but fireworks pop off along the perimeter with the words "Used with Permission from Ye Olde Not-Monsanto Agromagicks" glowing just above the condensation.

"What? Do you think I can fight their Archmages in High Court?"

>>27286237
>>27286247
I'm beginning to think the whole "large", "small", "far" thing should be dropped and left as variables depending on the caster's will, skill and luck.

>>27286260
>That modifier chain

Jesus christ how horrifying

>>27286260
The "surround target point" bit seems superfluous to me; you could just use "target area", since "target" allows you to designate the area you want.

>>27286260
Why do you need all those modifiers. Surely [Target : [Area]] would work fine.

>>27286095
>>27286098
The problem is that the lighting is to be created only once. That means it must be out of the sustain loop.
You know, I could probably just add pointless circles with pointless verbs around Create, Fire and Project to make them the "Innermost" circle instead. But that is just cheating.

>>27286339
What if target was a defined zone, or a specific entity, or other conditional?
>nearest other creature (within range)
>literally this guy over here
>everything within a 10 ft cube
Etc

>>27286336
I dig it. The runes describe what, the caster describes how (much)

>>27286338
Yup. This thread proved that chained modifiers are a necessity, and also that chained modifiers are the biceps of a cartoonish ugly arm. The system is doomed.

>>27286339
>>27286357
...
Fuck, I got caught up overthinking it. I keep forgetting this isn't programming and there is no need to set the radius as a potential variable.

>>27286329

Maybe patents could be circumvented by adding in runes to make the whole spell unreadable.
Like the lines of codes people used to make their wc3 maps un-editable by anyone but them since they had the original non-published version.

In fact, the codes they used caused your worldeditor to crash, so a magic equivalent could blow up into their face.

>>27286358
Just put an Exclude [Target : [Glyph]] in there, and have lightning affect it.

That way, it excludes a lightning glyph from the array which is specified at runetime. You could expand on this so that it automatically knows which glyph to exclude, but it would require significant expansion of the array itself.

>>27286403
>cartoon bicep
Fighter magic, if anything

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>>27286288
Do you have a single fact to back that up?

>>27286406
Yeah, with Target and Area, you have plenty of maneuver room for your variables.

>>27286403
It wouldn't be needed this much if we have a separate syntax for prepositions. Must of the modifiers are not adjectives and adverbs.

>>27286385
"Target" is always a modifier on a particular thing you want to target.
>nearest other creature
Wouldn't even use "target"; it would use (most : (near : (creature))), with creature additionally modified with "other".
>literally this guy over here
You'd use (target : (person)), with the caster specifying who exactly to target. Having to manually fill in the target details in the circle itself woud be excruciating.
>everything within a 10-ft cube
You'd use (target : (area)), with additional modifiers on area to make it a 10-ft cube (eg, "small", "square").

>>27286422
>runetime

Love that expression. Such an appropriate pun.

>>27286329
Holy shit, that's why stereotypical wizard spells have little fireworks and smoke! to avoid magical lawsuits!

>>27286406
As a programfag, I keep wondering how you would define the target. A single target, or group of targets, or specific area, it's hard to group those together.

I mean c# has interfaces, but what variables are common?

>>27286461
I know right?

>>27286403
>and also that chained modifiers are the biceps of a cartoonish ugly arm
Only when hastily sketched. For a proper magic circle, I imagine they could look damn elegant. You'd just need to arrange them with the proper curve and tapering-off in size.

>>27286336
I kinda like the magnitude modifiers to be relative to the caster. A "small" fireball by a master may be larger than a "large" fireball by a novice despite being more expensive on mana.

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Fifteen hours, and the idea posted by OP has been expanded on and nearly mastered.

This is /tg/ at its best.

>>27286495
That sounds like a compromise solution I can get behind.

>>27286409
And this could create a black market for un-fluffed proprietary spells. Suddenly we're entering EVE levels of backhandery, and I kinda like it.

>>27286470

Also chanting. And dress code requirements. And other shit like that.

A circle that marks everyone within it

Then use a lightning spell that targets the people marked

>>27286507
Not only that, but we have also figured out why most spells are full of useless bullshit and flair!

unfortunately this system will most likely never be made into a tabletop, or a vidya.

Just like mosaic ;_;

>>27286507
So, when will our dear friends over at the /tg/ Mages' Guild lose their shit over this?

>>27286470
>>27286521
>>27286558
And with that we completely debunked the old theories of magic. It's handwavium, but it doesn't really need to be so grandiose. It's just to not have to deal with those who patented the spells.

>>27286475
Just have target, and then have multiple modifiers attached to it.

Less like a macho arm, and more like a retarded flower.

So [Target : [Group] + [Area] + [Living]] instead of [Target : [Group : [Area : [Living]]]]

Fun fact: you can draw the "energy" rune in a single stroke without repeating lines

>>27286521
>Want to have a spell that increases your strength for years
>such a duration is unfeasible
>gather crushed gold and diamonds as they have the most innate magical energy (for the current season/moon phase)
>its time
>begin a ritual, the nature of this spell being to greatly magnify the duration at little cost

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Does this work? Or do I need to change SELF with EXCLUDE or add a REPEAT or something?

>>27286612
We can do that. But thanks to patent laws your muscles are gonna glow when you flex.

>>27286612
I'm sorry goyim, but the use of gold AND diamonds in a strength related spell has been patented by the shekel-mage foundation! either pay 1000000000000 magical shekels, or cease and desist.

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>>27286422
Eh? Lighting affect? I..I have no idea what this is.

Anyway, this is the closest I can get, using the exclude relation to exclude the two effects I only need to run once. Looks ugly as sin though.

>>27286567
And those tags are great, but how is that implemented in code? I don't see an elegant way to do it.

Yes anon, I understand the tags. Creatures can have them, but I need to design an object that can hold a collection of tag holders AND location definitions

>>27286637
I don't think there's a rune for "exclude"

>>27286640
And whenever you flex those muscles, advertisements are going to blare out at them to alert anything within a 30-foot radius about the patent's company.

>>27286637
it would work better as

[[death EXCLUDE FROM [self]] sustain]

>>27286600

What is the Energy rune anyway?

I can't find any alphabet, I missed the first thread.

>>27286637
Is that a suicide spell?

>>27286681
>>27286690

Actually it's supposed to exclude any living being from a place asides you. It could alternatively destroy germs inside your body, but since that would mean destroying the ones in your stomatch that let you survive I guess what counts as self is debatable.

Oh, and maybe I could make "(EXCLUDE = LIFE), (EXCEPTION = SELF)"

>>27286684
Energy's the bottom rune in this one:
>>27285371

Don't know of alphabets aside of the first image. It's probably making it up as we go along

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>>27286637
Exclude isn't a rune, it's a function. A double circle with an affect line joining to the outer layer is an exclusion.

Of course, the array you are trying to create will just instantly kill the caster, so I guess I have to ask why you would do this?

>>27286732
What's the difference between fire, plasma, and lightning? They're all forms of raw energy, and ice being the absence of heat.

>>27286738
>sell to runekiddy
>it will kill everyone in sight except for you!
>charge lifes worth of money for it
>muahahahaha

>>27286738
See this:
>>27286724
I want to do the exact opposite.

>>27286757
Lightning is a stream of plasma created by a charge arc. Fire is plasma created by an exothermic chemical reaction. So both are plasma, and plasma is ionised gas.

Unless you meant in a fantasy system, I don't know.

>>27286764
You see, this is why runecrafting is best left to the wizards. You get people like this who kill themselves while trying to make something useful.

>>27286475
They are completely different data type really, an ID, an array of ID, and a coordinate(s) with or without radius. Hell, they don't share variables at all. Easier to just make them different objects rather than use polymorphism IMO.

>>27286738
>Penniwyn: hey Sholdormor how i make runetime faster
>Sholdormor: live exclood from self
>Penniwyn: ...
>Sholdormor: BERZOOPLA

>>27286764
exclude everythhing that IS NOT alive?

would be useful if you were trying to start a nudist colony...

>>27286764
(SUSTAIN [life] [self])

>>27286757
>ice being the absence of heat
You mean cold.

>>27286799
See >>27286674
Maybe a list of position areas and a list of entities or something good.

>>27286757
What's the rune for a bose-einstein condensate?

Answer: ur mum

>>27285722
I like this a lot. It also requires inscription to take skill to perform on a small scale.

>>27286784
Yes and no. While that's the scientific definition, there's going to be a number of arbitrary things, like fire and lightning being different, even though they're fundamentally the same

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>>27286764
Then you want something like this.

GDI do we need a new thread again already?

>>27286836
So you want an object "target" that can means an entity, a group of entities, or an area? Eh..sorry, OOP is never my forte. Better to ask a programming community instead.

>>27286907
Magical antibacterial agents

I love it.

>>27286850
>>27285722
What if theres three or more and separate skills involved?

>Knowing the symbols (different alphabets for effects, etc)
>Drawing the symbols (inscription)
>arranging the symbols (runecrafting)
Thus you have a researcher economy, crafting economy (do you trust runes by others?), and spellmaking economy

>>27286850
Hence why the most complex spells, with many levels of chained modifiers (see >>27285342) and all, require several wizards working on a large surface and a lot of funding. Golden diamond ink doesn't grow on trees y'know.

>>27286907
That's suicidal too isn't it?

>>27284757
This explains everything, wizards are programmers.

>>27286969
No, because of the modifiers. It Destroys Life Inside Self, but doesn't affect Self.

>>27286947
Even more fun! Allows for multiple parts of the manufacturing process to come into play. Everything from creators to programmers even to menial laborers!

>>27286920
Yes. Those might look like this, programmatically

>Target.Position.XYZ
>Target[i].Position.XYZ
>TargetArea[i].PositionStart.XYZ

I understand the concepts, but class design was always my weakness

>>27286992
Ah OK. But you need some of those bacteria. We are sewers inside.

>>27286969
It'll kill everything inside you that isn't you.

Whether or not this is suicidal depends on whether magic considers the symbiotic bacteria living in your gut to be "you".

>>27286980
>>27284742
>>27284757
>>27285302
>>27285332
>>27285262
>>27286406

DIPSHITS DONT KNOW ABOUT BOOLEAN LOGIC, THIS IS FUCKING BOOLEAN LOGIC IT DOESNT NEED TO BE REPRESENTED BY PROGRAMMING

DIPSHITS

>>27284742
>>27284808
>>27284757

Any sufficiently analysed magic is indistinguishable from technology. There's no reason to keep the concept needlessly obtuse/nonfunctional. No one is forced to use all the options, after all.

>>27287028
Ummm no? We already know its boolean logic. We just use it the way we want.

>>27287028
u mad br0? ahuehuehuehue

caps lock is croos control for cuul, rite guize?!

>>27287003
It's like technology, the more you have, the easier it is to get more

>need tons of ink to research runes, cause and effect, etc
>first spells you learn increase the growth rate of oak trees, as well as allowing you to harvest extra bark, and a third spell to let you squeeze extra tannin from the bark
>repeat this for every raw material for every step of the process
>guilds and companies specialize in mass producing individual components
>the layman needs a spell to cure an earache so he heads to the nearest spellmart pharmacy to get it

>>27287013
You need most of them, they help us break down complex carbs, release metals, and they produce vitamins for us. They also outcompete foreign (often hostile) microbes that could cause us harm, by virtue of being already established. They also help the immune system and get rid of grease and sweat.

>>27286920
D&D 4E actually has a fairly relevant solution to this.

Targets are always individuals, but a spell can target everything (or a tagged subset of things) in its range.

So you have one variable that defines the spell's range and another that determines which things in that range are targets, which should make the parsing simpler.

>>27287113
that leads us to a new problem.

what will the runic numbers be? will they be base 10? will the units be metric, imperial, or something we make up?

>>27287113
That's pretty elegant, but what if I specifically wanted to target a section of floor that would turn to quicksand when walked on?

>>27287142
Roman numerals

>>27287085
And then comes the advertisers! EXP bonuses depending on how much you sell for your spellcorp client. Hah hah! This is completely autismal but I'm enjoying myself too much!

>>27287162
Draw the rune on the section and then target the spot as down. Inscribe on door jam.

>>27287173
not runic enough. sanskrit? pretty much latin numerals, but they look more rune-like.

how will we deal with giant numbers? like in the millions or more? can numbers have a special type of modifier circle, with each circle acting as a group of 3 digits (A comma?)

>>27287209
Numbers shouldn't be present in the circle because they are always represented by variables, which are defined on runetime.

>>27286907
What is that thing inside that the Self is modifying? I can't quite read it...

>>27287162
>specifically target a section of floor

I suppose 'targets are always single objects' is more appropriate than 'targets are always individuals'.

If you're doing something like creating an area effect at range I imagine you target a point, and other modifiers are responsible for the spell affecting an area around it.

>>27287205
(inscribed surface) ?

But like, there needs to be a way to target a zone without drawing on it specifically. You could use a target+radius thing, but... Ehhh.

>>27287209
How about using a notation system using new runes that work like regular western notation not too hard and would look runic

>>27287274
Inside is modifying Self, which is modifying Life.

The array is an elegant way to kill everything in you that isn't you. It's still suicide, albeit a protracted and slow suicide, because you need bacteria to live.

With a few alterations it could be a fantastic way to sterilise food though.

>>27287282
Right, and then the radius is determined at runetime, but I'm just trying to figure that out in terms of code

>>27287162
I... really don't think there is an elegant way to do it. A group of targets can be multiple object "target", but there is no simple way to make an area part of the same object... I can't even think of notable functions they shared.

>>27287299
Or add notation marks like * in its own circle with notations surrounding the final circle?

>>27287271
What if I want to manipulate the variables mid spell?

>>27287344
I was thinking something like accent marks dotting along the circle's edge. The bigger/longer/etc. you need it, you need a larger circle and more marks.

>>27287362
You can always try to replace one rune with another, or add/erase accent marks during the spell, but that would make it MUCH easier to botch, given that you are fucking with the flow of mana in the middle of the effect.

Maybe you can get away during the build-up phase though. Less chance of botching.

>>27287362
Limitation of the system.

You can expand the array to accommodate for that, but it will make it far more inefficient. As it should be.

>>27287329
Wait we are thinking about this wrong. Just choose the target when you set up the spell and add the condition in to be sustained after you activated it. Then new subset to (target)->(previous target)

>>27287329
The spell has an action that it does to the target. This can be abstracted via delegate methods to make it generalized.

So maybe there is an "area" object which defines a set of points, and an "entity" object which is a creature or item in the world. They can both implement an IDoSpellEffect interface with a signature like

>public interface IDoSpellEffect {
>....void Action(ISpellEffect effect, ISpellEffectArgs args)
>}

I'm failing to post a pic. I think we need a new thread.

>ctrl+F in this and previous two threads
>0 results found for gallifreyan

C'mon /tg/, not even a mention?

>>27287515
Wit?

>>27287515
fuck off whofag, we program not space arabic (effectively, they are both beautiful and artistic, but annoying to write)

>>27287383
>>27287431
Can't numbers be used as a modifier for runes such as "add" and "subtract" affecting variables?

I am wondering how to implement arrays into the runes, so that you can record down a list of things...

>>27287535
Not even a whofag, just pointing out the obvious.

>>27287541
like a spell that only activates once X people of Y weight pass over it, or something?

>>27287492
Even the spell effect functions for both objects are very different though. I will find it easier to just to give the area object a function allowing it to produce an array of entity objects within the area.

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Food Poisoning is a thing of the past.

>>27287588
Yep, incrementing and decrementing integer variables are very valuable for most functions, such as making a spell loop for a certain number of times.

>>27287615
slap that baby on a wand and get to blessing food

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I took of the outer double circle so this spell should spread over an area I suppose. Also, the NOT SELF/OTHERS was too big to fit inside the circle, so I simply put it there. The OTHERS is the logical opposite of SELF, so it'd destroy everyone's life but your own. NOT SELF is in case we don't have an OTHERS rune, so the NOT is a modifier of SELF.

>>27287541
No, because all modifiers are variables. You can't change a variable using another variable and nothing else.

If you want to change them mid spell, you need to have constructed the array in such a way as to allow you to do so.

>>27287589
Yes, the functions are very different. That is the point of virtual/overrideable methods and interfaces. It doesn't care HOW it works, only that it DOES

>>27287615
Inside which circle do you put your food?

How long has this thread been going now?

So, wait, are spells triggered immediately upon completion of the rune?

>>27287706
Item, I think.

Wouldnt it be better to put 'Target "A"' in the Item slot, and write "A" in non-toxic ink on the food ietm, or barrel/crate?

what if you just wright 'cheese'? guess what, you just killed all the bacteria in all teh cheese in the whole world, and destroyed the livelihoods of pretty much every cheese maker.

>create simple logic gates using energy markers and increment counters
>create half and full adder
>reimplement a real, working microprocessor foe your faction

We could probably solve a lot of the problems with targeting if we moved away from programming lingo and into sympathetic connections, but I don't know if that's too drastic of a break.

Example: Want to target a scry or kill spell on someone? Intersect the [TARGET] rune with another circle, in this circle you put a target's hair, blood, whispered Name, etc.

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>>27287641
Oh shit nigger what are you doing.

You create an exclusion command by using the double circle. Putting NOT SELF is waaay illegal.

Stop fucking up so hard dude

>>27287740
No they require energy to kick start them but afterwards they run through automatically

>>27287767
Okay, and do they start and end automatically or require a termination? Also, what kind of energy do they use?

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>>27287647
What? All modifiers are variables? I though they are there to add to the verb or noun they are attached to.
An example of manipulating variables is like this. It shoots fire 3 times.

>>27287766
Derp I remember I read the double circle working to exclude water in an area in the original explanation the OP provided but I fucked stuff up. At least I got my kill-everything-but-self rune.

If I put a large modifying the area, does it become nuke-worthy?

>>27287794
You can rig them to start auto but unless stated to start over they go until finished or they run out of energy.

Or they blow up.

>>27287722
We're at 191 posts. We have a little while to go yet.

>>27287740
No. They have an activation energy cost and then a mana cost.

>>27287761
That's basically a modifier to the target glyph. [Target : [[Original]Owner : [Hair/Tooth/Nail/Name]]]

Doesn't work if you just put, say, "Steve", you'd need a true name or something absolutely unique to that individual.

>>27287751
Activation energy and mana cost would be too high for the spell to successfully complete.

>>27287794

They end when they finish their script, or (if they're in a SUSTAIN loop) run out of mana (ambient, crystaline, or from blood)

>>27287808
You can't set global variables like that. It isn't that easy.

I have no idea how any of this works because I, too, am new to this thread. Is there any place with nice formatted instruction or documentation? Is it in the works? I want to use this for so many things, it gives me a boner. None of this "magic is feeling" crap. Hell no! Now... LOGICAL magic? That's my kind of shit!

>>27287814
Yes, but the activation energy and mana price would also increase proportional to the power of the array.

>>27287874
Why not? I guess it can be local too, since there is only 1 segment.

>>27287315
Well that depends on how you're choosing to represent your entire world of things you might want to shoot with spells.

Let's pretend everything in the world are represented by object that have some properties we can look at to figure out whether it's a person or the floor or whatever, and also where that object is in the world.

So I would ideally write the rune words so that properties of targetable objects are on one side of the target rune and information about which viable objects we're actually targeting (all, closest, stuff like that) is on the other. So we have something like (all(target(person, hostile))) to specify a spell that hits enemies in its range but doesn't affect anything else, like a mind control spell, or (single(target(point))) to designate the origin for a AoE fire effect that will indiscriminately burn stuff.

Then in code what we're going to do is take everything inside the target() rune and compare see which objects are in range and satisfy that list of properties. Those are our viable targets.

Then we take the rune that's modifying target and see what set of those viable targets are actually going to be affected. A single target spell might have the user select just one of the available targets, spells that hit everything apply their effect to all the viable targets, and so on. Targeted AoE spells would have most of the AoE shape information determined by the spell effect, and the targeting information would only be concerned about where the effect is originating from. A cone would be self-targeted if it originates from the caster, for example.

These are still fairly rudimentary examples since I don't want to make assumptions about what the language will look like and how complicated the parser we'd write for it would need to be, but it seems like a workable design.

Got a dare for ya'll, create one that creates a tsundere hologram with that loves dogs.

>>27287845
For instance each person is a subset with three names


A witch called moira who has a true name (say moraine)

Could be called with witch (her classification) moira (nickname) or moraine(true name) each getting more specific. And making the targeting more effective

>>27287901
Can't one just use a "CREATE = ENERGY" rune? Or make such rune surrounded by "ABSORB = ENERGY" runes and a "STORE = ENERGY" rune until you have enough energy? The process would be similar to what they do to uranium before turning it into a bomb, in my comprehension, and by similar I mean in the sense it takes time and work and probably making sure no one else knows what you are doing.

>>27287959
Discussed the absorb one and basically as long as you have a sink your it then you can store the mana.

>>27287914
Because meanings don't carry over from rune to rune. A single rune has one specific meaning, and that meaning cannot change. You simply can't have variables other than modifier variables.

>>27287959
>store energy
Oh baby

>giant room with magical capacitors on every surface
>captured wizards are placed in the middle to charge a giant mana bomb

>>27288000
Sink for it*

>>27287541
Why do you want to turn everything into a universal Turuning machine

>>27287959
That would be mana crystals, and yes, it would work, but mana crystals are both inefficient in terms of the mana stored in relation to the energy spent to create them, and fragile.

And Energy is different from mana. You can't create mana, it is just thrown out of the ley lines and wellsprings.

Or you could use the blood mana, which would be less unreliable than crystals and faster than ambient mana... But would involve sacrificing dudes.